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Old 07-10-2011, 09:33 AM   #16
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Re: Anyone good with words?

Goodness gracious! Sometimes you folks do go to extremes!

You would have to be in this particular (and very odd) situation to understand why I want to do this. No, I will not wait for him forever ... as a matter of fact, I'm dating again already.

Things are going to happen during our un-coupling process. I can tell you with 99% certainty that Joe has not even begun to face what this is going to mean to him. (Any man who could put the IRS breathing down his neck until they knock on his door can shut out just about anything!!!) He chose this path as a quick fix to problems that, in truth, had little to do with me. That's going to come crashing down on him. I want him to know that the door is ajar, that he is and always will be welcome in my life (whether that be as a friend or a lover is not yet known), and that I bid him no ill will.

Perhaps we get so caught up in the horrid trauma of a break-up that we forget there are two very flawed human beings involved. For me, this is not the time to issue judgments or ultimatums or to slam doors behind me.

I'm very realistic. I know that this is a process Joe must complete before he can even see it in its entirety. And when that moment finally happens for him, I just want him to know where I stand. If, at that time, he chooses to continue on this path, that's fine. I've accepted that as being a 99.9% certainty. But, as I've said many times, I just want to leave the door cracked open a tiny bit.

 
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Old 07-10-2011, 09:56 AM   #17
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Re: Anyone good with words?

Ok... so if he responds rudely or ignores your letter, that's it, right? You aren't going to continue to contact him, letting him know you are "there for him" again, since he'll already know that, right?

I am just concerned because it's very difficult to truly move on if you're "leaving the door open" to Joe. You aren't truly available to someone else if you're holding out hope that you and Joe can someday work things out and be together.

I do realize that you're not ready to try again with someone else. It's too soon. I just don't want you to feel like you can't move on because you feel guilty about dating someone else since your heart still belongs to Joe.

I just know that in my personal experience, as long as I held out hope that my ex and I would someday be together, I couldn't truly move on. It was only after I accepted that it just was never going to happen, and that it was a good thing, that I could move on and be open to someone else.

 
Old 07-10-2011, 10:37 AM   #18
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Re: Anyone good with words?

I agree with Cadence; life really is too short to wait long for anyone, especially someone who has made it pretty clear they're not interested.
You should not feel responsible for Joe.
Who cares if he "knows the door's open"?
He walked out the door. If he decided later he wants back in, let him come and beg to be let back in. A little uncertainty won't hurt him any.
You are only responsible for yourself and your own happiness, and i do hope you find happiness one way or the other.

 
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Old 07-10-2011, 12:33 PM   #19
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Re: Anyone good with words?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kali333 View Post
I agree with Cadence; life really is too short to wait long for anyone, especially someone who has made it pretty clear they're not interested.
You should not feel responsible for Joe.
Who cares if he "knows the door's open"?
He walked out the door. If he decided later he wants back in, let him come and beg to be let back in. A little uncertainty won't hurt him any.
You are only responsible for yourself and your own happiness, and i do hope you find happiness one way or the other.
I agree with both Cadence and Kali, and if I may add a little (nasty?) something... By implying that the door is still open (or ajar) for him, you are saying in a way that you are better (superior) than him, because he hurt you, he said rude things, he is owing you money, and you don't seem to be angry at him at all, in fact you already got over all the harm he did to you and are leaving the door open again. Don't get me wrong, I know I may not be seeing the whole picture, anyway, but I think I have seen enough to advise you to build a wall right now rather than a door.

 
Old 07-10-2011, 02:01 PM   #20
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Re: Anyone good with words?

I'm sorry, guys but I just don't feel angry. I feel sad, incredibly sad. A little lost. Lonely. But anger? No, I just don't feel it. And I won't pretend to feel it just to even the playing field.

 
Old 07-10-2011, 02:42 PM   #21
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Re: Anyone good with words?

I don't think you feel angry either.

I do understand...you want him to know that when things get tough, he can lean on you and you can and are willing to help him through it, he can put his head on your shoulder and let it all out, you want to support him (not literally I hope!!!) and assist him with your knowledge and experience, he can be himself around you and not fear that you will judge him...it's like that song:

"If you want to, I can save you
I can take you away from here..."

BUT...he might not want that!

He might want to take care of it on his own. He might think leaning on a woman for emotional support shows weakness. He might feel like he can't respect himself as a man if he accepts help from a woman. He might think a REAL man would find his own way out of his mess and not drag a woman down along with him. OR, he might be in such denial that he can't accept your help because that would mean having to deal with his issues, since you're probably going to want to discuss them with him and talk about solutions. Maybe he wants to put his hands over his ears and go "NANANANANANAAAAA" so he can't hear you. It's like if you had one big, dark secret that you are ashamed of and only one person in the world knows...and being around that person starts to hurt because they know your secret and you can't pretend in front of them. And so you start to avoid them. I know when I was terribly sick and in the hospital, I didn't want my boyfriend visiting me because I could not stand the thought of him seeing me like that. He asked and asked, and I just kept saying no. He didn't get it, he wanted so much to be there for me, but I just was not going to allow it. Maybe Joe feels that way too.

I think Joe already knows how you feel and that you want very much to help him through this tough time. If you really feel you must tell him one more time, then do so. But do it realizing that he may respond rudely or he may ignore you, and it may not turn out the way you hope.

 
Old 07-10-2011, 03:09 PM   #22
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Re: Anyone good with words?

I just think whatever feels right for you honey. You dont have anything to lose by sending the letter to Joe. The letter is well written and such thoughtful gentle words and i like it. I hope it all goes well.

 
Old 07-10-2011, 03:40 PM   #23
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Re: Anyone good with words?

It's something I will leave in the house for Joe when I exit for the last time. And it really is a salve to my own conscience. It's the way I can walk out knowing that I did every thing I could ... because I know he's going to crash at some point.

You're right, Cadence ... it is a case of not wanting those closest to him to know just what he's gotten himself into and what he's dealing with.

Thanks to my therapist, I've figured out that Joe has a personality disorder. He has a mild, but textbook case of it. One of the hallmarks of this dysfunction is avoidance. Rather than face the bad things in their lives, they avoid them. The time is quickly coming when Joe can no longer do that. Maybe he'll lean on me ... but he probably won't. And that's ok. I know that I've offered. He knows the support (and no, not financial) are there. If he opts not to take it and ends up going down a bad road? I can honestly say that I did all I could for him.

I've had some real aha moments this weekend thinking through his avoidance issues. I think I've been feeling bad about myself because he is over "us" so fast and I can't get there yet. But now I think I understand that he's not really faced it yet. I could take up page after page explaining it but suffice it to say that so many things he's done that made no sense, suddenly make perfect sense. It doesn't change anything but understanding is so importance to acceptance.

Joe is going to go on to have relationship after relationship that ends very similarly to the one we had. He IS loving as much as he's capable of but that's simply not enough to sustain much. And the important key is realizing that is doesn't even hurt him as much when it ends as it does the normal person. Just as he can't feel that love as deeply, he doesn't feel as much pain when it's gone. I'm not sure if I envy him that or pity him for that.

He's not going to suddenly come to a realization that he's going to suffer emotional pain when I'm gone ... but he is going to have a lot of financial and just plain practical things he's going to have to face that he's hidden from so far. And even that is not going to be easy for him.

As you can tell, none of these "aha" moments has led me to any great proclamations but they are helping me get past this and look forward more to the next phase of my life. The next time a guy tells you over and over again that he doesn't care about this, that or the other thing? Like where you have dinner, what color you paint a room, whether you go skiing or to the beach ... when they have virtually no opinions about things? They're not just easy-going ... they've got a problem somewhere! : ) Lesson learned!

 
Old 07-10-2011, 04:10 PM   #24
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Re: Anyone good with words?

I have to say this ......no one knows how Joe truly feels inside other than himself. He may feel heartbroken that its over but maybe feels strong enough to think its for the best. Dont forget alot of people put on a front like they are okay when deep inside they are not. Also people can block out pain and just get on with things and not deal it and then go through out life having problems because they wont allow themselves to feel how they truly deeply feel.

I do think you care ALOT about Joe and it seems your trying to explore his world and whats happening for him.

I think you really need to focus on moving on now. He chose to leave the relationship so he has to deal with any issues he may have. No one can save him but himself.

I think the letter is a good idea though leaving it for him to find when you leave the property.

 
Old 07-10-2011, 04:38 PM   #25
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Re: Anyone good with words?

The way you feel about Joe reminds me of the way I feel about my adult son (who has a drug problem).
Everyone I know has attempted to force me to "face reality", "get tough", "cut him loose", etc.
I can't. No matter what he does or how he treats me, whether he cares about me or not... I can't abandon him, I have to make sure he knows that I'm always here if he needs me. I don't want him to feel alone and abandoned, when he finally comes to his senses and realizes how horrible his life is (ha! Wishful thinking. Actually, he loves his life just the way it is, and is having a terrific time).

Anyway, I do understand how you feel about Joe.
But Joe isn't your child. He's a grown man, and the two of you are equals.
Don't let him drag you down.

 
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Old 07-12-2011, 03:15 PM   #26
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Re: Anyone good with words?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pendulum View Post
<snip> That you and he had something very rare and very real, that it went beyond the hearts and flowers of most romances and left you with a true and abiding friendship, etc, may be very true, but it is your opinion. He may not think the same, or if he ever did think the same, he might have changed now. If you want to send this paragraph this way, I would suggest that you should use expressions like: I think/I thought/It was my belief... so that you are not really imposing your ideas on him, if you see what I mean.

Third, the second paragraph, deny it as you may, is asking him to take you back, with a slight threat (menace), because if he doesn't, well, both of you will be lost, looking for a needle in haystack. Again this is your opinion, which he may or may not partake of.
I couldn't agree more. Well written letter, indeed. But quite presumptious.

 
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