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Old 12-04-2005, 07:32 PM   #1
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What choice would you make?

Ok ladies, just say this choice is before you. What would you do if this was you?

You're with a man who has the following qualities:

He's an alcoholic
He can't drive (no license)
He's on probation for forcible sodomy on a child under 12
He has a violent temper and has hit you before
He's jealous and possesive
He has no money, no career, no formal education

But he likes the same basic things you like and can be sweet sometimes.

And a guy with these qualities is deeply in love with you and wants you:

He doesn't drink
He drives (of course)
He's not on probation for any criminal offense, matter of fact he's completely unknown to law enforcement.
Kids love him and follow him everywhere.
He's patient and caring
He owns a small business and can at times make good money (and at other times nothing)
He raised your children to be upstanding, smart, honor students and atheletes
He's very good looking compared to the other guy.

But, he doesn't like as many of the same basic things, and when you were with him before (where the kids came from) he ignored your needs and took you for granted.

Stay with the first guy, you get to keep on driving your guy to work everyday, then you get to chop firewood to make ends meet until he gets off work and you bring him home.

Go with the second guy, and you'll never have to chop wood or worry about bills like that again. You also get your kids back. But if first guy finds out, there is a very, very good chance he'll KILL you. You know that you will get beaten for even talking about it.

What do you do? I know this looks like a no-brainer, but there is honestly some doubt as to the outcome that is desired. I want opinions from women. Do you take the chance that the second guy has changed and will not ever take you for granted again? Do you stay where you are because you know the deal there and may not like the change? Would the answer change if you honestly believed for a long time that the second guy hated you? What if you felt you would have to move away from all your friends and family in order to be with the new guy? Would that change your minds?

I ask all this because I sit here waiting to know. I've thought about every scenario humanly possible. From the ones where there is a happy ending to the ones where we all die to everything in between. I can't distinguish what is more likely from what isn't anymore. I just don't know what's going to happen. Since I can't get a female viewpoint that isn't clouded by knowing me too well, I ask here. Come on ladies. Don't be shy. What do you think?

 
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Old 12-04-2005, 07:41 PM   #2
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Re: What choice would you make?

Guy #2.

If you aren't sure about guy #2, still, please move on to guy #3 immediately.

 
Old 12-04-2005, 07:48 PM   #3
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Re: What choice would you make?

I know you asked you for the opinions of women, but this male is wondering something. Why aren't you considering option 3 which is being with neither guy? The second guy may sound a lot better than the first, but you don't have to pick one. You have the option of going out there and finding someone else.

 
Old 12-04-2005, 07:55 PM   #4
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Re: What choice would you make?

My vote would be to go for guy#2....being with guy#1 is like a death sentence anyway so I would take the risk and go with guy#2 just to find myself some happiness. The safety & security would be worth all the risks.

Nobody deserves to be with a guy#1.....in fact guy#2 could be the one who saves my life!!!

I know that you are sorry for what happened between you and your ex wife and that you are now a better man. I say go apologize and beg for her forgiveness...tell her that you want to make up for your mistakes & to be her hero and save her from the life of agony that she is now living and to have no shame in wanting to ask for your help...that you are there for her, love her and want to make up for all the mistakes of the past if she will have you back. Then make sure that you find a safe place for her, where she can be happy the way she deserves to be.

Hope this helps...Goody

 
Old 12-04-2005, 08:33 PM   #5
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Re: What choice would you make?

If I was this lady, I would definately NEVER EVER CONSIDER guy No. 1. If I was considering him on ANY level I would know that I needed some serious counselling and soul searching. In regard to guy No. 2 - I would need to feel as though he was taking my emotional needs seriously and was also perhaps prepared to enter into couple counselling.

HOWEVER.....I think this lady should take some time ALONE to sort out her life and feelings for self BEFORE she makes any further committments to anyone.

 
Old 12-05-2005, 07:43 AM   #6
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Re: What choice would you make?

I am a mother to 3 boys and I am going to be blunt here!

How you can even consider a man like that is beyond me. Have you ever stopped to think about that child once?

Why is it that children follow guy number two around?

 
Old 12-05-2005, 08:00 AM   #7
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Re: What choice would you make?

lose them both and take some time to yourself
you don't need to be dependent on anyone
take care of yourself
you will feel better about yourself

 
Old 12-05-2005, 08:07 AM   #8
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Re: What choice would you make?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ibeeshell
I am a mother to 3 boys and I am going to be blunt here!

How you can even consider a man like that is beyond me. Have you ever stopped to think about that child once?

Why is it that children follow guy number two around?
I think you misunderstood my post. I'm guy number two. Children love me. I love children. I enjoy their company and listen to them. I play with them. It's fun and it's one of the very few things I do that I actually enjoy in my life. They know I would never hurt them or do anything wrong. They trust me. Even teenagers love me for some reason. I have never been to a PTA meeting, never been to any school function other than my son's one year of football. (Went to every game.) Yet I am the most popular dad in school. They confide in me and tell me things their parents would give their souls to know. It's just the way that I am.

No one that knows her can understand what she sees in guy number 1. None of her family likes him. She honestly had no idea at all in any way that I still have feelings for her. We had no contact at all in any fashion from 10-93 until 7-05. We've talked once since then, on my birthday when she said "I will always love you for the way you raised our kids" and asked for that song. We didn't talk privately at all (without guy 1 around) when I saw her on 7-05 and 8-05. I don't know how they met or anything at all about the circumstances of their relationship. I think this is all going to be quite a shock to her.

I'm trying to see from her point of view. She lives in rural West Virginia. I know what it's like there. Her options are extremely limited. She has to live somewhere and she has to eat. If he treats her half decent most the time and takes some form of care of her she may love him. But would she believe that I can make her life better? Would she want me to? Is the chance to get to know your children after not seeing them at all for 15 years enough of an incentive to overcome any fears or doubts that she might have?

Last edited by -CvC-; 12-05-2005 at 08:17 AM.

 
Old 12-05-2005, 08:24 AM   #9
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Re: What choice would you make?

It might sound hard but my opinion is that you shouldn't do it for your kids, they wont thank you for it when they grow up. They need you to be happy because if you dont that unhappyness will follow them and you around. I dont believe in staying in a relationship for the sake of your children. Yes it does work sometimes but i can only give you advice on my past history the same as everyone else.

# 2 sounds way better than #1 but think to your self #3 is out there somewhere. Everything happens for a reason. Make mistakes, we all do just learn from them at the same time.

 
Old 12-05-2005, 08:28 AM   #10
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Re: What choice would you make?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrscarlh
wait a sec what about they way it is in w.v ????? i lived in a rural part of w.v and i loved it there i never had a prob with guys there i just happend to meet a more wonderfull man who happens to live in il. and got married i still have a lot of freinds in w.v. and fam there there is prob with men like that everywhere not just in w.v.
Not a dig on WV men. I was born and raised there and it's where my heart resides. But you did find a better man elsewhere, didn't you?

 
Old 12-05-2005, 01:59 PM   #11
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Re: What choice would you make?

I'm sorry but I would never want to be with someone who would consider being with man #1. She's a very messed up person to be involved with someone like that who has children. Please, please tell me those kids are NEVER around that man.

 
Old 12-05-2005, 02:56 PM   #12
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Re: What choice would you make?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver Lining
I'm sorry but I would never want to be with someone who would consider being with man #1. She's a very messed up person to be involved with someone like that who has children. Please, please tell me those kids are NEVER around that man.

The kids are 16 and 18. Both of them are much larger than man #1 and could easily beat him to death if he got out of line in any way. They've never spent any time with him without me around except for the 18 year old who spent half a day with the two of them last week.

Yes, she is pretty messed up. I won't deny that she has a lot of problems. It's a good bet there are some serious self esteem issues in there also. But as I now realise, it's my fault she is messed up. I never understood the damage I have done in other people's lives until last week. I see it now and it honestly makes me cry buckets. I didn't mean to hurt anyone. I didn't know what I was doing it at the time. I was just being me and doing what I thought I should do. I didn't listen to my heart or anything else. And I made her believe it was her fault. I made her think that she was to blame for everything. I thought it was her fault. She still thinks it was. She believes (as far as I know) that she just went crazy all of a sudden, got horribly depressed, fell into the arms of the guy next door and in doing so betrayed the guy who loved her more than anything in the world and made him hate her. I garuntee that to this day she still feels guilty for that. So yeah, she's messed up. Her sister said that after that guy beat her almost to death with that baseball bat in 2000 that she "lost her spirit" and hasn't been the same. The woman I knew wouldn't have spent one second with a guy that had hit her.

She's been abandoned, made to believe she was worthless, beaten, and told she was evil for pretty much 15 years. It's my fault. I should have seen what was going on, but I was 21 years old. I didn't know any better. So I ran away. Yes I took my kids and devoted myself to them completely and became "Mr. Upstanding". I look real good to everyone around me. But inside I now know the hideous, plain truth. It wasn't easy raising those kids without her. I put myself through so much loneliness and heartache. Not only myself, but the kids too. I really thought she didn't love them. I told them that. Hundreds of times. She has missed every single milestone since the youngest learned to walk. Instead of her being there for them I made her think she wasn't worthy of them and that they were better off without her. I am the monster, not her. So she's with a guy who is really a bottom dweller. I bet she thinks it's all she deserves. I am better that he is. I understand the truth now. It took 15 years to see it, and it may very well be too late. The years of abuse and alcohol have bound to have taken a toll on her. But if there's the slightest bit of hope left I am going to whatever I can to make the rest of her life as happy, secure and fufulling as humanly possible.

I never stopped loving her for one minute. I told myself I did, but my actions never bore that out. She apparently still has some kind of feelings for me. I just want her back. She has a huge choice to make and a lot of things are going to different in her life if she chooses me. But I don't know if she can make that leap of faith. I don't know if it has just been too long, or that too much has happened to her for her to ever be happy again. Or even if I can make her that way. But I am going to try. I have to.

 
Old 12-05-2005, 09:42 PM   #13
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Re: What choice would you make?

Sorry, I misread your post.

 
Old 12-06-2005, 09:51 AM   #14
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Re: What choice would you make?

all i know is never ever tell guy 1 about guy 2! i had a ex who was pysco and hit me, i told him i was leaving and he assumed for another guy i was friends with and tried to kill me and himself. luckly im still here unfortunatly he is too. Dont jump out of a relationship that is so horrible and expect to jump into a fairytale. You might not know it but you will take some of your first relationship with you. Just be carefull. Have you tried to be alone? Maybe it would be good for you and your kids. Just take it slow! But if i were you i would pack and run, run fast from the other guy! you and your kids are more important!!! Good luck.

 
Old 12-06-2005, 02:38 PM   #15
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Re: What choice would you make?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver Lining
I really don't get why this is all your fault. Why did you guys break up in the first place??? Did she cheat on you? How is that your fault? Did you abuse her physically?
I never laid a hand on her. It's not in me to hurt a woman. I'd sooner cut off my hand than use it to hurt a female. Yeah, she cheated on me. How is that it's my fault? Well, she did love me. I know she did. She trusted me to take care of her and to make sure she had her needs met. And she did have food and shelter. I made certain of that. But was paranoid she was going to leave me or cheat on me. I just couldn't believe that she really wanted me. I thought I had to keep up on her every minute to make sure that she wouldn't find someone better. In short, I made her a prisoner of my own fears. I didn't let her have any life outside of me whatsoever. I wouldn't let her work because I was afraid that she would meet another guy. Then I quit working because I was afraid she would find someone while I was at work. I was spending 24 hours a day, 7 days a week with her.

But I wasn't really there. She was telling me in the best way she could what she needed and I didn't hear any of it. I could have eased up, listened to what she needed, done it, and things would have gotten better. We had a family together. We loved each other. But I didn't listen to a word she said. I kept right on getting more and more paranoid. So she started rebelling. Then I got even more paranoid. I let her do less and less and she started acting out more and more. The bigger controlling monster I became, the more lewd and outrageous she became.

Then the guy next door came slithering along and noticed what was going on. He befriended her. He gained her trust. He listened to her problems. He acted like he cared about what she was feeling. He seemed to understand.

What would you have done if you were her? I mean, really. She was 20 years old. He wasn't good looking or rich or anything. He just listened to her. He did what I was supposed to be doing and so she did was she was supposed to be doing with me with him. I don't blame her. Now that I look back on it I wonder how on Earth I could have ever been like that.

But it gets better. Oh yeah, it gets much better. People are going to hate me for this. I do, so it's ok. I brainwashed her to think she was being evil. It sounds far fetched, but it's true. I actually made her believe that she was crazy. That she betrayed me, her family, her kids, everyone. I made her think that she was the most worthless person on the planet. I put her on the great mother of all ungodly guilt trips. It was so effective she gave me her kids and never once came back for them. She thought that she wasn't worthy of them. That she was a horrible person who would ruin them.

And I didn't even know I did a single bit of any of it. That's what makes me so incredibly sad and remorseful. I had no idea I was doing any of it at all. I believed I was right until last week. I believed she was evil. I thought she purposely set out to hurt my feelings, break up our family, and leave me to tend the kids while she had fun. I thought her rebellion was hatred for me. I thought my paranoia and deaf ear were concern for her and our relationship. I believed I did everything I could to keep us together when in fact I did everything I could to drive us apart. I blamed her for everything that happened.

All the while though I still loved her. Even though I told myself I hated her for what she did to me. Whenever I tried to date it never felt right. I am not a bad looking guy. I know it's hard to convey on the internet where everyone can be a supermodel if they pretend, but really, women find me incredibly attractive. I have the ability to make them walk into things if I dress up the right way. If I wanted to have a woman, I could. But I haven't been in a relationship but for two out of the last 180 or so months I have been divorced/seperated. I have went through the motions, and pretended to try, but there has been no motivation. I have several dozen women on these single sites wanting to meet me, but I can't even force myself to send them an email. I mean, I know I'm single now and that her and I are over and all that, and until last week that's they way I knew it was going to be forever.
It still didn't and doesn't matter. I have no desire for anyone else and never have. If she rejects me, which she will probably do, I still don't ever see myself dating again. I'd rather not have anyone if I can't have her. I've been 100% celebate for over 9 years. There only became a slim chance in hades of her every being mine again a week ago. If I am wrong about all this, nothing will change for me. Except now I will know why instead of sitting around for another 15 years asleep wondering what I did wrong. I can't say I was or will be perfectly happy without human companionship, but I can and do live that way and have for a long, long time. I didn't understand why before, it was just the way it was. I thought I was alone because I was a loser and a weakling and scared of women. I thought I hated my ex wife. I was starting to hate women in general.

All this was weighing down on me really hard. It was looking for a way out and finding it. Ever go a week without eating? Ever sit around depressed like your whole life is over and not know why? I was in a depression that I can honestly say was getting close to fatal. I didn't know why I felt so bad. I had no hope, there was no light on the end of the tunnel for me. No matter how much my boys care for me, no matter how much my sisters and mother depend on me, nothing seemed to matter to me at all. I just wanted to crawl into a hole and die.

And then my 37th birthday came. I was falling deeper and deeper into despair. The kids and family tried and tried to cheer me up, but all they did was annoy me. I was sitting in my room, listening to music, crying to myself and my youngest son came into the room with the phone. It was her. They didn't call her. I checked the cell phone records thing. She called me. Right then. Out of the blue and told me "She will always love me for the job I did raising our kids" and asked for the song "I keep forgetting". I could hear in her voice what she really meant. I told her I was coming to see her on her birthday. At my darkest moment she reached out and saved me. She gave me hope where there was absolutely none at all before. There is no way on Earth she could have known how I was feeling right then. If she had called me any other time before then there would have been a different outcome.

The next morning I woke up and knew the truth. For the first time in my life I understood it all. It has been like a million neutron stars have been taken off my back. Had she called and begged me to take her back this spring I would have been mean and laughed at her. (And dying inside silently) Any other day or time would have been different, but she called right at the second where I was literally giving up my last bit of hope in life.

Now I know what I have to do. I have to have her back. I have been happy once in the last 15 years. That was for 20 seconds this summer talking to her in her motel room with the kids and guy #1. It was magic. I will NEVER treat her poorly or smother her or not listen to her for one second again. If she takes that one last chance on me, if there is anything at all in her heart for me I will make her the most happy person that could ever be. If she will let me.

Quite a long answer to such a short question but the kids are sick or hearing it and the dog doesn't react. If I don't let this stuff out I will explode.

 
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