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Old 02-20-2004, 09:47 AM   #1
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Post GAD vs. Panic Disorder - Medication vs. Therapy

Been just hanging out for awhile, having some panic attacks myself lately, along with the other day to day misery. I see that the board is still functioning about the same. There are the ones on medications vs. the ones that live by therapy. I myself feel that medication is the last resort but also the first resort when the problem is panic attack, not anxiety. I have said this over and over, that anxiety is stress related and panic attack is a disease. No one wants to except that they have panic attack or a disease, so they continue to hang out on the "Stress and Anxiety Board Topic". It is so plain to see that the large majority of sufferers on that topic have panic disease not anxiety. The problem is that so many Doctors, who do not know the difference between the two, tell a person that their diagnosis is GAD and that they need to lower the stress in their lives. Anxiety is nothing more then restlessness, such as not being able to sleep, or occupy oneself. The feeling that you must do something, only you don't have anything to do. This can be and most of the time is stress related and can be cured by change in job, environment or therapy. Panic attack on the other hand is a true disease that has no specific diagnosis, nor does it have any one method of coping with it. It can not be cured by medication, or therapy but is simply manageable with both. Panic disorder is complicated because it involves most all of the phobia classes and paranoia symptoms that are real. These particular symptoms may be psychological not physical but what difference does it make? The physical symptoms are very real and intensely frightening. Many of you that believe or promote Therapy as a means to cure panic attack are dreaming, be it the old, "get to the bottom of the problem" or CBT. Yes they are having success with CBT in the management of mental disorders not the cure of, it is just as much a Band-Aid if that is your choice of words as the medications. Most people that can be cured of mental problems have stress-related anxiety or just phobias not panic disease. Everyone has anxiety. You can have anxiety everyday of your life; restlessness and stress can be cured as stated above by change. Panic disorder or disease can not be cured at all but managed with medications and supplemented with therapy and the therapy is just to keep depression down and a positive attitude to endure the disorder as close to being normal as possible. Most every neurological disease is not specifically diagnosable. They are diagnosed by ruling out symptoms and making an educated guess, which may not be correct, but what is the difference. There are no cures and no one knows enough yet about these diseases to specifically treat any one of them. I see people post on the board, "that others around them, think that it is all in your head and that panic disorder is not a disease". These are ridiculous statements, since most of you yourself on the board are not willing to except it yourself. Don't think that every time, even after years of this, that when I feel a little bit better that I don't think, "What if it is the medication causing this? Or I should try to go back to work. Or if I become strong mentally, that I can cure this and be normal". Then reality hits with just the slightest hint of a sensation or negative thought and bang! Back to the realization that this is with me and will not go away no matter what I do. The theory of removing negative thoughts is all it is, a theory. Negative thoughts can only be removed by one of two means. Taking enough medication that you can not think at all or the surgical removal of the brain. It is the nature of humans to have negative thoughts and it doesn't take any kind of genius to realize that this is just part of trying to survive. Unfortunately, once you have moved into the realm of panic disorder or disease, there is no turning back. You may be panic free for days, months or even years but it will always be lurking in the background, just waiting to catch you at a vulnerable moment and it will strike. This is why you can not let yourself ever believe that you are cured of panic attacks but must learn to live with the fact that you have a incurable disease that until modern medicine learns enough about the workings of the brain, there will be no cure. The only exception to this is that it is ruled out that you do not have a physical disease or disorder that is causing the panic attacks. The problem is that once you have felt the RUSH of adrenaline coming at the wrong time, you will never get the thought of it coming again out of your mind. You will probably fall into the phobias of course as you progress to the fears of having a problem or attack in public and such, as well as attacks at the slightest pain or sensation. GAD is exactly what it says, "General" Anxiety Disorder. This covers a whole realm of topics that makes it easy for a Doctor to speak it as a diagnosis. There is a definite line between this and panic attack and one may be cured and the other will not. Recommending any therapy over medication and not for the specific purpose of determining if medication is needed is as bad as recommending medication without suggesting therapy for this as well as physical examination for other causes. Therapy is not a cure for panic disorder; it is a means of determining the best path to take for the individual to cope. If you have panic disorder, at some point you will most likely submit to medication unless you are one of those people who just like to suffer. Most likely you do not have panic disorder but anxiety if you can do this because even the most "Suck it up" person who can take the worst physical abuse is afraid of the unknown symptoms without a specific cause. So I ask you all, Do you have a curable problem or a life time disease?

Sincerely,

Sickman

 
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Old 02-20-2004, 12:25 PM   #2
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KayT HB User
Re: GAD vs. Panic Disorder - Medication vs. Therapy

Wow, you're back!

I was worried about you.

Yes, I do have a life time disease, had it since I was a kid, and although at times it eases up or meds make it better, it never goes away..............

Where you been? We missed ya!

Kaytee:-)

 
Old 02-20-2004, 07:28 PM   #3
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Some12 HB User
Question Re: GAD vs. Panic Disorder - Medication vs. Therapy

I just wanted to move this to the top so the poster with all of the expert advice about medications being wrong and therapy being right can reply. We the veterans of this disorder come here to answer questions about medications not recomend them unless asked about which ones in our opinion "only" work. We give way to the CBT persons who also give way to us to answer questions asked of them. With all of your symptoms listed and a full six months or so of disorder I just wanted to know if you would like to compare symptoms and your vast knowledge of this disorder. I am waiting to be enlightened as to why I am not cured and haven't tried hard enough at other means as stated. Please reply to my post based on your own disorder, your symptoms and why all of the long time sufferers are complete morons concerning anxiety, panic attack, medications and therapy. Won't you please come forward and make my day? Just think, all of the years of this, all of the tests and over twelve specialists, including therapists that must have been morons also. I am waiting and I am sure everyone of the veterans of this disorder would like to learn why they are not cured either. It's High Noon, post.

Sincerely waiting,

Sickman

Last edited by Sickman; 02-21-2004 at 12:24 AM.

 
Old 02-20-2004, 08:52 PM   #4
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atmont1977 HB User
Re: GAD vs. Panic Disorder - Medication vs. Therapy

The fact of the matter is your right. Some of the stuff u had mentioned was surprising to even hear. Such as feeling like u should be doin somethin but u cant cuz of the disorder. At first i thought i was unique in this world to this disorder and after i realized i wasnt i felt like i was still unique in the content of my negative thoughts or feelings or which eva one it may be. But even though there may not be somethin to do, i feel like i couldve accomplished so much more if it wasnt for panic disorder. Well im jus rambling and feeling sorry for myself but you couldnt of stated that post any more accurate. Everything that u said i have felt. I really feel like panic is a disease and one not takin seriously enough by the general public. It sounds very silly to those who dont have it. I couldnt count how many times i hear "go about ur business and just forget about it" "what are u anxious about, ur 26 years old and u should be on top of the world", "just go do somethin productive and keep ur mind occupied." These same people get mad when i cannot follow their suggestions and that makes me very mad so now how do i deal with panic disorder. For me its meds and learning how others who have the disorder are handling this. Its certainly not from someone who thinks he is very smart and has all the answers to this crippling and sometimes deadly disease. My answer to them is thanks so much for caring and trying to help but dont u dare get mad at me or frustrated when i do not take ur advice and take my mind off of this. Thats exactly what i wanna do. I thank god for meds. I have no idea where i would be without them.

Last edited by atmont1977; 02-20-2004 at 08:56 PM.

 
Old 02-20-2004, 09:19 PM   #5
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Smile Re: GAD vs. Panic Disorder - Medication vs. Therapy

Quote:
Originally Posted by atmont1977
The fact of the matter is your right. Some of the stuff u had mentioned was surprising to even hear. Such as feeling like u should be doin somethin but u cant cuz of the disorder. At first i thought i was unique in this world to this disorder and after i realized i wasnt i felt like i was still unique in the content of my negative thoughts or feelings or which eva one it may be. But even though there may not be somethin to do, i feel like i couldve accomplished so much more if it wasnt for panic disorder. Well im jus rambling and feeling sorry for myself but you couldnt of stated that post any more accurate. Everything that u said i have felt. I really feel like panic is a disease and one not takin seriously enough by the general public. It sounds very silly to those who dont have it. I couldnt count how many times i hear "go about ur business and just forget about it" "what are u anxious about, ur 26 years old and u should be on top of the world", "just go do somethin productive and keep ur mind occupied." These same people get mad when i cannot follow their suggestions and that makes me very mad so now how do i deal with panic disorder. For me its meds and learning how others who have the disorder are handling this. Its certainly not from someone who thinks he is very smart and has all the answers to this crippling and sometimes deadly disease. My answer to them is thanks so much for caring and trying to help but dont u dare get mad at me or frustrated when i do not take ur advice and take my mind off of this. Thats exactly what i wanna do. I thank god for meds. I have no idea where i would be without them.
Dear atmont1977,
You are certainly not at all alone with any symptom, phobia or justifiable depression. Acceptance that you do infact have the disorder is the foundation and first positive step in learning to cope with this and achieving the most normal life possible. If you master exceptance of the symptoms and attacks without the fears you can beat many of the phobias. You can learn to go out in public without fear of having an attack, knowing that if you do, you will simply manage though it and continue with what you were doing. This is the hardest phobia or paranoia to beat. The fear of public places or embarrassment of having an attack. I am and have been on medications for years and I will always be on them. Without them I could not cope at all. The thing that I must understand is that I am going to have panic attacks of various types of symptoms, ever changing and there is nothing that I or anyone else can do about it. It is somewhat like an alcoholic. First they must except that they have a drinking disorder before they can learn to cope with the problem but they will always be an alcoholic. It is the craps but realistic. I believe that honesty is still the best policy and that applies to oneselve also.
Have a good day atmont1977.

Sincerely,

Sickman

Last edited by Sickman; 02-20-2004 at 11:48 PM.

 
Old 02-21-2004, 12:14 AM   #6
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lori j HB User
Re: GAD vs. Panic Disorder - Medication vs. Therapy

Sickman, no one can say it as clearly & completely as you. Thank you, now I'll sit back & watch, I see the shadow too, it must be High Noon!

 
Old 02-21-2004, 12:27 AM   #7
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Wink Re: GAD vs. Panic Disorder - Medication vs. Therapy

Quote:
Originally Posted by lori j
Sickman, no one can say it as clearly & completely as you. Thank you, now I'll sit back & watch, I see the shadow too, it must be High Noon!
Hi lori,
Watch my back!

Sincerely,

Sickman

 
Old 02-21-2004, 01:10 AM   #8
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hanelo4 HB User
Re: GAD vs. Panic Disorder - Medication vs. Therapy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sickman
Been just hanging out for awhile, having some panic attacks myself lately, along with the other day to day misery. I see that the board is still functioning about the same. There are the ones on medications vs. the ones that live by therapy. I myself feel that medication is the last resort but also the first resort when the problem is panic attack, not anxiety. I have said this over and over, that anxiety is stress related and panic attack is a disease. No one wants to except that they have panic attack or a disease, so they continue to hang out on the "Stress and Anxiety Board Topic". It is so plain to see that the large majority of sufferers on that topic have panic disease not anxiety. The problem is that so many Doctors, who do not know the difference between the two, tell a person that their diagnosis is GAD and that they need to lower the stress in their lives. Anxiety is nothing more then restlessness, such as not being able to sleep, or occupy oneself. The feeling that you must do something, only you don't have anything to do. This can be and most of the time is stress related and can be cured by change in job, environment or therapy. Panic attack on the other hand is a true disease that has no specific diagnosis, nor does it have any one method of coping with it. It can not be cured by medication, or therapy but is simply manageable with both. Panic disorder is complicated because it involves most all of the phobia classes and paranoia symptoms that are real. These particular symptoms may be psychological not physical but what difference does it make? The physical symptoms are very real and intensely frightening. Many of you that believe or promote Therapy as a means to cure panic attack are dreaming, be it the old, "get to the bottom of the problem" or CBT. Yes they are having success with CBT in the management of mental disorders not the cure of, it is just as much a Band-Aid if that is your choice of words as the medications. Most people that can be cured of mental problems have stress-related anxiety or just phobias not panic disease. Everyone has anxiety. You can have anxiety everyday of your life; restlessness and stress can be cured as stated above by change. Panic disorder or disease can not be cured at all but managed with medications and supplemented with therapy and the therapy is just to keep depression down and a positive attitude to endure the disorder as close to being normal as possible. Most every neurological disease is not specifically diagnosable. They are diagnosed by ruling out symptoms and making an educated guess, which may not be correct, but what is the difference. There are no cures and no one knows enough yet about these diseases to specifically treat any one of them. I see people post on the board, "that others around them, think that it is all in your head and that panic disorder is not a disease". These are ridiculous statements, since most of you yourself on the board are not willing to except it yourself. Don't think that every time, even after years of this, that when I feel a little bit better that I don't think, "What if it is the medication causing this? Or I should try to go back to work. Or if I become strong mentally, that I can cure this and be normal". Then reality hits with just the slightest hint of a sensation or negative thought and bang! Back to the realization that this is with me and will not go away no matter what I do. The theory of removing negative thoughts is all it is, a theory. Negative thoughts can only be removed by one of two means. Taking enough medication that you can not think at all or the surgical removal of the brain. It is the nature of humans to have negative thoughts and it doesn't take any kind of genius to realize that this is just part of trying to survive. Unfortunately, once you have moved into the realm of panic disorder or disease, there is no turning back. You may be panic free for days, months or even years but it will always be lurking in the background, just waiting to catch you at a vulnerable moment and it will strike. This is why you can not let yourself ever believe that you are cured of panic attacks but must learn to live with the fact that you have a incurable disease that until modern medicine learns enough about the workings of the brain, there will be no cure. The only exception to this is that it is ruled out that you do not have a physical disease or disorder that is causing the panic attacks. The problem is that once you have felt the RUSH of adrenaline coming at the wrong time, you will never get the thought of it coming again out of your mind. You will probably fall into the phobias of course as you progress to the fears of having a problem or attack in public and such, as well as attacks at the slightest pain or sensation. GAD is exactly what it says, "General" Anxiety Disorder. This covers a whole realm of topics that makes it easy for a Doctor to speak it as a diagnosis. There is a definite line between this and panic attack and one may be cured and the other will not. Recommending any therapy over medication and not for the specific purpose of determining if medication is needed is as bad as recommending medication without suggesting therapy for this as well as physical examination for other causes. Therapy is not a cure for panic disorder; it is a means of determining the best path to take for the individual to cope. If you have panic disorder, at some point you will most likely submit to medication unless you are one of those people who just like to suffer. Most likely you do not have panic disorder but anxiety if you can do this because even the most "Suck it up" person who can take the worst physical abuse is afraid of the unknown symptoms without a specific cause. So I ask you all, Do you have a curable problem or a life time disease?

Sincerely,

Sickman

I guess I'm not the only one still up. Sickman, I just want to say that you are a breath of fresh air. No one could have stated it better than you. For me, since I stopped asking myself, "why did I get this", it has been easier for me to except. No one wants to except that they have a problem, but I can tell you this much............once you do, it's a whole lot easier.

P.S. I'm watching your back too

Hugs you,
Chantel

Last edited by hanelo4; 02-21-2004 at 01:11 AM.

 
Old 02-21-2004, 08:04 AM   #9
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Posts: 724
Some12 HB User
Wink Re: GAD vs. Panic Disorder - Medication vs. Therapy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chantel2003
I guess I'm not the only one still up. Sickman, I just want to say that you are a breath of fresh air. No one could have stated it better than you. For me, since I stopped asking myself, "why did I get this", it has been easier for me to except. No one wants to except that they have a problem, but I can tell you this much............once you do, it's a whole lot easier.

P.S. I'm watching your back too

Hugs you,
Chantel
Hi Chantel,
The Panic Rangers ride once more. Have a nice day.

Sincerely,

Sickman

 
Old 02-21-2004, 09:02 AM   #10
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KayT HB User
Re: GAD vs. Panic Disorder - Medication vs. Therapy

Hi Sickman,

What you say about facing the fear is correct. I can say that two months ago I was petrified of all this............the med changes.......the withdrawal.........it just overwhelmed me...........now I am not so afraid........and others around me have commented that I sound so much better and no so scared..........I have learned that although this disorder and the mumbo jumbo of meds that have been moved and tossed around in my head the last three months are what make me feel bad..........and that it is not going to kill me, make me go crazy or send me over the edge............and a good friend of mine, my cousin, told me once that I can fall down but then I just have to get back up...........so I have tried to just hang in there and not fall down and get through this.............in my case though we both know it was bad handling of meds that got me where I am right now.........trying to locate some level out point............the poor pdoc that I have now........I feel bad for him because he got me a mess and now has to try and fix me after another set of docs already jacked things up...........but he's up for the challenge and so am I........

I guess this still scares me at times.......like my concerns about going off the Zoloft completely.......worried about withdrawal.......but all in all I am handling this much better and also want to say that you have helped a lot with that..............

I have accepted my situation, know that it will get better and that has made it a lot easier to get through............

Kaytee:-)

 
Old 02-21-2004, 02:10 PM   #11
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atmont1977 HB User
Re: GAD vs. Panic Disorder - Medication vs. Therapy

Thank u sickman for your reply to my reply. That was exactly my point. The best help i can get is from those who go through this garbage and meds. Both ur post and ur reply were extremely helpful and better than any bit of information that someone without the disorder can give me (ofcourse its not their fault).

 
Old 02-22-2004, 04:35 AM   #12
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Natasha1981 HB User
Re: GAD vs. Panic Disorder - Medication vs. Therapy

I agree but disagree. GAD is also a disease, like panic disorder. Anxiety and stress are not the same thing, imo. Anxiety is more of a disorder while stress is a reaction.

 
Old 02-22-2004, 07:35 AM   #13
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Some12 HB User
Thumbs up Re: GAD vs. Panic Disorder - Medication vs. Therapy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Natasha1981
I agree but disagree. GAD is also a disease, like panic disorder. Anxiety and stress are not the same thing, imo. Anxiety is more of a disorder while stress is a reaction.
Dear Natasha1981,
I can buy into that GAD may be a disorder but I do think that most doctors use it as an answer to cover themselves in a broader manner when the actual diagnosis is panic attack. I also can conceed to anxiety being a disorder and stress a reaction but I see a lot of people wanting to believe that stress is the disorder and anxiety is the reaction. Have a nice day.

Sincerely,

Sickman

 
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