Hi all! I have been a member of the board for over two years discussing possible thyroid issues and most of the people here had a devil of a time getting a doctor to listen to you about thyroid stuff. My question is: Why don't doctors talk about optimal ranges? Why is it that all the veterans of the thyroid board know about this and the doctors don't seem to? I have been to THREE endocrinologists and none of them say anything about optimal ranges prior to official diagnosis. Did they all go to the University of Ignorant? That's my question for the day--Hopeto--
Re: Hey! I've got a question about optimal ranges!
Most endos now seem to know that optimal TSH is around 1.0 (for those on T4 only meds). But, many Gps and other doctors still don't know that yet.
Of course a TSH of 1.0 on Armour or Cytomel is likely NOT optimal. They still don't seem to know that.
But you must be talking about the FREE T3 & FREE T4.
Its not just thyroid hormone levels that the tyranny of the 'normal range' gets in the way of optimal health; but probably one with some of the most consequences !
Using the TSH instead of the actual thyroid hormomes just compounds the problem!
Most doctors are taught in medical school that hypothyroidism is easily treated by using Synthroid and getting the TSH anywhere in 'normal range'.
The makers of Synthroid spend a lot of money at medical schools & with doctors after they begin practices.
Furthermore, the most common hypothyroid patient is a middle aged, over weight woman (often who gave birth recently).
They are quick to blame their continous symptoms on things like...depression, just unhappy, not happy to be a mother!, female problems, fibromyalgea, etc. The list is long. And they just need Prozac , etc.
The book; "Stop The Thyroid Madness" has a good chapter about this.
That source and my own experience is THE ONLY REASON I KNOW.
I spent 25+ years feeling lousy on Synthrod while being told over and over that my levels were 'in nomal range', that I was derepssed and over worked (due to mother-hood).
I was robbed.
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25 years feeling worse every year on Synthroid & 13 months feel good on Armour Thyroid.
Re: Hey! I've got a question about optimal ranges!
I feel so much better on Armour now (thanks for asking).
I still get a little weepy when I think about how I felt while my children were growing up...my energy levels and moods, etc. THAT affected every day of my life (and theirs!).
I tried so hard to be the very best mother I could, read all the books during pregnancy, didn't even have caffeine while pregnant & breast fed all 3 children.
I spent most of those years dragging myself through everyday! My energy was so low!
They told me I was depressed.
I was never depressd!
It was all due to my poorly treated hypo-thyroidism!
Plus my ferritin was VERY low (due to hypothyroidism too).
I try not to look back too much & just do the best I can now.
It even makes me sad to look at pictures of my children when they were young ( It reminds me of how I felt at he time, it seems like I missed out on so much, being so fatigued most of the time).
My children are 19, 16 & 15.
They all turned out pretty well dispite it all.
I did the best I could, moving in slow motion.
I feel compelled to warn others.
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25 years feeling worse every year on Synthroid & 13 months feel good on Armour Thyroid.
Re: Hey! I've got a question about optimal ranges!
Both my Endo & Osteopathic got me barely I N tonormal range & thought they were D O N E. The highest I've been on Free T4's is 1.0 !! (so it's no wonder s that I still have symptoms!)
Unfortunately, tooooooooo many Dr's seem to be numbers crunchers while NOT LISTENING to symptoms their patients are still having.
Luckily, I didn't spend YEARS feeling like garbage on T4 or t4 & t3 meds.
Pure and simple, I feel so much more alive on Armour
Re: Hey! I've got a question about optimal ranges!
Oh boy can I relate to the "missed yrs"! I wonder how much better my life and health issues would have been if only my so called "in range" tsh was treated? Now, medicated and tsh is good, but the t's are still bottom of the low range. Thankfully I got t3, Cytomel and its been about 3 wks and I am seeing some improvement!!! The depression especially, sleep, well working on that, 25yrs of insomnia, still waking up after a couple hrs. Toying with doses on cytomel, and 7.5 seems to be the magic bullet for me! We'll see what my labs are next time? changing endos again, hoping to get better treatment, atleast one that returns calls. But after 6 months of Synthroid and seeing no improvement, I refused to go on any longer without trying to level out the low numbers. My synthroid was reduced but hoping the t3 is bringing them all up to mid range?
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Hashi's / Hypo Jan 2008
C 5-6-7 fusion
L-5 s1, discectomy, ddd, o/a, scoliosis
Hysterectomy
Re: Hey! I've got a question about optimal ranges!
Quote:
Originally Posted by kindspirit
Oh boy can I relate to the "missed yrs"! I wonder how much better my life and health issues would have been if only my so called "in range" tsh was treated? Now, medicated and tsh is good, but the t's are still bottom of the low range. Thankfully I got t3, Cytomel and its been about 3 wks and I am seeing some improvement!!! The depression especially, sleep, well working on that, 25yrs of insomnia, still waking up after a couple hrs. Toying with doses on cytomel, and 7.5 seems to be the magic bullet for me! We'll see what my labs are next time? changing endos again, hoping to get better treatment, atleast one that returns calls. But after 6 months of Synthroid and seeing no improvement, I refused to go on any longer without trying to level out the low numbers. My synthroid was reduced but hoping the t3 is bringing them all up to mid range?
Great to hear T3 is working for you. I think I'll be giving that a try next month so fingers crossed for me too
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Rach xxxx
Total Thyroidectomy Oct 06 due to Massive Multi Nodular Goiter and Hashi
Adrenal Fatigue
180mg NTH
28mg HC
2 x Caltrate
What's the difference between 0.027, current "normal" range low figure, in some parts of the country, and a reading of 0.0025?
Microscopic, right? What is the exact difference?
Before getting on Medicare and with a new lab and doctor, I've been always at .01, and could tolerate still having most of the hypo symptoms, as many people in the forums do.
The new Dr. says leave off half of your Sunday T4 tablet, which a girlfriend also does, so I assumed it wasn't much while getting acquainted, tho' he kept saying "way off". If you're taking 300mg, for years, and subtract 150 mg once a week, what percent is that of your total weekly dosage?
Editing to add, we've all read that there are so many myths re thyroid, med schools only spending about ten min. on it, that it's dangerous for the heart, but one day I overheard an elderly woman's husband telling her doctor she was always freezing when he was burning up. Her heart had slowed down so much she was being hospitalized. I don't know if anyone's ever died.
We'd realize it if we were getting hyper, the symptoms are so extreme, and we know them. Why are doctors, especially men(?) so afraid we'll go hyper? Nobody ever says exactly what damage it could do. Has anyone heard? I've just found out, I'm editing to add, that quite a few things can lower your TSH, we usually are not told, another reason you always need to know your T3 and T4 and their range at that particular lab. The TSH is a pituitary hormone, not thyroid, anyway. It's meant to stimulate the thyroid to produce the right amounts.
Do you people have such low-thyroid brain fog that you can't remember how to do math? What's the difference between 0.027, current "normal" range low figure, and a reading of 0.0025?
Microscopic, right? What is the exact difference?
Well both readings are really low but the difference is a reduction of 0.0245 - but if you were to put it to 2 decimal places then 0.0025 equates to 0.00....basically zilch!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eagle
Want another question? If you're taking 300mg, for years, and subtract 150 mg once a week, what percent is that of your total weekly dosage?
You would be taking 93% of your usual dose
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Rach xxxx
Total Thyroidectomy Oct 06 due to Massive Multi Nodular Goiter and Hashi
Adrenal Fatigue
180mg NTH
28mg HC
2 x Caltrate
Well both readings are really low but the difference is a reduction of 0.0245 - but if you were to put it to 2 decimal places then 0.0025 equates to 0.00....basically zilch!
You would be taking 93% of your usual dose
Hope this will sink in after I print it out and read a few more times. Since you understand the math so well, is this enough difference from the local Range, which may change again tomorrow, to reduce my dosage and my feeling of well- being that I had on the full dosage for years? You're saying zilch is "no" difference? So it's not "way off"?
Hope this will sink in after I print it out and read a few more times. Since you understand the math so well, is this enough difference from the local Range, which may change again tomorrow, to reduce my dosage and my feeling of well- being that I had on the full dosage for years? You're saying zilch is "no" difference? So it's not "way off"?
What I mean by zilch is....the new figure is almost zero - nothing there at all.
I'm assuming this is your TSH you're talking about is that right? If so is there a reason for it being so supressed? Normally the 'optimal' is around 1.0?
__________________
Rach xxxx
Total Thyroidectomy Oct 06 due to Massive Multi Nodular Goiter and Hashi
Adrenal Fatigue
180mg NTH
28mg HC
2 x Caltrate
Re: Hey! I've got a question about optimal ranges!
Mine's normally .01, as some people just feel and function better a little lower.
We had a guy at this board or another one once who said he does best when his is Undetectable. I would want SOMETHING. His case was a little unusual.
Can';t find the Can Anyone Do the Math thread this morning, so I'll ask here, isn't my 180 or 1.80 low for a Free? What does that mean? Never thought I had to pay much attention before, but this is so far off from my usual reports.
Editing 7-29 to say I un-filed my report yesterday to look again and they did give my Free T4 and the Range for that. My test result was within Range, but the doctor only looked at the bottom line TSH, not bad with NEWEST Range, which is only in some parts of the country so far, and I think you're right that it's about 1. around here.
I've just found that several things can lower your TSH. Inhaled Steroids, Nodules, Large doses of Aspirin, Beta Blockers, etc.
Re: Hey! I've got a question about optimal ranges!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eagle
Can';t find the Can Anyone Do the Math thread this morning, so I'll ask here, isn't my 180 or 1.80 low for a Free? What does that mean? Never thought I had to pay much attention before, but this is so far off from my usual reports. TIA.....
No way of us knowing this without the ranges sorry
__________________
Rach xxxx
Total Thyroidectomy Oct 06 due to Massive Multi Nodular Goiter and Hashi
Adrenal Fatigue
180mg NTH
28mg HC
2 x Caltrate
Re: Hey! I've got a question about optimal ranges!
Quote:
Originally Posted by tygwyn
No way of us knowing this without the ranges sorry
Thanks for the info that Free T3 and T4 should be fairly close. Now I remember hearing that before.
Yesterday I un-filed my lab report and found they did give a Range for the Free T4, and mine was within it, also that my TSH is normally .01 rather than .1. Sorry to have to ask but is that a large difference? At least it bumps up the thread.
Anyway, the doctor only looked at the bottom line TSH, not the Frees, and reduced my dosage so that I've felt bad. I had been using Inhaled Steroids since my last test, and quite a bit of aspirin, and just found out there are several things which can lower your TSH. Also time of day has an effect. I can't decide whether to try to discuss with him or just try to find a woman doctor who'll use a different lab, also because his woman assistant left. It's rather insulting when he thinks we have to match an arbitrary lab figure instead of being individuals, doesn't even check any details about what affects our results,much less tell us.
Why is it that all the veterans of the thyroid board know about this and the doctors don't seem to? 
That's my question for the day--Hopeto--
Re: Hey! I've got a question about optimal ranges! 
s that I still have symptoms!)
MIDwest! - but who is older 
Thanks So Much! 
