It appears you have not yet Signed Up with our community. To Sign Up for free, please click here....



Parenting Issues Message Board
Post New Thread   Closed Thread
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 03-11-2004, 06:43 AM   #1
Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 305
ana_24 HB User
Sexually promiscuous child... what can this mean?

My boyfriend's 8 year old daughter has over the course of the last couple of years been caught in a couple of situations that are VERY worrisome.

1) A couple of years ago, she was having a sleep over at a friend's house and the two girls were having a bath together. When the girls' mother came in and asked them what they were doing, she said "we're having sex."

2) Around the same time and with the same girl as above, they were caught in a bedroom together, my boyfriends' daughter with her clothes off. When her friends' mother asked what was happening, her daughter said that my boyfriend's daughter, let's call her Laura asked her to "kiss her vagina." When the situation was delved into a little deeper, Laura said it was actually the other girl who had said that.

3) Fast forward to present time, Laura had a sleepover at her aunt's house on the weekend. Her and her aunt's stepdaughter are the same age and are close friends. They tend to see each other a couple of times a month when Laura stays with her dad (my boyfriend) for the weekend. There have been a few sleepovers over the last couple of years but this time, when she went home to her mother, she told her that her friend Melanie "touched" her when they were having a sleepover. Her mother who has serious issues with our relationship and has been doing everything in her power to cause trouble over the past year, called my boyfriend and told him this last night. She accused him of "corrupting" her daughter and exposing her to harmful situations. She also said that we pushed her into having a sleepover simply so we can be alone and have sex. This is of course not true. He has NEVER put her in any inappropriate situation. Laura was the one who wanted the sleepover. It also came up during this conversation that another friend of Laura's is now not allowed to play with her because her parents found a note written by the two girls to her friend's "boyfriend" saying that she is breaking up with him and will not hump him anymore.

Does anyone else see a pattern? It seems that these situations are following Laura around and although she always blames them on someone else, she is the only common element. I'm very concerned and at a loss as to what we can do. Counseling seems like the obvious choice and it will definitely have to happen but what else can we do? Last night my boyfriend asked his ex to put Laura on the phone and she wouldn't. I'm afraid this woman may have exposed her daughter to sexual abuse or at least to things that are inappropriate for her eyes. She had her daughter in highschool and was never in a serious relationship with my boyfriend. They were together only for a year. Ever since then she has been in and out of casual relationships, sleeping around, having men over at her house when Laura is there. She currently has two boyfriends who she is supposedly only friends with but she has them over at the house for weekends at a time. It is definitely not a healthy environment for a child to grow up in.

Any insight? I haven't been able to sleep all night thinking about this. My boyfriend was practically in tears last night. I think he's been denying that there's a problem up until now, thinking it's always the other child, it's not his daughter who is the bad influence but now he can't deny the pattern. Has she been sexually abused? Has she been exposed to sex? Is she making up stories for attention? Are kids simply too advanced these days and she's learning it from school? I just don't know anymore.

 
Sponsors Lightbulb
   
Old 03-11-2004, 06:59 AM   #2
Inactive
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: cincinnati Ohio USA
Posts: 652
maak823 HB User
Re: Sexually promiscuous child... what can this mean?

I think you are right to suspect that this child may have been sexually abused by someone. 8 yrs old is awfully young to be acting out sexually on her own. I would suggest that she get some counseling ASAP. What an awful thing to have happen to such a small child. I have been involved with Foster Care for many years and have seen this first hand. Almost 100% of the cases where a child of that age is acting out is because they have been sexually molested themselves.

I would sit down and have a heartfelt talk with your boyfriend. Does he have any custodial rights to her at all? If so, he can take her to a counselor- find someone with a background in treating children in these types of situations. If you suspect that the abuse could have occurred in the care of her mother- you can call Child and Family Services to intervene- but you want to do that as a last resort. Sometimes thier intervention is good- but other times it could result in the child being placed in foster care, and that would only cause more trauma to her life in my opinion.

It seems that your boyfriend cares deeply about his daughter and wants to help her- he could also get the school counselor involved or call her pediatrician to get a referral to an outside therapist.

This is going to be rough on all of you- she will need a lot of love and support to deal with what has happened to her - and since she is so young, she herself may not realize that what happened was wrong and that she was abused.

I wish you the best of luck.

 
Old 03-11-2004, 07:05 AM   #3
Senior Veteran
(female)
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 3,326
Blastoff9600 HB UserBlastoff9600 HB User
Re: Sexually promiscuous child... what can this mean?

First you cant blame the schools,they barely teach anything remotely like what his daughter is acting out. Mostly in elementary school they will teach them the basics of what their bodies will go through with puberty and even taht info isnt the greatest in the world.
Second you cant really blame being exposed to sex such as seeing sex in the act,if that were true then alot of kids who catch their parents in act would act out in the same manner. My oldest son will be 8 soon and has caught Dh and I few times and he hasnt acted out in any manner like that.
The most likely is that she has been abused. I know that scares both you and your bf but the patterns that are popping up tend to point in that direction.The only way to find out is to have her in counseling and the faster that is done the better. Dont go pointing fingers just yet because that could only cause more problems and those arent needed right now. Dont automactically assume that it was one of the mother's bfs granted the chances are high with your info that she has had many casual relationships but that doesnt mean any of them might have abused her. The abuse could have happened anywhere that the girl has been ranging from school to a family member or after school activity.
Again encourage your bf to get his daughter in counseling as soon as possible.
__________________
Married 3/25/95
DS 13 yr
DS 8 yr (3+ yrs ttc)
TTC #3 since 01/02

 
Old 03-11-2004, 07:20 AM   #4
Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 305
ana_24 HB User
Re: Sexually promiscuous child... what can this mean?

He has her every other weekend and can see her once a week. The arrangement was fine for the most part up until the time I can into the picture. The mother is very jealous, very manipulative, very materialistic and she is teaching her daughter to be the same way. I wish I could just take her and raise her and protect her from all of this. I had a serious talk with my boyfriend last night about whether he would ever want to go for full custody. We're not currently living together and he is with a roommate. But we do plan to buy a house and move in together in probably a year to two years max. I just feel like by that point it will be too late to save this child. Every day, every month counts. She is already 8 and way too promiscuous for her age. She knows things she shouldn't know. She is only a child and she acts like a child for the most part. She is affectionate, happy... does get moody sometimes especially at the end of her weekends with her dad when it's time to go back home to her mom. She can be whiny at times, doesn't like to share and she only makes friends to people she wants to make friends with. I think that's just personality. There are none of the obvious sexual abuse signs that I've read up on but it could be because this was something that happened years ago. My work pays for counseling and I am going to see if I can find a child counselor in our area ASAP. I had my suspicions about her when I heard about the second incident from a friend of my boyfriend's.. actually the mother of the other little girl involved. But when I brought it up with him, he got mad and said that the other mother is simply trying to place all the blame on his daughter. I had a feeling but I didn't pursue it.. I think he was refusing to acknowledge the problem because he didn't know how to deal with it. Now he can't ignore it any longer.
One incident worth mentioning that occurred when Laura was 4 or 5 is something I also heard from the same mother mentioned above. SHe was close with my boyfriend's ex, they were neighbours so they used to walk the girls to school together. One time, the school called her to say that Laura hasn't been at school for over a week and her mother never called. She called, my boyfriend called and no one could get in touch with her. Eventually she went to her house and who opens the door? An uncle who supposedly molested her as a child. And behind him stood Laura!! Her mother was upstairs in bed, supposedly sick. This uncle stayed with them for two weeks and god only knows what went on during that time.
I'm so depressed about this. I just don't know what hope this child has to turn out normal with all the issues that she obviously has.

 
Old 03-11-2004, 07:21 AM   #5
Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 305
ana_24 HB User
Re: Sexually promiscuous child... what can this mean?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blastoff9600
First you cant blame the schools,they barely teach anything remotely like what his daughter is acting out. Mostly in elementary school they will teach them the basics of what their bodies will go through with puberty and even taht info isnt the greatest in the world.
Blastoff, I simply meant other kids in school, especially older ones talking to her about these things. I didn't mean that the schools actually teach them inappropriate things. I know they don't.

 
Old 03-11-2004, 07:59 AM   #6
Inactive
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: cincinnati Ohio USA
Posts: 652
maak823 HB User
Re: Sexually promiscuous child... what can this mean?

Well it certainly sounds like she has found a guardian angel - you seem to really care about her and want to help. Unfortunately, since you are not married, you are limited to what you can do- but your boyfriend isn't. He can seek custody, or at least counseling for her. Now I am convinced from your last post that this child has been molested. You can have her pediatrician check for physical signs- but if there was no penetration, it is unlikely that he will find anything. It is a place to start though. Definately check into the counseling- the sooner the better. The mother could be in denial about the whole thing too, she may suspect- but does not want to admit that she could have subjected her daughter to an abuser (this is very common).

With a lot of love and a good counselor- there is still alot of hope left that she will be OK- if she gets the help she needs now, don't wait- if the issues are not addressed now, it will be much harder to get her to accept the help as she gets older, and she will probably need counseling then too- because she will need help with the anger issues she will have against her abuser.

I wish you the best of luck and I do hope that you will keep us posted about what happens.



Quote:
Originally Posted by ana_24
He has her every other weekend and can see her once a week. The arrangement was fine for the most part up until the time I can into the picture. The mother is very jealous, very manipulative, very materialistic and she is teaching her daughter to be the same way. I wish I could just take her and raise her and protect her from all of this. I had a serious talk with my boyfriend last night about whether he would ever want to go for full custody. We're not currently living together and he is with a roommate. But we do plan to buy a house and move in together in probably a year to two years max. I just feel like by that point it will be too late to save this child. Every day, every month counts. She is already 8 and way too promiscuous for her age. She knows things she shouldn't know. She is only a child and she acts like a child for the most part. She is affectionate, happy... does get moody sometimes especially at the end of her weekends with her dad when it's time to go back home to her mom. She can be whiny at times, doesn't like to share and she only makes friends to people she wants to make friends with. I think that's just personality. There are none of the obvious sexual abuse signs that I've read up on but it could be because this was something that happened years ago. My work pays for counseling and I am going to see if I can find a child counselor in our area ASAP. I had my suspicions about her when I heard about the second incident from a friend of my boyfriend's.. actually the mother of the other little girl involved. But when I brought it up with him, he got mad and said that the other mother is simply trying to place all the blame on his daughter. I had a feeling but I didn't pursue it.. I think he was refusing to acknowledge the problem because he didn't know how to deal with it. Now he can't ignore it any longer.
One incident worth mentioning that occurred when Laura was 4 or 5 is something I also heard from the same mother mentioned above. SHe was close with my boyfriend's ex, they were neighbours so they used to walk the girls to school together. One time, the school called her to say that Laura hasn't been at school for over a week and her mother never called. She called, my boyfriend called and no one could get in touch with her. Eventually she went to her house and who opens the door? An uncle who supposedly molested her as a child. And behind him stood Laura!! Her mother was upstairs in bed, supposedly sick. This uncle stayed with them for two weeks and god only knows what went on during that time.
I'm so depressed about this. I just don't know what hope this child has to turn out normal with all the issues that she obviously has.

 
Old 03-11-2004, 12:30 PM   #7
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 144
kfs333 HB User
Re: Sexually promiscuous child... what can this mean?

I will also say she needs counseling. I would also suspect sexual abuse. If you and your bf are really close to her and she will talk to you openly, you could ask her if anyone has touched her inappropriately. You 2 will need to be ready for the answers though.

 
Old 03-11-2004, 09:03 PM   #8
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 97
dentalnitemare HB User
Re: Sexually promiscuous child... what can this mean?

Your boyfriend and his little girl are very lucky to have a caring person like you.Thank God for people who care enough to do something.I don't know what to tell you as far as advice goes,but to please talk your boyfriend into doing whatever it takes to save her.I agree with you another year or two may be too late.Good luck with this,I know it has to be so hard.You all will be in my prayers.

 
Old 03-11-2004, 09:07 PM   #9
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 97
dentalnitemare HB User
Re: Sexually promiscuous child... what can this mean?

One more thing it's ashame the little girl's mother wants to put you down.You very well could be her little one's savior in all this.

 
Old 03-11-2004, 10:25 PM   #10
Senior Veteran
(female)
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Utah
Posts: 901
Angel77 HB User
Re: Sexually promiscuous child... what can this mean?

Please excuse me if I repeat someone else, I was so compelled to write, that I didn't read any of the other posts. My son was exposed to this at about 7, by my nephew. I didn't have a clue. I did notice that he had become more hostile and withdrawn, but attributed it to the fact that we had a new baby and he was having a hard time adjusting.

Finally, my nephew broke down and said something to his grandma. It was downplayed significantly. I found out, like you, he was the only common factor and that it had happened with a couple of his other friends. My son eventually confided that he had been being manipulated by him, being told, "If you don't let me touch it, I won't be your friend anymore..." etc..things along those lines. I blew! They did nothing to help my nephew. The kid should have been put into counseling and figured out where this was learned. It is not NORMAL for children to be that sexually aware at such a young age.

I understand your boyfriend's unwillingness to see his daughter's role in this, but he needs to know that she may be perpetrating, but it is because somewhere, she's been victimized. She is not old enough to understand how this situation should be handled, she apparently hasn't confided in anyone, or worse, maybe mom knows and swept it under the rug.

She needs counseling fast! In some states, you can take them to counseling for sexual abuse and don't have to disclose it to the other parent until you know the facts. My friend had to do this and her ex tried to drag her through the mud for not telling her. The reason was that he told her that he told his dad and that dad pushed it aside! We still to this day don't know who it was, but strongly suspect the dad or one of his friends. He is sooo guarded about it, that we may never know.

He did wonderfully in counseling. The counselor specialized in children sexual abuse and used sand-tray therapy. This is ideal for a child who doesn't know how or doesn't have the capacity to express what they're feeling. My friend's son illustrated this by placing a little boy under a glass dome and placing demons and witches all around. When asked what it meant, he said, "It's me and if I tell, those bad guys are going to get me. I want to tell my mom, but I can't." Talk about gut wrenching.

Please call around to counselors that specialize in this and set up an appointment for you and b/f to attend w/o his daughter. Talk to the counselor and develope a strategy. But also let him know that if he doesn't feel comfortable with you being in the room, that it's okay and you won't be mad. This sometimes becomes uncomfortable because he may feel he in some way caused it by not protecting her of what he didn't know.

I've found that some kids clam up when you talk to them about hard issues if you're too focused on them. So with a particular child, I just yakked with her like a friend while I cleaned house and puttered around the house. She spilled it all and because I didn't act overly interested, she didn't feel defensive or as scared.

I hope this helps, please let me know if I can help. I'm sorry. Give her a great big hug for me and kudos to you for being such a great second mommy. What a big heart.
__________________
If you don't experience anything bad, you'll never appreciate the good when it comes around!!!

 
Old 03-12-2004, 05:38 AM   #11
Veteran
(female)
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: NY, USA
Posts: 378
TerryB HB User
Re: Sexually promiscuous child... what can this mean?

I would expect child abuse also. Another possibility is that she is being exposed to pornography. This is definitely something to pursue. Terry

 
Old 03-12-2004, 06:34 AM   #12
Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 305
ana_24 HB User
Re: Sexually promiscuous child... what can this mean?

Thank you everyone for caring enough to respond. Your suport means SO much to me!
Yesterday my boyfriend called his sister to let her know what has happened. She was very upset, talked to her fiance and he went over to his ex's house to speak to the girls. One thing that I forgot to mention is the Laura said that Melanie told her that her older sister does this to her and her little sister. Well, it turns out that they don't have an older sister. I am so confused about why this happend, if it happened, whether it's a cry for attention, who initiated it, it's all one big question.
I fell asleep early last night so I haven't talked to my boyfriend to find out what the result of the conversation with the girls was. I will find out today and will post an update. This is so far out of my area of expertise that I feel completely helpless. This sort of thing just does not happen in my family and it's hard for me to deal with it.

 
Old 03-12-2004, 06:39 AM   #13
Inactive
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: cincinnati Ohio USA
Posts: 652
maak823 HB User
Re: Sexually promiscuous child... what can this mean?

Sounds like a good place to start. There was a suggestion from an earlier post which counseling for adults was brought up- I think this is a very good idea- all of you will need help in coping with this and learn how to handle the situation. Thank goodness you and your boyfriend care enough to address it and not let the situation go untreated. The sister comment could be a cousing or a friend, who has told her that they are her sister. Often the perpetrator will convince the child that they are thier close relative and confidant, in order to gain the childs trust. My heart goes out to you and your family, especially this poor little girl who has been put through something that no one should have to deal with in thier lifetime.

Take Care and God Bless,
-M

Quote:
Originally Posted by ana_24
Thank you everyone for caring enough to respond. Your suport means SO much to me!
Yesterday my boyfriend called his sister to let her know what has happened. She was very upset, talked to her fiance and he went over to his ex's house to speak to the girls. One thing that I forgot to mention is the Laura said that Melanie told her that her older sister does this to her and her little sister. Well, it turns out that they don't have an older sister. I am so confused about why this happend, if it happened, whether it's a cry for attention, who initiated it, it's all one big question.
I fell asleep early last night so I haven't talked to my boyfriend to find out what the result of the conversation with the girls was. I will find out today and will post an update. This is so far out of my area of expertise that I feel completely helpless. This sort of thing just does not happen in my family and it's hard for me to deal with it.

 
Old 03-12-2004, 07:52 AM   #14
Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 305
ana_24 HB User
Re: Sexually promiscuous child... what can this mean?

I talked to my boyfriend and he said the other girl's father went to speak to her last night and she said she didn't know anything about this. I don't know why, but I had a feeling that may be the case.

 
Old 03-12-2004, 03:10 PM   #15
Senior Veteran
(female)
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Utah
Posts: 901
Angel77 HB User
Re: Sexually promiscuous child... what can this mean?

I'm sorry, I'm getting confused right along with you. This is going to snowball if the adults go from child to child and may cause more harm than good. I think that for right now, keep the children either apart or very well supervised (my son no longer has a door on his bedroom, that way, no surprises), not allowing closed doors, better yet, they stay in the main area of the house with the adults.

As for the adults, those who are adult enough to be handling this, need to all sit down and talk. Get a note book and write everything in it that has been said, done, seen or suspected, so it doesn't get more confused or things aren't left out. That will help pin-point a few things. Then, decide how to approach the kids. It's important not to point fingers or place blame, otherwise you'll never get to the bottom of it. If need be, bring all the girls into a room together, with all the adults and gently talk to them.... maybe something to the effect of, "we are concerned about what's going on. We are not angry but we need to understand all of it, why it's happening and what we can do to stop it. No one will be in trouble for speaking their mind and telling the truth. But, if you don't tell us everything, we may not be able to help in the best way possible."

Then, wait to see what they say. Try to refrain from anger, because, chances are, it originated with an adult. As far as the sister that doesn't exist, it could be a number of things. It may be a coping strategy, and at the most extreme end, kids who are abused will sometimes splinter off and develope another personality to deal with things. If I read right, the little girl that is the common thread is the one who created the sister who is doing this to everyone....if that's correct, she may have developed her as a way to cope with the extreme guilt she's feeling by acting out like this.

She knows it's wrong, but not to the extent that adults do. She knows it makes her sick inside and knows that it shouldn't have been done to her, or she wouldn't being making up stories to cover it up. The problem is, even though she knows it's wrong, she doesn't have the coping skills to stop it or change how she feels. She's probably scared to death that if she admits to what she's been doing (if, in fact she has been the instigator with the other children) that no one will love her and then she'll be all alone. No child wants that.

I think that's where you and your b/f come in. "Honey, we know that something has been going on that makes you feel really bad and we love you so much that we want you to tell us, so we can help you. We will love you no matter what you tell us and we'll never stop. But this type of behavior hurts everyone and we need to figure it out so that no one gets hurt anymore. It's going to be hard and I know you're scared but you will not be punished for telling us the truth. We will just work really hard together to make things better."

Then hold her while she cries...it will happen. Maybe make it as upbeat as possible, get some icecream, some floor pillows, etc and just try to keep it together while she talks. She will probably wander from subject to subject when it gets too painful, gently bring her back. After the fact, she may say something about it out of the blue, don't act shocked and don't put her off. If it's at an inappropriate place or time, quietly take her aside, listen and then explain that while you want to give your full attention right now, it's not possible and that you can pick up where you left off when you get home.

I would recommend your b/f see if he can get a guardian ad litem involved and start papers for custody. Does the mom have anything in her past or current life that would make it easier for him to get custody? Morals are a big thing with the judges. If he can show that she puts his daughter in danger by the revolving bedroom door and a few other things, compared with the stability his own home can offer, he stands at least a good chance of temporary custody until this issue is resolved.

I wouldn't let on to the ex what he's up to if he goes this route. You don't want to give her time to cause problems, take off with her or what not.

Does your boyfriend want custody? Does he have the means to get an attorney and support her? What kind of situation is it in your home? I'm sorry, I didn't catch if you live with him? I think it would be beneficial for all involved. She sounds like a wonderful little child who is caught up in a bad situation and living with a grown child who doesn't have the capacity to see past herself and her own self-created drama to take care of her daughter.

I grew up in a home where my mom set me aside for every man that walked into her life, as well as her friends. And the last husband decided that I looked like a younger, thinner version of my mom and it went from there. When it all came out, she was angry at ME!! She felt like I was competing for him! It got to the point, she was so mad at me that she told me she was going to send me to the mental home or a foster home. When the police became involved, she told me that if I told them my "lies" that she would make up so much stuff about me that no one would come with in ten feet of me again....and she was dead serious. So I walked into the police station and told the detective I was a liar.....I'd rather get in trouble with them for lying, than have to live with her! After that, she rarely spoke to me unless she was calling me the B or manipulative little B, smacking me, tearing me down or taking away the phone when I was on it and hanging it up after she clocked me in the head with it.

I know that sounds extreme, but this girl's bio mom sounds somewhat the same. And as she gets older, it will only esclate. It wasn't always that bad. It was hard, she threw a lot of things at me, hit me with wooden spoons and spatulas and was verbally abusive, but nothing compared to what the aftermath of that situation lead to. It was more important for her to have a man in her life, than the safety, well-being and happiness of her child (BTW, I wasn't the only child, just the only one treated this way).

So please, if possible, get that little girl out of there and get her therapy and let her know that she's loved more than life itself. She's going to need it. She's got a long road ahead.

Also, I seriously applaud you for being so interested in her well-being and wanting to help her. So few are like that. Most look at a non-bio child as a threat or irritation or don't care nearly as much as you do. You are a wonderful person...I wish there were more of you.

Please let me know how she's doing and how you are all holding up. Also, do a search on signs of abuse and ways to approach it. Maybe if you can print off the information it will help to ask the questions and keep the emotions under more control.

God Bless, I'll keep you all in my heart and prayers.......Angel
__________________
If you don't experience anything bad, you'll never appreciate the good when it comes around!!!

 
Closed Thread

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Board Replies Last Post
is my child being sexually abused? sue19 Family & Friends of the Mentally Ill 8 11-30-2010 02:41 PM
Sexually aggressive child? SocialWorks Children's Health 6 03-23-2010 10:43 AM
how do you know when you were sexually abused? vvaneeden Abuse Support 4 08-31-2009 03:27 PM
What do you do when you have a promiscuous child? Mzjacokes Parenting Issues 9 04-17-2008 08:04 PM
Is Lyme Sexually Transmitted? IL_gal Lyme Disease 27 08-25-2007 06:31 AM




Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




Sign Up Today!

Ask our community of thousands of members your health questions, and learn from others experiences. Join the conversation!

I want my free account

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 09:34 AM.



Site owned and operated by HealthBoards.comô
Terms of Use © 1998-2014 HealthBoards.comô All rights reserved.
Do not copy or redistribute in any form!