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Old 12-10-2009, 06:37 PM   #1
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h1n1 after vaccine

Friends of ours all had the h1n1 vaccine over a month ago. The mom came down with H1n1 last week (tested positive) and now the 3 year old son has it. How can this be? Even if they were exposed before their immune system developed antibodies, they would just NOW be developing symptoms. Has anyone else seen this?

 
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Old 12-10-2009, 06:46 PM   #2
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Re: h1n1 after vaccine

I read an article recently about a primary care doctor that has had H1N1 TWICE (caught from his patients). Same strain, confirmed by a lab. Although having it once or getting the shot is supposed to provide protection, it doesn't work that way for everyone. It's also possible that it mutated but I haven't heard of any mutations except in the Ukraine.

 
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Old 12-10-2009, 07:24 PM   #3
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Re: h1n1 after vaccine

1. It is possible that the person is unlucky in not getting enough immune reaction from the vaccine (influenza vaccines are usually said to give immunity in 70% to 90% of the people who receive them; partial immunity in the others may reduce the severity).

2. Are they certain that they got the novel H1N1 "swine" influenza vaccine, rather than the seasonal influenza vaccine? Also note that one of the seasonal strains is an H1N1 influenza, but is different enough that there is little or no cross-immunity.

 
Old 12-10-2009, 08:21 PM   #4
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Re: h1n1 after vaccine

Quote:
Originally Posted by tjlhb View Post
1. It is possible that the person is unlucky in not getting enough immune reaction from the vaccine (influenza vaccines are usually said to give immunity in 70% to 90% of the people who receive them; partial immunity in the others may reduce the severity).
That's what I was thinking, except that this happened to TWO people in the same family who had the vax. That's the part that seems strange to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tjlhb View Post
2. Are they certain that they got the novel H1N1 "swine" influenza vaccine, rather than the seasonal influenza vaccine? Also note that one of the seasonal strains is an H1N1 influenza, but is different enough that there is little or no cross-immunity.
Yes. Actually, they got both vaccines. (Seasonal & H1N1)

 
Old 12-11-2009, 04:22 PM   #5
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Re: h1n1 after vaccine

My grandbaby who never gets sick and is very healthy, just got the h1n1 shot 2 days ago
after she got it she started acting much more tired then normal and sleeping more
This morning she woke up calling to me and her mom to help her and we found her at the top of the stairs out non-responsive she would not wake up. We called 911 just as they got here she started to snap out of it. Doctors are saying she had a febrile seizure but how can this be she is not sick at all. if I had it to do over again I would not have let her get it. We are home now and she looks ok but her sugar was very high 234. I'm very worried. She's the light of my life

Last edited by SternFan; 12-11-2009 at 04:23 PM.

 
Old 12-11-2009, 11:41 PM   #6
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Re: h1n1 after vaccine

Quote:
Originally Posted by SternFan View Post
My grandbaby who never gets sick and is very healthy, just got the h1n1 shot 2 days ago
after she got it she started acting much more tired then normal and sleeping more
This morning she woke up calling to me and her mom to help her and we found her at the top of the stairs out non-responsive she would not wake up. We called 911 just as they got here she started to snap out of it. Doctors are saying she had a febrile seizure but how can this be she is not sick at all. if I had it to do over again I would not have let her get it. We are home now and she looks ok but her sugar was very high 234. I'm very worried. She's the light of my life

I feel for your grandbaby and anyone who's parents have not done enough research to realize that a healthy child should NEVER recieve a vaccine that has had virtually NO research done.

Reactions to the basic flu vaccine include Guillian-Barre Syndrome (GBS) convulsions, syncope (fainting), blood and lymphatic system disorders, and immune disorders such as anaphylaxis, just to name a few – all events that can be life-threatening enough to end in death.
And to the H1N1, Guillian-Barre syndrome, Exacerbation of symptoms of mitochondrial encephalomyopathy, Gastrointestinal disorders, Immune system disorders, including anaphylactic reaction
What this amounts to is that everyone receiving these vaccines is part of a big public health experiment.
It is absolutely the state of your immune system that determines whether or not you will get sick if you come in contact with this virus. The virus itself has no special powers to kill or maim.

As reported by MSNBC, vaccines now are viewed as “a crucial path to growth,” due to lagging prescription drug sales. The article goes on to say:

“Investment in partnerships and other deals to develop and manufacture vaccines has been on a tear — and accelerating since the swine flu pandemic began. Billions in government grants are bringing better, faster ways to develop and manufacture vaccines. Rising worldwide emphasis on preventive health care, plus the advent of the first multibillion-dollar vaccines, have further boosted their appeal.

While prescription drug sales are forecast to rise by a third in five years, vaccine sales should double, from $19 billion last year to $39 billion in 2013, according to market research firm Kalorama Information. That's five times the $8 billion in vaccine sales in 2004.

Success on some vaccines in development, particularly for Alzheimer's and AIDS, likely would bring billions a year in sales.”

Do you need more proof this is a scam to the american public to make money at the expense of your children?

 
Old 12-12-2009, 10:59 PM   #7
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Re: h1n1 after vaccine

Quote:
Originally Posted by alwaysonthago View Post
The virus itself has no special powers to kill or maim.
Perhaps not special compared to "normal" influenza, but the risk of severe problems requiring hospitalization or death from influenza in a non-immune person is orders of magnitude higher than the risk of severe problems from the influenza vaccine.

 
Old 12-13-2009, 02:48 PM   #8
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Re: h1n1 after vaccine

Thank you tjlhb,

After reading the previous post about Guillain Barré "convulsions" (?!) and how the H1N1 vaccine is a big "health experiment", your sane and sensible reply brought my blood pressure back down.

As to the H1N1 vaccine never having been tested, it is EXACTLY like the regular flu shot. The only difference is that the STRAIN of influenza that is being vaccinated against is the novel H1N1 strain (there are other strains of H1N1 but the recent swine flu strain that has been going around is a new one which has the same H1 and N1 proteins as other strains that have existed). Therefore, every year the regular flu vaccine that is given to the elderly is theoretically also a new and so called "untested" shot because it protects against a different strain of the flu.

Indeed no flu vaccine nor anything for that matter is without some element of risk (including drinking a glass of water or eating an apple) and of the millions of people who will be vaccinated, there will be a small number who suffer some kind of reaction. Anaphylaxis is more controllable because reaction is immediate and there are people on hand at the time the vaccine is given who can stabilize anyone with this reaction. Anaphylaxis can also occur during surgery due to latex gloves, in the park if you get stung by a bee, and even by eating certain foods (the most famous being peanuts). Guillain Barré is another extremely rare reaction to a vaccine (not just the flu vaccine) but you must keep in mind that you also have an increased risk of acquiring Guillain Barré Syndrome from catching the actual flu. The culprit is not the actual vaccine but rather the engagement of the immune system. Your risk for G-B is highest (although still very rare) after being infected by Campylobacter, a bacteria that lives in foods such as poultry, eggs and raw milk.

Just as I would not tell people to stop eating poultry, eggs and nuts because they may get anaphylaxis or Guillain Barré, I would also not tell people to stop getting the flu vaccine.

 
Old 12-13-2009, 02:50 PM   #9
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Re: h1n1 after vaccine

Oh and HOW DARE THEY try to develop a vaccine against Alzheimer's and AIDS ?! Shame on THEM !!!

 
Old 12-13-2009, 11:34 PM   #10
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Re: h1n1 after vaccine

Quote:
Originally Posted by estria View Post
As to the H1N1 vaccine never having been tested, it is EXACTLY like the regular flu shot. The only difference is that the STRAIN of influenza that is being vaccinated against is the novel H1N1 strain (there are other strains of H1N1 but the recent swine flu strain that has been going around is a new one which has the same H1 and N1 proteins as other strains that have existed). Therefore, every year the regular flu vaccine that is given to the elderly is theoretically also a new and so called "untested" shot because it protects against a different strain of the flu.
Thank you for that post.

I get so frustrated with people that think this vaccine is somehow "different" than the vaccine that comes out every year. It's made exactly the same way.

The method is tried and true.

 
Old 12-17-2009, 01:48 PM   #11
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Re: h1n1 after vaccine

SternFan,
Just as a precaution, I would keep an eye on your grandchild's blood sugars. It's quite possible that she may be developing diabetes. Often in children it goes undiagnosed for several months until it gets bad and then, if the blood sugars go high enough, it can cause convulsions. I wouldn't expect to see convulsions with bg's in the low 200's, but do keep an eye out as, God forbid, if she is developing diabetes, the sooner you find out about it, the better. And, if that's the case, it most likely was not the vaccine that did it but, rather, perhaps a cold she may have had anytime in the past 6 months to a year.

I hope that's not it, but better to err on the side of caution.

Ruth

 
Old 12-25-2009, 11:17 PM   #12
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Re: h1n1 after vaccine

Quote:
Originally Posted by estria View Post
Thank you tjlhb,

After reading the previous post about Guillain Barré "convulsions" (?!) and how the H1N1 vaccine is a big "health experiment", your sane and sensible reply brought my blood pressure back down.

As to the H1N1 vaccine never having been tested, it is EXACTLY like the regular flu shot.

Just as I would not tell people to stop eating poultry, eggs and nuts because they may get anaphylaxis or Guillain Barré, I would also not tell people to stop getting the flu vaccine.

Here are the reasons I would NEVER choose to harm my family by giving them an unneccesay flu vaccination, being that they have contained the following ingredients (that they do NOT want you to realize):

Ethylene glycol (antifreeze)

Phenol, also known as carbolic acid (this is used as a disinfectant, dye)

Formaldehyde, a known cancer-causing agent

Aluminum, which is associated with Alzheimer's disease and seizures and also cancer producing in laboratory mice (it is used as an additive to promote antibody response)

Thimerosal (a mercury disinfectant/preservative) can result in brain injury and autoimmune disease

Neomycin and Streptomycin (used as antibiotics) have caused allergic reaction in some people.

My family will take their chances with influenze...and if they get it they will suffer for a short period of time and gain natural immunity in the future!

 
Old 12-26-2009, 07:18 AM   #13
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Re: h1n1 after vaccine

I hope for you and your family's sake that if you do get the flu that you do indeed only suffer a short amount of time and that you don't have any of the complications that some have had. I am quite sure that the opinion of the parents whose children and family members have died as a result of complications from the H1N1 flu is quite different from yours and that given the choice they would have had their families vaccinated. Unfortunately, the vaccine was not available at the time.

Not all of the vaccines contain the items mentioned above so it might be worth someone's while to take a closer look at what is actually contained in the specific vaccine that they are taking if they are concerned about this. One should note that these things are also contained in many of the things that we eat everyday in much larger quantities than in the vaccine (tuna contains mercury and apples contain formeldahyde, just to name a couple) so I am not sure that we should throw the baby out with the bath water so to speak.

I am of the opinion that if a vaccine is available for something that may cause serious illness in specific individuals (they still don't know exactly why some are more prone than others) then it only makes sense to protect oneself. Vaccines are the reason we no longer have smallpox, dyptheria, polio and a host of other illnesses. Who knows, if my parents were overly concerned about additives in vaccines and did not have me vaccinated as a child against some of these diseases, I may not even be here today (when I was a child, smallpox and polio were still a real threat).

 
Old 12-26-2009, 11:12 PM   #14
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Re: h1n1 after vaccine

[QUOTE=estria;4149825]I hope for you and your family's sake that if you do get the flu that you do indeed only suffer a short amount of time and that you don't have any of the complications that some have had. I am quite sure that the opinion of the parents whose children and family members have died as a result of complications from the H1N1 flu is quite different from yours and that given the choice they would have had their families vaccinated.

The problem with looking at the situation like the previous person does it that the people who have passed as a result from "COMPLICATIONS" from H1N1 could have aquired those complications from any other illness and it may or may not have just happened to be this one. For example, pnemonia can be accompanied with a number of other illnesses that unfortunately result in death in a lot of cases. However, the media have taken the oppertunity to blow this H1N1 scandel outrageously out of porportion. I hope that people will take the time to realize that people do die from influenze every year, even though it is extremely unfortunate. But there are so many things that people can do to protect themselfs like to eat organic raw foods rather than processed, chemical, preservatives and unnatural additives in foods. There is so much research out there on how harmful these things ALONE are that it is a completely different subject but such a good one to be aware of!


If someone is adement to argue this subject I feel that it is a desperate attempt to dismantle anyones view who is not that of another's. And I only say that because I have been doing much research on my cause for over 5 years now. I encourage everyone to do their own research and get another opinion. If you are not familiar with other types of health care I highly encourage you to see an herbalist. I also have two different chiropractors who deal with alternative methods of treating illness. Why not experience a different kind of health care it can't hurt! If you are like me you only want all the best for your family and all children really!!

 
Old 12-27-2009, 06:54 AM   #15
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Re: h1n1 after vaccine

I am sorry if you feel that I am trying to "dismantle" your point of view. If that is how my post appears, it was definitely not meant in that way. I am simply trying to put things more in perspective because people seem to be freaking out over the preservatives in this particular flu vaccine when every year we hear nothing said about the regular flu vaccine which contains the same preservatives and works in the same manner. I am not sure why the public has latched onto this particular vaccine and not to others. We have turned the H1N1 vaccine into some kind of monster when in reality it is a VACCINE.

That being said, I happen to agree with you that the media has blown things out of proportion, as they always do. Their motive is getting more viewers and let's face it, sensationalism sells. I would definitely take whatever the media has to say with a grain of salt. I too am quite furious when I see reports in the evening news that blow things way out of proportion and I think that the media needs to seriously examine its ethical standards.

I also agree with you that one should eat healthy whole foods, organic when possible, and avoid all processed foods that contain additives and preservatives. You may be surprised to find out that I am an individual who abhors industrialized food preparation and my meat, fruits and vegetables come from local organic farmers. Wholesome eating and healthy exercise are a way of life for me and I believe that this is how one can stay in good health to a ripe old age.

However, I don't appreciate the villifying of medical personell. I have relatives in the medical profession who put themselves in danger in order to help others and who work long and difficult hours because they think they are doing good. To say that they are lying about complications from the H1N1 flu is not fair or justified. If this is what they say they are seeing, it makes no sense for us to say "they are wrong those people must have died from something else".

I definitely appreciate your opinion and I have to admit that I like a good, healthy debate on a variety of issues. However, I do apologize if you see this as an attack on alternative medicine. It is not meant to be. Rather, it is a fending off of an attack on traditional medicine and if you truly knew me you would be extremely surprised to find me at this end of the table. I am a person who is extremely skeptical about pharmaceutical companies and certain medical opinions but I do believe that allopathic medicine can still be an excellent tool for health if used knowledgeably. This is just as true of naturopathic and homeopathic medicines as well. Ideally I would love to see all of these practices used together for the benefit of us patients and I am happy to see that some allopathic doctors are incorporating the wisdom of other medicines into their own practice.

Wow, how did a simple issue about the H1N1 vaccine escalate into this heated discussion ? Perhaps our insecurities over the H1N1 vaccine are not actually over the vaccine itself but over the medical profession's credibility ... healthy skepticism is good but I still stick to my opinion that one should get the vaccine in addition to maintaining a healthy diet and exercise. In my opinion, the benefits are well worth the risks.

 
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