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Old 05-28-2008, 05:39 AM   #1
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kelly1986 HB User
next step up from Norco

hi, i have never introduced myself but have been reading post and this board has helped me alot with information about my chronic pain, meds etc..so first...thank you...my name is kelly and i have a question, i hope someone can help...i have been taking Norco 10/325 (progressive from hydro 5 then 7.5) now Norco 10/325..first 3 times daily..last month we went to 4 times daily...started 2 years ago...i'm rambling forgive me...my question is..i still am taking too many to control my pain and don't even think that is working...can anyone tell me or suggest the next step up of pain control?? without going overboard?? would it be Percocet?? i don't want to go any stronger than i have to and do want a ton of acetaminophen either.....but i can't keep taking 5 or 6 Norco a day and not getting pain control either...i'm confused...don't want to give TMI but my pain in gynecologically related and isn't going away anytime soon....thanks so much for listening...its refill time and i'm scared to change but need help too !!!! aahhhhh
thanks again kelly

 
Old 05-28-2008, 06:13 AM   #2
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cmpgirl HB User
Re: next step up from Norco

Hi Kelly, Welcome! I am sure you will find some great support and advice here.

I don't want to pry, so I am not going to ask what your specific condition is, but I'm going to ask you a few questions so that I have a better idea about what you are dealing with, OK?

Do you see a pain management doc? Or is it your family doc or GYN who is prescribing your meds? Have you had surgery or do you have a condition that causes pain, by it's own nature? (Like me) Is your pain constant, or does it come and go? Do you get any relief at all, from the SA meds?

The reason that I ask, is that because in many cases a Pain Management doc (PM) would more than likely have offered you a long acting (LA) med, for overall pain coverage and a short acting (SA) med for breakthrough (BT) pain. Not all PM's agree with this theory, but it seems as though just taking the short acting meds (hydro and norco) is not helping you.

Let us know a little more about your history, if you can. I'm sure you'll get lots of info and support. Take care and let us know, CMP

 
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Old 05-28-2008, 06:50 AM   #3
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Re: next step up from Norco

hello cmp and everyone..thank you so much for responding....i so feel like i'm fighting this pain battle daily alone (because i just don't think you can understand unless you feel it) my family is wonderful but....well you know...

anyway to answer your questions...since Nov. 06 i have seen 8 drs. from my GP, to NPrac to OB/GYN specialists in Indianapolis and am in the process of waiting for an appt. in Northern Indiana. Biopsy (not fun in that area i'll tell you)... Jan of 07 i had a severe allergic reaction to something topical prescribed... I also have Genital Herpes which i contracted in 93 and have pretty severe outbreaks.
I also had a pretty severe tear when i had my son in 86. Theres from childhood and thats just something i can't go into, hope you understand.

anyway...so far what we do know is that i have pretty severe nerve damage which is causing terrible pain. up and down...not always terrible but ALWAYS, from toothache type throbbing pain, to stabbing pain, at times it goes down the back of my leg and my whole left side down aches.

i know this may sound like a post for womens health but.. and it may be that also but right now my main concern is how to function daily and what pain management system might help me the best...so far the Norco has been the only thing to touch the pain and now i'm afraid i may have built a tolerance to it...

one more thing..i have tried neurontin, cymbalta, and lyrica the normal neuropathy type drugs and i react terrible to them , i also battle depression (go figure) and they made it so bad i could hardly function ....geesh now that i say all this out loud it sounds worse....i hope someone has some suggestions....thanks for listening this has been rather cleansing to my soul...kelly

 
Old 05-28-2008, 08:21 AM   #4
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Re: next step up from Norco

Hey Kelly, Thanks for the info. I'm sorry to hear about all you've been through. I have had the same type of biopsy in the past. (for pre-cancerous cells) I can relate to how unpleasant it can be.

I also have some neuropathy and have taken many of the same meds that you mentioned. None of them did much for me and I also had some nasty side effects. It always amazes me what we have to go through to find the right treatment for our pain.

It sounds to me like you are in need of a PM specialist. I don't know if this is the appointment that you have coming up, but if not, maybe your GP can refer you to one. I know we all feel a little skittish about long acting pain meds, but when you are chronic, it can really be what makes the biggest difference. It is also a trial and error process, because meds work differently for each person. We have such unique chemistry and metabolism. With any opiate/opioid meds, there are usually tolerance issue that come up eventually.

Are you currently seeing a psych profesional for the depression? Unfortunately GP's don't always have the best mental health experience and can tend to prescribe whatever the pharm reps are pushing that week. I'm not saying that they don't know anything about it, but it is clearly not their field of expertise. I see a psychiatrist for therapy and meds. He has made a huge difference in my overall PM. I consider him part of the "team".

I wish you the very best and I hope you can get in to see a really good PM doc. Please keep us posted, especially when you have had this upcoming appointment. Take care, CMP

 
Old 05-28-2008, 09:49 AM   #5
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Re: next step up from Norco

Hi Kelly, For me percocet was the step up from vicodin. I don't want to do any stronger then I have to either. I will tell you if this has become a CP issue then take the advice given here & ask about pain management. I waited to long & wish I could go back & do it over. You won't know unless you ask a doctor you can trust,perhaps the one prescibing your meds now. Chronic pain is chronic pain no matter where it orginates from. So don't wait to long for many of the doctors have a process they follow before recommending PM. Good luck Sammy

 
Old 05-28-2008, 10:33 AM   #6
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Re: next step up from Norco

Kelly,

Welcome to the Board! Please don't be embarrassed by the cause of your chronic pain. Much of my chronic pain is pelvic as well. I have endometriosis, but it really doesn't matter to anyone here why you have the pain you do. You will soon find that the people here are wonderful, and the last thing anyone would use to describe them is judgemental. So please don't be embarrassed or afraid of a reaction when you post. You have chronic pain, so do we. I hate that you are a part of this club, but you have come to the right place.

I agree with Sammy that percocet would be the most logical next step. You can change from Norco 10/325, to Percocet 10/325. This should noticably help much more that the Norco. I know from my own experience that many ObGyn's only like to prescribe Motrin 800, or Anaprox for pain. In my experience that these meds are actually more dangerous than taking narcotic pain meds on a regular basis. I know, I have the ulcers to prove it!

Is your Ob doing your pain management, or do you have a pain doctor? I have found that the best way to address an issue such as this, is to discuss how the pain is effecting your quality of life. Use clear examples of what you cannot do, and what you feel you could accomplish if you were not in so much pain. It is often not a good idea to go to a doctor and ask for a specific drug for many reasons, so I would stick to the above conversation. If you are not ready to go on a long-acting medication, this should be the most logical step for your doctor as well.

I hope some of this helps, and welcome again! We're happy to have you!

Your Friend,

Amanda

 
Old 05-28-2008, 11:38 AM   #7
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kelly1986 HB User
Re: next step up from Norco

good afternoon all,

since i posted last i had to run errands and came back to see if anyone had replied to my question...what a wonderful surprise to see you all rally with me...your support almost brought me to tears...seems like i have been suffering for two yrs alone and suddenly there are people who feel what i have been feeling...i feel like a weight has been lifted from me...thank you all soooo much!!

to answer some of your questions...my GP and OB are together on the Norco scripts and agree that there still may be an answer (possibly surgical) to relieve some of my pain eventually. My next appt. with my GP is next Wed 6/4 and i plan on talking to him about a referral to a pain management Dr. as you suggested but i'm not even sure what they do??? is it a clinic?? a pain specialist?? because this is affecting my life...i recently graduated from nursing school and started my first job at a nursing home where we work 12 hr shifts. i just physically barely make it...i just want to cry...

thats another reason i'm concerned about stepping up from Norco because i have been taking it for 2 yrs and i know how it affects me...it helps my pain for a couple of hrs but my mind is clear and i can function fine...changing drug types worries me due to my work...

for depression i took lexapro for 3 yrs and counseling...my GP 2 wks ago (i'm going every 2 wks because i'm just not doing well with life right now) changed lexapro to Pristiq?? and started me on Buspar for anxiety ...ok i'm so sorry so long...i just want to answer everyones questions since you all are taking time to try to help me and i sooooo appreciate it...i'm scared ...i'm so tired of hurting 24 hrs a day...i just feel like if my main source of pain (vaginal ps. i also have endometriosis) i could deal with the other stuff better...do you ever wish you could just have ONE DAY pain free just to remember what it was like???

i think it is sinking in that i may never be pain free and i'm having a hard time accepting it...........thanks again for your kind words and support...love and prayers kelly

 
Old 05-28-2008, 02:37 PM   #8
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ms_west HB User
Re: next step up from Norco

Quote:
Originally Posted by kelly1986 View Post

.i just feel like if my main source of pain (vaginal ps. i also have endometriosis) i could deal with the other stuff better...do you ever wish you could just have ONE DAY pain free just to remember what it was like???

Although my chronic pain is not due to endometriosis, I suffered with it for many years and my heart goes out to you. It can be a verrrry painful disease. I had a hysterectomy at 24 from it.

i think it is sinking in that i may never be pain free and i'm having a hard time accepting it...........thanks again for your kind words and support...love and prayers kelly
Kelly, I want you to know I am in the process of accepting a life with chronic back pain and I must tell you it is a long process and will not happen over night. It will take us many years to accept.

I have found a book called Managing PAIN Before It Manages You by Margaret A. Caudill, MD, PhD and it has been so helpful to me. You can purchase it off the net for around $20.00 and it is worth every penny. You will probably find it helpful in your nursing career as well.


Lastly, I want you to know that you have found an AWESOME board. We all come from different places as far as our pain but we share the chronic day to day pain, dealing with medications, dealing with doctors and nurses, dealing with the lack of support from people, dealing with constipation (med side effects), etc. In my opinion, you struck gold when you posted on this board. We are here for your 24/7 and you will find that you can share anything with us and we will not sit in judgement of you. I wish you the best and pray that you find comfort in our support. This is journey no one should have to walk alone.

Last edited by ms_west; 05-28-2008 at 07:45 PM.

 
Old 05-28-2008, 03:04 PM   #9
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Re: next step up from Norco

Well Kelly you have just got a sample of why I can't go without these people, they are my antidepressant. I have tried many of the meds you mentioned, buspar, lexapro, lryica ( I think you mentioned that) & more, norco to.
In fact ran out of percocet & pharmacist said to take the norco, so I took it along with skelaxin & motrin 800, nothing, no relief. In fact I did not know how bad it was till I had nothing to take for 9hrs.
For me big difference between norco & percocet. I am never pain free but I took for granted the relief the percocet gave me. I would rather be at a level 4 0r 5 which my normal pain level then what I experianced today. We are all different when it comes to the meds so it is always wait & see.
A few of us are trying to get into pain maganement so it will be new for us to, but what we have learned from this board is priceless & we will all benefit from it when it comes to PM. Others can answer your question in more detail about what a PM doctor is, but just what is says, a doctor who helps to manage you chronic pain so you can have some quality of life, but also if I am to understand from this board they are very different then say your GP. I have suffered for 3yrs & just got a diagnosis a couple of weeks ago. With me it Myofascial damage that has become chronic because of being misdiagnosed for so long & let go.
I am with diet pepper & trying to come to terms with being told I will living with this pain from now on, unless someone has a miracle in their pocket. I still try to have hope, why not?
We all should to some degree. So you are in good company here & we truely are like a family. We realize other people, even those closest to us can not understand, but we do, no matter what. I call this board my saving grace.
Read some of the threads & posts & educate yourself on pain management & then you will be more prepared when you speak to your doctor. I am so glad you are going to do so, I don't want anyone to be in my shoes by putting it off. I wish as I said I would have pursued it long ago, but I kept hoping.
Now to answer your question, I wonder every single day what it would feel like to wake up & have one day with no pain. I cant remember anymore, & that alone makes me cry, but I will look forward to pain management & know that I have hope of living a more pain free life & hopefully can take some of my life back & I hope the same for you. Sounds like you have a great career ahead. Hang in there & we will all wait to see what your doctor says about Pain managment. Sammy

 
Old 05-31-2008, 07:29 AM   #10
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kelly1986 HB User
Re: next step up from Norco

good saturday morning to everyone,

first i hope you are all doing well, its a beautiful day here after pretty severe strorms last nast in our area so i'm thankful.

secondly i want to thank you all, i worked 15 hrs yesterday and was too tired to write last night but i wanted to tell you that i have been thinking alot about what you have all said and i think that i have accepted this "chronic pain" idea and have hope for the first time in awhile that things are going to be ok.

i talked with my GP the other day and he upped my Norco to 5 x a day until i see him next wed. which seems to be helping....that last hr or two between 4 x a day was just killing me...then next week well talk about something stronger and i plan on asking about pain management clinics in our area. so i feel very hopeful.

another thing is that before i accepted this(chronic pain) as part of my life, i spent alot of time worrying about the drug use. I am a recovering alcoholic (sober ten yrs as of Jan 8, by the grace of God ) but i wanted to let you guys know, due to the fact that the drug use has been hard for me and I just couldn't accept the fact that is was "ok" for me to be taking narcotics. But i have recently accepted (partially thanks to you all) that drug use is NOT the problem, it is the ANSWER. and i could not function without pain meds...and Alcohol was my drug of choice...never drugs...i never even smoked marijuana...i think its just been the worry of addiction and the pride i take in my recovery that was holding me back....also my GP has been my Dr. for 25 yrs and went through the whole Alcohol battle with me, so we are both being very careful and aware...

so anyway, since you all have been so willing to help me...i wanted to put my final concern on the table (i don't do that often) and tell you again how thankful i am to have found you all!!!...

does anyone else take Norco and can i ask how many?? i started 2 yrs ago with 3 x day then 4 now 5...it does help for awhile...i just wondered how many a day you can go up to...my thought on the Percocet was that maybe i wouldn't have to take so many a day...but if the Norco works...i don't mind taking more...i just can't stand the times when its wearing off....love and prayers kel

 
Old 06-01-2008, 02:30 AM   #11
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Re: next step up from Norco

Try LA tramadol 200mg twice a day, and Celebrex 200mg twice a day.... the long acting stuff means you arnt always looking at your watch, counting down the miuntes until you can take another dose... easier to live your life, and better psychologicaly

 
Old 06-02-2008, 12:22 PM   #12
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Re: next step up from Norco

Kelly, Good for you, you had a problem & you addressed it, you have every right to be proud of yourself. You are smart for being concerned. At the same time you deserve to live a pain free life.
I just spent a couple days on the Norco, I usually take the percocet. For me it would require twice as many Norco & still not achieve as much relief. Also I thought for me the Norco was abit tougher on my stomach. It will be a personal decision between you & your doctor. Everyone is different & I remember being scared when they started me on the percocet & the oxy. I prefer the percocet. I take 3 10-325 aday & know I need to up it abit, I am hoping just in the morning. That will be up to what ever PM doc I see.
You can't worry about a problem you don't have, but you know what to watch for I bet.
If it were me I would focus on getting the right pain control & take it from there.
There are others here who also are recovering alcholics so they know how you feel & if I remember correctly some of them had the same concerns. I commend you & say take control of the pain before it takes control of you (I think that may be the name of a book the diet pepper recommends , ha). Good luck, Sammy

 
Old 06-03-2008, 08:05 AM   #13
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Re: next step up from Norco

awwwww sammy thank you...words i needed to hear today.
i'm so nervous, i go to my GP at 11:10 tomorrow and i plan on asking about local PM clinics etc. and i only have enough norco left through today and the worry of what he will suggest just frightens me...at this time i'm on 5 norco daily. i think he also worries about addiction with me (like i said he went through 17 yrs of alcoholism with me) poor guy...but i know he and his nurse have been sent to me straight from heaven!!! anyway question is if we go to percocet and decrease the amount of times taken daily...does it affect you much different than norco mentally?? i'm just worried about being "foggy" at work, because the norco doesn't affect me that way...i take them at work and am fine (15 hrs doesnt work well with chronic pain, especially in my area of concern) half way through i can't sit down and am almost in tears....one more question to you all...i'm still having a hard time with the fact that, well, its i'm finally realizing that there may not be a "cure" for my pain and that i'm pretty sure pain control is going to be my only hope....was it hard for you all to accept??? thanks everyone and hope you all have a wonderful, pain controlled, happy day!!!! love and prayers kel

 
Old 06-03-2008, 09:07 AM   #14
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Re: next step up from Norco

Kell, let me see if I can answer all your questions.
When I first went on the percocet it did give me abit of the dazed feeling, but ohhh the relief. After being on it awhile it got better. There are still times I feel it, I am not sure why because it is not all the time. Perhaps its when I am tired, you know when I don't get enough sleep. I will tell you that sometimes the second dose can make me sleepy, but if I move around it passes pretty quickly. Once again it is not all the time. I can only tell you that huge difference between the percocet & norco for me. Who knows you may be able to take smaller dose of the perc. & get good results. If you are concerned ask to start on the lowest does. I take 1/2 of 10mg just to see if I can get by at times, most of the time I need the 10mg but I still try the 5mg. I break the 10mg in half, & of course I asked the doctor & pharmacist first.

If you have a good relationship with your doctor come right out & tell him that the norco is just not cutting it & you are concerned, what would he suggest you try & you just want to be able to function more pain free, tell him it is effecting your quality of life. You seem to do ok on the norco, so perhaps letting him know that you know enough to be careful & if you have any concerns you will address them with him right away. You might have to make it clear you really need to try something new & if he is nervous about it can he recommend someone else.
As far as accepting, well that is a doozy. I am trying really hard, really really hard. As is pepper & alot of other people. I wont lie & say it easy because its probalby one of the hardest things I will ever go through. I did not accept it until the surgeon came right out & said it a few weeks ago & I still can't believe this is my life. The good news is this is the best place you can be. Everyone here has been there or is in your shoes. Think about the people who don't know this board exists. Yes our famalies & friends care, but no way can they totally understand. These wonderful people do. So I just try to take their advice & encouragement & most important for me is one day at a time. No amount of money could pay for what you get from here. There is aways someone who can identify with what your going through. So use this board my friend you wont have to walk the cp walk alone.
Stay strong & speak with confidence at your appointment, remember you know how you feel & you know its time for a change. You have proven you have strength & you know what you have to watch for. Some times people get focused on the wrongs or mistakes & don't give trust or credit for the good or what one has over come. Let us know how the appointment goes. I will watch for your post. Sammy

 
Old 06-04-2008, 04:59 PM   #15
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Smile Re: next step up from Norco

good evening all,

sorry it took so long to get things posted ...long errand running day.
So i saw my GP today and we "rearranged" and added some things.
so heres where i stand med wise
1. Buspar for anxiety (been on for 4 wks now)
2. Pristiq for depression(been on for 2 wks)
3. Ambien to sleep (changed back from Prosom which gave me hallucinations and nightmares)

4. he wants me to stay on Norco for another month at 5 x daily 10/325 (so he added one more daily)
5. he also added 1 amtriptyline at night (not sure if thats for pain or sleep or both) i have to look it up yet

he thinks that all the anxiety is making the pain worse and the pain is making the anxiety worse so he wants to try going at it from both directions....
i go back in 1 month then he said well see how everything is working and consider a PM referral...which is fine with me at this point...i know he is trying so hard to help me...does anyone take amitriptyline and how did it go??

hope you are all having a pain free day...and thank you all for thinking of me today....i had a different strength when i was talking to my Dr. today ...like i wasn't alone and i had you all there cheering me on...bless you..love and prayers kel

 
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