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Old 09-13-2003, 09:44 PM   #1
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Post Late night ponderings about fluoride

I'd like someone else to see if this sounds like a possibility. I was just thinking about recent tidbits I've heard saying that fluoride causes hypo-T. Well I was doing great on Armour for months, working up to 2 grains, feeling great then it was like hitting running into a brick wall. The hypo symptoms came back. I keep thinking what happened?! It occured to me tonight that about the same time I started using fluoride toothpaste again was about the same time the symptoms started back. I had been using non-fluoride toothpaste for 4 years because a friend had convinced me the stuff was poison because it causes arthritis. Then I got samples of this new toothpaste. I liked the gel, but the health food store had only the paste kind which didn't taste as good. So I mail ordered the gel which turned out to be fluoride whereas the paste did not contain it. Could the fluoride possibly be the culprit? I mean I don't know how much one can absorb from brushing their teeth. The local water supply is one of the few places left that does not have the fluoride added. Is this a possibility or am I having delusions and should just go on to bed?

 
Old 09-13-2003, 10:02 PM   #2
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Flouride used to be used as a hyperthyroid treatment, many years ago. I read somewhere that the amount of flouride that many of us get in our tap water can exceed the amount that was prescribed to treat some hyper cases in some instances. Add to this, the flouride in your toothpaste, and you have a recipe for hypothyroidism.

Ever wonder why some 20 million Americans are hypo? This could certainly explain it.

Have you ever read the label on a toothpaste containing flouride? I don't use the flouride toothpaste, but my fiance does. On a tube of Crest in my medicine cabinet I read this "If more than the amount used for brushing is swallowed, get medical help or call a poison control center immediately."

Scary, huh? They admit that it is a poison, right there on the label!
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Old 09-13-2003, 10:23 PM   #3
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Meep- You convinced me. I just threw out my toothpaste with fluoride. I had an old tube of the non-fluoride variety in the drawer. Now I have heard of parents calling poison control for kids that drank fluoride rinse. I'm trying to remember from like 30 yrs ago there was this really yummy Avon kids toothpaste that tasted like juicy fruit gum. My cousin and I used to eat it. Between the toothpaste eating, pituitary problem and CAH no wonder I am hypo now!

 
Old 09-14-2003, 03:42 AM   #4
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I have terrible teeth (and insomnia) at 38 yrs old, do you think I should sacrifice the fluoride??

Kathy

 
Old 09-14-2003, 04:27 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally posted by wxKathy2:
I have terrible teeth (and insomnia) at 38 yrs old, do you think I should sacrifice the fluoride??

Kathy
There has been no study done that DEFINITIVELY links flouride use to stronger teeth, but that HAVE been studies linking flouride use to mottled and brittle teeth as well as oher problems, including hypothyroidism, osteoporosis, and osteoarthritis.

Here are some excerpts from the January 2003 "Townsend Letter", a magazine on alternative medicine for doctors and patients:

++++++++++++++++++++
Dental Fluorosis
According to a 1989 National Institute for Dental Research study, 1% to 2% of children living in areas fluoridated at 1 ppm develop dental fluorosis, or permanently stained, brown mottled teeth. Up to 23% of children living in areas naturally fluoridated at 4 ppm develop severe dental fluorosis.

In a 2000 study, researchers report that the prevalence of dental fluorosis in the United States has increased over the last 30 years in both fluoridated and nonfluoridated communities. They conclude that without intervention measures, such as using low-fluoride water to dilute infant formulas, supervising the toothbrushing of young children and changing fluoride supplement recommendations, the fluoride intakes of infants and children are likely to continue to increase and be associated with a further increase in the prevalence of enamel fluorosis....

...A recent review of the literature identified four major risk factors for dental fluorosis. “There is substantial evidence that fluoridated water, fluoride supplements, infant formulas, and fluoride toothpastes are risk factors for fluorosis,” alone and together, reports Dr. Ana K. Mascarenhas of Ohio State University. And, too often, dentists and physicians misprescribe fluoride, she concludes....

...Although the ADA and the government consider dental fluorosis only a cosmetic problem, the American Journal of Public Health says that “...brittleness of moderately and severely mottled teeth may be associated with elevated caries levels.”10 In these cases the fluoride is causing the exact problem it’s supposed to prevent. According to Dr. Yiamouyiannis, “In highly naturally-fluoridated areas, the teeth actually crumble as a result. These are the first visible symptoms of fluoride poisoning.”...
++++++++++++++++++++
Skeletal Fluorosis
When fluoride is ingested, approximately 93% of it is absorbed into the bloodstream. A good part of this intake is excreted, but the rest is deposited in the bones and teeth13 and is capable of causing a crippling skeletal fluorosis.

Large numbers of people in Japan, China, India, the Middle East and Africa have been diagnosed with skeletal fluorosis from drinking naturally fluoridated water. In India alone, nearly a million people suffer from the affliction.14 While only a dozen cases of skeletal fluorosis have been reported in the United States, Chemical & Engineering News has stated that “critics of the EPA standard speculate that there probably have been many more cases of fluorosis – even crippling fluorosis – than the few reported in the literature because most doctors in the US have not studied the disease and do not know how to diagnose it.”15 Because some symptoms of skeletal fluorosis mimic those of arthritis, the first two clinical phases of fluorosis can easily be misdiagnosed.16

According to Dr. Connett, the causes of most forms of osteoarthritis are unknown. It is not implausible that the high prevalence of arthritis in America may be related to our high levels of fluoride intake.17 (Arthritis is one of the most prevalent diseases in the US; nearly 43 million Americans have arthritis and related conditions.18) A 2001 study in Turkey found that the severity of osteoarthritis of the knee was greater in patients with endemic fluorosis than in control subjects.
+++++++++++++++++
Bone Fractures
At one time, fluoride therapy was recommended to help build denser bones and prevent the fractures associated with osteoporosis. But several articles in peer-reviewed journals suggest that fluoride actually does more harm than good because it is associated with bone breakage.

Three studies reported in the Journal of the American Medical Association showed links between hip fractures and fluoride.223-25 A 1992 study, for example, found “a small but significant increase in the risk of hip fractures in both men and women exposed to artificial fluoridation at 1 ppm.”26 In addition, the New England Journal of Medicine has reported that people given fluoride to cure their osteoporosis actually end up with an increased nonvertebral fracture rate.27 Austrian researchers have also found that fluoride tablets make bones more susceptible to fractures.28

Scientists at Yale University discovered that doses as low as 1 ppm of fluoride decrease bone strength and elasticity, making fracture more likely.29 Two studies published in the early 1990s found that the rate of hip fracture generally increased with exposure to fluoridated water,30 and the results of more recent studies have suggested that fluoride in water will increase the risk of hip fractures for certain age groups of women.31,32
++++++++++++++++++++
Effects on the Thyroid System
The supposedly safe fluoride levels in our water may pose a particular danger for any of the millions of people who suffer from thyroid disorders, reports Dr. Connett.46 He explains:

“Earlier in the 20th century, fluoride was prescribed by a number of European doctors to reduce the activity of the thyroid gland for those suffering from hyperthyroidism (overactive thyroid) (Merck Index, 1960, p. 952; Waldbott, et al., 1978, p. 163). With water fluoridation, we are forcing people to drink a thyroid-depressing medication which could serve to promote higher levels of hypothyroidism (underactive thyroid) in the population, and all the subsequent problems related to this disorder….

“It bears noting that according to the Department of Health and Human Services (1991) fluoride exposure in fluoridated communities is estimated to range from 1.58 to 6.6 mg/day, which is a range that actually overlaps the dose (2.3 - 4.5 mg/day) shown to decrease the functioning of the human thyroid (Goletti & Joyet, 1958).47 This is a remarkable fact, and certainly deserves greater attention considering the rampant and increasing problem of hypothyroidism in the United States. (In 1999, the second most prescribed drug of the year was Synthroid, which is a hormone replacement drug used to treat an underactive thyroid.)” More than 20 million people in the US receive treatment for thyroid problems, and many others are thought to go undiagnosed.48 Keep in mind that 1 quart of water fluoridated at 1 ppm contains 1 milligram of fluoride.

Excess fluorine in drinking water was a risk factor for the more rapid development of thyroid pathology in a 1985 study. Water with a raised fluorine content resulted in several thyroid effects in healthy subjects, including an elevated production of thyroid stimulating hormone (TSH) and a decrease in the concentration of T3 hormone, compared with healthy people who drank water with a normal concentration of fluorine.
+++++++++++++++++++++
Effect on the Pineal Gland
Another concern is fluoride’s effect on the pineal gland, a small but powerful structure located between the right and left hemispheres of the brain. The pineal gland secretes melatonin, a hormone that affects such functions as sleep cycles, jet lag, hybernation in animals, immunity and the onset of puberty.

Jennifer Luke, PhD, found that the pineal gland attracts fluoride and thereby interferes with the functions of melatonin.73 In autopsy studies, she discovered extremely high concentrations of fluoride in the gland, averaging 9,000 ppm and reaching 21,000 ppm in some cases.74 In an accompanying study of fluoride-treated Mongolian gerbils (the animal considered most favorable for studying effects on the pineal gland), Luke found lower levels of melatonin and earlier onset of puberty.
++++++++++++++++++++

The last one could explain your insomnia, possibly. Melatonin is responsible for regulating our sleep cycle, and is affected by flouride levels. Interesting, huh?

These are only excerpts from the article. The rest can be read online. do a search for using the words "townsend", "flouride", "mottled teeth", and the article should be at the top of the search.

------------------
Danny

I am not a doctor, nor have I ever played one on TV...

[This message has been edited by Meep (edited 09-14-2003).]
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Old 09-14-2003, 07:53 PM   #6
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Just a testimonial here- I grew up in a heavily fluorated area and ate toothpaste as a kid. I have fluorosis. I am very self concious of how bad my teeth look (despite having straight teeth from wearing braces) because of the mottling the fluoride left. Even though it is widely know what the cause is of this mottling, every dentist I have ever seen paid dumb probably because they don't want to admit how bad fluoride is. But then I asked my dentist if it would be harmful to stop using fluoride toothpaste and he said "no".

I hear friends complain how their young kids have a mouth full of metal because three times the citizens of this town have voted NO to fluoradating the water. But I watch my friends and they let their kids eat crap all day long, they drink only soda and do not even brush their teeth every day. The best fight against cavities is brushing, even with baking soda or even plain water. Having said that I have to admit I am in love with my Sonicare electric brush. There's something very exciting about brushing at 30,000 strokes per second...that is after you learn how to hold onto the thing! LOL

 
Old 09-14-2003, 08:18 PM   #7
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wow ... only bottled water for me now ...
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Old 09-14-2003, 09:10 PM   #8
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But there's no guarantee bottled water is fluoride free. Some bottled ones are actually from tap water. I've got a Brita filter. It makes water taste a lot better by removing chlorine, but I don't know if it would filter out fluoride too.

 
Old 09-14-2003, 09:58 PM   #9
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The only water that crosses my lips is from the reverse osmosis machine at the grocery store. It takes out fluoride, chlorine, lead, and a bunch of other things I can't recall, plus it kills all bacteria with its ultra violet light. This water costs me 29 cents a gallon and I reuse the same jugs, so don't have to keep buying them. This is the best route to go. Bottled water is okay, but alot of times it's just filtered tap water and there's a good chance it will still contain bacteria. We even put a filter on our shower so that we don't absorb ehe fluoride and chlorine through our skin.

If you're having a difficult time finding toothpaste without fluroide, used kid's toothpaste - most of it is fluoride-free.

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Old 09-14-2003, 11:40 PM   #10
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Wow! I had no idea - I don't know how much fluoride is in our water here? - but I even get fluoride treatments 2 x year at the dentist! I don't have the mottled effect you describe - but my thyroid is wacked and I have ostepenia at 38! Something to think about - and thanks for telling me where to get water and toothpaste without it -

I really appreciate this board - I am learning so much - thank you!
Kathy

 
Old 09-15-2003, 05:20 AM   #11
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If you use reverse osmosis it's a good idea to take a good multivitamin as the process removes electrolytes from the water. I know this from keeping aquariums; we need electrolytes just like the fish do.

I used to get a lot of canker sores till my dentist told me to avoid toothpaste containing sodium laurel sulfate which is easier said than done. Peelu and Jason's brands are fluoride and SLS free. Tom's of Maine does come in fluoride free and is alot easier to find in most towns.

 
Old 09-15-2003, 06:35 AM   #12
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Ok, I was wondering how much flouride is too much? When I was a kid I got those flouride treatments. The ones where they'd put the trays in your mouth and you'd sit with it on for awhile and then you can't eat or drink for an hour or so after. I hated those things! My dentist was horrible, and the trays were always too big for my mouth. The flouride would drip down my throat and I'd end up swallowing a good amount. That stuff would make me so sick to my stomach. But the dentist never seemed to care. Was it really that bad to be injesting that stuff??

 
Old 09-15-2003, 06:47 AM   #13
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What is "mottle"?

 
Old 09-15-2003, 06:52 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by 22ad22:
Was it really that bad to be injesting that stuff??
Judge for yourself, based on the information I presented above. My opinion is that the stuff is EVIL, but that is only my opinion.

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Old 09-15-2003, 08:20 AM   #15
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Exactly. The best thing for dental health is your general health. You eat the garbage like that, and don't keep the crud off the teeth, and you're going to have problems. And why do hypothyroid people have dental problems? Because they have bone problems. The thyroid hormones aren't there enough, so the calcium isn't replenished in the bones fast enough.

And the dentists don't play dumb. They're under pressure to tow the American Dental Association line, which says that fluoride is totally safe and essential for dental health. If they go against the ADA in any way, their licenses get threatened. We see this in the fluoride category, as well as the mercury filling issue (they phased the mercury fillings back in, after all the publicity regarding the bad health).

Get money and greed out of medicine and you solve most of these problems. The fact is the only reason fluorides were added to toothpaste and the water supply was that it was just a handy and cheap way to get rid of industrial wastes...

Dental health is simple...stay away from sweets and brush - but a dentist won't tell you that. Dental health gets worse, though, when you follow the dentists advice. Mottled brittle teeth, damaged teeth for fillings, and everything else puts money in their pocket. As with a medical doctor, they don't make money by curing people. They make money by keeping people sick and coming into their offices again and again.

P.S. the only safe water is DISTILLED WATER.

Quote:
Originally posted by AngelaA:
every dentist I have ever seen paid dumb probably because they don't want to admit how bad fluoride is. I hear friends complain how their young kids have a mouth full of metal because three times the citizens of this town have voted NO to fluoradating the water. But I watch my friends and they let their kids eat crap all day long, they drink only soda and do not even brush their teeth every day.

 
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