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Old 03-08-2004, 07:47 AM   #6
yinksy
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Join Date: Aug 2003
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Re: latest from rosie

Rosie - good work - you're doing it all right!
Hope your health probs sort themselves out.
Always remember that the drugs you are taking (both opiates and more subtley - the benzos) have medically recognised side effects. (Did you ever get round to reading The Ashton Manual? Worth - at your stage now - reading about withdrawal effects - dead easy to access and read online - strongly recommend - you will find it very informative and helpful I think. Just turn straight to the section labelled Benzodiazepine Withdrawal Symptoms, Acute and Protracted - chapter 111 pages 35 - 39 After that - there is similar info on withdrawal symptoms from anti-depressants. Just good informative background stuff. I would sent you a copy by post if I could! In fact - you can buy a printed copy online should you so wish)

Your sponsor - dont take all this too seriously - its not a decision for life - you can change sponsors at any time too. FWIW - I never actually "asked" anyone to be my sponsor - but effectively the person whom I regard as just the wisest person in the world is really my sponsor - nothing "official". Funny - as it turns out - my sponsor is a very elderly man - a fisherman of 78 yrs old - lives very modestly in a wee cottage on a shoreside miles away from where I live. I met him while on holiday............. but he is my rock. And it really does help to have someone "special" like a sponsor. Always remembering too that - just as you are helped by the sponsor - so is he/she helped by your input - its a two way thing. Wonderfully supportive for both of you. Wont be long until someone asks you to be their sponsor....... and so it continues.
Rosie - dont want to sound patronising - so wont say much more -but you have been so very courageous and really intelligent in your approach to all this. You've recognised and embraced your problem. Not stuck your head in the sand or put off to another day......You simply now cannot fail. OK - there are still rocks on the road.......(and I do know it is hard - but its doable) but once you have this amount of self awareness there is no turning back.........you have set out now on the journey of your life! Aren't you really deep down excited now about your position? No longer is the outlook bleak or hopeless - you have this very real prize sitting in the road ahead of you? Great stuff.
Just look how the bold Kinda now is skipping along that road called LIFE?
If I can help in anyway, Rosie - just give me a shout.
Y
(and all that is required is that you do it.....one day at a time! And that's the way all of us CAN do it)
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Old 03-08-2004, 11:39 AM   #7
John 3:16
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Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: MS, USA
Posts: 1,648
Re: latest from rosie

Good morning, Rose!

Just wanted you to know that I was thinking of you today. I wish I could wave a "magic wand" and make everything better for you, but then you wouldn't have the strentgh you are now developing to draw on someday! You are doing such a good job- I KNOW it is hard! I could never taper because I didn't have the willpower and YOU DO! I know you can do this!

Hang in there and like Yinksy said, there are still rocks in the road but just remind yourself of the so many you have already stepped over! Just keep on going!

With all my love and support,
Michelle
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Old 03-08-2004, 11:56 PM   #8
rosietee
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Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: California
Posts: 536
Re: latest from rosie

Thank you thank you Y and Michelle. I have so far to go. One way or another I will be off by the end of the month. I have one more shipment coming in tomorrow. I am only taking chips of the klonopin now and will definitely do the Ashton taper on those--haven't been on them too long, but long enough, I'm sure. You two have given so much courage. I know that I have a long spiritual journey ahead of me separate and apart from any physical trauma (w/d yuk). I didn't go to my meeting tonight, because my husband said I should either tell my mom and go or not go, because it was kind of obvious, since she got here Friday a.m. and leaves Tuesday a.m. and I went to a Friday night meeting and a Sunday most of the day brunch. So I called the lady in charge of the group to let her know and I have touched base with my fil and his friend today, so the facts of life are fresh in my brain.

I do have to admit that today with my mother around I "lost count." Bad, bad, bad, I know. I'll feel crappy tomorrow. I AM going to call this lady that I really like tomorrow (she would fit right in with our group here, I think! She is alot of fun) and try to get started on the steps.

I swear, Yinksy, I don't think I would have made it to my other bar meeting without your support. Isn't that funny all the way from Scotland, maybe you helped save my life.

Well, I've started hanging on the thyroid board now, they seem nice so far. There is a syndrome where your thyroid lab tests are abnormal due to another underlying serious condition, hope that's not it, like my liver or something, but with family history and life-long symptoms, I think it's part of my answer. March 15 is the day!!!!

luv,
rosie
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Old 03-09-2004, 07:50 AM   #9
yinksy
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Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 499
Re: latest from rosie

Aw Rosie - could you not make D Day the 17th March - that is St Patrick's feast day? That would be just so appropriate? LOL It's a big feast day here - obviously for Irish catholics, as I know it is in New York too - Kinda assures me he will be in the Parade............ shamrock, pipes.......... celtic earing.......... look out for him! He is the "saintly looking" one! LOL LOL LOL
Hey - do you think that Lynn and Alice might be there too - in an ecumenical role? Hee hee........... I can just picture them in wee tartan skirts, rosary beads and skull caps! ho ho ho ho ho ho........
(PS - hope Kinda doesnt read this - he will pillory me for being a holy roller and bible thumper...... and I only say this as I know you too are catholic .............. but.............. I will be at Mass on that day ............... and I will offer up my intentions "for Rosie and her future". And I mean that. Crikey - hope that doesnt sound too sanctimonious! )

Talking of which - I agree with you about your whole outlook and yes you are going on a long spiritual journey with this now........ Addiction for many of us in here is just the outward symtom of what is going on inside our heads? A deep spiritual malaise? Otherwise - why would we be addicts? (I obviously dont mean that applies to people with serious chronic pain issues). So - once you get the physical bit out of the way then the "proper" business begins. But - dont fear it - its something to really look forward to........... And people in AA will get you started on the right road.......And it continues for life.......... for it is a daily exercise........self exploration. And you will have such self knowledge. Did I ever suggest to you for daily spiritual reading - just a sort of thought for today....... the Jesuits 24 hour book? Not unlike AA 24 hours - just a bit deeper and thought provoking.

I think you will be pleasantly surprised at how quickly you recover physically from these horrible drugs............ at the time the withdrawal is ghastly, but, now, when I look back on my 8 month taper.........it really was not that long. In the overall span of things. However you finally get off the opiates - well - no matter - it will be done? In the end some things just have to be bourne? And its wonderful to hear you are tapering the K too. Hopefully - as you have not been on it for long - you will just skoosh (technical term!) your way off those too! I honestly think that - with a clear head - you will "see" your own situation and be able to judge as to what drugs you really need to be on. Perhaps - guy few? Depending on your thyroid situation etc. Anyway - no need to waste time thinking those thoughts today................. just focus for now on tapering and getting off. So - you have 6 days till D Day? Are you tapering quickly - have you managed to get down a bit more? Anyway - whatever - you know there are loads of folk in here who will advise you and support you thro those 5 days following the final wrench............ and after that it will all start to fall into place? You say I have so far to go But Rosie - altho I agree to some extent........... and would have to say that you have undertaken the most difficult part of all.......can you really believe how far you have come in the past couple of months? Its tremendous - dont underestimate what you have accomplished already. And once you finally kiss those opiates good bye then you are setting in place a philosophy for living for the rest of your life.......... and you know its never more than "just for today". So - in a way - yes - you have a long way to travel - we all do - but its just life? No more complicated than that. And of course - it isnt going to be plain sailing - life simply is not that way for anyone. But we all learn coping strategies and are able to face life and deal with all it throws at us without having to resort to pills (or alcohol or whatever) - just like all those so called normal people out there. And isnt that all we want really? To be normal?

I owe you thanks too Rosie - you have a lovely calm assuring approach in this forum - your input always has a gentle, warm, levelling effect on people - have you noticed? Ha ha? Tricks of the trade? So easy for things to be misconstrued.......... and all of us chipping in with our own ideas and all of us coming from such varied and different backgrounds............ I guess you and Lynn are the diplomats in here - keep the "talks" from sometimes grinding to a bad humoured halt! Thanks Rosie!

So - good luck - I know the next week or two are going to be really difficult for you - physically - I dont think there is really any way round it............... but beyond that there is so much waiting for you.............we are all holding your hand tight for the next wee while................ you'll do it! Nae bother! Courage, mon amie!

Bíodh lá deas agat
(have a good day)

Y

Last edited by yinksy; 03-09-2004 at 07:54 AM.
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Old 03-09-2004, 12:35 PM   #10
Twinlynn
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Posts: 1,067
Smile Re: latest from rosie

Rosie and Yinksy

Rosie - You've had so much to handle these past few months--and you are doing it so well. (I know you are saying to yourself "no I haven't been handling it well...I'm a fraud...I reach for those drugs....etc, etc.") But you really ARE doing well. You are getting there! And if you have thyroid problems, I know from my mother how much that can influence your behavior. Alice and I were just talking about that...when we were kids and during our early teens our Mom just flew off the handle so quickly..she'd go 0 to 70 in two seconds!! Her response to tiny little things was so out of proportion. But then she had her thyroid level checked--and her doctor discovered that she had a BAD problem. Within a month or so of taking the thyroid drug (can't remember its name---Synthroid??)--she just mellowed out so much. Compared to her previous quick anger and her percolating emotions, it was like she'd just been prescribed Aldous Huxley's "Brave New World" drug--Soma!(A futuristic drug where society was kept pacified by this Soma concoction!!!) Hmmm...or was it George Orwell's book "1984"?? Duhhhh!! Anyway! It was like night and day. So, you, too, may feel more stabilized when your thyroid levels are corrected. Just wanted to mention that.

I also note that you appear to be doing a similar taper to Alice and I--you've chosen not to "abandon ship until your last shipment sinks!!" Al and I are doing a similar type taper.....we get our Vics (7.5 mg) from our legitimately-in-pain cousin, who shares her meds with us. But her doctor is weaning her off the hard-stuff...and it's just a matter of time...so we've tapered down from about 8 a day to 4 or 5 a day "in preparation" for the Big Day!! (Which we anticipate with a combination of relief--and dread.) Pretty spineless, eh? When I read of others' strength and determination (your's included), I can feel pretty disgusted with myself. I've been so strong and determined in so many other aspects of my life...fought my way through the horrific, mind-numbing years of my mother's dementia. (We had her at home with us.) So, when people here offer the names of spiritual books....all I can think is that for 8 years "The 36-Hour Day" was my bible!!! (A fairly well-known book in the healthcare/caregivers circle--it is a practical, hour-by-hour, "tell-it-like-it-is" guide to surviving--mentally and physically--those hopeless, helpless times that lie ahead for both yourself and your parent (spouse, sibling, etc.) At any rate....if I was able to survive those most horrible years of my life...and had the ability to face the reality head-on....then why am I so weak now?? Why can't I face the week or so it would take to withdraw? And then battle through the long, slow climb to normality?

The answer?? Probably, because, in spite of what you all tell me about the joy of finally seeing life clearly, I have very real fears, that as a depressive person who's struggled with my own brain chemistry for much of my life, I may plunge back into a bleak, cheerless world--or, at the very least, never emerge from a lifetime of the "blahs"! (...Although my antidepressants are heaven sent...and, intellectually, I know I will "come out the other end"--as you have all done.)

That's about as honest as I can be about why I'm still taking that lower--but addictive--amount of pills. I know that withdrawing from 5 Vics a day is not a horrendous withdrawal...but it's more the fact of what lies ahead...will I ever feel that joy and "natural high" that you all talk about when you stop taking them?? Troubling, too, is that when my cousin gets her 40 mg oxys--off and on--I find myself "nibbling" off the ends several times a day. (About the equivalent of two pills.) Luckily, she may have had her last prescription of them a few weeks ago--because that is one strong drug..and I would never want to get hooked on them!! No, no, no! )

I just fear never being "my old self" again...and that "old self" was someone who once got so much pleasure over the tiniest things in life. There's this real lurking anticipatory despair, that, if taking a little pill gave me that ability to enjoy everyday life....what if I can never again reproduce those feelings "naturally".

Reading the posts of all of you who are trying so hard to get back to where you were before the drugs took over, made me think again, that....despite the fact that I've never taken enough pills to be sick from them... nevertheless, I am still frozen at the thought of never feeling their effects again. (In spite of the fact that they really don't do much for me anymore...my system's too used to them.) It's not that I fear the actual withdrawl. I fear that my own brain chemistry will never "work" again--and I will never get back the natural feeling of life being a treasure--and a pleasure--like I once did.

Anyway, Rosie...I think you've been doing great. And those days when you exceed your taper are not "bad" days...they are just "reminder" days... to be regarded as "blips on the landscape"...and to keep going in the right direction.

Yinksy - "Wee tartan skirts, rosary beads...and skull caps..." LOLOL!!! Oh, noooooo. Perhaps if we select plaid skull caps, the House of Ralph Lauren or Yve's St. Laurent will let us get away with it. What a picture! Baby boomer twins, still asserting their own unique sense of style. (For the Easter parade we can dress up as twin eggs...en route to locate a spare uterus!)

I have been to many a St. Patrick's Day parade....great fun!! You must come see one! Even the crowds dress up. Once a year, on March 17 EVERYBODY is Irish!!!

Don't know, Yinksy, if you saw a note I wrote you on the thread titled--at least I think it was titled--"Kinda and Yinksy"...or something similar. It was about two days ago. When you sent me that limerick!!! (That long thread where you lined us up against the wall and read us the riot act! LOLOL)
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