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    Old 10-11-2004, 06:07 AM   #46
    openseason
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    I agree acne is an internal malfunction. So why are you rubbing oil of oregeno on your skin? Food does not cause acne. Howard Sterns GF Beth eats chocolate by the pound, she is a model without acne. If food caused acne everyone would have acne all their lives. The fact is acne usually starts during teenage when the hormones are up.

     
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    Old 10-11-2004, 08:32 AM   #47
    SweetJade1
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by openseason
    I agree acne is an internal malfunction. So why are you rubbing oil of oregeno on your skin? Food does not cause acne. Howard Sterns GF Beth eats chocolate by the pound, she is a model without acne. If food caused acne everyone would have acne all their lives. The fact is acne usually starts during teenage when the hormones are up.
    Well it could be because she's consuming quality dark chocolate which doesn't have the dairy and/or the refined sugars.

    Yet, once again, the reason why she & others SEEM to get away with eating crap (probably have other health problems) and don't get acne, is because of their GENES =P

    Last edited by SweetJade1; 10-11-2004 at 08:38 AM.

     
    Old 10-11-2004, 05:48 PM   #48
    boulder21
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Open season - you're crazy if you don't think what you eat has any affect. The reason the person you speak of can get away with it and people like myself can't is that we're all different.

    When doing research to find a solution other than the one the derm provided I found a web site who's author had an interesting message. The message was that acne is your body telling you something is wrong, something needs to be fixed and basically consider yourself lucky that your body is telling you this.

    I don't know if I want to really consider myself lucky that I've had acne for so long but by starting a healthy diet/lifestyle I've solved my acne problem and will probably live a longer life because of it.

    Of course the author of this website was some quack selling something for $39.95, but he did have an interesting message.

     
    Old 10-11-2004, 07:51 PM   #49
    openseason
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Acne may be your body telling you that you have clogged oil glands, excess oil production, or inflamation of the oil glands. The truth is no one knows why acne occurs, only that it is hereditary/genetic which certainly means it is not caused by food or dirt on the surface of the skin.

     
    Old 10-11-2004, 07:55 PM   #50
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Sweet Jade: You state she consumes quality chocolate, and the you say it is due to her genes. Acne is due to genes too, precisely what the dermatologists say, so eat what you want.

     
    Old 10-11-2004, 07:57 PM   #51
    pigletJen
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    I have to add something silly. I cannot live without chocolate even if it is a cause for break-outs

     
    Old 10-11-2004, 08:00 PM   #52
    openseason
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    piglet I cannot eat vanilla ice cream unless it has hot chocolate on it.

     
    Old 10-11-2004, 08:04 PM   #53
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Umm, yummy, gotta go get a pint... now that you all got me started

     
    Old 10-11-2004, 08:50 PM   #54
    SweetJade1
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by openseason
    Sweet Jade: You state she consumes quality chocolate, and the you say it is due to her genes. Acne is due to genes too, precisely what the dermatologists say, so eat what you want.
    NO, I gave you 2 possibilites. So let me try it again, it's either because she eats good quality chocolate OR because her Genes do not express junkfood she eats in the form of acne. Her genes may express the junk she eats via eczema somewhere, high cholesterol, diabetes, etc.

    Yet, I fear that that still doesn't work for some people....honestly I don't know what will.


    Yes Acne can be attributed to one's genes BUT only because there is SOMETHING Wrong inside!

    If you can FIX what is wrong inside (medication, gene therapy or by changing your environment influences), the acne will usually go away.

    Example: those with thyroid disorders, androgen disorders, allergies, intolerances, chemical sensitivities, or toxic/damaged organs can have a variety of skin conditions.

    They don't have eczema or acne because they were BORN to, but because they have an underlying health problem that is being expressed PHYSICALLY in this manner....other people show NO signs whatsoever and then end up with diabetes or cancer!

    So, HOW can diet come into play, right???

    It's not the foods so much as what those foods contain. They have enzymes, proteins, fats, & sugars that can sometimes interract negatively with our bodies. There's a variety of factors that come into play here (why our "acne diets" vary somewhat), but generally the quality & the amount of specific foods seem to cause problems for a group of us.

    While I do believe that people can break out from allergies & intolerances, I generally only ever truly push for the Insulin-Androgen-Acne Connection, because you can't knock it down! If you think you can, by all means spend several 1000 hours of research like myself and others have, trying to do so...you'll fail.

    I'm sorry if altering your diet (did you?) didn't work for you, but it has for us and many others. Sometimes it took us several attempts before we found the right diet, so don't give up if this is your "only hope". While nothing for the most part is ever 100% successful for everyone, this once again would be thanks to our genes. Accutane isn't 100% successful yet I really don't hear many people emphatically saying it doesn't work...so why are you picking on diet?

    Sometimes I think some of you just aren't READING what we write, or maybe you just don't want to "hear" it, but it's the truth whether you or anyone else is "ready" to believe it or not. In the end, all you are doing is possibly cheating yourself or someone else when you say that "there is no connection between diet & acne."

    Last edited by SweetJade1; 10-11-2004 at 09:53 PM.

     
    Old 10-11-2004, 09:39 PM   #55
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Freerider
    Sweetjade, thanks for the insightful post. I agree with everything you wrote. Don't you wish sometimes that you can have a higher platform from which to express your beliefs and the facts on the effects of a modern diet? The acneboard is a humble podium. Until some of talking heads catch the wave, we'll have to keep to our grassroots approach to changing people's thinking. I proposed this argument to a friend eating cheese curls the other day. Drawing from the doodle's resemblance to Styrofoam, I asked my friend if he would ever eat orange Styrofoam. He just rolled his eyes, as he usually does when I begin a diatribe on healthy dieting. I told him that I bet 200 years ago people would have gasped at the prospect of ingesting something as foreign to the body as a cheese curl. He somewhat agreed after pondering the idea. I then bet that 200 years from now, if we continued the downward spiral, people may be eating food closer to the chemical composition of Styrofoam than to actual food. He thought I was an idiot, but I donít think I was being to far-fetched.

    We live in a country of convenience. Because of the societal pressure to be successful, financially-speaking, people have put careers ahead of all else, including family. People used to have more time to prepare food from scratch, grow gardens, etc. Now deadlines and commitments and the drive to be have more money/things than your father and neighbor forces people to turn the priority pyramid upside down. Family and health is the side project to the career. People address me as Freerider (pseudonym), the successful Environmental Specialist, instead of Freerider, the good husband and humanitarian. Okay, I'm at the wrong board for this type of tangent. But I believe the screwed up diet of today has roots here.

    Sweetjade, do you have backup research articles or other sources for the thought that those of us with hormonal diseases (inc. acne) are more susceptible to acquiring other diseases? I would be very interested in reading up on this and passing the knowledge to othersÖ.
    Freerider,

    Sorry it took me a while to get back to ya but sometimes it feels like you are talking to a wall around here and you've gotta live your own life cuz you know that when you come back, everything will still be the same as when you left it. ;-) Although, I'm always thrilled to see that there are at least few more people that have been successful with diet around here when I do.

    Anyway, I only found a few direct studies, the others just show various signs & symptoms of a particular disorder. I don't know if I can post the articles, but I'll just give you the links from Pubmed.gov that have the abstracts:

    The influence of medical conditions associated with hormones on the risk of breast cancer.
    [url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=A bstract&list_uids=8144280[/url]

    Early growth, adult body size and prostate cancer risk
    [url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=A bstract&list_uids=12455039[/url]

    Androgen action: molecular mechanism and medical application
    [url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=A bstract&list_uids=7735002[/url]

    Polycystic ovary syndrome: a review for primary providers
    [url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=A bstract&list_uids=15024892[/url]

    Cutaneous manifestations of systemic diseases
    [url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=A bstract&list_uids=9889752[/url]

    Skin disorders and thyroid diseases
    [url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=A bstract&list_uids=11686547[/url]

    Acne and hirsutism in polycystic ovary syndrome: clinical, endocrine-metabolic and ultrasonographic differences.
    [url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=A bstract&list_uids=12396556[/url]



    Just for kicks, there was a study done on acneic twins and it was found that those that had acne also had low levels of Apolipoprotein A1 which is the main part of HDL Cholesterol (good stuff) ....well Insulin Resistance Syndrome, usually a preventable disease, also reduces the levels of both of these.

    The influence of genetics and environmental factors in the pathogenesis of acne: a twin study of acne in women. [url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=A bstract&list_uids=12485434[/url]

    Prevalence of non-traditional cardiovascular disease risk factors among persons with impaired fasting glucose, impaired glucose tolerance, diabetes, and the metabolic syndrome: analysis of the Third National Health and Nutrition Examination Survey (NHANES III). [url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=A bstract&list_uids=12485434[/url]

    Mechanisms of HDL lowering in insulin resistant, hypertriglyceridemic states: the combined effect of HDL triglyceride enrichment and elevated hepatic lipase activity.
    [url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=A bstract&list_uids=12951168[/url]

    Lipoprotein lipids in polycystic ovarian syndrome: independent associations with androgen excess and insulin resistance [url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=A bstract&list_uids=10682453[/url]

    Well, I guess that's enough for now. Hope all is well =)

    Last edited by SweetJade1; 10-11-2004 at 09:42 PM.

     
    Old 10-11-2004, 09:47 PM   #56
    DiselPower4
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Hey SweetJade, are you a scientist? If not you should be.

     
    Old 10-12-2004, 11:09 AM   #57
    boulder21
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by openseason
    Acne may be your body telling you that you have clogged oil glands, excess oil production, or inflamation of the oil glands. The truth is no one knows why acne occurs, only that it is hereditary/genetic which certainly means it is not caused by food or dirt on the surface of the skin.

    OK, then give me a reason why my acne has gone away since I've started healthy eating habits? It may be hereditary that I have acne prone skin but the reaction is triggered by certain things -- food among others.

     
    Old 10-12-2004, 11:20 AM   #58
    boulder21
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    SweetJade -

    It's interesting you say this:

    Just for kicks, there was a study done on acneic twins and it was found that those that had acne also had low levels of Apolipoprotein A1 which is the main part of HDL Cholesterol (good stuff) ....well Insulin Resistance Syndrome, usually a preventable disease, also reduces the levels of both of these.


    The most recent time I had my cholesterol tested my doctor said "Wow, these numbers overall are awesome! But the good cholesteral is a bit low."

    This was quite a while ago, before I started a healthy diet. I can really eat anything and everthing I want without worrying about weight or cholesteral but unfortunatley I do have to worry about acne.
    So looking back on it, and with the information above, low (relative) HDL could have been a contributing factor to my acne problem.

     
    Old 10-12-2004, 03:48 PM   #59
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Boulder,
    Yeah it is and that's how science starts to piece things together. I've always had normal levels too, but if you have Insulin Resistance Syndrome, theoretically you will have higher LDL, Trigylcerides, & Free Fatty Acids, and Low HDL. So perhaps we are like you said, on the low-normal end of things in terms of HDL. I do know that when I was getting diagnosed, I was off of all meds and my glucose was on the low-normal end too.

    I know that B5 Therapy helps metabolize fats, and as such it reduces your insulin resistance by decreasing LDL and boosting HDL levels. Iím guessing thatís why itís supposedly the next best thing to accutane ;-)

    I chose to follow a Gluten-Free/Low Grain diet and some people have been successful with this, while others follow a No Grain diet, Low-Carb GF Diet or some other type of Low-Carb diet (results vary). Either way, Wheat/Gluten has been implicated in various studies to raise your Insulin, LDL, Triglycerides, Free Fatty Acids, (& testosterone) while lowering your HDL & SHBG (binds free testosterone).

    Now, plenty of people argue that there is a genetic link, and of course for certain ethnicities, populations, genders, blood types, etc there are greater risks, yet that does NOT mean that altering their environmental influences won't help.

    Sometimes the only reason they are at risk, is because their environment (food, stress, toxins, etc) is CONTRIBUTING and thus AGGREVATING the problem! Therefore, if you alleviate things that will ADD to your risk, that may be enough to fix you.

    For example, there is an association with having Diabetes (Type I or Type II) and being gluten intolerant/Celiac. Also, according to D'adamo there is an association between Type B & Type O Blood types (most prevelant types) being intolerant to gluten & select lectins AND developing Insulin Resistance & Type II Diabetes (90% of diabetics). Now Iím a Type O, my Dadís a Type B & Diabetes Type II runs in the family. I was dx as Insulin Resistant/PCOS, yet despite me not being allergic to wheat and testing negative for gluten intolerance, my diet still worked for me.

    This type of anomaly is becoming more frequent. Insulin Resistance, Type II Diabetes, Obesity, etc are on the rise and obviously, there needs to be other ways to test for gluten sensitivity and Insulin Resistance. After all, IR is being implicated in a lot of health & hormonal disorders and even the scientists are admitting medications & dietary changes specifically for IR are working for those that ďgeneticallyĒ shouldnít need it. Therefore, there must be some other way to diagnose those people that the tests are missingÖor wait until it gets worse.

    For those that don't want to wait, that right there is something you could be preventing, when you find that your diet helps with acne. It works to reduce your bodyís overall metabolic burden so that hopefully you donít have to take medication. Sometimes it's not enough, but that's why people use Niacin, Fish Oils, NAC or B5 & diet or just those alone. They all work to metabolize lipids, but some will work better for others. Thatís why I also believe that despite whatever our personal opinions are and what we are ďwilling to do & not do,Ē our genes DICTATE what types of treatments will be the most effective for us.

    For example, without a doubt my acne is hormonal. I have very high androgens levels (from IR) and am at risk for type II diabetes, yet medication (Insulin Sensitizers & Antiandrogens) was no where near effective as appropriately altering my diet. When it comes to PCOS & Insulin Resistance, I've seen others' regimens, and they are taking several (high dose) medications and/or supplements, but I don't know many that are clear from medication alone when it comes to treating those disorders specifically. Why not? Well, as long as they continue to eat the very foods that are CONTRIBUTING to or FUELING the problem, the medication will NOT be as effective. It's like you have two opposing forces (one's good, the other's ďbadĒ) and one of those forces will eventually be the dominant one.

    So, what dietary changes helped you?


    Bye for now =)


    P.S. Diesel, I canít call myself a Biologist until I finish my degree, but I donít know if the same applies for something as general as being a scientist. Either way, Iíll be able to do so very very soon ;-)

    Last edited by SweetJade1; 10-12-2004 at 05:55 PM.

     
    Old 10-12-2004, 05:25 PM   #60
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Your posts make a lot of sense, how do you know that you have very high androgen levels? Just curious.My daugher (blood type O) was told by doc that her blood sugar levels were low, do you think this may figure into all this?

     
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