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    Old 01-19-2004, 11:36 AM   #31
    Neca
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    Re: Home Phototherapy for Mild/Moderate Acne

    Sorry, I just had to dedicate one post to my current happiness at what I have just read!

    Jhart this is so damn good to hear. I know I shouldn't be jumping up and down thinking we have found a cure because it is early days BUT maybe just maybe we are moving in the right direction!

    It's also good to hear that you are off Accutane because that stuff is nasty. Very wise decision. Honestly I think doing the Dermalux regime without using/taking any heavy medication and instead doing standard morning and evening face washing with water is a much better test. With regards to the redness, do you regain your original facial colour after say 30mins-60mins? Or does it take the whole evening? The fact that your inflammations have reduced alot is also unbelieveable. I am so happy for you man!

    And what's more, it seems as if the number of spots and intensity of them are being greatly reduced! I think the reason for this is probably because the blue light has killed off any bacteria that is either on the surface or just underneath the surface of your skin thus leaving the dormant 'stuff' that is deep below the skin. Within a few days these should be killed by the light and with a bit of luck you should be only experiencing a few pimples, if any at all, per day.

    Now what you NEED to do is concentrate on Friday night!!!! Finally you will be able to look forward to something without feeling self-conscious! I totally understand where your coming from when you say you have loads of smart clothes and just don't want to wear them. I have the exact same problem. Acne, as well as other diseases, opens your eyes and actually makes you realise 'Damn all I REALLY want is to be HAPPY & HEALTHY.' Being materialistic just doesn't even enter my head. It can't! I would so feel more comfortable if I had perfect skin and wore trampy clothes than acne and million$$$ clothes!

    My unit should be with me either by Wednesday or Thursday, I'll let you know when the eagle has landed, lol. Until then, good luck with the next few days, keep posting your updates and I'm sure you'll be dusting off that Hackett shirt in no time....take it easy

     
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    Old 01-19-2004, 12:28 PM   #32
    ErimusValidus
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    Re: Home Phototherapy for Mild/Moderate Acne

    Cheers Neca, I appreciate your empathy and good will. I shall keep you posted regularly, don't worry.

    Yes, the redness is usually gone within 30 minutes. Although, my ears and nose take longer because they get the closest exposure (I turn my head to the side for some of the time to treat the sides of my face and neck and the ears get quite hot).

    And you asked earlier about oil production. Well, I can't really tell whether or not there's much less oil because I don't have especially oily skin. But I have noticed that some enlarged pores have reduced in size. This thing is like a catch-all treatment, if you ask me
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    Old 01-20-2004, 03:22 PM   #33
    Neca
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    Re: Home Phototherapy for Mild/Moderate Acne

    Jhart, just wanted to check something with you. I read this at [removed]:


    "[removed]"

    I thought all three types of light box: Acne Lamp, Verilux and Dermalux emitted the same wavelength intensity? This being 405-420nm Blue and 660nm Red. Do you think the above quote is correct meaning that we are more likely to get better results if we use AcneLamp than Dermalux???

    Hope everything else is going well.

    Last edited by moderator2; 01-21-2004 at 09:08 AM. Reason: Please carefully read, know and follow the board guidelines and posting policy. Not allowed to post websites with forums or to copy from them. Thank you.

     
    Old 01-20-2004, 04:04 PM   #34
    ErimusValidus
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    Re: Home Phototherapy for Mild/Moderate Acne

    Neca, the 405-420 nanometre figure relates to the wavelenghth of the light. This does not relate to the power (or intensity) of the lights. Power is measured in Watts (in the case of visible radiation). The Dermalux unit supposedly operates at a power of 60W. Now, consider that your average light bulb operates at around 40W, that's quite powerful - especially when you sit right next to it.

    Now, light is a funny thing. Even in today's enlightened world scientists are torn between two theories about light. Some believe light is a constant stream of radiation (a "wave"), whilst others believe billions of "photons" make up a beam of light. I personally prefer the photon theory since everything else in the world is made up of tiny particles.

    If you look at it that way, then you're constantly being bombarded with photons (including when you're in the dark and UV and infra-red light is coming at you ). So we're always going to get some light in this hallowed 405-420nm range. But we want to get more of it. So you'd think that the greater the emission of light in that range, the better. However, I personally believe there's probably an absorption threshold in our skin that determines how much of the relevant radiation we recieve anyway.

    At this point I should say that most of the above is very sketchy and based on my own theories But what I'm trying to say is that I think there's only so much our skin can benefit from the blue light (and the red) and after that any extra photons are just wasting electricity. I've read the AcneLamp web site and they quote the same studies and suggest the same 8 week "noticeable improvements" time.

    I'm not saying their lights aren't better at filtering out the specific wavelengths of light (although I seriously doubt the 3300% figure) but I think it's more of a sales gimmick than a scientifically proven benefit to their system. They might have "purer" light but it won't be much more powerful. You'll appreciate that when you see how bright the Dermalux unit is. And you'll also see that the lights really are blue and red (although, the red light is dominant since the blue is tending towards ultra violet which is invisible).

    By the way, Neca, I didn't mean to go off on one here. I'm currently really intrigued by all of this, even though it sounds so dull, because it's "science in action", if you will. And right now science is actually working for me and it's blinkin' marvellous. This morning I admit I woke up with a couple of new pimples again, but that's the great part: they're pimples, not fully-blown, painful, red spots.

    They were very small, soft whiteheads and they're virtually disappeared again now. I honestly can't believe it. So, yeah, thank you Neca. Everything is going well. But, of course, as it the nature of these things, I am waiting for the sky to fall in and everything to go wrong. There are only three more sleeps 'til Friday night now so I'm crossing everything in the hope that it doesn't happen before then
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    Old 01-20-2004, 04:31 PM   #35
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    Re: Home Phototherapy for Mild/Moderate Acne

    I'm bored and wanted to check something out:

    speed of light = wavelength x frequency

    speed of light = 3 x 10^8 metres/second = 300,000,000 m/s

    wavelength = 420 nanometres = 0.000,000,42 m

    therefore, frequency = (3 x 10^8) / (420nm) = 714,285,714,285,714.28571428571428571

    That means that photons of blue light emitted from the unit come at a rate of over 700 trillion times a second!! Boring but quite incredible, nonetheless What's more, I did all those calculations in my head
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    Last edited by jhart999; 01-20-2004 at 05:01 PM.

     
    Old 01-21-2004, 05:38 AM   #36
    Neca
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    Re: Home Phototherapy for Mild/Moderate Acne

    LOOOL....someone is in a good mood aren't they? Seems like the light box is giving you your 'real' personality back that acne took away. I'm still looking for my old self but I'm sure I will it somewhere.

    Anyway yeh when I said 'I thought all three types of light box: Acne Lamp, Verilux and Dermalux emitted the same wavelength intensity? This being 405-420nm Blue and 660nm Red.' I meant wavelength intensity to mean wavelength of light or wavelength range, definitely not POWER/watts. Sorry my elocution of science was never the most accurate.

    I did try to dissect your 'wave' vs. 'photon' theory of light but it was oh so Einstein-esque for me, lol. I agree though with what you said about the AcneLamp's 3300% figure being a sales gimmick. That figure is ridiculous! And yeh they do use the same documentation as Dermalux to backup the use of light in the treatment of acne.

    You said that your skin seems to be producing pimples rather than 'acne' and they are healing up much quicker than normal. That is great and seems to correlate to posts I have read on acneorg. A few of the light users there said they were still experiencing pimples but the light had increased their skin's recover/healing time. IMO that is extremely good and it obviously shows that the light only penetrates so far down in the skin. It seems more likely that the blue/red light attacks the surface of the skin only. I think they need to invent a GREEN LIGHT to dig down inside...lol

    No Dermalux for me today , it's gotta be here tomorrow. Will keep ya posted.

     
    Old 01-23-2004, 08:09 AM   #37
    Neca
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    Re: Home Phototherapy for Mild/Moderate Acne

    Jhart just wanted to post a quick good luck for tonight! Hope the Dermalux has worked its magic and you're looking ab-fab ! Have a wicked time at the Union and hope you strike it lucky!!!! You've got your exams over and done with so now it's party time for you!

    Take care man...

     
    Old 01-23-2004, 02:37 PM   #38
    Neca
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    Re: Home Phototherapy for Mild/Moderate Acne

    IT CAME! MY DERMALUX UNIT ARRIVED TODAY...WOOHOOO, finally!

    Day 1:

    I'm going to keep a rough progress journal detailing how my skin reacts to the Dermalux treatment. First things first, Jhart you were right, the light is really bright so thank God they supply you with some goggles. They are quite effective.

    Anyway, after using the box for 15mins I looked at my skin and it seemed normal i.e. it had not turned pink as yours did. Infact my face didn't even feel hot while I used the box. I also put my hand infront of the tubes and they didn't feel hot either. Is there something wrong with my box?

    Apart from the light, you don't realise notice anything happening while you use it. It's just like if you were sitting down watching T.V., your skin feels virtually nothing. Is yours like this or am I supposed to feel heat?

    One thing I AM slightly concerned about is my eyes. I did use the goggles but I experienced quite alot of sparkles/stars floating around while my eyes were closed. Maybe because I had them closed so tight? I may but some tissue in the goggles to be extra safe.

    And one final thing, I have a bit of hyperpigmentation on my nose. Do you think I should cover this part while using the unit in case it makes this part of my skin darker? I know they say it won't cause hyperpig but what's your opinion?

    I will do another session tomorrow morning and post the results if any.

     
    Old 01-24-2004, 06:25 AM   #39
    ErimusValidus
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    Re: Home Phototherapy for Mild/Moderate Acne

    Cheers Neca I've just crawled out of my pit after sleeping off a vicious hangover. I had a good time last night. I didn't feel overly self-concious at all and was able to relax and enjoy finishing my exams.

    I'm glad to hear you got your unit. I'm also glad you didn't suffer any redness. I think I was just sitting too close the first few times I used it. And to clarify, I *expected* the tubes to be hot because of the brightness but they're not, are they. There's nothing wrong with your unit, don't worry

    Eyes-wise I would just keep them closed. Maybe you could add more of a filter but I guess they tested the goggles and found them to be safe. Although, they aren't exactly comfortable, are they. I'm afraid I don't know what will happen with your hyperpigmentation, but I guess maybe you're right in thinking it's best to cover it.
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    Old 01-26-2004, 02:05 PM   #40
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    Re: Home Phototherapy for Mild/Moderate Acne

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jhart999
    Now, light is a funny thing. Even in today's enlightened world scientists are torn between two theories about light. Some believe light is a constant stream of radiation (a "wave"), whilst others believe billions of "photons" make up a beam of light. I personally prefer the photon theory since everything else in the world is made up of tiny particles.

    If you look at it that way, then you're constantly being bombarded with photons (including when you're in the dark and UV and infra-red light is coming at you ). So we're always going to get some light in this hallowed 405-420nm range. But we want to get more of it. So you'd think that the greater the emission of light in that range, the better. However, I personally believe there's probably an absorption threshold in our skin that determines how much of the relevant radiation we recieve anyway.

    At this point I should say that most of the above is very sketchy and based on my own theories But what I'm trying to say is that I think there's only so much our skin can benefit from the blue light (and the red) and after that any extra photons are just wasting electricity. I've read the AcneLamp web site and they quote the same studies and suggest the same 8 week "noticeable improvements" time.

    I'm not saying their lights aren't better at filtering out the specific wavelengths of light (although I seriously doubt the 3300% figure) but I think it's more of a sales gimmick than a scientifically proven benefit to their system. They might have "purer" light but it won't be much more powerful. You'll appreciate that when you see how bright the Dermalux unit is. And you'll also see that the lights really are blue and red (although, the red light is dominant since the blue is tending towards ultra violet which is invisible).

    By the way, Neca, I didn't mean to go off on one here. I'm currently really intrigued by all of this, even though it sounds so dull, because it's "science in action", if you will. And right now science is actually working for me and it's blinkin' marvellous. This morning I admit I woke up with a couple of new pimples again, but that's the great part: they're pimples, not fully-blown, painful, red spots.

    Just so that some people are not mislead Here are some clarifications:

    Not quite. Scientist aren't torn between the wave and particle nature of light. Light behaves in certain cases like a particle, and in others, like a wave, depending on the experiment, and on how it is disturbed during its measurement. There is no contradiction for physicists, even though they do not claim to understand how it does it exactly. Light is both (simply put!) and luckily we are not forced to choose which one is correct.

    Also, even though it is possible that we are hit with IR or UV light in the dark, it is not a given. That light is just like visible light, in that it can really be completely dark for all practicle purposes, even with no UV or IR; i.e. where it would not cause any impact whatsoever on the skin, or even sensitive light detectors. It is not like the cosmic background which can not be turned off. As proof, anyone can construct a light-tight box where no IR or UV or visible light enters

    I'm also not clear on what you meant by light filtering always being needed: Many lights can generate few frequencies of light through exciting various gasses by high voltage. And even cheap solid state devices (i.e. high powered leds) can generate a really thin frequency band of intense light by pulsing the current way past the intended specific maximum current capacity. It is not a given that a filter is what is always used to generate certain frequencies. Although, maybe the designers _are_ really making inefficient devices

    I'm glad it's working for you, regardless of the scientific explanations!

    EDIT: One final detail to help: Light is most commonly referred to as a "wave packet", since this accounts for both sides of light: wave and particle. Essentially, a wave packet is a closely bunched frequency spread (wave part) travelling together (almost like a solid particle).

    Last edited by pjlc; 01-26-2004 at 02:09 PM.

     
    Old 01-26-2004, 03:17 PM   #41
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    Re: Home Phototherapy for Mild/Moderate Acne

    Thank you pjlc - I feel educated Like I said, the information I posted was sketchy to say the least since I based it on A Level Physics from three years ago. Add to the time delay the fact that my teacher used the introductory lesson to set the school playing field alight (it was the height of summer and he was demonstrating projectiles with fireworks ), and you might appreciate my lack of accuracy. You are right, of course, "wave-particle duality" is more of a standardised theory than a dispute between physics boffins.
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    Old 01-26-2004, 07:37 PM   #42
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    Re: Home Phototherapy for Mild/Moderate Acne

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jhart999
    was the height of summer and he was demonstrating projectiles with fireworks )

    Those types are unfortunately few and far between, the ones who are enthusiastic about their work. This teacher one sounds like one of the few! At least he (she?) didn't demonstrate trajectory by pushing an old car off a building, like that one silly commercial Although that is more exciting!

     
    Old 01-27-2004, 03:54 AM   #43
    Neca
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    Re: Home Phototherapy for Mild/Moderate Acne

    >>>>DAY 5

    Well I must say it is going surprisingly well, I haven't developed any new spots on the areas I have used my Dermalux. The only place I did develop one spot was just below the ear, on my neck. But the light from the Dermalux box doesn't reach past your cheek area if you sit face on so I think I am going to start doing profile treatments too.

    Will post another update in a few days time.

     
    Old 01-28-2004, 11:52 AM   #44
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    Re: Home Phototherapy for Mild/Moderate Acne

    Yes, Neca, I too experience that phenomenon. I generally dedicate a total of five minutes to the sides of my face to ensure greater coverage. As a test I've been ignoring the back of my neck and I'm adamant that the acne in that area is not clearing as fast as the rest. I'm really glad the results have been positive for you so far
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    Old 01-28-2004, 04:02 PM   #45
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    Re: Home Phototherapy for Mild/Moderate Acne

    Just wanted to encourage you to give us updates on your progress. I'm very interested in these machines since my daughter experiences total clearing every summer without doing anything else besides wakeboarding in the sun. I may go ahead and order one. It makes sense that it's the light that helps.

     
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