posted 09-10-2002 09:04 AM            

The good new is that in about 95% of these situations everything turns out OK as maturity just seems to "happen". That, however, does not help your current situation.

He's 17. He is going to do whatever he is going to do. Try to see that he gets a smile and a hug each day and knows that in spite of his youthful indescretions you still love him.

Taking away the allowance is a good idea. If he wants to get high at least he can get a job and pay for it himself.

Any women in the picture? When they start smoking dope sometimes they make bad decisons regarding women.

Hope you guys get through this OK. As I mentioned, I have been through this too. Not to scare you, but in my case it resulted in jail time, rehabilitation and military school. My situation was a bit extreme but the good news is that even with all of that drama things turned out just fine and I have a healthy, happy 22 year old son that is a fine young man. Keep posting here or over in the "parenting issues" forum.

Best regards

posted 09-10-2002 04:39 PM            

Hope this helped!

posted 09-10-2002 11:56 PM            

He will likely throw a fit or pretend he doesn't care, but at his age, you must let him learn his own lessons.
Don't let him tie you into what he is doing. Make sure he knows that you won't participate in anyway in helping him feel like he is doing OK with his life, when he isn't. He isn't going to feel or look so big to his friends when he is broke and can't get the car.
You have no way of knowing what else he has been doing or will do, and in my mind that isn't the point.
The point is the direction he HAS taken is illegal and very irresponsible and fruitless.

If you take a strong stand and he keeps headed that way, he can move out, and you will know you did all you can do for him. He will have to learn in the school of hard knocks. OR, hopefully, his bad friends will fade off, and he will get a clue, and get himself turned around. Plenty of kids do, when their parents take a stand.

The key word here is HE has to want to turn his life around, and you cannot make him do it. You can only stop fueling the momentum.

You may be surprised at what happens, if you can do this without anger or angry words. The first time I gave my son a consequence, without being angry, my son looked at me like I was crazy. He said, "You aren't even mad at me! Why are you doing this?" I just told him, "Sit in your room and think about it".

I did this because I had been very frustrated with his not listening to me, and a book suggested that kids think we do things because WE are angry, not because THEY did something wrong, when we are reactive. So, instead of reacting, I had sent him to his room, while I gathered myself together and made a decision what his consequence was, and then calmly told him. Later on, he came to me and said HE was wrong and deserved his consequence. It really felt good.

Don't think it was easy to do, because I really was furious with him. But I was determined to discipline myself so I could discipline him! Let us know what you decide to do.

posted 09-11-2002 08:03 AM            

Skinny: How are things going with you & your son? Please let us know.
Still in my prayers, Kim

posted 09-11-2002 09:46 AM            

I wonder how everyone would react if the young man was having a few beers each night. Alcohol is much more addictive than marijuana and causes alot more crimes such as drunk driving and violence. You don't hear of too many people smoking a bit of weed and then going out and beating up their wives or girlfriends.

posted 09-11-2002 03:59 PM            

I know many, many people who smoke and don't use other drugs...many of them have never even tried hard drugs cause they're scared of them. Some of these are young people and some of them are middle aged and some are even in their 60's. I am one of them, which is why I feel so adamantly about this. I'm 38, have a good job, a good husband, a decent house and car...and yes, I'm a bit of a pothead. What I am not, and never have been, is a junkie, a prostitute, a bum or a theif which is exactly how my parents predicted I would turn out if I smoked & what nearly everyone here has been telling this woman about her son. So I guess it just makes me a bit defensive when I hear people automatically say things like what I have been hearing here.

posted 09-11-2002 06:42 PM            

I support you in the decisions you shared. I have heard Dr. Laura advise parents to strip the room of TV, VCR, Stereo's, etc, and leave a bare-bones existence, for kids that refuse parental rules.
It seems drastic, but it doesn't hurt kids to have nothing but food and shelter and clothes! Hey! They might even gain character!

You are doing the right thing, and your son will very likely turn around, not when you want, of course, which is yesterday! Just love him as he is, while treating him like you treat someone that does those things. And make sure he can't hide any of it in your home. A policeman told me to search my son's room daily for drugs and alcohol. He was angry and resisted it, but I found a stash of tiny bottles of liquor under the bed, which I used to prove to him that there was no reason to trust him, and that trust has to be earned.

posted 09-12-2002 11:46 AM            

Here is something to think about:
I really think you cannot afford to shield this young man from his lies about pot use to the guidance counselor.

He is exhibiting profound disrepect for you and the rules for your home. Protecting him from the full possible rammifications of his behaviour is not going to help him take responsibility. Do you really want a recommendation written that is based on deceptions?
Will this really help his future or his character?

I think he needs to be held accountable to his counselor, and possibly he could be told that he has two days to tell the counselor the truth before you do. And that you will check with the counselor to see if he did come clean.

He is being rude because he knows he is wrong, and he needs you to show him where the lines are, by you standing on those priinciples you know are right.
Don't be afraid of what he may lose right now. They are small prices to pay for true character. He needs to see that others hold him accountable besides you.

When my son was going haywire one thing I did was take him down to the police station and I asked an officer to talk with him. (I am not telling you to do this, or not to.) I was amazed at what the policeman saw through in my son that I had not even noticed.
It didn't change my son at the time, but it sure did open MY eyes! It helped me to take a stronger stand.

posted 09-12-2002 11:49 AM            

As for not yelling fire over a spark... I agree with this in other situations such as a mother who is worried her son might be gay because at the age of 6 he wants to play with his sister's dolls and not his trucks! Yes...then don't yell fire but hell...he is already at least contiplating (or on) mushrooms as well. I look at it like this...a little spark is much easier to put out, or at least easier to control, than a blazing fire...so why wait!

As for not wanting to scare her...she already IS!

Guys you are right that there are people who use and use only on a "social" level. I actually know some people like that...good jobs, good lives, etc, and I have no problem with them at all. I have even done it on occasion myself. But overall most people I know (and it is alot) who are pot users are "junkies" even though they usually only use pot. I seen it all.. ruined lives, deaths, prision, brain burnouts, etc. so no one can convince me that it is not a HUGE concern. I have just seen too many people I love have their lives ruined by pot addiction and it hits very close to home for me!!

Skinny you and your family are always in my thoughts and prayers!

posted 09-19-2002 09:21 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by mlgable:
To AshleeD.............apparently you didn't read about my once genius friend who has killed so many of his brain cells off with his use of pot that he doesn't remember simple things that he should know as well as more complex things that used to be a snap for him. And yes people do use pot and other drugs at the same time more often than you think. When I was single I often hung around with a group that did pot as well as other drugs often. It is such a shame to see a brain wasted from pot use or worse yet the nightmare of suicide even after you quit using pot and other drugs.

---

I'm sorry, I hate to but in, but I have to take issue with the fact that a lot of you are saying things that have been proven in the literature to be false. I symptathize with those of you who have had tradgedies result from drug use, but it is my opinion, after reading and researching as much as possible, that marijuana is actually not that bad, and that the majority of people use it without any adverse consequences. Moreover, marijuana research has been completed by biased sources who want to provide for the "war on drugs" that America consistently loses.

First of all, " Millions of Americans have tried marijuana, but most are not regular users. In 1996, 68.6 million people--32% of the U.S. population over 12 years old--had tried marijuana or hashish at least once in their lifetime, but only 5% were current users." From http://www.nap.edu/html/marimed/ch3.html (original citations can be found there). Seriously, if the 32% of the American population who had tried marijuana was also a heroin user, you think we'd have heard about it.

Secondly: "In the sense that marijuana use typically precedes rather than follows initiation into the use of other illicit drugs, it is indeed a gateway drug. However, it does not appear to be a gateway drug to the extent that it is the cause or even that it is the most significant predictor of serious drug abuse; that is, care must be taken not to attribute cause to association. The most consistent predictors of serious drug use appear to be the intensity of marijuana use and co-occurring psychiatric disorders or a family history of psychopathology (including alcoholism)." (from the same website, original sources available there). Data on marijuana as a gateway drug are from flawed studies. One such widely-cited study made the assumption that marijuana were a gateway drug because they interviewed only crack and heroin users, the majority of whom had started out smoking pot. A better way to find out of marijuana is a gateway drug would be to interview all the marijuana users (remember that 32%?) and ask them if they are now addicted to hard drugs. That has not since been done, so I can't quote you the numbers.

So is your son doing something bad? If you think it is. Should you be concerned? Yeah, probably. Is he going to spiral ever downward until he's stealing from you to support his *cough cough* pot habit? Probably not. Have you ever smoked pot? Maybe you should be honest with your son on that point; you seem like you have good communication. Take away the mystery. I smoked pot daily for a number of years, and at the very same time, I was making honor role and completling two majors in college. Drinking alcohol and smoking pot in moderation won't negatively affect your life, and I'm proof.

Edit: Last of all, are you sure that all he's doing is pot? I've been around a lot of people who smoke dope, even some in their 40s and 50s, and I have to say, I've NEVER seen them sell something they love to buy pot with. I remember reading, and of course, I'll find the sources in a minute, that marijuana addiction is a "psychological addiction," whereas cigs, alcohol, crack and heroin (for example) are "physical" addictions, in that when they are stopped, they prodcuce physiological withdrawal symptoms that lead more often than not to futher use. Hope I'm helping and not just ticking people off. Well, you gotta stand up for what you believe in, I guess, and what I believe in is critical thinking skills.

[This message has been edited by Phaycops (edited 09-19-2002).]

posted 09-24-2002 05:05 PM            

I suggest that you spend a lot of time rewarding the child that is behaving, and not spend a lot of time on negative feedback. Just let the other child know that actions have consequences, and that her brother has to take responsibility, because you love him, and that it is your problem to deal with, not hers.

Make sure the brother is not griping to the daughter, or burdening her. Spend a lot of time with her.

I admire your stance.

posted 09-28-2002 01:33 AM            

Perhaps his counselor at school could suggest someone to deal with him on this issue. I think you are very smart to be pro active on this before it gets out of control. Good luck