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Old 05-10-2008, 06:21 PM   #1
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Issues with girlfriend and past friendship... very long

I just want to say in advance that this situation is very long, so bear with me here

I know a guy we'll call John. John and I are both 24 and were acquaintances in high school. I ran into him during freshman year of college (Me going to the local state school and him at city) and he helped me out getting a part-time job and we became pretty good friends. We were both normal, red-blooded college freshmans: going to parties, drinking, hooking up with girls, etc.

In high school John had a lot involvement with drama and music. He had the lead in the school musical senior year and since has never really left it behind. Ever since graduating he has volunteered there every year, as he has a good relationship with the choir director. His first year volunteering he gradually started hanging out with all the high school kids that were in the musical and other productions (16-17 year old kids mainly). I thought it was a bit weird, but as he just graduated and we were only 18 it wasn't that bad.

Fast forward to today. John is 24 and his core group of friends are, still, the kids in the drama club at the high school. He hangs around 17 year old kids and buys them alcohol, parties with them and etc. like he's still a senior there, its like time is standing still for him while everyone else is graduating college, getting successfull careers, getting married and etc. He's still at city college, and its been 6 years since we graduated. Because of all this we have basically parted ways, as I thought his friendships with kids not even of legal age were a bit creepy and odd to say the least, and 90% of his leisure time involves these kids.

The only reason I continued being around him was because we still worked together (up until about a few months ago, I just got a new fulltime career after graduating college). We never hated each other or anything, we just both started hanging out with others and stopped talking. At the beginning of this work year, he got his friend Joanna a job where we worked. She's 19, goes to my old college, and of course is a past lead in one of the high school musicals.

Well, to make a long story short, me and her ended up dating and are now together. While we were dating and weren't "official" yet, John pretty much put the last nail in our friendship coffin by basically trashing my character and telling Joanna that he saw her as a sister, and that "he would never want me dating his sister." He told her how I used to hook up with different girls in college, and basically portrayed me as a womanizing horndog that is purely out for sex. She almost backed out and stopped seeing me based on the things John was saying, because she saw him as a good friend and trusted his judgement. She's also a bit inexperienced (and a virgin), so these things obviously really turned her off. I basically had to sway her to my side after two months of persistence to show her that I wasn't a horrible guy, and that John just has problems seeing those around him grow up and become successful when he is still living vicariously through a group of kids in high school. She finally came around and we are now incredibly happy together, except for the next part.

The obvious problem is that John and Joanna are still pretty good friends. She tells me that I never even come up when they hang out or in conversation (it's always in a group and he isn't the most appealing of guys to say the least, so that's not what I'm worried about). It still bothers me though that they are good friends after I've basically written him off. {removed} I told her from the beginning that if her and him want to be friends then I'm not going to tell her who to hang out with obviously, but she knows how I feel about him and that he bothers me. The thing that's more irritating is that she will talk to me about how weird he is sometimes and that he's one of the most obnoxious, immature people she knows, but I feel like she just says that to appease me because they'll still hang out at least once a week.

I know it's a bad situation for her to be in, and I feel crappy that she's stuck in the middle, but I really don't know how to deal with this. I still can't believe some of the things he said to her about me (some of those that happened over five YEARS ago, and that he also participated in!). All of my friends joke around and say that he is probably jealous and that I "stole her" away from him, but if he felt that way it should have been his responsibility to tell me in the beginning. It seems like the longer we're together as well, the more he tries to get her to come out with him and the more he invites her out as they have several mutual friends from the school.

How can I just be the bigger person and get past this!? I'm a new college graduate with a good job, a car, my own apartment and a full life ahead of me and I feel like I'm back in highschool again dealing with all this bs. I feel that if I confront him it will just add more fuel to the fire anyways, since he thrives on stuff like this and gets sucked into drama whenever he has the chance. It's getting harder and harder to ignore it though, especially when me and her just got into a fight about how she confided stuff in him about one of our recent arguments. I told her point blank that I'm not okay with her talking to him about personal stuff in our relationship (especially when she gets relationship advice from a guy who hates the fact that we're together), but she just thought I was overreacting Will this ever let up, or should I just move on?

Last edited by Moderator BAC; 05-12-2008 at 07:32 AM. Reason: If a word has to be asterisked it is not appropriate for these boards.

 
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Old 05-11-2008, 12:40 AM   #2
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Re: Issues with girlfriend and past friendship... very long

I'm sure because of her age and inexperience, she has no idea what this guy really is. I think your best bet is to have a conversation with her about how it makes you feel when she not only hangs around with, but defends a person who has done so many things to try and break the two of you up. Ask her how she would feel if one of her "friends", took you aside one day and said that her "claiming" to be a virgin is a big act, and in reality, she slept with the entire football team. Ask her to really think about that, before she gives you an answer.

I would go about this very calmly, without letting it get your "hackles up". It's possible that what she is reacting to is your defensiveness and not really putting herself in your shoes. If she still doesn't get it, I don't know what else to tell you. To me, that would make me think she is just too young and immature to be in a real commited relationship on an adult level. I hope that isn't the case, because from past posts, it sounds like you really have feelings for her.

Good luck and let us know how things go.

 
Old 05-11-2008, 03:06 AM   #3
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Re: Issues with girlfriend and past friendship... very long

At worst, this could be a triangle. But no, she is not romantically involved with him. It's just that he still has some influence over her. She is sitting on the fence, so to say. With time, she will have to lean towards one side. In the meantime, she will be playing these games, as if she enjoyed being in the middle. I agree with Cpmgirl. She appears to be somewhat immature and not really into you. If she really were aware that she is your girlfriend, then I guess she would gradually drop John. Wouldn't you do the same if you were in her shoes? I think it is all or nothing, especially in the beginning of a relationship. You two are in the beginning of a relationship? You don't want any friction now, do you?

There's another important point. I don't know where you stand in relation to sex. Do you think it's ok to have sex with your girl-friend or not? If she is a virgin, there are only two possibilities for you: either you avoid sex with her and have a chaste relationship, or you initiate her into it. What would you choose? Or neither?

 
Old 05-11-2008, 10:00 AM   #4
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Re: Issues with girlfriend and past friendship... very long

Honestly, I think the older she gets and the more she matures and lives her life she will come to see just how creepy he is. She has known him a long time and she just doesn't see the "whole picture" yet. I have no doubt she will one day, whether or not the two of you are still together.

With that being said, I agree with cmpgirl's advice. I think you should try to get her to see your point of view on this. Try to view it from your perspective. Hopefully she will be mature enough to be open to it. But if she still handles it like a "high school girl" then I don't know what else you can do.

 
Old 05-11-2008, 10:28 AM   #5
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Re: Issues with girlfriend and past friendship... very long

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Originally Posted by CyberNick View Post
How can I just be the bigger person and get past this!? I'm a new college graduate with a good job, a car, my own apartment and a full life ahead of me and I feel like I'm back in highschool again dealing with all this bs.
Here's the thing... you've obviously got your stuff in order, and for that you should be really proud. I know guys 10 or 20 years older than you who don't have that! Now here's the part that gets tricky. You're going to have to decide if you want to stay in a relationship with an immature girl who still has a ton to learn about life, goals, experience, etc. Because this situation isn't likely to change any time soon.

What you should be doing is dating a woman who is in the same place in life as you are. I've learned this the hard way, if you date someone who is so majorly behind you, it's going to cause problems. I don't see this relationship working out for you for that reason (among all of the other high school drama that you're dealing with).

Listen, you're an adult at this point. You don't need to be dating in the kiddie pool anymore. You're just going to have to trust me when I tell you that it never works to date someone who isn't at the same point in life as you are. It doesn't work out.

 
Old 05-11-2008, 11:15 AM   #6
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Re: Issues with girlfriend and past friendship... very long

To cmpgirl: I know what you mean. She doesn't necessarily defend him, but she doesn't really take my side either. I figured as time goes on she will start to see him for what he really is and all I can really do is wait it out. We just had an argument about her talking to him about our relationship, but she's on vacation until Tuesday and she sent this:

"i know that my friendship with john is not ideal. and i know how much you dislike him and that sometimes i am naive about it. i lightheartedly told him about what happened between us. it's kind of routine for me to tell him things, just cause we've been close friends for almost 2 years. i promise though i do not confide things about our relationship to him, i am smarter than that. he knows only superficial things. he does not influence how i feel about you in the slightest, and i've already told him i would prefer not to discuss you with him. it's hard for me to be in the middle of this and you know that."

i don't know what she means by "superficial" things, but i tried to take her side and have faith in her since i can't talk to her until she's back. I am really taken by her, so I definitely want things to work out.


To Pendulum: She definitely doesn't like being in the middle. She has started to take a new viewpoint that is leaning towards my side, but the hard thing is that a few people she knows hang around him as well so its almost impossible to just "cut all ties" so to speak.

She really isn't that immature, the reason I was originally attracted to her is because she actually has a really good head on her shoulders and is extremely intelligent and mature for her age. She's been in a long-term relationship already, and isn't a virgin because of any special faiths or convictions, it just hasn't happened for her yet. Her last boyfriend was a devout christian and wanted to wait until marriage so they were never really that physical. Not to get too graphic or anything, but we've already done more in a couple months than they had in over a year so its not an issue.


To Happymom: yeah, all I can really do at this point is convince her further and wait it out to see what happens. I try to put her in my shoes, but her point of view I think is that as long as I am not a part of the discussion between her and him then it shouldn't be an issue. My friends have already said that eventually she will either have to lean more towards my side or more towards his, so I'll just keep an open mind about it and wait to invest too much of myself until this is dealt with.


To Kszan: I know it seems like there is a huge life gap between us, but to me I guess 4 years isn't a huge deal. I have tons of friends that are done with college and who are dating girls in college. She's a college sophomore and is on the 4 year plan for her degree, so she's not extremely far behind me in terms of life goals and etc. I guess for those reasons I don't really see her being in the kiddie pool so to speak.

The only things she's really "immature" with is the fact that she doesn't understand that sometimes you just need to choose your allegiances straight out, put your foot down and pick a side. She sticks it out with a lot of friends that don't get along with each other and ends up getting stuck in the middle a lot because she is pretty easygoing and doesn't like to stir things up. She's also kind of the mom or caretaker with her friends, the one that will pick up after the ones who act carelessly and make sure everyone gets home ok, etc. I tell her all the time that she is too nice and deals with too much, but she feels bad saying no or letting people down.

Thanks for all the advice.

 
Old 05-11-2008, 11:25 AM   #7
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Re: Issues with girlfriend and past friendship... very long

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The only things she's really "immature" with is the fact that she doesn't understand that sometimes you just need to choose your allegiances straight out, put your foot down and pick a side.
That's one of those things that really only comes with life experience. Basically, if it happens enough times, eventually the person learns the importance of this.

The thing that bugs me about this is that she doesn't seem to be on your side on this. If she's your gf, her alliance should be with you, not to him. And if you know that he is doing his best to poison her mind against you, then she should be able to see that and tell him flat out that it's unnacceptable. I'm not saying she should drop his friendship, but as it pertains to you, she should tell him straight up that she's not discussing you with him anymore. I just hope she can see the difference between him trying to legitmately be helpful or him just trying to make you out to be the bad guy on purpose. I hope she is smart enough to know the difference?

 
Old 05-11-2008, 11:38 AM   #8
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Re: Issues with girlfriend and past friendship... very long

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Originally Posted by cmpgirl View Post
Ask her how she would feel if one of her "friends", took you aside one day and said that her "claiming" to be a virgin is a big act, and in reality, she slept with the entire football team. Ask her to really think about that, before she gives you an answer.
.
Well, that wouldn't be the same thing, since she is in fact a virgin, so they would be spreading lies. In Cybernick's case, his old "friend" is not spreading out and out LIES, but rather slightly hyperbolized versions of the actual TRUTH, because Cybernick admits that he hooked up with girls and partied in his past.

Just to take a moment and look at things from her side of the issue, cybernick, I was also not a wild girl and virginal at 19, and I gotta tell you, I would be very very put off by a guy who had had many one night stands and flings and such. It does say something about how he views sex and women. BUT...it is wrong for this guy to use your past against you like this.

This is a tricky tricky spot. You can't every well tell your girlfriend who she can and can't be friends with, but it will be incredibly hard to conduct this relationship with someone she trusts and hangs out with on a regular basis constantly bad mouthing you and trying to get her to dump you. Something's gotta give sooner or later. I hate to tell you to just dump her and move on, that's a bit rash at this stage, but in my experience, when you're dating someone and their friends are telling them to dump you, that's pretty hard to overcome and get past and survive. Ask her why she continues to hang with him if he's so obnoxious and immature as she says, and does it feel to her like he respects the relationship she has with you, and if not, is that really "friendly" behavior? Maybe that will make her think a bit. Good luck.

 
Old 05-11-2008, 09:46 PM   #9
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Re: Issues with girlfriend and past friendship... very long

Quote:
Originally Posted by Larrylou'smom View Post
Well, that wouldn't be the same thing, since she is in fact a virgin, so they would be spreading lies. In Cybernick's case, his old "friend" is not spreading out and out LIES, but rather slightly hyperbolized versions of the actual TRUTH, because Cybernick admits that he hooked up with girls and partied in his past.
It's not so much what is a lie and what isn't. Whether CyberNick did these things in his past or not, it has no relevence to his current relationship with this girl. This guy has no business telling her anything about CyberNick's past bad habits. It's just not his place to do so.

I don't think this girl gets it. And I suggested to him that he ask her this question, hypothetically, to help her stop and think about how she would feel, if someone were trying to make her look that bad in CyberNick's eyes. It's more about CyberNick being villified by this guy. Not so much about the validity of the stories he is telling. It's the principle, not the content.

 
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