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TryAgain121 01-11-2011 10:52 AM

Re: About the WAIS-IV
 
So, I have an appt at the 20th of this month, and I will discuss many things with the doc at that point, but mainly the IQ test and its diagnostic power in recognizing ADD. Eh, I'm getting the rather ominous feeling that something is deeply impaired with my intelligence (or, even, that there was not much there to begin with).

I need to know if those treated for ADD/Depression etc have the potential to score higher. I've scored 130, and 126 on a timed one, but also lower. Something tells me the lower ones are more accurate, for some reason.

janewhite1 01-11-2011 06:24 PM

Re: About the WAIS-IV
 
Trust me, there are many reasons that someone can underperform on a test, from not feeling well test day to anxiety to trouble speaking the language the test is given in. It's impossible to "overperform." The test is too long and complicated for you to do well by dumb luck. Therefore, if you got a good score (and didn't cheat in some way ;)) then you deserve it.

That "something" telling you that you don't is your insecurity.

When I was considering grad school, my biggest fear was that I didn't have the creativity and raw intellectual brainpower to succeed in higher mathematics. During the semester I applied, I had a remarkable teacher (in 2 different classes.) She taught me something, not in words, because those would never have convinced me, but indirectly.

"That's just imposter syndrome. Everyone worries they aren't good enough." That was what reading the biographies of mathematicians taught me. "You ARE creative and innovative in mathematics, at least in some areas." That was what her assignments showed me.

She's retired now, after forty years of teaching, so what she gave me I pay in the only direction a debt like that can ever be paid: Forward.

TryAgain121 01-12-2011 12:18 AM

Re: About the WAIS-IV
 
[QUOTE=janewhite1;4659344]Trust me, there are many reasons that someone can underperform on a test, from not feeling well test day to anxiety to trouble speaking the language the test is given in. It's impossible to "overperform." The test is too long and complicated for you to do well by dumb luck. Therefore, if you got a good score (and didn't cheat in some way ;)) then you deserve it.

That "something" telling you that you don't is your insecurity.

When I was considering grad school, my biggest fear was that I didn't have the creativity and raw intellectual brainpower to succeed in higher mathematics. During the semester I applied, I had a remarkable teacher (in 2 different classes.) She taught me something, not in words, because those would never have convinced me, but indirectly.

"That's just imposter syndrome. Everyone worries they aren't good enough." That was what reading the biographies of mathematicians taught me. "You ARE creative and innovative in mathematics, at least in some areas." That was what her assignments showed me.

She's retired now, after forty years of teaching, so what she gave me I pay in the only direction a debt like that can ever be paid: Forward.[/QUOTE]


I should've mentioned that these were ONLINE tests (my ADD is rearing its ugly head again) that I scored those numbers in. If the wide range of scores are to be believed, then I am an idiot and a genius at the same time :P

I know what you mean, though, if someone scores high on an official one, it is not on accident. We shall see soon enough, I suppose.

Also, yes good teachers are invaluable, pity I didn't have too many of them. But maybe I'll get lucky in college.

janewhite1 01-12-2011 06:45 AM

Re: About the WAIS-IV
 
Ah. Online IQ tests may or may not mean anything at all, and cannot possibly test as wide a range of cognitive skills as an official one, simply due to format. I have no information about which online IQ tests are useful or reliable.

TryAgain121 01-12-2011 07:33 PM

Re: About the WAIS-IV
 
Yep, one problem is that they may or may not be "normed" properly, and anyone can put an IQ test online, while unknowingly putting the "wrong" answer as the right one in some cases. There are many other problems with online testing, as you said due to format. Namely testing "performance IQ."

In the end, I might have to visit another pysch with experience in LDs, as someone can be smarter than they seem, or perform. I do plan to keep my current apt and squeeze all the information out of that session as possible.

Also, I've read that if there is a large discrepency in test scores there is a chance that someone can be both really intelligent but that LD prevents them from performing well on paper. My SAT scores seem to be indicative of that, exceptional English scores, but poor everything else (I attributed that to lack of attentional abilities).

But, I have not considered the Neuropsychopathology of the matter :P

janewhite1 01-12-2011 07:49 PM

Re: About the WAIS-IV
 
Yes, that is how "IQ" tests are used nowadays. The psych--- looks especially for score discrepancies, because those are clues to learning disabilities.

TryAgain121 01-17-2011 09:53 PM

Re: About the WAIS-IV
 
[QUOTE=janewhite1;4660194]Yes, that is how "IQ" tests are used nowadays. The psych--- looks especially for score discrepancies, because those are clues to learning disabilities.[/QUOTE]

Yep. I've heard the reasoning that bright individuals simply [I]know[/I] there is something wrong with them, either from an neurochemistry perspective, or otherwise. Any discrepancies will be a useful tool. Not counting today, or the day of, I have two days left then I will be one step closer to solving the mystery.

TryAgain121 01-20-2011 11:30 AM

Re: About the WAIS-IV
 
Well, had my appointment with the psych today. He provided some interesting information. He said "some people will tell you IQ can change, others will say the opposite" and that education can effect IQ, specifically the math, information, comprehension, and vocabulary sections. A large vocabulary is a requirement for scoring extremely well, supposedly (well, in general). I became side tracked, so I forgot to ask if ADD can impair IQ scores. The test date is March 3rd, I'm hoping I perform sufficiently.

Thunor 01-20-2011 05:06 PM

Re: About the WAIS-IV
 
ADHD tends to impair 'performance' IQ scores, but not 'verbal' IQ scores. This would affect the overall score, so it's important to see the breakdown.

Case in point, my own 'verbal' IQ scored at 121, and my 'performance' IQ scored at 90, leaving me at 105 overall. Obviously, it's important to understand the sub-scores when looking for ADHD or other learning disabilities.

TryAgain121 01-20-2011 07:34 PM

Re: About the WAIS-IV
 
[QUOTE=Thunor;4665740]ADHD tends to impair 'performance' IQ scores, but not 'verbal' IQ scores. This would affect the overall score, so it's important to see the breakdown.

Case in point, my own 'verbal' IQ scored at 121, and my 'performance' IQ scored at 90, leaving me at 105 overall. Obviously, it's important to understand the sub-scores when looking for ADHD or other learning disabilities.[/QUOTE]

Verbal IQ would include working memory, so then ADHD doesn't really impair working memory then? If that's the case, I wonder what else could be causing my (working) memory problems.

But, back on track, were you able to take the test a second time and score higher when medicated? As far as performance IQ goes, are any subtests from that section timed? Is that a required component, I mean? Well, technically my psych wants to get through the entirety of the test in about 2hrs. However, if the time limit isn't necessary I would opt for that option so I could score optimally.

janewhite1 01-20-2011 07:43 PM

Re: About the WAIS-IV
 
Working memory like digit span? My digit span score was atrocious! Lowest score out of all of them, the only one that was way below average, and, digit span is very commonly impaired by ADHD.

I also had the classic 30-point spread between verbal and performance scores. Had it on the WISC at 9 and on the WAIS at 19. When I was 19 somebody finally bothered to look in a book and figure out what that kind of score gap meant. At 9, the tester looked only at the total score, and told my parents I was a prodigy and there was nothing wrong with me, feel free to punish until adequate performance is seen.

Some people with ADHD, however, are "medicated" by the excitement of testing to the point that they score normally, so there's really no saying what will happen.

Most sections of the test are timed, by the way.

TryAgain121 01-20-2011 07:49 PM

Re: About the WAIS-IV
 
[QUOTE=janewhite1;4665857]Working memory like digit span? My digit span score was atrocious! Lowest score out of all of them, the only one that was way below average, and, digit span is very commonly impaired by ADHD.

I also had the classic 30-point spread between verbal and performance scores. Had it on the WISC at 9 and on the WAIS at 19. When I was 19 somebody finally bothered to look in a book and figure out what that kind of score gap meant. At 9, the tester looked only at the total score, and told my parents I was a prodigy and there was nothing wrong with me, feel free to punish until adequate performance is seen.

Some people with ADHD, however, are "medicated" by the excitement of testing to the point that they score normally, so there's really no saying what will happen.

Most sections of the test are timed, by the way.[/QUOTE]


Will reply in fuller detail later (rushed), but I've heard someone spreading out the test during the course of several days. Is there a way to get the time aspect relaxed? Also, is it possible for someone to have an above average IQ and still score below average in more than one subtest? I suppose they would have to blow most of the others out of the water, then.

I know I've mentioned this before in a previous thread, but if my results are desultory (even on meds), then perhaps ADHD isn't the problem. Though, I suppose it would depend on the severity of it.

janewhite1 01-20-2011 08:25 PM

Re: About the WAIS-IV
 
I know I scored really low on digit span, and I think I was right around average or maybe slightly below on visual memory. (The only way I have ANY visual memory is if I start describing things to myself verbally, LOL). I can't remember the other scores now, and I have no idea what I did with the records. Wasn't real relevant once I left college.

Anyway, even with 2 low marks, my total overall score was I believe 142, so it is possible. (And that and two bucks will get you a cup of coffee.)

The fact of the matter is, the WAIS is not the best screening test for ADHD. It's there to tell you what your brain does well and what it does poorly. The results can give you better insight into how you learn and how you can accomplish things most efficiently. Might even give you a few career hints. But ultimately it's a measure of what you can do right now, not of how your brain does it. Other screening tests, especially behavioral observations and case history, are a lot more reliable.

TryAgain121 01-20-2011 11:50 PM

Re: About the WAIS-IV
 
[QUOTE=janewhite1;4665873]I know I scored really low on digit span, and I think I was right around average or maybe slightly below on visual memory. (The only way I have ANY visual memory is if I start describing things to myself verbally, LOL). I can't remember the other scores now, and I have no idea what I did with the records. Wasn't real relevant once I left college.

Anyway, even with 2 low marks, my total overall score was I believe 142, so it is possible. (And that and two bucks will get you a cup of coffee.)

The fact of the matter is, the WAIS is not the best screening test for ADHD. It's there to tell you what your brain does well and what it does poorly. The results can give you better insight into how you learn and how you can accomplish things most efficiently. Might even give you a few career hints. But ultimately it's a measure of what you can do right now, not of how your brain does it. Other screening tests, especially behavioral observations and case history, are a lot more reliable.[/QUOTE]


I'm not expecting a score nearly that high. As I'll probably get more than two low marks I suspect. I agree it probably isn't the best screening test for ADHD. I'm getting the sense you don't think ADD really impairs overall scoring. Sorry if I misinterpreted.

Honestly, though, I don't feel like my brain does anything well. I believe I missed the boat on cognitive development.

janewhite1 01-21-2011 06:52 AM

Re: About the WAIS-IV
 
[QUOTE=TryAgain121;4665960] Honestly, though, I don't feel like my brain does anything well. I believe I missed the boat on cognitive development.[/QUOTE]

Oh, my dear, take an actual look around the Internet one day. Do you have any idea how many adults out there can't put a coherent sentence together? Trust me, your verbal skills are extraordinary.

Yes, I do believe IQ can impact overall scoring. I just happen to test better than I do many other things. (I was 20 before I could write a simple essay without being terrified.)


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