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Old 06-05-2005, 05:58 PM   #1
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Here are my labs.....need advice.........

I just got all my labs back and my Doctor wants me to switch from Synthroid .50 to Cytomel(never heard of it).........I ahve been on Synthroid for 10 years............this is a new Doc..........
Free T3 2.4 ..................2.6-4.4
TSH 1.82..................0.48-5.90
Free T4 1.4................07-1.9

Is something that out of wack............I am very scared to switch meds. Anyone been on Cytomel or can you give me advice on my lab results....?

Very confused

 
Old 06-05-2005, 06:13 PM   #2
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Re: Here are my labs.....need advice.........

I wouldn't go on straight Cytomel and cut the Synthroid...Im sure that was not his intentions...at least I hope not.....more like Armour would do the trick. Cytomel is pure T3 whereas Synthroid is pure T4 and Armour is a mix of T3 and T4 which seems to be what you need most. If he does give you Cytomel, I hope that he gives it to you in conjunction with some Synthroid so you get some T4 + T3. A little Cytomel added to your routine might help but its pretty powerful stuff. T3 is strong and fast acting whereas T4 is slow and more mellow on the system. Looking at your labs, you can certainly use a little T3 added to the mix. It will probably make you feel great as long as he doesnt give you too high a dose and turn you hyper. My opinion is that you seem to be a perfect candidate for some Armour.

 
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Old 06-05-2005, 06:40 PM   #3
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Re: Here are my labs.....need advice.........

Quote:
Originally Posted by nastyhashi
I wouldn't go on straight Cytomel and cut the Synthroid...Im sure that was not his intentions...at least I hope not.....more like Armour would do the trick. Cytomel is pure T3 whereas Synthroid is pure T4 and Armour is a mix of T3 and T4 which seems to be what you need most. If he does give you Cytomel, I hope that he gives it to you in conjunction with some Synthroid so you get some T4 + T3. A little Cytomel added to your routine might help but its pretty powerful stuff. T3 is strong and fast acting whereas T4 is slow and more mellow on the system. Looking at your labs, you can certainly use a little T3 added to the mix. It will probably make you feel great as long as he doesnt give you too high a dose and turn you hyper. My opinion is that you seem to be a perfect candidate for some Armour.
What is Armour?? And I was told to stop synthriod and just take cytomel......... Has me worried what to do

 
Old 06-06-2005, 05:15 AM   #4
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Re: Here are my labs.....need advice.........

Cytomel is very rarely an "only" drug. People just don't need straight T3 and you with those labs certainly do not need straight T3. I would be worried too. If he doesn't dose you correctly, you will end up very hyper, very quickly and if you think hypo is no fun, wait until you spend a few days with your eyes glued wide open while your heart pounds out of your chest....its scary stuff.

Im not a doctor of course, but have listened to enough people here and have had my own share of trouble with Graves AND Hashi's to know that from your labs I would at BEST:

1. Switch you to Armour Thyroid instead of your Synthroid which contains approx 20% T3 and 80% T4.

2. Continue you on your Synthroid, maybe lowering your dose just a little bit while adding just a tiny pinch of Cytomel which is pure T3.

Here's the deal. The Thyroid normally produces a few different hormones. For the sake of simplicity, it produces 2 hormones, T3 and T4. You need to read up on the differences between the two. In normal people, you make about 80% T4 and 20% T3. Most of the T3 found in your body is converted from T4 by the liver. T4 has a long steady half life. That's why it takes 6 weeks to adjust doses. T3 has a short half life. That's why in 2 days or even a few hours you may feel a difference, but it does not last long.

I can tell you from experience and Im sure others may vouch for me, pure Cytomel is not what you need. Look at it like this, your T4 is only 1.4 in a range of .70 - 1.9 WITH the addition of .50 MCG T4 (Synthroid). What happens to your T4 score when you take that extra T4 away? It goes down. Now, you add pure T3 (Cytomel) per the doctors request. Cytomel is potent. Your T3 is 2.4 in a range of 2.6 - 4.4. That number for you should be closer to 3.8, not 2.4 so you need some T3. I think you will find an optimal dose somewhere at .50 mcg Synthroid and a TINY dash of Cytomel to perk you up.

Armour Thyroid is just like Synthroid in the fact that its just another thyroid drug but it is very different for the fact that it contains T3 AND T4, whereas your current Synthroid only contains T4. Armour is just ground up pig thyroid but it contains the same amount of T3 and T4 and in proper ratios that is found in normal humans so many people find relief from it.

I do not want to tell you to listen to some moron over the Internet and not take your doctors advice. He might have a plan for you. From my experience though, it sounds like he might be a little unfamiliar with thyroid disorders because I don't think there is a doc in the country that would take a clearly hypo patient off synthroid completely and put them on straight Cytomel. I can see if you had some type of disorder where you clearly could not convert T4 to T3 maybe giving something like that shot but in your case, I would if anything start witth he combination. If I had to "self dose" and it were me, I would probably try to lower my Synthroid dose slightly to .0375 MCG and add the smallest dose of Cytomel and then I would split that dose in half and take half that tiny Cytomel in the morning and the other half in the afternoon. Do that for 6 weeks and see where you are at and get retested.

Anyone else out there have any experience with straight Cytomel? Any advice?

 
Old 06-06-2005, 05:36 AM   #5
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Re: Here are my labs.....need advice.........

Quote:
Originally Posted by nastyhashi
Cytomel is very rarely an "only" drug. People just don't need straight T3 and you with those labs certainly do not need straight T3. I would be worried too. If he doesn't dose you correctly, you will end up very hyper, very quickly and if you think hypo is no fun, wait until you spend a few days with your eyes glued wide open while your heart pounds out of your chest....its scary stuff.

Im not a doctor of course, but have listened to enough people here and have had my own share of trouble with Graves AND Hashi's to know that from your labs I would at BEST:

1. Switch you to Armour Thyroid instead of your Synthroid which contains approx 20% T3 and 80% T4.

2. Continue you on your Synthroid, maybe lowering your dose just a little bit while adding just a tiny pinch of Cytomel which is pure T3.

Here's the deal. The Thyroid normally produces a few different hormones. For the sake of simplicity, it produces 2 hormones, T3 and T4. You need to read up on the differences between the two. In normal people, you make about 80% T4 and 20% T3. Most of the T3 found in your body is converted from T4 by the liver. T4 has a long steady half life. That's why it takes 6 weeks to adjust doses. T3 has a short half life. That's why in 2 days or even a few hours you may feel a difference, but it does not last long.

I can tell you from experience and Im sure others may vouch for me, pure Cytomel is not what you need. Look at it like this, your T4 is only 1.4 in a range of .70 - 1.9 WITH the addition of .50 MCG T4 (Synthroid). What happens to your T4 score when you take that extra T4 away? It goes down. Now, you add pure T3 (Cytomel) per the doctors request. Cytomel is potent. Your T3 is 2.4 in a range of 2.6 - 4.4. That number for you should be closer to 3.8, not 2.4 so you need some T3. I think you will find an optimal dose somewhere at .50 mcg Synthroid and a TINY dash of Cytomel to perk you up.

Armour Thyroid is just like Synthroid in the fact that its just another thyroid drug but it is very different for the fact that it contains T3 AND T4, whereas your current Synthroid only contains T4. Armour is just ground up pig thyroid but it contains the same amount of T3 and T4 and in proper ratios that is found in normal humans so many people find relief from it.

I do not want to tell you to listen to some moron over the Internet and not take your doctors advice. He might have a plan for you. From my experience though, it sounds like he might be a little unfamiliar with thyroid disorders because I don't think there is a doc in the country that would take a clearly hypo patient off synthroid completely and put them on straight Cytomel. I can see if you had some type of disorder where you clearly could not convert T4 to T3 maybe giving something like that shot but in your case, I would if anything start witth he combination. If I had to "self dose" and it were me, I would probably try to lower my Synthroid dose slightly to .0375 MCG and add the smallest dose of Cytomel and then I would split that dose in half and take half that tiny Cytomel in the morning and the other half in the afternoon. Do that for 6 weeks and see where you are at and get retested.

Anyone else out there have any experience with straight Cytomel? Any advice?
THANK YOU SO MUCH!! I had no idea what Cytomel was. It makes sense as she had me take .75 up from .50 for 5 days wile waiting for my labs to get back.................I KNOW THE WIRED FEELING.......it was horrible and I felt so OFF!! I am at such a loss as I will not stop my synthroid as that took me years to get balanced.........I may pick up the Cytomel script and try taking a half or 1/4 of the tab for 6 weeks and see how it works. I do NOT want that wired feeling as I suffer from anxiety anyway.
Thanks for the well written repsonse. I GREATLY appreciate it!

 
Old 06-06-2005, 01:39 PM   #6
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Re: Here are my labs.....need advice.........

I just spoke with my Doc........she DID want me ONLY in Cytomel........I told her that from what I read and what the pharmacy told me it was to be take together..........she got very defensive but told me I could do it either way........SO I am going to take .50 of the synthroid that I have been on for years and 1/2 of a 25 cytomel and see how that goes......... Hope it does NOT make me HYPER I can not stand that..........anyone else take Cytomel??

 
Old 06-06-2005, 03:49 PM   #7
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Re: Here are my labs.....need advice.........

FYI>>Cytomel is a VERY short acting drug relative to Synthroid. I think it best to start as small as humanly possible and work your way up according to how you feel....maybe even 1/4 dose could do the trick. A lot of people react quickly to the addition of T3. Because it is so short acting, some people feel better literally within hours. If you get shakey, nervous or feel your heart rate increasing, chill out on the dose and back off a little. A typical dose is sometimes described as like "someone who doesnt drink coffee had their first cup" type of energy....anything more than that in the way of a reaction might mean you are getting alittle too much. It should lift any clouds and fogginess pretty quick.

 
Old 06-06-2005, 07:05 PM   #8
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Re: Here are my labs.....need advice.........

Quote:
Originally Posted by nastyhashi
FYI>>Cytomel is a VERY short acting drug relative to Synthroid. I think it best to start as small as humanly possible and work your way up according to how you feel....maybe even 1/4 dose could do the trick. A lot of people react quickly to the addition of T3. Because it is so short acting, some people feel better literally within hours. If you get shakey, nervous or feel your heart rate increasing, chill out on the dose and back off a little. A typical dose is sometimes described as like "someone who doesnt drink coffee had their first cup" type of energy....anything more than that in the way of a reaction might mean you are getting alittle too much. It should lift any clouds and fogginess pretty quick.
Thanks for the advice..............A question.........if it is short acting does it continue to build up in your system? Could I notice more side effects later on as it has been in my system longer or will I notice them right away??

THANKS!

 
Old 06-07-2005, 05:09 AM   #9
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Re: Here are my labs.....need advice.........

Just want to throw in my 2¢ here....
Twenty-five mcgs of Cytomel equals 100 mcgs of Synthroid, so in effect, you've been given a whopping dose increase at one time. I won't say you need it or don't need it, but most people would have more than a few problems adjusting to such a big increase at one time.
I'm a big fan of MDs who are willing to prescribe T3, but I'm a little leery about this one.

 
Old 06-07-2005, 05:39 AM   #10
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Re: Here are my labs.....need advice.........

If I can add my two cents: both those posters, in my humble opinion, are giving you really, really great advice...from all what I have read in books and online...they are right on! Hope it goes well for you!

 
Old 06-07-2005, 06:29 AM   #11
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Re: Here are my labs.....need advice.........

Thanks Midwest. I had no idea about Cytomel dosing. If that info is correct, I am glad for Fusion that you posted. She would go real hyper on that dose most likely. It almost would seem like 1/4 pill of 25 will still be a lot. That's why I suggested earlier for her to cut her Synthroid from .5 to .375 and maybe only take 1/4 pill of the Cytomel. What do you think Midwest?

And Fusion...to answer your question, there is of course a slight buildup effect with Cytomel but its nothing like Synthroid. If you turn hyper and you stop taking the Cytomel, you will very quickly get it out of your system....literally if you feel hyper and stop taking the added Cytomel, you will feel better within hours and it will be totally out of your system within a few days, unlike Synthroid, which takes weeks.

Based on Midwest's info, I would now shoot for lowering the Synthroid if possible to .375 mcg and take 1/4 pill (if you can quarter them) of the Cytomel to start and see how you feel. I would even go a step further to see if that 1/4 pill can be halved and take 1 half of the 1/4 pill (1/8 of a total pill) in the morning and the other 1/2 of the 1/4 pill in the afternoon. Because the T3 is shorter acting, taking a little in the morning and a little in the afternoon might be perfect for you. This way, you are not getting a big dose at once and you'll be wide awake in the morning and sleepy in the afternoon after the T3 wears off....splitting the dose will keep you Even Steven throughout the day and not make your heart blast out of your chest.

 
Old 06-07-2005, 06:42 AM   #12
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Re: Here are my labs.....need advice.........

WOW I think I need a new Doctor!!! I did look it up and it comes smaller a 5mcg....Of course the Doc told me this was the LOWEST dose!!.........I took 1/4 of a tab this a.m. with my synthroid. I am so scared of new med as I get horrible side effects and HYPER is NOT good for someone with anxiety and panic attacks............maybe I should just stay on my synthroid and leave it all alone??? My TSH was fine...........Keep the suggestions coming.........also why would it be prescribed 1 time a day when it wears off so quickly? If you take it early a.m. and get a blood draw late after noon will the test vary from a a.m test?? I am just so confused but learing ALOT thanks to all of you!!


 
Old 06-07-2005, 06:52 AM   #13
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Re: Here are my labs.....need advice.........

One time a day is more convenient but not optimal. Its not gonna kill you to take it once per day and its certainly easier. Some people have no trouble once per day and others tend to get sleepy in the afternoon when it wears off....see how your body takes to it and use it as an option if you notice extreme fatigue in the afternoon.

1/4 tab given your current situation will probably not turn you hyper....If it does, it should really only be mildly hyper and you can back off. I dont think the 1/4 pill is too much for you given your extremely low T3....Look forward to it...it might actually make you feel awesome! We've given you a lot of details about it so you know what to look for. If you turn hyper, back off a little. Don't "talk yourself" in to a panic attack. Stick with that small dose and get retested after a few weeks and see if your numbers improve. You can always add a little more later.

And PS...your doctor is an As$^#le and probably has no business working on Thyroid patients IMHO.

 
Old 06-07-2005, 07:37 AM   #14
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Re: Here are my labs.....need advice.........

LOL Nasty... That's a heck of a lot of math for someone as math-challenged as me!
T3 is 4 times more potent than T4, so that's why 25 mcgs T3 = 100 of T4.

Truthfully, I don't recommend altering your dose by yourself as much as Nasty suggests, Fusion. It's confusing, and it should ideally be the MDs job to do it right. I know you were probably kidding about finding a new doctor, but I think that would be easier than trying to split a Cytomel into eighths. It would be impossible to get an accurate dose splitting a tablet into that many pieces. Each cut will splinter off a lot of powder that represents a portion of the dose.

If the MD wants you to quit Synthroid, and take only 25 mcgs Cytomel, that would not be as high an increase as I said earlier. Cytomel-only would have the effect of a 100 mcg dose of Synthroid; together, the two would be like 150 mcgs.

I think it's time to sit down with the doctor and question her treatment plan and reasoning for it. Of course, that means you should first read and absorb the basics of thyroid function from a reliable source like Thyroid For Dummies, because you'll want to ask pertinent and intelligent questions.
It seems that she is aware that your FT4 is probably at a good level for you and that your FT3 needs to increase, which is her reason for you to take Cytomel only. It may work, so if you choose to trust her for a time until it either works or it doesn't, that's OK.
It look a little, though, that she may be one of those MDs who resents questions of all sorts from her patients and wants them to follow her instructions blindly. That works for some doctor/patient relationships, but it isn't my cup of tea at all. Maybe you should consider getting other opinions.

 
Old 06-07-2005, 07:50 AM   #15
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Re: Here are my labs.....need advice.........

I too applogize...must be my Terets Syndrome kicking in where my mouth just spews crapola.....however, being that I only have a college BA (bad attitude) and not an MD and your doctor does, it might make perfect sense to either A: Find another doctor more capable of handling thyroid patients or B: Try hard to work with your current doctor AFTER you become fully informed about Thyroid health so you can sort of double check his work and make sure he's not overdosing you. After the junk I've been through I tend to play Mister Know It All and I am very sure I do not know much or else I would be fixed myself. I just want to make sure others try to get the A to B treatment when it comes to Thyroid so they don't have to suffer with years of misdiagnosis and trouble as I have. For the record, I officially have had 8 different endos and 2 different primary docs look at me over the last year or so, so I have pretty decent insight into the subject. My last Endo, who was supposed to be a specialist was so blown away by my odd labs that he referred me to a "specialist of specialists" and told me flat out, thankfully, that he didn't know how to help me - probably the best advice I ever got from a doctor ever and I was thankful for his honesty....it happens.

My question now would be....You already took the 1/4 pill....you notice anything? How is it going? It might be way too soon but some people find really quick releif from the addition of T3 particularly when their body is so lacking as is yours.

Last edited by nastyhashi; 06-07-2005 at 07:55 AM.

 
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