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Old 04-04-2011, 12:42 PM   #1
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Would FT4 levels be similar if TSH levels are similar?

Hi all, I am a 22 year old male that suspects he is hypo. I was hypo {self diagnosed ex post facto} when I was younger {starting around age 15 and ending around 17.5}, but it was not treated or diagnosed because the lab used the children's TSH range and not the adult range {my TSH was 4.85 and my total T4 was 6.4 and I had cholesterol issues, which I believed were anomalous, despite being told they were a result of dietary issues. My saturated fat and cholesterol intake did not support their levels, they were approximately 50% of the recommended daily allowance}, so my pediatrician told me the symptoms were all in my head. At that time, the symptoms included fatigue, muscle pain, irritability, excessive need for sleep, high cholesterol, weight gain, poor academic performance, brain fog, dry skin, and poor memory. The failure to diagnose and treat the thyroid dysfunction resulted in me dropping out of high school due to poor attendance and the aforementioned poor academic performance despite a high level of intelligence {I got 960 on the SAT in 7th grade}. I have a fairly extensive family history of hypothyroidism {mother, grandmother, and an uncle all had it, I suspect my younger cousin has it as well}, so I suspect that it is Ord's or Hashimotos, since they are genetic, at least according to wikipedia.

So anyway I currently have a TSH of 2.63 {no T4 test of either type was performed}. I have some blood work from before the episode that show a TSH level of 2.59 with a free T4 level of .9 on a .9 to 1.4 range. Would the free T4 level be similar to the current level since the TSH levels are similar?
I was experiencing symptoms similar to those mentioned earlier with the addition of joint pain and cold extremities. I tried to do a self thyroid exam, but I couldn't find the gland, I have no problems dealing with a bra clasp in the dark though. I started taking an over the counter thyroid supplement that appears to be similar to Armour, except it's bovine instead of porcine. This has resulted in all the symptoms being eliminated within hours, which is pretty damning evidence of thyroid dysfunction if you ask me.

Thanks in advance,

Alex.

 
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Old 04-04-2011, 12:43 PM   #2
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Re: Would FT4 levels be similar if TSH levels are similar?

PS. I apologize for being a little long winded and getting off track.

 
Old 04-04-2011, 12:49 PM   #3
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Re: Would FT4 levels be similar if TSH levels are similar?

TSH (pituitary hormone) levels change in attempts to keep FreeT4 levels stable.

So, to properly evaluate thyroid function, it's best to look at the actual thyroid hormone level - FreeT4.

Last time you had FreeT4 checked, it was at the very bottom of the range which indicates hypothyroidism.

Most people have FreeT4 levels at mid-range, if not in the upper third of the range.
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Last edited by sammy64; 04-04-2011 at 12:50 PM.

 
Old 09-01-2011, 02:41 PM   #4
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Re: Would FT4 levels be similar if TSH levels are similar?

Well, I have an update for y'all...


I GOT DIAGNOSED! Yay! lol. I apparently have Hashimoto's disease, but with no antibodies. Apparently, a certain percentage of people with it test negative for antibodies. The endo I got in to see had an ultrasound done, and there were a couple nodules, around half a centimeter in diameter, and they were too small to biopsy. So anyway, I'm going on medication, 75 mcg Synthroid.

 
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Old 09-13-2011, 07:59 PM   #5
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Re: Would FT4 levels be similar if TSH levels are similar?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PeaceSells560 View Post
Well, I have an update for y'all...


I GOT DIAGNOSED! Yay! lol. I apparently have Hashimoto's disease, but with no antibodies. Apparently, a certain percentage of people with it test negative for antibodies. The endo I got in to see had an ultrasound done, and there were a couple nodules, around half a centimeter in diameter, and they were too small to biopsy. So anyway, I'm going on medication, 75 mcg Synthroid.
Hi I am glad you got diagnosed.
How are you feeling now? I have the same levels of FT4 and i feel like crap. Major memory problems. I cant ever find my car even though i park in the same parking lot. Did you have constipation too or no?

 
Old 09-13-2011, 10:07 PM   #6
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Re: Would FT4 levels be similar if TSH levels are similar?

Okay. It definitely Sounded like hypot to me.

You need to make sure that you get your
TSH 3rd Generation
FREE T3
FREE T4
Tested frequently.

Is there a family history of thyroid issues? Your history smacked of puberty activated Hashimoto's. It can take years to destroy the thyroid enough to impact you thyroid function. I am glad that the ENDO you saw was knowledgable enough to diagnose you and treat you with the care you deserve.

Sincerely,
MG
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Last edited by mkgbrook; 09-13-2011 at 10:15 PM.

 
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Old 09-14-2011, 05:52 PM   #7
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Re: Would FT4 levels be similar if TSH levels are similar?

Quote:
Originally Posted by confused34 View Post
Hi I am glad you got diagnosed.
How are you feeling now? I have the same levels of FT4 and i feel like crap. Major memory problems. I cant ever find my car even though i park in the same parking lot. Did you have constipation too or no?
I'm feeling way better. I had some memory issues as well. I didn't really feel constipated, but I was highly irregular, like 2 or 3 BMs a month irregular.

 
Old 09-14-2011, 06:02 PM   #8
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Re: Would FT4 levels be similar if TSH levels are similar?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mkgbrook View Post

Is there a family history of thyroid issues? Your history smacked of puberty activated Hashimoto's. It can take years to destroy the thyroid enough to impact you thyroid function. I am glad that the ENDO you saw was knowledgable enough to diagnose you and treat you with the care you deserve.

Sincerely,
MG
Yes, I do have a family history. I know my mom and grandma had thyroid issues, and I think one of my uncles and one of my little cousins have them as well. I think it only took a year or two for me to become symptomatic, since I started showing symptoms when I was around 14 1/2. I'm just glad this crap is over, hahaha.

 
Old 09-14-2011, 06:10 PM   #9
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Re: Would FT4 levels be similar if TSH levels are similar?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PeaceSells560 View Post
Yes, I do have a family history. I know my mom and grandma had thyroid issues, and I think one of my uncles and one of my little cousins have them as well. I think it only took a year or two for me to become symptomatic, since I started showing symptoms when I was around 14 1/2. I'm just glad this crap is over, hahaha.
My last TSH was 1.15 0.34 - 5.60 uIU/ML
FT3 395 230-420 pg/dl
FT4 0.86 Range 0.80 - 5.60

I have been like this for ever since i can remember.
My congnition is really bad. Short term memory is unreal. Its very depressing and affecting my whole life.


I want to try Westhroid. Does anyone have an idea what dosage to start at?
When did you notice the symptoms of Memory improve? 1week or few months?

Last edited by confused34; 09-14-2011 at 08:20 PM. Reason: changed value for Free T3

 
Old 09-14-2011, 07:03 PM   #10
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Re: Would FT4 levels be similar if TSH levels are similar?

=confused34;
My last TSH was 1.15 0.34 - 5.60 uIU/ML
FT3 395 230-395/ pg/dl
FT4 0.86 Range 0.80 - 5.60
these results are very familiar to me. Have you been thoroughly tested for Hypoadrenalism? You are 100% in T3 while 0% in T4. This is a very common our come in long term under or in treated hypoTs. You are basically hypoT in T4 while being hyperT in T3.

This happened to me after four years of untreated Hadhimoto's and graves disease turf war waged in my body. I am not an MD but I am familiar with the testing and care of Autoimmune fallout.

Have ever had your cortisol or adrenal function tested? I was diagnosed after an 8am blood draw of cortisol, aldosterone, DHEA, and ACTH. In addition I had a 24 HR cortisol saliva test that showed my cortisol levels continued to drop through out the day.

One thing Hypoadrenalism is known for is thyroid hormone supplement intolerance. I couldn't tolerate more than 12.5-25 mcgs with out driving myself hyperT3. Without cortisol all or most of your T4 is converted to T3. If this matches what you have been going through I strongly recommend requesting an adrenal profile be run or even a trial hydrocortisone supplement. It only took a month on 20 mg of hydrocortison tablets a day to control my T4 to T3 conversion and allow me to treat my hypoT.

I hope this helps.
MG

This matches Hypoadrenalism. You should do a little research and then talk to your MD about it.
I have been like this for ever since i can remember.
My congnition is really bad. Short term memory is unreal. Its very depressing and affecting my whole life.

I want to try Westhroid. Does anyone have an idea what dosage to start at?
When did you notice the symptoms of Memory improve? 1week or few months?
I fear from personal experience that supplementing your T4 you will only make things worse.
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Last edited by mkgbrook; 09-14-2011 at 07:12 PM.

 
Old 09-14-2011, 07:52 PM   #11
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Re: Would FT4 levels be similar if TSH levels are similar?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mkgbrook View Post
=confused34;
My last TSH was 1.15 0.34 - 5.60 uIU/ML
FT3 395 230-395/ pg/dl
FT4 0.86 Range 0.80 - 5.60
these results are very familiar to me. Have you been thoroughly tested for Hypoadrenalism? You are 100% in T3 while 0% in T4. This is a very common our come in long term under or in treated hypoTs. You are basically hypoT in T4 while being hyperT in T3.

This happened to me after four years of untreated Hadhimoto's and graves disease turf war waged in my body. I am not an MD but I am familiar with the testing and care of Autoimmune fallout.

Have ever had your cortisol or adrenal function tested? I was diagnosed after an 8am blood draw of cortisol, aldosterone, DHEA, and ACTH. In addition I had a 24 HR cortisol saliva test that showed my cortisol levels continued to drop through out the day.

One thing Hypoadrenalism is known for is thyroid hormone supplement intolerance. I couldn't tolerate more than 12.5-25 mcgs with out driving myself hyperT3. Without cortisol all or most of your T4 is converted to T3. If this matches what you have been going through I strongly recommend requesting an adrenal profile be run or even a trial hydrocortisone supplement. It only took a month on 20 mg of hydrocortison tablets a day to control my T4 to T3 conversion and allow me to treat my hypoT.

I hope this helps.
MG

This matches Hypoadrenalism. You should do a little research and then talk to your MD about it.
I have been like this for ever since i can remember.
My congnition is really bad. Short term memory is unreal. Its very depressing and affecting my whole life.

I want to try Westhroid. Does anyone have an idea what dosage to start at?
When did you notice the symptoms of Memory improve? 1week or few months?
I fear from personal experience that supplementing your T4 you will only make things worse.
Well ok, Now i am scared. My Doc said i was Hyper by some of the indices that he tested for like tyosine and some others. Its funny because sometimes i will sweat for no damn reason and things seem to be going a few times faster than what they should. But if i am hyper t3? Y the constipation and the damn brain fog. its really crazy. I have been like this for ever. Should i just push for the ITT? I have lots of hormone issues. Right now i am on Arimidex for high estrogen which helps with my emotions and tiredness, i have recently lost my libido while my Testosterone is 900+. Bio available T is also 85percentile.

last cort test were
in 06

basal 13.5 10am
30min 24.1
60min 31.9
90min 38.9

few months ago my cort was 17 or 18 i think.
Your symptoms seem really close to me.
What should i do? check out the Insulin tolerance test?
Why would i be converting too much of t3? I am seeing an neuroendo now, and he is good, but he specializes with the head and secondary endo.

I also get flushed in the face for some odd reason and i am always asked if i have high blood pressure. One thing i know is if i dont get this resolved, im gonna be jobless.

Last edited by confused34; 09-14-2011 at 08:10 PM. Reason: few more thoughts

 
Old 09-14-2011, 07:56 PM   #12
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Re: Would FT4 levels be similar if TSH levels are similar?

As of June
Glucose 101 65 -99
Testosterone total 491 ng/dl 250
Free test 89.2 46 - 224
bioavailable 191.2 110-575
Albumin serum 4.7 3.6 5.1
Estradiol 41 pg/ml 20 - 47
ACTH 25 8 - 48
renin 2.65 .25 5.82
Epineph plasma 93
Norepineprine plasma 226 112-658
Dopamine <30 less than 30
total plama Caecholamine 319 123- 671
Lipoprotein A <10 <75
Aldosterone 10 <=28
Tyrosine 74 38 - 96
Cortisol 17.5 .0 - 25
insuline 7.24 1.9 - 23
DHEA-S 419 106 - 464
LH 3.4 1.24 8.62
FSH 4.4 1.27 19.26

 
Old 09-14-2011, 08:01 PM   #13
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Re: Would FT4 levels be similar if TSH levels are similar?

Latest Testosteone 8/24/11
after arimidex
Estradiol 51 pg/mL

Total Test 923
Test Free 193.7 46 -224 pg/ml
Test Bio avail 390 110 - 575 ng/dl

SHG 23 10 - 50
albumin 4.4 3.6 5.1

Please help
My memory is the worst of it all.

 
Old 09-14-2011, 10:17 PM   #14
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Re: Would FT4 levels be similar if TSH levels are similar?

T4 is essential for brain function, memory, thyroid hormone reserves and more when I was at 10% I couldn't function or focus and I was working on my PHD! It really slowed down my ability to comprehend new material and retain it. You are not alone in this feeling. It is a very common hypoT symptom.

Well I am not a MD. But I would think that you should look at the issues circling thyroid function. Adrenal testing at 8 am peak monitoring time chemically.

Reactive hypoglycemic? Insulin resistance? The enforcing system is complex and varied. The more you evaluate the better chance you will find your trouble makers.

Have you had MRI of your pituitary/hypothalamus/thyroid/adrenals? Maybe there is some thing structural that can clue your MD in.

My record was 15 vials of blood when they were trying to find all my issues. Now five vials a visit seem so minuscule. I wish you the best.

MG
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Last edited by mkgbrook; 09-14-2011 at 10:27 PM.

 
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