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Old 01-06-2006, 07:04 AM   #1
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pipermac HB User
My Advice......

My advice to everybody is to not take anybody's advice including mine!

Well Actually its more to just take everyones advice with a grain of salt. Remember This is a Peer Message board....none of us are experts. Before following anybody's advice try to do some research first..then make your own decision.

Everybody has an opinion and there is always two sides to every story. It is important to learn about both sides as much as you can. It is very easy to read a lot about one side of a story and then decide that it is the right side without even researching the other side.

We have a Big problem in todays society and that is trying to decide who to believe. Everything is driven by money and we never really know what a persons agenda is when they give "advice". We are bombarded with opinions that are presented as fact. We are consistent told that you shouldnt eat this or you shouldnt eat that. or this is bad for you or that is bad for you. One of the biggest problems is that Most of these recommendations come from "Studies" but there is something inherently wrong with studies...and that is that they are usually biased. Studies have to be paid for....and the people paying for these studies usually want a specific result so they will have the studies taylored to get the result they want. We never really know if a study is unbiased or not. Another problem with these studies is that they generally can not detect problems If it only effects a small percentage. Most studies are done on animals and are done with a few hundred subjects. IF something is Bad and affects one in a thousand people then it usually will not be detected in any study. one in a thousand woud be roughly 300,000 americans.

So what do you believe? Sometimes I just dont know who to believe.

What I have decided peronally to do is try to pick the side that would cause me the least damge if it was wrong and weigh that against the Possible Inconvenience in my life that it may cause, Monetary cost being one of them.

There is something else to consider when researching things. Just because the person giving the advice is a doctor or a trainer or an nutrionalist, etc and they may not seem to have anything to gain by advising what they do does not mean you should givie their opinion any more consideration. you need to understand where they are getting their information from. they will ofton just be passing on to you what they believe....but if they are just relaying what they Learned from someone else....what makes their opinion any more reliable?

An Example would be the Atkins diet. Almost all Positive things about atkins comes from atkins himself. He Has taught others his philosphy and they have taught others....these people all believe in it....but that does not make it right.
How I decide about atkins:
The Atkins Side says that it is perfectly healthy and works to lose weight and works better then other diets.
The Opposite side says that yes it will work to lose weight but is not healthy and in studies does not cause more longterm weight loss then any standard diet.

Obviously one side is right and one is wrong....in reality there is no way for me to know which is right. So Which one would cause me the most harm if they were wrong? Obviously the Atkins side. But lets also consider other factors.....Conveniece, With Atkins I can only eat very few carbs, it is very restrictive, not convenient at all. Also MAny of the atkins Foods are more Expensive. It is also recomended to take extra vitamin supplements wich cost more money.

I think the decision is easy...No To Atkins! Besides that I also tend to believe about the negative health benefits of atkins.

I believe if you take this approach to any decision about advice to you especially on diet, fitness and Weight loss you will be making the right decison more ofton then not.

It is your health and your body that you are making decisions on, dont you think that is worth finding out as much info as possible? Just remember to try to look at both sides of the arguement equally before making a decision.

 
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Old 01-06-2006, 07:41 AM   #2
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Re: My Advice......

Hi there-
I am not big on "fad" diets either, like the atkins you had mentioned. I have tried to just use good old common sense when it came to eating and exercise and I have been fairly successful. However, a year long struggle to get those last 10 pounds has had me resort to trying the South Beach Diet. I am not happy about caving in to such a restrictive diet, but my technique wasn't working anymore. Do you feel the same way about the SBD as you do Atkins? Bloomers

 
Old 01-06-2006, 07:48 AM   #3
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Re: My Advice......

Piper, as always, beautifully said

Getting healthy and losing a few pounds shouldn't be based on what a diet book tells us; that is, unless we may need some new ideas for meal planning! Even in that case, there are many websites and cookbooks to address that.

A diet should also be enjoyable, but a challenge, too. It should be a learning experience. How else would one stay on it? So many of us think "diet = boring, lackluster food and X amount of time at the gym." That doesn't have to be the case at all. It all boils down to education about nutrition and the body and getting moving throughout the day, not just sweating on a machine at one set time.

FWIW, I agree with you about Atkins. I checked it out, discussed it with all of my physicians (high cholesterol, GI troubles and weight issues here) and decided it wasn't for me, for many of the reasons you cited, in addition to my physicians' advice.

Best wishes for a happy, safe, prosperous & HEALTHY New Year!

Lysne

 
Old 01-06-2006, 08:14 AM   #4
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pipermac HB User
Re: My Advice......

I think Souch beach is a bit Better.....But I was mainly using the atkins as an example of how I try to make some of my decisions.

I am doing the Same thing with things such as organic Foods. I dont know fore sure that Genetically modified foods or the pesticides used cause us any harm...But it There is an alternative...and the cost is not prohibitive or an inconvenience then I will choose the organic substitute. I have a place where I get organic apples for the same price as Non- organic an my local grocery store....so I choose organic. But I love Chicken...and paying more then twice as much for organic chicken is just too much...so I dont eat organic chicken.

One of the biggest things anyone should consider is that IF they believe something...then they should ask themselves WHY do I believe that? Because you read it somewhere? What makes that accurate? It is the same when reading or watching the news...there is so much bias out there that you just cant automatically believe something is true just because it was in the news.

 
Old 01-06-2006, 08:50 AM   #5
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Re: My Advice......

So, you start out proposing that people research all sides of an idea (I definitely agree with you there) but then end by blasting the idea YOU don't like. Goodness, gracious.

Very clearly you don't like Atkins. But . . . what was it you said . . . "One of the biggest things anyone should consider is that IF they believe something...then they should ask themselves WHY do I believe that? Because you read it somewhere? What makes that accurate? It is the same when reading or watching the news...there is so much bias out there that you just cant automatically believe something is true just because it was in the news." So how did you arrive at YOUR "truth" about the Atkins plan? Have you read anything recently that was not on a very biased site? (Tied to the PCRM or similar organization?) Or to a study that was not funded by the Potato Council or similar group?

More and more studies from mainstream sources are finding that many of the earlier criticisms of the Atkins plan just don't hold up.


And if there is one phrase I would love to banish from the English language because it is used so incorrectly, it would be "fad diet". Atkins has been around through two revisions of the USDA nutritional recommendations. WHICH is a "fad"?

 
Old 01-06-2006, 09:06 AM   #6
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pipermac HB User
Re: My Advice......

Quote:
Originally Posted by auntjudyg
So, you start out proposing that people research all sides of an idea (I definitely agree with you there) but then end by blasting the idea YOU don't like. Goodness, gracious.

Very clearly you don't like Atkins. But . . . what was it you said . . . "One of the biggest things anyone should consider is that IF they believe something...then they should ask themselves WHY do I believe that? Because you read it somewhere? What makes that accurate? It is the same when reading or watching the news...there is so much bias out there that you just cant automatically believe something is true just because it was in the news." So how did you arrive at YOUR "truth" about the Atkins plan? Have you read anything recently that was not on a very biased site? (Tied to the PCRM or similar organization?) Or to a study that was not funded by the Potato Council or similar group?

More and more studies from mainstream sources are finding that many of the earlier criticisms of the Atkins plan just don't hold up.


And if there is one phrase I would love to banish from the English language because it is used so incorrectly, it would be "fad diet". Atkins has been around through two revisions of the USDA nutritional recommendations. WHICH is a "fad"?

I think I explained How I come up with my opinions And I said right at the beginning...to not just believe everything...Including Me! All I have done is added that I dont believe that atkins is Good. I believe It is a powerful Marketing machine that has the ability to Persuade People to believe things that are not necasarily true. I dont expect anyone to take this as gospel. My Advice was to Look at both sides and try to form your own opinion.

And what makes you think the studies that support atkins are not biased? That was my point in this post. The Truth Is that We Dont really know. I will readily admit that it is possible that the atkins side may in the end be correct. But I am not convinced. This Post was not about Atkins...Atkins was just used as an example.

 
Old 01-06-2006, 05:19 PM   #7
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Re: My Advice......

I understand pipermac post and the suddestions/opinons.
theres always pro and cons...and two sides to evertything.

I was on Atkins 3 MONTHS lost 30 lbs but stop it reason> because I stop was not loseing weight....along with believeing other people.

Everyone had told me his diet was not good for me that I would get artery desease > eatting so much fat the build up over the years ect,,,ect,, that scared me so I got off.... who do we believe?

but I do agree with his diet to a certain point the hi carbs are bad for you/and the things we eat does make a difference like the sugars and stearches/bad carbs..... without going into full details, its like he believes in the metabalism process that when we take in the fat like eatting hi proteine the body gets rid of it before it has a chance to be stored and therefor theres no reasons to say the diet does cause health problems/artery desease ect,,ect,,....if you follow his diet correctly.

I don't know if theres concrete eveidence his diet is not good for you or not?, that hi protein, causes fat to be stored in the artries ect,,ect,,,fat around the heart sack ect,,ect,, causing complacations in some people...esp with dibetes ect,,,ect,, some say Dr Atkins died of "heartfailure"?
I heard he "died from complcations of swelling in the brain from a a fall he took in NY City"?...some Dr found his medical files and twisted the storey around about his already controversal diet/and his death...his widow is in legation.

The things we read about this diet is all specualtion and no explantion of anyone getting in bad health because of his diet? they base it on assumption.
I tend to think that Dr Atkins reserched all this and the way the meatabloic process in our bodys works, it is his findings that if this diet is followed correctly by the book it is safe...some are to affraid to take the chance...and I'm one of those affraid/maybe I would not feel this way if I would have kept on loseing the weight? who knows forsure?

I think all diets are hard to do and it's up to everyones own what goes in there mouth...knowing that something will be bad for you and you and in all probability will gain weight.... so you have to ask yourself should I or shouldn't I.

 
Old 01-06-2006, 06:26 PM   #8
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Re: My Advice......

I have a favorite haunt. It's a forum with 50,922 members (I went to this site to varify the exact number. It is the busiest forum I have ever been apart of and its a low carb forum. There are people on this site who live this WOE like I do. From Atkins, South Beach and Protein Power. There are people on this site who were 400 pounds to be svelt and lovely and toned. Many have been on low carb since Atkins began in 1970. No health problems for these people in fact testimony after testimony of just the opposite. These are real people not facts on a page.

One woman went to see if she were a match to donate her kidney to a family member. The technician said she had one of the healthest blood levels he has seen in a long time. When she told him she does Atkins, he laughed and said this diet gets so much bad press but really works. There are thousands and thousands of stories like these.

My DH was nearly 300 pounds and today he is 190. He ballooned because of Effexor as it really causes an increase in appetite. Atkins has allowed him to continue this medication and lose weight. His doctor is thrilled.

Our Doctor says this diet helps diabetics and isn't dangerous. It isn't all protein either as many believe. It isn't that restrictive. Once you reach your goal weight it is similar to South Beach and many before things that were not advised is now permitted. Fruit is one of them.

 
Old 01-06-2006, 07:58 PM   #9
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Re: My Advice......

Excellent advice, pipermac.

People need to stop following the herd and doing what everyone else is doing. You have to figure out what works for you, even if the rest of the world is doing something different. And given that there's a 95% failure rate at losing fat permanently, it doesn't make a lot of sense to do what everyone else does. If you follow the herd, you'll step in something unpleasant.

People also need to look at everything with a critical eye and a healthy dose of skepticism. For example, it amazes me that people still believe in the government's food pyramid. This thing was put together by The Department of Agriculture, a department whose function is to ensure the health of the food industry and whose members include former executives at major food companies. And I personally have a hard time taking health advice from people who don't look like the model of good health. That's why I dismissed the Atkins Diet as soon as I saw the doctor behind it. If his diet works so well, then why is he still fat?

One thing I do think people need to do is get a better understanding of the fundamentals of nutrition. Too many people are looking for something original or cutting edge. If it's something they never heard of and sounds really radical, they'll listen. If it's the same old "eat healthy and exercise" message, people won't listen. And the diet industry preys on people like this by coming out with some new radical diet every year. Don't fall for it. Just focus on the basics, even if they are boring.

 
Old 01-06-2006, 09:17 PM   #10
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pipermac HB User
Re: My Advice......

Quote:
Originally Posted by anitak1982
I have a favorite haunt. It's a forum with 50,922 members (I went to this site to varify the exact number. It is the busiest forum I have ever been apart of and its a low carb forum. There are people on this site who live this WOE like I do. From Atkins, South Beach and Protein Power. There are people on this site who were 400 pounds to be svelt and lovely and toned. Many have been on low carb since Atkins began in 1970. No health problems for these people in fact testimony after testimony of just the opposite. These are real people not facts on a page.

One woman went to see if she were a match to donate her kidney to a family member. The technician said she had one of the healthest blood levels he has seen in a long time. When she told him she does Atkins, he laughed and said this diet gets so much bad press but really works. There are thousands and thousands of stories like these.

My DH was nearly 300 pounds and today he is 190. He ballooned because of Effexor as it really causes an increase in appetite. Atkins has allowed him to continue this medication and lose weight. His doctor is thrilled.

Our Doctor says this diet helps diabetics and isn't dangerous. It isn't all protein either as many believe. It isn't that restrictive. Once you reach your goal weight it is similar to South Beach and many before things that were not advised is now permitted. Fruit is one of them.
Interesting about the Effexor...I was put on it by my doctor and I lost my appetite....just goes to show the same thing can have differents effects on different people.

I dont dismiss that Atkins may work for some people..and they may not get the proplems associated with it...but just like the effexor the same thing affects different people in different ways.

Its like the old arguement about smoking....dont ya love it when a smoker says something like.."Well my grandfather lived till he was 94 and he smoked all his life!" Hey thats great...but what about all those other people that have died of lung cancer because of smoking?

Things can still be bad for you but not actually cause you any harm.

Lets say a Poison gas bomb goes off in the united states and 300,000 people die...would you consider the poison to be safe? Probably not...but that would only mean that 1 in 1000 people were affected.

At what percentage of people does Something causing damage get to be labeled bad for you? I would think that if 25% of people were harmed it would be considered bad....if this was true about atkins (No idea if it is or not) then most people would consider it bad and not do it....but there would still be a ton of people that would say it worked great for them and never had any problems.

 
Old 01-07-2006, 06:36 AM   #11
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Re: My Advice......

Quote:
Originally Posted by pipermac
At what percentage of people does Something causing damage get to be labeled bad for you? I would think that if 25% of people were harmed it would be considered bad....if this was true about atkins (No idea if it is or not) then most people would consider it bad and not do it....but there would still be a ton of people that would say it worked great for them and never had any problems.
Well Piper my Doctor says our blood levels are perfect (cholesterol, triglicerides, sugar), my husband no longer has high blood pressure, neither of us have heart burn any more, more energy than we know what to do with. My husband has been able to lower his intake of Effexor down to the lowest level and the Doctor is weening him off of it. As he doesn't seem to need it anymore. We are calmer and happier than ever before.

We can eat and maybe sometimes over eat and never count calories and never gain one pound. Our clothes fit comfortably and anything we reach for fits day in and day out.

All we do is we do not eat things that would cause a diabetic problems. Sugar, flour, rice, corn. We do eat many veges, salads, meats, yogurt, fruits (some more in moderation than others) and frequently enduge in deserts that I make. No we are not deprived. Nor are we unhealthy. Your arguement doesn't fly with my lifestyle and what my Doctor has told us.

 
Old 01-07-2006, 08:10 AM   #12
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pipermac HB User
Re: My Advice......

Quote:
Originally Posted by anitak1982
Well Piper my Doctor says our blood levels are perfect (cholesterol, triglicerides, sugar), my husband no longer has high blood pressure, neither of us have heart burn any more, more energy than we know what to do with. My husband has been able to lower his intake of Effexor down to the lowest level and the Doctor is weening him off of it. As he doesn't seem to need it anymore. We are calmer and happier than ever before.

We can eat and maybe sometimes over eat and never count calories and never gain one pound. Our clothes fit comfortably and anything we reach for fits day in and day out.

All we do is we do not eat things that would cause a diabetic problems. Sugar, flour, rice, corn. We do eat many veges, salads, meats, yogurt, fruits (some more in moderation than others) and frequently enduge in deserts that I make. No we are not deprived. Nor are we unhealthy. Your arguement doesn't fly with my lifestyle and what my Doctor has told us.
Like I Said....some things can be bad for people in general...but not for others. Truthfully I dont know for sure if atkins/Low carb is truly bad or not. IT is great that it works you guys. But I am not trying to debate The validness of adkins/low carb.

My whole point was on how people make there decisions. I have seen posts here were one or two people state their opinion about something and then someone says WOW..I never knew that and start to blindly follow that persons advice.
You Can not 100% say that Atkins/Low Carb is a good healthy Diet....Allyou can do is say is that for you it is! At least up till now......you still dont know how it may affect you 5, 10 years from now. It may not ever affect you badly. but that does not mean it wont cause major problems to someone else.

 
Old 01-07-2006, 11:23 AM   #13
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Re: My Advice......

The low-fat diet has been the cornerstone of the national strategy to prevent heart disease since the late 1970s. Yet statistics show that Americans have only continued to get fatter. Low-fat diets not only fail many people but they can also cause some bad biochemical side effects like raising triglycerides to dangerous levels and lowering the levels of HDL, or "good cholesterol."

So to each his own. One must find what works for them. Some say moderation is the key. If that works for them then great but it's a "diet" to me and I don't want to be on a diet. Other's exercise till their blue in the face. I am too lazy.LOL!

 
Old 01-07-2006, 12:34 PM   #14
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Re: My Advice......

Quote:
Originally Posted by anitak1982
The low-fat diet has been the cornerstone of the national strategy to prevent heart disease since the late 1970s. Yet statistics show that Americans have only continued to get fatter. Low-fat diets not only fail many people but they can also cause some bad biochemical side effects like raising triglycerides to dangerous levels and lowering the levels of HDL, or "good cholesterol."

So to each his own. One must find what works for them. Some say moderation is the key. If that works for them then great but it's a "diet" to me and I don't want to be on a diet. Other's exercise till their blue in the face. I am too lazy.LOL!
Well.....I think the main reason so many people are overweight is not that a low fat diet or a high protein diet or whatever doesnt work is that they are still Eating too much. A Lower fat diet if followed properly is still a good diet ( Assuming it is low fat and not NO fat) Since a gram of Fat is 9 calories as apposed to 5 for protein and carb then by cutting down on fat will cut down the calories. The Biggest problem is that people eat low fat foods that are loaded with Carb so often thier calorie intake actually goes up when they start eating Low fat foods.

I have never said that Atkins/Low carb does not work to lose weight...it obviously does And if somefinds that is the only way they can manage to lose weight then going on it will probabyl out weigh the possible risks as being overweight is a problem in itself. My Personal Belief iand feeling is that there are potential risks to atkins/low carb and I would only suggest it to somebody as a last resort, if nothing else works for them.

A Key thing that anyone should remember is that there are very few things that will 100% of the time cause a problem to a person. Whnever Something Is mentioned to be bad for you its not because it WILL cause a problem but it is because it has an increased chance of causing a problem. For many the increased chance may not out weigh the possible benefits they get from it. (Not just talking about Diets here...this can apply to just about anything).

This is why I recommend that people listen to both sides and be aware of what the possible risks are. they they have to weigh that against the benefits they will get. they also have to consider what alternatives there are and decide what is best for them.

In My Case I believe there are Possible risks to Atkins/lowcarb. And because of the Alternatives that are available I dont think that it is worth the risk. But that s just me. I dont want anyone to listen to me and just blindly follow my advice. I want them to be informed and follow there own advice.

 
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