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Old 11-24-2004, 10:53 AM   #1
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Meep, Midwest, and Other Numbers Experts...Please Help With Test Results

Hi,

I'm currently being treated with Synthroid for my Hashi's/Hypo. I've been on Synthroid for years. I asked my endo if I can try some Cytomel (in addition to my Synthroid), as I've been feeling lousy for over a year. Symptoms include fatigue, depression, anxiety, headaches, eye twitching, insomnia, significant weight gain (and inability to lose it despite diet and exercise), and brain fog.

I have other medical problems in addition to Hashi's/Hypo, and one of them is Polycystic Ovarian Syndrome (PCOS). Hypothyroidism, PCOS, and Type 2 diabetes often go together as one syndrome. Well, my lastest blood test showed that I may be in the beginning stages of Type 2 diabetes (I'm 38, BTW). It also showed that I am anemic (I've never been anemic before in my life and suspect that the new findings have something to do with the diuretics I have to take). Oh, and I also take estrogen (birth control pills) for the PCOS.

My endo won't give me the Cytomel until we clear up my other issues, and I'm getting very impatient with her. I may go for a second opinion.

Anyway, my test results follow. If anyone can help make heads or tails of them, I'd really appreciate it. My endo says that my thyroid results are "contradictory."

Testing was done around 11:00 AM, and I fasted.

-----------------

T4 Total: 13.0 (4.5-12.0) High
T3 Uptake: 26.3 (27.8-40.7%) Low
T4, Free, Calculated: 3.42 (1.53-3.85)
T3 Total: 186 (60-181) High
T3, Free: 302 (230-420)
TSH: 3.01 (.40-5.50)

------------------

(I think these numbers are the anemia numbers...)

WBC: 11.6 (3.8-10.8) High
MCV: 76.3 (80.0-100.0) Low
MCH: 25.6 (27.0-33.0) Low
RDW: 16.7 (11.0-15.0%) High
Platelet Count: 457 (140-400) High

-------------------

Sex Hormone Bind Glob: 179 (17-120) High (probably due to birth control pills)

-------------------

(This is the number associated with diabetes...)

Hemoglobin A1C: 6.4 (Non-diabetics < 6.0%) High

------------------

(Probably due to diuretics...)

Chloride: 97 (98-110) Low

------------------

Cholesterol, Total: 276 (<200) High
LDL Chol, Calculated: 144 (<130) High
Triglycerides: 251 (<150)

Last edited by LovesTeaching; 11-25-2004 at 05:44 AM.

 
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Old 11-24-2004, 11:14 AM   #2
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Re: Meep, Midwest, and Other Numbers Experts...Please Help With Test Results

Meep can probably give you a better breakdown but I'll throw in my few cents worth.

Sugar is a problem for you. The A1C test is to high. My doctor, concerned with my weight and potential for diabetes specifically wanted me under 5. I am at 4.8 for the A1C. When your sugar goes up high quickly and then drops like a rock as your insulin burns the sugar off too quickly, you will have many symptoms that can make you nuts. Stable sugar is one key for you. You need to go to ebay and pick up a test kit and monitor yourself carewfully each day, throughout the day. Your fasting sugar, when first waking up should be under 100 all the time. I use the Freestyle monitor. It uses a tiny droplet of blood and you can ***** your forearm...totally painless. Avoid sugars as best you can - no soda, candy, white bread, etc. Eat grain breads and lots of proteins and your sugar should stabilize.

Your cholesterol is high which can be associated with your Thyroid problem, assuming you are not eating McDonalds each night. Are you a smoker? Your triglycerides are pretty high and that's usually caused by eating crummy food (fast food, lots of preservatives) or smoking. Not enough essential fatty acids, like those found in fish - maybe supplement with fish oil capsules.

Your white blood cells are high, indicating your body is fighting something off - could be an infection or could be your thyroid is inflamed.

You need to get your iron up to snuff. Ask the doctor for a Serum Ferritin test if you have not had one as well as a magnesium test and B12 test (Methylmalonic Acid).

How are your other labs? Have you had a liver function test, kidneys, adrenals? I'de want to know all that information to find the cause of the raised platelets and white blood cells.

Last edited by hypodude; 11-24-2004 at 11:22 AM.

 
Old 11-24-2004, 06:22 PM   #3
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Re: Meep, Midwest, and Other Numbers Experts...Please Help With Test Results

Hypodude,

Thanks so much for your valuable input.

My liver and kidney functioning are both fine (test results in range). What are the specific tests for adrenals? I'm not even positive that these tests were done as part of my most recent battery.

I've never been a smoker (I have asthma and can't even be around people who are smoking).

I'm worried about the iron deficiency (because I have stomach issues and iron bothers my stomach). I hope I can get what I need from foods and not have to take supplements.

Thanks again for your help.

LT

 
Old 11-24-2004, 10:33 PM   #4
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Re: Meep, Midwest, and Other Numbers Experts...Please Help With Test Results

Quote:
Originally Posted by LovesTeaching
Symptoms include fatigue, depression, anxiety, headaches, eye twitching, insomnia, significant weight gain (and inability to lose it despite diet and exercise), and brain fog.

I have other medical problems in addition to Hashi's/Hypo, and one of them is Polycystic Ovarian Syndrome (PCOS). Hypothyroidism, PCOS, and Type 2 diabetes often go together as one syndrome.
Quote:
It also showed that I am anemic (I've never been anemic before in my life and suspect that the new findings have something to do with the diuretics I have to take).
Quote:
My endo won't give me the Cytomel until we clear up my other issues, and I'm getting very impatient with her. I may go for a second opinion.
On the other hand, the Cytomel might clear up the problems, but your thyroid labs are a littel unusual.

T4 Total: 13.0 (4.5-12.0) High
T3 Uptake: 26.3 (27.8-40.7%) Low
T4, Free, Calculated: 3.42 (1.53-3.85)
T3 Total: 186 (60-181) High
T3, Free: 302 (230-420)


Quote:
Anyway, my test results follow. If anyone can help make heads or tails of them, I'd really appreciate it. My endo says that my thyroid results are "contradictory."
When did you take our thyroid meds that day? When do you take your BC in relation to our thyroid meds? Do you have a TSH test result, too?

------------------
(I think these numbers are the anemia numbers...)

WBC: 11.6 (3.8-10.8) High
MCV: 76.3 (80.0-100.0) Low
MCH: 25.6 (27.0-33.0) Low
RDW: 16.7 (11.0-15.0%) High
Platelet Count: 457 (140-400) High
-------------------
I would say you need to get on some iron supplements, and maybe some B12, too.

Sex Hormone Bind Glob: 179 (17-120) High (probably due to birth control pills)
Possibly skewing thyroid test results, too.
-------------------

(This is the number associated with diabetes...)

Hemoglobin A1C: 6.4 (Non-diabetics < 6.0%) High
Definitely looking hyperglycemic...
------------------

(Probably due to diuretics...)

Chloride: 97 (98-110) Low
Wah about sodium and potassium levels? I bet they are off, too. If they weren't tested, it woud be interesting to test them.
------------------

Cholesterol, Total: 276 (<200) High
LDL Chol, Calculated: 144 (<130) High
Triglycerides: 251 (<150)

Possibly high due to thyroid levels being off.
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Last edited by Meep; 11-24-2004 at 10:34 PM.

 
Old 11-25-2004, 02:37 AM   #5
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Re: Meep, Midwest, and Other Numbers Experts...Please Help With Test Results

You know thats weird how your white count is high, mine is too..11.2.
Is that something that goes along with being hypo as well?

 
Old 11-25-2004, 05:42 AM   #6
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Re: Meep, Midwest, and Other Numbers Experts...Please Help With Test Results

Hi Meep,

Thanks for your help.

I'm sorry to sound dense, but what does BC stand for? I took my Synthroid about 3 hours prior to my blood testing (testing was around 11:00 AM).

I forgot to post my TSH result. I'll go add it to my original post, but here it is...

TSH: 3.01 (.40-5.50)

Sodium and potassium are OK (at least one of my 2 diuretics is "potassium sparing")...

Sodium: 135 (135-146)
Potassium: 4.1 (3.5-5.3)

I made an appointment with another endo (who is also an internist) for a second opinion. He's supposed to be one of the top guys in Manhattan. We'll see. My appointment is during the second week of December.

Thanks again, Meeps.

---------------------

Hi Likeme,

I have no clue what's up with the high white count. I'm a little concerned about it, though.

LT

 
Old 11-25-2004, 05:46 AM   #7
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Re: Meep, Midwest, and Other Numbers Experts...Please Help With Test Results

Go to this site: altsupportthyroid.org and read. Here's a tidbit on what t3 might help:

"It has improved people's libido, memories, and vision. It has eliminated or greatly reduced brain fog, feeling cold, constipation, depression, chronic fatigue, headaches, insomnia, muscle and joint pain, and chronic sinus infections. For some people, but not all, it has helped them finally lose weight."

And the link also talks about why armour and not cytomel-- because there are other ts and reverse ts that play a small but maybe critical role.

It sound like you have other physical issues too and women are so much more complicated than men but who knows, maybe this site and/or armour will help you. Certainly, to have your symptoms for a year is not acceptable. Keep trying.
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Old 11-25-2004, 05:49 AM   #8
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Re: Meep, Midwest, and Other Numbers Experts...Please Help With Test Results

Choc,

Thanks so much! I will definitely check out that site.

You're right -- women are more complicated.

 
Old 11-25-2004, 06:21 AM   #9
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Re: Meep, Midwest, and Other Numbers Experts...Please Help With Test Results

Just one more thing. One of the sites I read, and it was a Doctor speaking, said it was no natural to make a patient get t3 solely through the body's ability to turn t4 into t3. She said the body naturally produces it's own t3 as well as t4 so it's only natural to conclude that the body needs t3 straight up-- in addition to the t4 and if you are denying your body straight t3 and forcing your body to turn t4 into t3 then that would be the un-natural way to do it.

Makes sense. This doctor also acknowledged that some people don't feel better on t3 and they should just stick with t4 but for many t3 is a must. And I now know that to be true for me.

One of the sites also said how much better armour was than cytomel. So, if you have to convince a doc. to change your meds, you might want to cut straight to armour rather than ask for cytomel and if that doesn't help then go to armour. You know how the docs don't like patients who tell the doc what they need.
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Old 11-25-2004, 06:25 AM   #10
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Re: Meep, Midwest, and Other Numbers Experts...Please Help With Test Results

Spinach has loads of iron....so does red meat, but red meat will also raise your cholesterol even higher. I think you need to look into supplements. BC, I believe is Birth Control Pills.

nutritiondata.com is a good resource to find high sources of nutrients you need in natural foods. You can search for foods highest in iron.

Your sodium is low normal. Anytime there is an imabalance of minerals and electrolytes you can experience problems. Its probably from the diaretics though. Instead of the directics, have you ever tried increasing your potassium naturally? Eat plenty of bannanas and raisins. Also drink plenty of water....Water you would think will add to the bloating but it actually provides wicking action in the cells and as it travels through your system, it tends to take additional water with it. Potassium and sodium work in conjunction with each other and should be balanced. Potassium essentially takes water and draws it out of your cells and out of the body and salt does the opposite and draws water intot the cells and increases blood pressure due to the increased volume of water in the cells.

Your TSH at 3+ is still a little high and problems could certainly be Thyroid related. Iron is VERY important. It helps almost every cell in your body. Too much is no good, but in your case, it needs to come up. I believe you should take iron along with vitamin C, but you might wanna ask your doc about that first. I believe it helps the absorption of iron. Here's some iron rich foods if you prefer:

Liver, round steak, hamburger, baked beans, pork, white beans, pork and beans, lima beans, black=eyed peas, fish, chicken, iron-fortified cereals, oatmeal, bagel, english muffin, rye bread, whole wheat bread, white bread, prune juice, dried apricots, prunes, raisins, plums, spinach, peas, asparagus, Brewer's yeast, kelp squash, seeds (pubmpkin, squash, sunflower), blackstrap molasses, and wheat bran.

On a higher protein, lower carb diet which might be good for you between your sugar level and iron deficiency, iron will not be a problem. I eat tons of chicken in an attempt to keep my sugar stable and control my weight and my iron was actually too high.

Like Meep said BC (birth control) does work in conjunction with Thyroid meds....you need to watch how you take your thyroid meds in relation to the birth control.

It sounds like you need to strategically address each problem one at a time. I would want to start with the sugar because that is ever changing and can affect everything else. Work with your doctor to establish a plan to get your sugar under control and I'll bet some of your other numbers will come into balance. Also, in your case, I think it is imperitive that you get a glucose monitor and keep a log of your sugar levels. I'll bet that you are very borderline diabetic if not full blown and I'll also bet that after you eat a meal, if you test your sugar, you are probably very high and then your insulin kicks in a burns everything off. It would not surprise me to see with you numbers like 280 - 350 for sugar 30 minutes after a decent meal and then 82 for sugar 40 minutes later. However, judging by your A1C test, your sugar level is staying high for long periods of time because that number represents a 3 month average glucose cause blood cells die every 3 months roughly.

Fasting sugar for normal people are at 78-92 typically first thing in the morning. After a meal, you can get as high as 170 - 190 but even that is pretty high. Im usually at 140 after a meal and then 1 hour after a meal I'll be back around 98, which is pretty normal - my sugar is fine - borderline low blood sugar actually.

If you have not had one, I would suggest the 3 hour glucose test. Make sure if offerred that your doc does not give you a huge dose of glucose though because you do have a problem and it might be too much sugar at once for your body. I forgot what the quantity of glucose they use but it varies...I think its like 50 grams, 75 grams or 100 grams. 100 would be too much for you probably and you'll feel really crappy. 50 grams would provide them the info they need and would feel better for you so you don't freak out.

 
Old 11-25-2004, 08:17 AM   #11
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Re: Meep, Midwest, and Other Numbers Experts...Please Help With Test Results

Added....

Im still looking over your numbers and Im guessing between the sugar, the iron deficiency, your high TOTAL T4 and T3 with Low Free T4 and T3 that you eat lot and lots of carbs. Is that the case?

I ask because Im seeing numbers that are off and Im not sure why. I do know this....basically, you have a lot of TOTAL thyroid hormone in your system but not enough of it is "FREE". Add on an pretty good Iron deficiency and sugar problems and it leads me to believe you do not have enough essential protein in your diet to:

1. Stabilize your sugar.
2. Provide you enough iron (and I'll bet B12 is low too)
3. Cause you to gain weight
4. Not be able to increase your Free T's given your TOTAL T numbers (could be the birth control increasing the high total numbers).

As I look it over, I keep coming back to something with your diet that is not right. Have you looked it over closely? I would be curious to see what a typical day's meals include for you.

Here's a link to a good article written by my doctor (he's excellent with Thyroid problems) regarding "Free" versus "Total" numbers:

[url]http://thyroid.about.com/cs/testsforthyroid/a/freet3.htm[/url]

 
Old 11-25-2004, 08:35 AM   #12
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Re: Meep, Midwest, and Other Numbers Experts...Please Help With Test Results

Hi Guys,

I'm getting ready to head to my folks' house for Thanksgiving, so I'll write a more comprehensive reply tomorrow afternoon/evening (when I return home). I do want to thank you all for your thoughtful posts. It's so nice of you to put all this thought into helping someone you don't even know. I can't tell you how much I appreciate it.

Hypodude,

I went to a nutritionist who supposedly specializes in my endocrine problems. This woman charged me $300, and all she told me was to count my calories! What a quack! I need to find a nutritionist who really knows what's what. As I posted earlier, I have an appointment with a doctor who specializes in diabetes, thyroid disease, and polycystic ovary disease. If I like him, I will have him take over the management of my endocrine problems. I will also ask him for a good nutritionist who understands my medical issues.

One more thing -- over the summer, I tried the South Beach diet at the suggestion of my endo. I also started working out with a trainer. And you know what? I still didn't lose weight. UGH. And yes, I am a carb addict, but I am aware of it and try to counter my carb intake with healthy proteins and fats.

OK, off to celebrate Turkey Day (and I promise to eat more turkey and veggies than stuffing and pie ).

Happy Thanksgiving, everyone!

 
Old 11-25-2004, 10:24 AM   #13
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Re: Meep, Midwest, and Other Numbers Experts...Please Help With Test Results

Quote:
Originally Posted by LovesTeaching
I'm sorry to sound dense, but what does BC stand for?
Bitrh Control

Quote:
I took my Synthroid about 3 hours prior to my blood testing (testing was around 11:00 AM).
OK, so your Free T3 and Free T4 are artificially elevated, and those tests need to be redone to be accurate. Meds should not be taken within 8 hours of having your blood drawn. That is part of the inconsistency in your results.

If you are taking your birth control with estrogen within 4 hours (I think 8 hours is even better) of your thyroid meds that can cause your thyroid meds to be bound to proteins in your blood causing your meds to be less effective. This is also part of the inconsistency you and your doc are seeing.

Quote:
I forgot to post my TSH result. I'll go add it to my original post, but here it is...

TSH: 3.01 (.40-5.50)
As you may have read, this is still a little elevated. TSH is inconsistent and doesn't correlate well with symptoms, but this does indicate that your body is crying out for more thyroid hormone.

Quote:
Sodium and potassium are OK (at least one of my 2 diuretics is "potassium sparing")...

Sodium: 135 (135-146)
Potassium: 4.1 (3.5-5.3)
Potassium is "ok", bt your sodium needs to be up near the middle of the range. If sodium and potassium are not balanced properly, then there will be symptoms.

Quote:
I made an appointment with another endo (who is also an internist) for a second opinion. He's supposed to be one of the top guys in Manhattan. We'll see. My appointment is during the second week of December.
I hope it goes well ,adn this doc can make sense of the results. They aren't that hard to figure out by asking a few questions like I did.

Quote:
I have no clue what's up with the high white count. I'm a little concerned about it, though.
You have some kind of infection that your body is fighting, be it a cold, flu, candida, or something else... if the results are high on the next twst, you shoudl definitely find out what hte underlying cause is.
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Last edited by Meep; 11-25-2004 at 10:29 AM.

 
Old 11-26-2004, 02:08 PM   #14
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Re: Meep, Midwest, and Other Numbers Experts...Please Help With Test Results

Hi Meep.

I called my endo's office the day before my last blood tests were performed. She wasn't available, so I spoke to one of her colleagues. He told me that it wouldn't matter whether or not I took my Synthroid the morning of the tests because Synthroid stays in one's system for about 8 days. I therefore took the Synthroid. Did he steer me wrong?

I take my Synthroid in the morning and my BC in the evening, so I think I'm OK there.

Thanks again for your help,

LT

 
Old 11-26-2004, 03:33 PM   #15
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Re: Meep, Midwest, and Other Numbers Experts...Please Help With Test Results

Quote:
Originally Posted by LovesTeaching
Hi Meep.

I called my endo's office the day before my last blood tests were performed. She wasn't available, so I spoke to one of her colleagues. He told me that it wouldn't matter whether or not I took my Synthroid the morning of the tests because Synthroid stays in one's system for about 8 days. I therefore took the Synthroid. Did he steer me wrong?
Yes. Apparently, many doctors (and other healthcare professionals, for that matter) don't know that taking thyroid meds orally causes an artificial rise in your Free Thyroid levels (T4 and or T3, depending on the med you are taking, T4 only in your case). This rise peaks two hours after you take the meds, and remains high for up to 6 hours after that, thus my recommendation to not take your meds within 8 hours of getting Free T4 tests done.

Of course this wouldn't affect Free T3 since you are taking only Synthroid, but your Free T4 test is not usable at this point.

Quote:
I take my Synthroid in the morning and my BC in the evening, so I think I'm OK there.
Good! That is wise and it does help. Still the extra estrogen causes more thyroid hormone to be bound to proteins in your blood, so you have less available to use. No big deal, there, it is just that even if your Total T4 and Total T3 look too high, you may not have enough of the immediately usable Free T3 and Free T4 to feel well.

Quote:
I'm worried about the iron deficiency (because I have stomach issues and iron bothers my stomach). I hope I can get what I need from foods and not have to take supplements.
How about this, idea? Cook your meals in Cast Iron pans instead of the standard aluminum and non-stick stuff most people use. Cast Iron, whhen properly used and cared for is fairly non-stick, heats very evenly, even on an electric range, and by nature of the direct contact of the iron with yoru food, leaches iron into the food, which is a perfect arrangement for an anemic person.

Aluminum also leaches into your food from aluminum pans and has been linked to many health problems, including Alzheimer's, Parkinson's, osteomalacia (soft/brittle bones), glucose intolerance, and (brace yourself) anemia!! Do the glucose and anemia problems sound familiar? Two of the most common sources of aluminum in our bodies are the water we drink, and the food we eat. Bottled water and cast iron pans sounding any better, yet? Most of us also apply aluminum to our armpits every day and this is likely a significant source, too (read the label on your favorite antiperspirant).
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