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Old 02-15-2008, 09:09 PM   #1
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was it rape?

hi,
i am not sure that this post belongs on this board, but i do not know where else to place it, i hope i am in the right place. i have a few questions. would it be considered rape if my boyfriend were to proceed to penetrate me though i was clearly attempting to resist his advances by moving away and saying "i cant" (though too shocked to say anything else such as 'stop' or 'no')? what if i were too intoxicated to speak or move and i was unable to get him off of me or express my objection?

 
Old 02-15-2008, 09:34 PM   #2
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Re: was it rape?

well, if your boyfriend took advantage of you when you were very drunk and penetrated even though clearly you didn't want him to, then I suppose you could consider it rape.

But, you also have to ask yourself...were you actually clear in telling him you didn't want him to? If you were too drunk to speak, say no, or get up and leave, then how can you be sure that you actually did resist at all? There's a fine line sometimes between making a poor decision while under the influence of alcohol, and being raped. If you and your bf were both drunk and had sex, and now, sober, you wish you hadn't and think that you should have stopped him, then I don't think that rape is the correct term for it.

 
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Old 02-15-2008, 11:18 PM   #3
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Re: was it rape?

If you were clearly letting him know you were not consenting, or if you were too drunk to give consent, then yes, it was rape. the kind that is next to impossible to prosecute in a court of law, but yes, rape nonetheless. When a girl goes to a frat party and gets so drunk that she passes out, and someone puts her on a bed in one of the rooms, and some guy sneaks in and has sex with her that's rape as well because she was unable to clearly give consent. Just because this guy is your boyfriend doesn't mean he has the right to assume consent.

LIke I said very very hard to procecute in court, but yes, I'd say this was rape. If it were me, I'd think long and hard before continuing to see him.

 
Old 02-16-2008, 11:36 AM   #4
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Re: was it rape?

In my opinion, yes it is rape. Any sex absent a clear yes is rape. A man cannot assume that until you say NO it's a yes. The opposite is true - a man should assume it's a NO and that you do not consent until you clearly say yes and clearly give your explicit consent. If you don't clearly say yes or are intoxicated and incapable of consenting (or are too scared to move or say anything) - then that means NO. It is NO until you clearly say it's yes. It's pretty obvious that you did not say YES - so you did not consent.

Whether or not you actually said "NO" isn't the point. Legally and morally, it's NO until you say otherwise. So the point is that because you didn't say YES and didn't consent, he had no right to have sex with you. He proceeded as if it is Yes until you say No. That's just wrong. It's not your job to control him, it's his job to control himself.

It's a pretty clear concept. It's like going into someone's house. You assume you're not allowed to enter a person's house until they invite you in. You do not assume that you can walk into a person's house uninvited and that it's okay until they tell you to get out! No one is going to argue that walking into a person's house without permission is a trespass. It's the exact same here - he had no right to enter you until you explicitly invited him. It's not assumed he's invited until you say otherwise. It's assumed he's not invited in and not allowed to just open the door and waltz on in. A person knocks, waits for the person to answer and then waits to see if they say it's ok. Same deal here. Only in your case, he assumed it was okay, didn't ask, didn't wait for your answer and when you said "i can't" he just ignored you and entered anyway.

What he did is wrong. Very very wrong. He had sex with you without your consent. That's exactly what rape is. When it comes to consent, it's not yes until you say no. It's no until you say yes. You did not say yes!

I'm so sorry that this happened to you. Have you considered calling a sexual assault help line? it might help to talk to someone about it. They are anonymous.

Big Hugs

 
Old 02-16-2008, 12:08 PM   #5
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Re: was it rape?

I understand what Amy is saying, but I think that where sex is concerned, there is gray area. You see girls all the time, all over a guy when they leave a club, all over them on the way back to their apt, they invite him in, they keep going, going...maybe in their heads they're thinking, "I'll do everything except penetration with this guy..." but honestly, if a girl just keeps going further and further with a guy with no limits set, I do'nt think he's a criminal if he keeps going as long as the girl doesn't say STOP. Especially if they are bf/gf.
I have seen plenty of girls at college and beyond who have gotten plastered at bars, gone home with guys that they normally wouldn't have given a second look at, and the next day say "what was I thinking? how could I have slept with this guy??" And if you can drive past a night club circa 2am and see girls falling all over the place drunk, but having screaming fights with girlfriends, or boyfriends, then you know that it doesn't take much to give a simple "no" or a shove if he doesn't stop. Of course if he persists after that it's rape. But, honestly, there is an easy solution to this: if you're a girl, DON'T GO GET SO DRUNK THAT YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE SAYING OR DOING. or, if you insist on going out and getting plastered, have a deal with your girlfriends or whoever your with, that at the end of the night, you touch base and keep each other in check.

This is all hypothetical and in no way reflects on blue712, only she knows if she truly made an effort to stop this guy, or made it clear to him in one way or another that she did not want to have sex with him. Blue, I hope you've at least had a talk with this guy about what happened, if you used protection, if you're at risk for any illnesses, and you've let him know that it is unacceptable in your eyes.

 
Old 02-16-2008, 01:57 PM   #6
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Re: was it rape?

actually, i was referring to two seperate occasions (with this ex-boyfriend). once where i had been drinking (yes, it was a mistake on my part), and another where i was sober. when i hadnt been drinking, i was just very shocked and scared, i wish i had said something more than 'i cant' but i felt physically unable, i dont know if it would have made a difference either way. also i should note that he was completely sober both times. when i was intoxicated i was so gone that i was drifting in and out of consciousness, but i do remember him on top of me and not being able to push him off or speak, just feeling really sick and wanting it all to be over with.

Last edited by blue712; 02-16-2008 at 02:05 PM.

 
Old 02-16-2008, 02:08 PM   #7
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Re: was it rape?

See it is that type of thinking the bf/gf or husband/wife that screws with people's heads. Rape is rape no matter the "coupledom" or noncoupledom. There have been cases of wives filing rape charges against husbands. Yes it can be harder to prove because so many people are under the assumption that sex within a couple relationship is always consentual(sp). But there are some who do see that isnt so and more and more courts are supporting cases of spousal rape. Still not near enough to bring it to the light of day but still some are.
As for this situation it can be iffy. If you kept resisting even if you werent issuing a vocal NO it can be seen as rape. Witht he drinking yes it is a clear cut case of rape. There are laws now backing that up whether you are in a relationship or not. If you can not give consent due to being to drunk it is rape.
I want to strongly suggest you dump the bf and seek out counseling for yourself. The reason I say that is because you have been raped twice now and really should have someone to talk to about that.
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Old 02-16-2008, 03:18 PM   #8
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Re: was it rape?

Quote:
when i was intoxicated i was so gone that i was drifting in and out of consciousness, but i do remember him on top of me and not being able to push him off or speak,
Wow, that is sick of him to have had sex with you while you were slipping in and out of unconsciousness! How could it be enjoyable to sleep with someone who is barely conscious? He sounds like a pig.

It worries me how you say the other time you were sober but afraid to resist him. You have to learn to speak up and stand up for yourself! It's your body and you decide what happens to it.
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Old 02-16-2008, 05:38 PM   #9
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Re: was it rape?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GypsyArcher View Post
Wow, that is sick of him to have had sex with you while you were slipping in and out of unconsciousness! How could it be enjoyable to sleep with someone who is barely conscious? He sounds like a pig.

It worries me how you say the other time you were sober but afraid to resist him. You have to learn to speak up and stand up for yourself! It's your body and you decide what happens to it.
A 100% agreed, and it also worries me more that you accepted to have sex AGAIN (since this happened twice) with him despite having known what a pig he could be!

Last edited by Nina000; 02-16-2008 at 05:45 PM.

 
Old 02-17-2008, 08:08 AM   #10
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Re: was it rape?

I agree with some of what the other posters have said.

I think you can do much better in picking a boyfriend who will show you more respect. For now though, I think you will do better in preventing these situations in the future if you take more responsibiity for your own actions.

No one else seems to be looking out for you. It is in your best interest to start looking out for yourself and speak out loud and clear when your need arises.

HOOP! (seriously)

 
Old 02-17-2008, 12:36 PM   #11
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Re: was it rape?

Quote:
Originally Posted by amy2705 View Post
In my opinion, yes it is rape. Any sex absent a clear yes is rape. A man cannot assume that until you say NO it's a yes. The opposite is true - a man should assume it's a NO and that you do not consent until you clearly say yes and clearly give your explicit consent. If you don't clearly say yes or are intoxicated and incapable of consenting (or are too scared to move or say anything) - then that means NO. It is NO until you clearly say it's yes. It's pretty obvious that you did not say YES - so you did not consent.


Big Hugs
Amy and the other posters are right, and good luck with finding a boyfriend who shows you proper respect and affection! You don’t need this one!

Big hugs from me too!

 
Old 02-18-2008, 08:05 AM   #12
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Re: was it rape?

I was raped by my first boyfriend. Although I never took any action, it still has affected me in many ways in my relationships. He was wonderful to me otherwise but got drunk one night and as I was lecturing him in the back yard (to get some privacy from my father), he forced me down on the ground, held my mouth shut and I couldn’t do anything considering I weighed about 90 pounds and he was about 250. I did say no and stop but he would just put more weight on me so I decided to shut up. When all was said and done, I got up and ran into the house, with grass tangled in the back of my hair and my brother pointed out to me that my back was bleeding through my t-shirt.

I never told anyone in fear because amazingly, I still loved him and figured I had already had sex with him multiple times (As he had taken my virginity a year before). Needles to say, I never spoke to him again. Although this act was unforgivable, I still appreciated what he did for me as I was brought up in an abusive household and he helped me through hard times.

This IS rape and I only hope that you can take some form of action against this man and get the heck away from him ASAP! Don’t fool yourself into believing that this is acceptable. You don’t deserve to be treated that way!

((((((Hugs))))) Jul
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Old 02-19-2008, 06:19 AM   #13
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Re: was it rape?

I have a question also pertaining to this same topic..
What about if you were sleeping or just waking up and really groggy, and he penetrated you?
IS that rape also?

 
Old 02-19-2008, 07:20 AM   #14
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Re: was it rape?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jess86 View Post
I have a question also pertaining to this same topic..
What about if you were sleeping or just waking up and really groggy, and he penetrated you?
IS that rape also?
Technically, yes. Whenever you are unwilling or unable to give consent (and that includes being asleep or unconscious, regardless of your previous sexual history with the person) and you are not an active and willing participant in the act, then yes, it's rape. Hard to prosecute in a court of law, but rape nonetheless.

 
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