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Old 06-20-2006, 10:26 AM   #1
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Veronica_Mars HB User
Personality types and relationships

Hi everyone,

I have been wanting to post about this for awhile...I've always been interested in psychology and personality, maybe because I'm so strange. Lately I am figuring myself out more and more, which is helpful, and it occurs to me that our tendencies/natures probably have a huge impact on how we relate to other people, especially in relationships. I was wondering if anyone else has been interested in this or thinks that understanding our personalities better could help us be better with other people? For me I think it could definitely help me learn to date in a wiser manner. Anyway I was just curious what you think, especially those of you with similar personalities to me...I know that includes at least Sophia!

So anyway my favorite author about this subject, David Keirsey, wrote an excellent book called Please Understand Me 2, which I am quoting below as an example of why I think this sort of thing is accurate (about me, at least) and helpful in general. This is what he has to say about my personality type, as he classifies it:



All NTs are good at planning operations, but Mastermind INTJs are head and shoulders above all the rest in contingency planning or what is called entailment management. A contingency plan has if-thens in it, put there to deal with foreseeable operational errors and shortages of personnel and materiel. All sorts of contingencies are bound to arise when any complex project is undertaken, from planning a family vacation in Europe to preparing for the invasion of Europe as in World War II. Such operations involve many, many steps, each of which must be coordinated to follow each other in a necessary progression, and each of which can be subject to unforeseen problems. Masterminds are able to grasp how each step necessitates or entails the next, and to prepare alternatives for difficulties that are likely to arise. INTJs never set the course of their current project without a Plan A firmly in mind, but they are always prepared to switch to Plan B or C or D if called for.

As a variant of Plato's Rationals and Aristotle's Dialecticals, the INTJs are little different from the other NTs in most respects. Like all the rationals, they are abstract in their communication and utilitarian in how they implement their goals. They choose to study science, are preoccupied with technology, and work well with systems. Their point of view is pragmatic, skeptical, relativistic, focused on spatial intersections and intervals of time. They base their self-image on being ingenious, autonomous, and resolute. They would if possible be calm, they trust reason, are hungry for achievement, seek knowledge, prize deference, and aspire to be wizards of science and technology. Intellectually, they are prone to prize strategy far more than diplomacy, tactics, and especially logistics.

Masterminds are rare, comprising no more than one percent of the total population, and they are rarely encountered outside their office, factory, or laboratory. Although they are highly capable leaders, INTJs are not at all eager to take command, preferring to stay in the background until others demonstrate their inability to lead. Once in charge however, they are thoroughgoing pragmatists, seeing reality as nothing more than a chess board for working out and refining their strategies. When planning, the Mastermind is completely open-minded and will entertain any idea holding promise of utility. Fruitful theories are quickly applied, all else discarded.

To the INTJ, order is never arbitrary, set in concrete, but can be improved. Thus authority based on degrees, credentials, title, or celebrity does not impress them, nor do slogans or catchwords. They will adopt ideas only if they are useful, which is to say if they work efficiently toward accomplishing well-defined goals. Only ideas that make sense to them are adopted; those that don't, aren't, no matter who the author is.

Masterminds tend to be much more self confident than other Rationals, having usually developed a very strong will. Decisions come easily to them; indeed, they can hardly rest until they have things settled and decided. They have a drive to completion, always with an eye to long term consequences. Ideas seem to carry their own force for them, although they subject every idea to the test of usefulness. Difficulties are highly stimulating to INTJs, who love responding to a problem that requires a creative solution. These traits of character lead them to occupations where theoretical models can be translated into actuality. They build data and human systems wherever they work, if given the slightest opportunity. They can be outstanding in scientific research and as executives in businesses.

These seclusive coordinators usually rise to positions of responsibility, for they work long and hard and are steady in their pursuit of goals, sparing neither their own time or effort nor that of their colleagues and employees. They tend, ordinarily, to verbalize the positive and to eschew comments of a negative nature; they are more interested in moving an organization forward than in dwelling on the mistakes of the past. However, they can become single minded at times, which can be a weakness in their careers, for by focusing so tightly on their own pursuits they can ignore the points of view and wishes of others. Masterminds are certain that both internal and external consistency are indispensable in the well-run organization, and if they encounter problems of overlapping functions, duplication of effor, inefficient paper flow, and waste of human and material resources, they are quick to realign operations to the forgotten goal. Remember, their imperative is always cost-effectiveness.

INTJs are the highest achievers in school of all the types. And on the job, because of their tendency to drive others as hard as they drive themselves, they often seem demanding and difficult to satisfy. Their fellow workers often feel as if a Mastermind can see right through them, and often believe they find them wanting. This tendency of people to feel transparent, and even incompetant, in their presence often results in working relationships which have some psychological distance. Colleagues may describe INTJs as unemotional and at times cold and dispassionate, when in truth they are merely taking the goals of an institution seriously, and continually striving to achieve these goals.

Fortunately, indifference or criticism from their fellow workers does not particularly bother Masterminds, if they believe that they are right. All in all, they make dedicated, loyal employees whose loyalties are directed toward the system, rather than toward individuals within the system. Masterminds want harmony and order in their home and in their relationships, but not at the cost of having a submissive mate. The most independent of all types, INTJs want their mates to be independent as well, able to stand up to the sometimes formidable strength of their personality. Courtship is a special problem for Masterminds, since they regard the selection of a mate as a rational process, a matter of finding someone who correlates highly with their mental list of physical and intellectual requirements. They know quickly, usually on the first or second date, whether or not a relationship has any future, and they will not waste their time on anyone who holds little promise.

In general, masterminds rely on their head and not their heart to make these choices, and at times, therefore, they will seem cold and calculating. Even in more casual social situations, they may appear cold and may neglect to observe small rituals designed to put others at ease. For example, INTJs may communicate that time is wasted if used for idle chitchat, and thus people receive a sense of hurry from them which is not often intended. Make no mistake, the emotions of an INTJ are hard to read, and neither a male or female of this type is apt to be very outgoing or emotionally expressive. On the contrary, they have a strong need for privacy. But for all that, Masterminds are deeply emotional, even romantic types, and once they have decided a person is worthy of them, they make passionate and loyal mates, almost hypersensitive to signals of rejection from their loved one. With their children, Masterminds are loving and unfailing in their devotion. Their children are a major focus in life and they loyally support them and allow them to develop in directions of their own choosing. These supremely definite INTJs encourage independence of action and attitude in their offspring.

Wishing to control events, the reserved and scheduling Masterminds (INTJs) are probably more systematic than all other types in choosing a mate. Mate selection must be done in a logical, methodical way, with each candidate required to meet certain criteria, or else quickly dropped. In any event, Masterminds will rarely go wrong with an expressive and probing Champion (ENFP). On the one hand, they speak the same language of ideas and fantasies, but ENFPs also compliment INTJs significantly, bringing to a relationship an enthusiastic and effervescent enjoyment and wonderment about lifeóthe very antithesis of the tightly focused, thoughtful exactitude of the master of contingency planning.

Last edited by Veronica_Mars; 06-20-2006 at 10:30 AM.

 
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Old 06-20-2006, 11:06 AM   #2
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Re: Personality types and relationships

Hey Veronica,
It's so great to see that I am not the only one interested in personality types and relationships. Just took the Myers-Briggs test online a few weeks ago and came up as an INFP. I read through all the Internet literature and discovered this INFP fit me so well to a tee that it was literally scary. On the positive side, I have an exceptional intuition into other people and their problems, am a great friend and counselor, and care deeply and authentically about the world and important causes. On the negative side, an extreme dislike of conflict and criticism which I go to great lengths to avoid. Unfortunately, anxiety and depression are common symptoms among these INFPs but I already knew this about myself. Interestingly enough, INFP males are extremely rare (only about 1% of the population) and their ideal mates are almost as rare to find. We are caring, loving, and romantic, and possess a high sex drive (all true in my case but have let my anxiety overwhelm my ability to develop relationships). The girl I am currently talking to is really intrigued by me and thought I was a shrink (actually I am a lawyer) because my communication skills are so strong. She said I was not asking her "guy things" and this fact put her more at ease but also made her more skeptical. I am not gay or bisexual but am one of those rare guys who is sensitive and complex. You can imagine how difficult it is for people (especially women) to understand and accept me.

mrslots

 
Old 06-20-2006, 12:18 PM   #3
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Veronica_Mars HB User
Re: Personality types and relationships

Hey Mrslots, thanks for writing back! It is so cool and interesting to hear another perspective on this stuff, especially from someone with a different personality type. It can all be kind of confusing because everyone uses slightly different labels for each type and character trait, but I guess I should have been specific so that everyone knows what I am talking about. I am so glad you did though! I will have to read what my books say about you and then construct a more intelligent and informed response, lol. But what type are you supposed to be most compatible with? I know what you mean about having trouble finding people who really get you and fit with you as I am also an unusual type and just an odd, particular person in general. Hey, I'm going to be a lawyer too--I wonder if we would get along? Probably! It's interesting what you said about men and women because I often feel like my personality and just my general outlook is more suited to being a man--I like being a girl though because it's an excuse to be less brave and dirty and to do less grunt work. Also it's nice to relate to men in a sexual way, because I love men, but anyway, it's cool to come across someone else who feels like their personality is more typical of the other gender.

For people who are interested in this stuff, I would recommend doing some internet research or if you want to take out a library book or something, look for one by David Keirsey or Isabel Myers-Briggs. Otherwise you could search for information on myers-briggs typing (that is where you get the 4 letters, which most people believe are 16 variations on four basic personality types, mine being NT). The best free internet test I have seen to determine one's personality type is called the Keirsey temperment sorter and I'm sure you can find it pretty easily online. I will post other ways to find out about this stuff when I can because I don't know much about the other types! Anyway thanks again Mrslots for replying, and I hope you tell me more about your personality and relationships etc.

 
Old 06-20-2006, 01:26 PM   #4
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cark HB User
Re: Personality types and relationships

Im an intj as is my husband. I never got along with anyone nor was very happy with a partner until I met him.
Personality type has a heck of a lot to do with successful relationships. I do suggest taking the long test and not the little one onlline.. its not as accurate.

 
Old 06-20-2006, 01:39 PM   #5
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Veronica_Mars HB User
Re: Personality types and relationships

Hey awesome, other INTJs! I SOOO know what you mean about not getting along with anyone or being happy with people who aren't like you/don't get you. That could not be more true for me as well...so do you think I should subject all potential mates to this test?

I have a link to one of the good tests, but I don't know if it is ok to put it here. If it is not ok I am sorry and I will take it down.

[url]http://www.humanmetrics.com/cgi-win/JTypes2.asp[/url]

Last edited by Veronica_Mars; 06-20-2006 at 01:41 PM.

 
Old 06-20-2006, 01:41 PM   #6
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heavenisnevaeh2 HB User
Re: Personality types and relationships

hi,
yes i am very interested. i have been for many years, studying other peoples personalities and what i find most interesting, i know about more people than i know myself. I found that i know very little about myself and how to keep me happy.
i'm on a new journey now.

 
Old 06-20-2006, 02:08 PM   #7
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LostMyHeart HB User
Re: Personality types and relationships

Everytime I do that test - I never feel the explanation of my type (ISFP) fits me.

I don't know if that means I'm not being true to my true-self, or I'm just really messed up!

 
Old 06-20-2006, 02:10 PM   #8
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cark HB User
Re: Personality types and relationships

Quote:
Originally Posted by Veronica_Mars
Hey awesome, other INTJs! I SOOO know what you mean about not getting along with anyone or being happy with people who aren't like you/don't get you. That could not be more true for me as well...so do you think I should subject all potential mates to this test?

I have a link to one of the good tests, but I don't know if it is ok to put it here. If it is not ok I am sorry and I will take it down.

[url]http://www.humanmetrics.com/cgi-win/JTypes2.asp[/url]

Test 'em.. save you plenty of time that'd be wasted on incompatible folks. Also points you in the right direction for career and etc.

 
Old 06-20-2006, 02:14 PM   #9
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cark HB User
Re: Personality types and relationships

Quote:
Originally Posted by LostMyHeart
Everytime I do that test - I never feel the explanation of my type (ISFP) fits me.

I don't know if that means I'm not being true to my true-self, or I'm just really messed up!

HAH! Sometimes it is in the interpretation. I took the MMPI in college and I was flagged for answering a question "questionably" ... it asked if I "saw things others didnt". I answered yes. To me this meant did I perceive things or see things that others missed int he same set of circumstances.. not did I see pink elephants.

 
Old 06-20-2006, 02:34 PM   #10
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ladyofkypros HB User
Re: Personality types and relationships

Veronica,

I went to the website for the Jung Typology test and took it. The results are pretty darn accurate! I'm a ISFJ - Protector Gaurdian, which pretty much flat-out explains why I keep getting into relationships with people who walk all over me and use me emotionally and physically. Now my question is, is it possible to change these personality traits or to weed out the negative ones and replace them with healthy ones? It was VERY insightful for me, THANK YOU!

 
Old 06-20-2006, 03:00 PM   #11
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Veronica_Mars HB User
Re: Personality types and relationships

Hi LMH--I agree that it might just be the way you interpreted some of the questions--it's usually best if you go on instinct. But if you read a variety of descriptions for your type and it doesn't sound like you, I would suggest reading the descriptions of other similar types as well (one or two letters off) or else reading some general information. The jung typology site has some of that as does a number of other sites that have myers-briggs info. I've found that it's best to read a number of different takes on each type to get an accurate picture and also that some of the quizzes give different results than others even when I think I'm being consistent in my answers. So who knows? I would definitely look at the other types to see if there was a better fit, or maybe you should try to act more in tune with your "true" nature? I'm not really sure, you can probably answer that better than anyone else.

There are a number of good books about this stuff if anyone is interested. I am certainly no expert but other than please understand me, I know there are some books on personality types and relationships as well as specific types and how to interact with other people if your types are different, etc. There is a lot of info out there on this stuff, some is better than others. Interestingly philosophers from Greek times to Roman times to the enlightenment to the modern era up through the 20th century have used more or less the same classifications (4 basic types with 16 possible variations in total) and descriptions to describe people throughout recorded history. So I think there is definitely some truth to the idea that people are different because they have different natures and if we would understand that and stop trying/wanting/expecting to make everyone just like us, we would definitely have an easier time with relationships. I know I would! It would be so easy if everyone else was an INTJ or at least an NT. I think the major groups are SJ, SP, NT, and maybe NF too--these have been given many different names by different philosophers and psychologists throughout the years. Interesting stuff--I am so glad you guys find it interesting too, and I really hope it is helpful for people to read about themselves and also the personalities of the major people in their lives. It has definitely helped me a great deal with my parents mostly, lol, and also with friends. With boyfriends, I'd love to give them the test, I'll do it on my my space I think, lol! But I'm not sure what the right answer is, as I'm not sure if the most compatible people always or ever have the same type as their partners.

 
Old 06-20-2006, 03:04 PM   #12
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cark HB User
Re: Personality types and relationships

You hit on something .. partners of the same type arent necessarily compatible.. probably not a usual thing. I think its easiest for an INTJ because the other is usually on the same quirky page and understands. HAH! But I cant imagine that partners of the same type in other myers briggs categories would be very compatible.

 
Old 06-20-2006, 03:40 PM   #13
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Veronica_Mars HB User
Re: Personality types and relationships

LOL, I know, who else but an INTJ would get how odd and quirky and random and just plain weird we can be? I have been making my friends take it over the years and definitely the people I click with most are other INTJs, or at least some sort of NTs. I like people of all types, but when it comes to choosing a partner, I think I am going to stick to men who have a lot in common with me. It's so wonderful to find men who really understand me and like me without judging--in fact it's the best thing ever and if I ever settle down, it will have to be with a guy like that. I am going to make my new kind of sort of boyfriend take it! He is an old friend and so much like me it is very scary. But yeah I think you're right--for some personality types, it is better to be with someone different. A lot of the books try to address that, which types have what kinds of relationships with the same and other types. Very interesting!

 
Old 06-20-2006, 07:31 PM   #14
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Re: Personality types and relationships

Veronica-personaltitypages ***. Has a test and it tells you which personality types you would be most compatiable with, how to grow and so forth. It is interesting but don't get to deep into it. You will find yourself anaylizeing people too much and it kind takes away that special little thing called ignorance. I minor in pyschology and I can pretty much analyzize any person within a short amount of time and can usually predict behaviors, know what they are missing in life and so forth. Outside of my schooling I have always been an intuitive person. I can generally tell when people are lyeing, and what people are actualy saying when they are talking to me. I cant remember what my personality type was on the page, but I do remeber it saying that I typically know people better than they know themsevles. Like that other poster said, people always feel comfortable telling me their problems. Like even at my work these guys that have so much pride in front of everyone else always spill thier guts to me when I am working with them. It is annoying sometimes because it makes me feel less like a man. Just a note to the other guy who posted...women do not like guys who act like therapists to them. They start to associate thier problems with you..because you talk to them about it. It is appealing but not attractive. Anyhow as far as realtionships go I have read that a lot of times you are attracted to people like your parents. This is becuase it feels familiar. You know how some women are attracted to abusive men? A lot of times these women had abusive fathers. Anyhow point of the post is dont worry so much about trying to figure other people out. It just makes you think for two people and that can create a lot of chaos. Plus it can lead you to make irrational assumptions about others when you could be wrong. I know women do this a lot anyways, as with some men. Of course this is all my opinion. Well anyhow it is an interesting subject.

Last edited by Mr.G; 06-20-2006 at 07:54 PM.

 
Old 06-21-2006, 06:42 AM   #15
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BetsyJean HB User
Re: Personality types and relationships

My husband and I are different in areas of our personality that have worked to balance each other out over the the years.
Spender/Saver
Outgoing/Homebody

BUT, we are very similar in our core values, ethics, morals, etc. which I think is vital for a relationship to survive. (Along with alot of stubborness to not give up)

 
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