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-   -   TMJ & 'Derealization' (http://www.healthboards.com/boards/tmj-disorder-temporomandibular-joint/921348-tmj-derealization.html)

jacko1 10-03-2012 02:29 AM

TMJ & 'Derealization'
 
I had my four wisdom teeth removed. Shortly after I noticed a decent improvement in that the fullness in my head and ears left, but I am still left with a feeling of what I would describe as derealization, like the world doesn't feel real to me, I am in a dream and I can't take everything in. At no point have I noticed any pain. Just wondered if anyone on here had felt similar symptoms. What are the other options for treatment in TMJ Disorder? I have noticed conditions to do with the inner ear have similar symptoms. I have never felt any pain or dizziness, but there is still a slight clicking in my jaw, and when I inflate the left side of my mouth there is there sound and sensation of fluid at the top of my jaw.

JoAnn15 10-04-2012 01:48 PM

Re: TMJ & 'Derealization'
 
Yes I ha...ve...Feeling this way for about 3 weeks now...Some days are better than others but I keep pushing forward

CherylLynn24 10-10-2012 08:56 PM

Re: TMJ & 'Derealization'
 
My son was treated for a severe case of TMJD at the age of 13, in which his treatment was successful in the 10 years that followed. The only symptoms that he's been left with are recurrent derealization and tinnitus.

I think this is the first time that I've seen the symptom of derealization on this forum, thus my need to respond.

After 10 years of research on TMJ disorder, I haven't been able to come across anything stating that TMJD would cause derealization. Oddly enough though, I have come across a plethora of information suggesting that derealization can be brought on by primary cervical issues, as does tinnitus.

This may be something worth looking into. Hope this helps.

jacko1 10-11-2012 03:48 PM

Re: TMJ & 'Derealization'
 
I hope you feel better soon JoAnn.

Hi Cheryl, thanks for your post. I am also unconvinced TMJ is causing this. What sort of other tests has your son had? I am going to have an EEG next week which may pick something up hopefully. The only link with TMJ is that the feeling began when they were coming through, there may have been an improvement when they were removed.

CherylLynn24 10-12-2012 09:37 AM

Re: TMJ & 'Derealization'
 
Hi Jacko,

Out of curiosity's sake, do you have cervical pain or tightness?

My son has had MRI's, CT scans and Tomograms of his TMJ's and C-spine (bone and soft tissue) over the years. The tests had shown that his discs were displaced at a time, but have since been recaptured. He currently has no pain or issues with his jaw/joints.

The only thing that stood out regarding his C-spine was that he had lost the curvature of his neck. (Often known as "military neck" or "the curve of Georgia") This is quite often due to spasm, which causes pulling, tightening and shortening of the muscles. He continues to see a Chiropractor and participates in Massotherapy for this.

Oddly enough, there have been several occasions throughout the years where he's been playing basketball or some type of sport, his neck has cracked and he was instantly relieved of his tinnitus and whatever level of derealization he was experiencing at the time. Again, this leads me to believe that his current symptoms that have not improved (derealization and tinnitus) are directly related to C-spine issues.

I would be interested in hearing how your EEG goes. If you have the time, please do come back and report the findings.

Liquidplasma 10-12-2012 12:28 PM

Re: TMJ & 'Derealization'
 
When you say recaptured his discs set themselves back into place or your son needed a splint? To do this?

jacko1 10-12-2012 01:01 PM

Re: TMJ & 'Derealization'
 
Hi Cheryl, no I have never experienced any pain whatsoever with jaw, neck, or in my head. That is very interesting that he improved when his neck cracked. How often does he experience derealization/tinnitus on a daily basis? And how does it affect him? I will certainly let you know how the tests go, it will answer some questions, and probably give me some more.

CherylLynn24 10-12-2012 02:13 PM

Re: TMJ & 'Derealization'
 
Hi Jacko,

Regarding your situation, did this all begin with the extraction of your wisdom teeth? Were you diagnosed with TMJD prior, or after your extraction? Have you ever seen an ENT or TMJ Specialist for this sensation you described above your jaw? (Sorry for all of the questions, I'm only trying to get a clearer picture of your particular situation)

My son's tinnitus is always there, 24/7. As for the derealization, it comes and goes, quite often on a daily basis. There doesn't seem to be any sort of pattern to it. He has said that he notices that it intensifies when he sits for more than an hour or when he's not moving around much.

Brief relief following his neck cracking leads me to believe that it has got to be related to something in his C-spine, whether it be nerve, blood flow-related or something. I just can't figure out what, exactly. While I haven't been able to make a connection of TMJ/Derealization during my research, I have found much information out there from Chiropractors stating a connection with the C-Spine, however they offer no explanation as to why.

Please do let me know how your tests go and perhaps we could have more to go on.

Liquidplasma~~~

My son used a repositioning splint which in turn recaptured his discs.

jacko1 10-12-2012 03:50 PM

Re: TMJ & 'Derealization'
 
It began before I had my wisdom teeth removed. Derealization was the first and only symptom, it sort of came in periods before it set in. I actually included a link in my first post to a post I made on here 4 years ago stating that I had just been to an oral surgeon who took an xray and found my jaw had been pushing up onto my disk on one side. I was never diagnosed with anything, and I just learned to live with it before I had a massive anxiety attack a few weeks ago and realised I had to get something done. I have ordered a book about it from amazon by a guy who had it (and tinnitus) for 20 years before cutting out refined sugars and it disappeared, there is one girl who had it for a few years and then was later told it was caused by epilepsy, other people have caused by back problems, others anxiety, you just have to make sure you work through every possibility.

Liquidplasma 10-12-2012 03:50 PM

Re: TMJ & 'Derealization'
 
Thank you very much for the info, I will try this for myself. I truely wish you the best and to find your sons problem and correct it

jacko1 10-12-2012 04:02 PM

Re: TMJ & 'Derealization'
 
Just happened to be going through my old posts on here and saw I said my symptoms included occasional ringing in the ears and a fullness in my ears which both disappeared shortly after my wisdom teeth were removed.

CherylLynn24 10-12-2012 06:53 PM

Re: TMJ & 'Derealization'
 
I'm really surprised that if your jaw weren't positioned correctly, you didn't have pain of some sort. Perhaps you do need a repositioning splint to correct that. It seems as though with TMJD, you must look at all possibilities.

My son had the same as you, regarding the tinnitus and ear fullness. Within the past few years, he had all 4 wisdom teeth removed and the fullness disappeared, unfortunately the tinnitus did not. It was suggested by his Specialist that he have only 2 teeth removed at a time, so one year he had 2 removed and waited a year for the second 2.

You mentioned having anxiety attacks. Have you taken anything for them? Benzodiazepines (Xanax, Klonopin, Ativan, Valium, etc.) are known to cause derealization. I just thought I'd throw that out there.

It sounds like you're researching into all possibilities. I have come across information stating that sugar, caffeine, aspartame, MSG and a host of others can cause all sorts of these symptoms.

jacko1 10-12-2012 07:12 PM

Re: TMJ & 'Derealization'
 
I haven't take any prescription drugs, which rules that out. It's interesting that a number of people seem to have used marijuana and other recreational drugs, and sort of got locked in this state of derealization. Another odd thing I noticed was after I got this condition my feet started getting a thick layer of skin on the bottom, and then after my teeth were removed it began to peel off until and it has almost gone, but then stopped improving. Another piece in the puzzle.

Thelma-Louise 10-18-2012 08:43 PM

Re: TMJ & 'Derealization'
 
[QUOTE=CherylLynn24;5070459]My son was treated for a severe case of TMJD at the age of 13, in which his treatment was successful in the 10 years that followed. The only symptoms that he's been left with are recurrent derealization and tinnitus.

I think this is the first time that I've seen the symptom of derealization on this forum, thus my need to respond.

After 10 years of research on TMJ disorder, I haven't been able to come across anything stating that TMJD would cause derealization. Oddly enough though, I have come across a plethora of information suggesting that derealization can be brought on by primary cervical issues, as does tinnitus.

This may be something worth looking into. Hope this helps.[/QUOTE]

I totally agree. Although I have never used the term unrealization and have never seen it discussed on this forum either, I often describe it as being disconnected from myself. It definitely responds to cervical adjustments done to my atlas, axis (c1 and c2) and cranium by my ICAK aka cranial chiro and he has been the only one I ever mentioned this to that knew exactly what I was describing and did not make me feel like there was some type of underlying psychological issue at play.

jacko1 10-28-2012 07:06 AM

Re: TMJ & 'Derealization'
 
So I haven't been back to the Dr yet, I have been tossing around a few things. I know derealization is most often caused by a stressful event or events, however upon doing some research I have discovered that it doesn't set in right away after that event. I had one particular stress related episode in 2005 that could very well have triggered it to slowly develop. I would be able to accept that however why did I notice the fullness leaving my ears and the ringing going after I had my wisdom teeth out? I am quite sure there was a reasonable improvement in my condition after they were taken out. Yet I had no pain at any point, or any other TMJ Disorder symptoms (excluding ear clicking). Cheryl has your son ever described exactly what he feels when he is going through a derealization episode? And Thelma would you be able to tell me your description of it? Thanks so much!


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