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  • Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

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    Old 10-14-2004, 08:16 AM   #76
    BostonGirl44
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by openseason
    You need to take antibiotics to stop the bacteria from growing in the oil glands if you want to treat acne.
    I tried antibiotics for the longest time. They were not very effective for me in the long run.

     
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    Old 10-14-2004, 08:30 AM   #77
    SweetJade1
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by openseason
    The title of this thread is why dermatologists dont tell the truth. The fact is no one knows what drives the biological process that causes acne. However there is a strong genetic predisposition. Hypoglycemia may be found in some people with acne. That does not mean the hypoglycemia caused the acne. You need to take antibiotics to stop the bacteria from growing in the oil glands if you want to treat acne.
    See, you don't get the big picture and I'm not saying that I KNOW what that is 100% , but others, including myself are a lot closer to understanding the FACT that acne isn't it's own disease, but is a SYMPTOM. Therefore, you don't treat the symptom, but what is causing this to occur.

    Regarding bacteria, yes there are more p.acnes & even demodex mites in acneic patients, but EVERYONE has this bacteria but not everyone has acne, right? Therefore, the fact that there is MORE bacteria, is not enough of a case to say that it is soley caused by bacteria. Something MUST be contributing to the increased bacterial growth. I've heard theories and they all still fall back on androgens, sebum, & sugar. Not to mention, sugar itself, trans fats, IGF-1, & Cytokines, can also contribute to inflammation. Yet, that doesn't explain why there's increased bacterial growth in a clogged pore.

    So, what caused it to be clogged? Again, it falls back on Androgens because they are what is going to cause an increase in Growth of the sebaceous glands which mean larger pores & more sebum. This also means an increased rate of skin cell growth, BUT a decreased rate of skin cell shedding, therefore...your body is unable to properly exfoilate, thus a clogged pore. Of course there's more bacteria in a clogged pore, where else are they going to go?

    Now what will be a MAJOR deciding factor on how influential a role bacteria play in inflammation, I know they can contribute or are involved in a variety of skin conditions, is when they actually do come up with a p.acnes vaccine. I believe that they are working on this and some other method of handling the bacteria. Once those are out, it will be interesting to see the results, YET if it does eliminate acne, it still does NOT eliminate the problem for a % of the population.

    Some people's focus is on eliminating acne, but I know enough to understand that it is a symptom and just because you eliminate ONE symptom of a problem, it doesn't mean that everything else has been fixed. There is still something WRONG or IMBALANCED within your body and all you did was mask it in the superficial sense. If that is enough for you, so be it, but that's not enough for myself and many others, particularly women, that discover that we had Allergies, Intolerances, Toxicities and/or a major Hormonal Imbalance that caused us to have acne as a SYMPTOM.

    Last edited by SweetJade1; 10-14-2004 at 09:10 AM.

     
    Old 10-14-2004, 09:05 AM   #78
    SweetJade1
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by BostonGirl44
    I tried antibiotics for the longest time. They were not very effective for me in the long run.
    Absolutely not, the last thing anyone should do is treat acne with an (oral) antibiotic. Sure they reduce inflammation, but it's not always 100% effective, they'll wear off, and then you will be left with a bigger mess than when you started. Now, the vaccines...who knows what those will bring.

    Now you mentioned that accutane cleared you, of course it did. Roche claims they don't understand the mechanisms, and to a point I can see why they say that, yet there are articles on their own website and are published thoroughout scientific journals that accutane is NOT an antibiotic. I hope most people know that by now. It doesn't have anything to do with bacteria as it primarily functions as an Antiandrogen & DHT Inhbitor.

    Accutane, also known as Isotretinion or 13-cis-retinoic acid, inhibits 5 alpha reductase enzyme and the 3-alpha diol dehydrogenase enzyme. So what that means is Azelex, RetinA, Isotrex (topical accutane), and Accutane all work because they reduce the amount of DHT and androgens produced in your pores.

    Now where I can understand Roche's confusion is that this antiandrogenic effect is only while you are taking accutane. Once you stop, you should continue to produce more DHT and your acne should return. Yet for some people it never comes back (was it due to the end of puberty?). Others it comes back within a few months. While others acne comes back within 3 - 6 years. The good thing though is that for at least some of these people, the acne is less severe.

    One possibility as to why accutane is a permanent solution for some people is because it also functions as a growth inhibitor, in the sense that it was used to treat cancer at one point. Therefore it ceases sebum gland growth, oil production, & hyperkeritinization by increasing your amount of IGFBP-3. This is something that binds IGF-1 (a growth factor). IGF-1 also comes out in response to Insulin in your blood stream, yet Insulin has the ability to reduce your IGFBP-3, now that doesn't help much huh? Hyoerinsulinemia has been associated with an increase cancer risk, especially breast & prostate cancer. The hormones that are associated with cancers are also Estrogen & DHT, which both rely on IGF-1 to induce normal cell growth or worse tumorigenisis. So that's another possibility, that it may somehow permantly alter your sebum glands.

    Of course, as with everything else, accutane isn't a cure all for everyone. Otherwise people wouldn't be on up to 6 Coursers nor would they be following a "maintence dose". Yet when they are on it, usually there's no acne and all it's doing is reducing the amount of DHT & IGF-1 formed, thus reducing the amount of sebum produced, thus allowing your skin the ability to shed properly and be free of clogged pores. Obviously, as you've already found out, an antibiotic isn't needed to treat acne. =)

    Last edited by SweetJade1; 10-14-2004 at 09:22 AM.

     
    Old 10-14-2004, 09:28 AM   #79
    SweetJade1
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by openseason
    SweetJade if food causes acne it would be very easy to prove it the connection. Just because you state it dosent make it so. Point me to the scientific study which shows food causes acne because I want to read it for myself.

    Right just like it's very EASY to prove that food causes weight gain. Funny thing is, usually the same foods that cause weight gain in susceptible individuals are the same foods that cause, heart disease, diabetes, and....well acne. How strange...yet I guess that would explain why we all usually eat the same things yet look, behave, and think so very DIFFERENT from one another, right?

    Dermatologists do admit that for some people iodine can play a role. I found supporting studies where excessive amounts of iodine will aggrevate a variety of skin conditions. Yet, if you choose to avoid all foods with iodine, you will be following a much more restricted diet than what most of us follow. So for them to say that "there is no connection between diet & acne, but perhaps you should avoid iodine" is rather odd, since you get most of your Iodine from your diet. Again, I never said FOOD itself is the problem, the problem is in WHAT that food contains.

    Oh and I NEVER state anything I haven't found recent scientific evidence in support of. The sad thing is, we can go back 20 years and the evidence is STILL there. Now I posted studies for Free Rider, perhaps you would like to look those over and if interested in an actual discussion instead of repeatedly quoting the same brainwashed information to me, I would LOVE to hear your thoughts.

    Last edited by SweetJade1; 10-14-2004 at 09:36 AM.

     
    Old 10-14-2004, 10:13 AM   #80
    boulder21
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SweetJade1
    Funny thing is, usually the same foods that cause weight gain in susceptible individuals are the same foods that cause, heart disease, diabetes, and....well acne.

    Yep -

    As I said before I can eat way more pizzas than humanly possible and not gain weight but as I've recently discovered if I do so I'll be in trouble with respect to acne. I don't have the genetic predisposition to weight problems but do for acne.

     
    Old 10-14-2004, 02:09 PM   #81
    Nametaken84
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    I forgot to mention before...when I went on vacation, I ate all the junk food I wanted, drank all the pop I wanted, didn't wear sunscreen outside, went swimming in the ocean and pool all day long, got sweaty and didn't wash my face til at night, and yet my acne was basically completely gone in a week. However I broke out the day I got home. So maybe diet doesn't have as big of an affect on me as it does on others. Maybe it's more stress, because I was basically carefree the whole week and didn't really give a crap how my skin was. Plus I read that a pimple takes 6-8 weeks to form...so if diet does have an effect, which it probably does, you still wouldn't see the results from eating crappy for at least six weeks. So how come some people eat something and then break out the next day? Finally, in response to the antibiotics, I think they should only be used if you are also on a topical, so it keeps the acne away when you drop the antibiotic.

     
    Old 10-14-2004, 04:51 PM   #82
    yungace11
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    i eat pretty good and still get acne. the only thing i drink is water and i eat alot of fruits and not alota junk....
    i do 100% agree with you tho. im sure if they wanted to they could easily come up with a cure for it but your right its not threatning

     
    Old 10-14-2004, 05:24 PM   #83
    SweetJade1
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Nametaken84
    I forgot to mention before...when I went on vacation, I ate all the junk food I wanted, drank all the pop I wanted, didn't wear sunscreen outside, went swimming in the ocean and pool all day long, got sweaty and didn't wash my face til at night, and yet my acne was basically completely gone in a week. However I broke out the day I got home. So maybe diet doesn't have as big of an affect on me as it does on others. Maybe it's more stress, because I was basically carefree the whole week and didn't really give a crap how my skin was. Plus I read that a pimple takes 6-8 weeks to form...so if diet does have an effect, which it probably does, you still wouldn't see the results from eating crappy for at least six weeks. So how come some people eat something and then break out the next day? Finally, in response to the antibiotics, I think they should only be used if you are also on a topical, so it keeps the acne away when you drop the antibiotic.
    Hmm...ocean water, salt??? LOL, I don't know, we are all so different your answer could be something "easier" ;-) Although, as far as when acne is formed, that's complete bull and I'm surprised that still floats around. It doesn't take 30 days nor 90 days for all acne to form; if you are allergic to something it only takes a matter of minutes or hours, right? If you are intolerant to something it only takes a matter of days. For me, it takes 3 - 7 days before I notice the results of what I ate. Anyone that says otherwise in terms of how quickly acne forms, obviously hasn't broken out badly days within using an irritating or pore clogging skin care product ;-)

    Best wishes

     
    Old 10-14-2004, 05:28 PM   #84
    openseason
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Accutane is synthetic Vitamin A. Thats why it is dangerous to the liver. No on knows how Accutane works to decrease sebum, only that it does

     
    Old 10-14-2004, 05:28 PM   #85
    SweetJade1
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by yungace11
    i eat pretty good and still get acne. the only thing i drink is water and i eat alot of fruits and not alota junk....
    i do 100% agree with you tho. im sure if they wanted to they could easily come up with a cure for it but your right its not threatning
    Yup, and all of us will say that we ate pretty good too. Although I did'nt always but I thought that I was eating foods that were healthier for me, only to find out that they were the MAJOR source of my problems. I would love to say that I don't want diet to be the answer for everyone, but at the same time, it's the one thing we can't live without...eating. So if we can alter our diets and profit from it via clearer skin, weight loss, better health, etc than why wouldn't people chose to do that, vs. constantly taking all of this medication & topicals??? I guess that's where a personal decision comes into play, huh? Say, what is your typical diet like?

     
    Old 10-14-2004, 05:29 PM   #86
    SweetJade1
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by openseason
    Accutane is synthetic Vitamin A. Thats why it is dangerous to the liver. No on knows how Accutane works to decrease sebum, only that it does
    Really, wow and would you be in the science field?

     
    Old 10-14-2004, 06:12 PM   #87
    openseason
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    SweetJade, I am sure there is a genetic hereditary influence on the development of acne,

     
    Old 10-14-2004, 06:45 PM   #88
    SweetJade1
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by openseason
    SweetJade, I am sure there is a genetic hereditary influence on the development of acne,

    You aren't answering my question, but I never said there wasn't a genetic influence. Yet the problem is, you don't believe that you can alter your environmental influences in order to override the genetic component, right? Well, in light of all our testimonies, explanations, lab results, doctors' advice, & scientific studies, please explain your reasoning for this and feel free to throw in some recents studies if you must.

    Thanks

     
    Old 10-30-2004, 10:35 AM   #89
    Blazin mami
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    so right!!! so what do u do to combat acne?

     
    Old 10-30-2004, 06:33 PM   #90
    openseason
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    Re: Food & acne (why dermatologists don't tell the truth)

    You said acne is caused by a genetic hormonal dysfunction affecting sebum production. So my question to you is can diet change your skin color, or the color of your hair ? No it cannot, because the body breaks every food down to simple sugars. Does the acid in Coca Cola, which will rot an iron nail rot your stomach ? No because the natural stomach tissue neutralizes the phosphoric acid of the Coke.

     
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