It appears you have not yet Signed Up with our community. To Sign Up for free, please click here....



Addiction & Recovery Message Board

  • AA vs. RR



  • Post New Thread   Closed Thread
    Thread Tools Search this Thread
    Old 09-29-2003, 05:50 PM   #46
    verylucky
    Veteran
     
    verylucky's Avatar
     
    Join Date: Jul 2003
    Posts: 364
    verylucky HB User
    Cool

    oops!! I'm at home now and that's why the above post came out under Hope's username (she wishes she could write so well). Anyway, sorry about the confusion.

    Take care and we look forward to hearing from you Chris,
    verylucky

     
    Sponsors Lightbulb
       
    Old 09-30-2003, 04:31 PM   #47
    trinity714
    Member
    (male)
     
    trinity714's Avatar
     
    Join Date: Sep 2003
    Posts: 56
    trinity714 HB User
    Post

    I was watching the movie "Life as a House" (with Kevin Kline) the other day. For those who haven't seen it...the general story line is a man who finds out he only has four months to live, so he decides he wants to fulfill his dream of building his own house. He "enlists" the help of his estranged and "troubled" son, and through the process they become closer and there are a lot of links between his relationship with his father, and his relationship with his son. During the movie, his son takes some of his father's vicodin on several occasions. Finally, he admits to his dad that he's done so...and his father says that he knew, and asks why. His son makes a comment to the effect of, "I like the feeling of not having to feel anything."

    I thought that was a good, simple explanation of what a lot of us have felt in terms of our using. For me, and I would assume for others as well, in my journey of sobriety, I've also recognized that I used in a dysfunctional attempt to fill a hole I felt inside. in looking at my past behaviors, I can recognize through the years that I had tried to full this "hole" in many ways...through sex, through drinking in college years, through food...and then I discovered the narcotics and how those "worked" in a sense to fill that hole. Now as I'm working a program, I'm having to face some of the uncomfortableness of self-discovery and analysis about what the "hole" in me is, and where it's origins might be.

    My point in laying all of this out goes back to the topic of why I feel AA/NA is so vital to recovery. Because it's a program that really forces one to look long and hard at themselves, their coping skills, and their behaviors in every way relating to using. I've really been discovering how the 12-step programs are really so much more than just "not using." For me at least, it's about learning who I am, and what i need, and how to get that in non-self destructive ways. That's why I think it works...because addiction is about so much more than just the act of taking too much of whatever substance. It's about an attempt to fill a need (and a need on a variety of levels), to numb out or escape feelings, and I really have found that working a program can address all of that. Again, if you are really working a program.

    I fear that I'm not expressing all of this all that well, but hopefully you all can get the gist of my meaning.

    Chris, I think you may have hit it on the head when you said that maybe your reluctance to see addiction as a disease came from not wanting to admit that it's something you don't have a lot of control over, because in your experience that's been a negative thing. I think a lot of people would rather see it as a personal flaw, because then it's something more easily controlled. But if you take a good, honest look at your behavior...if it's just a matter of self-control, why wouldn't you have stopped just like that? why wouldn't it be easy to stop? I'm sure that in many other facets of your life you are successful, and driven and can work hard to get where you want. But it doesn't seem to fall that easily into place when it comes to getting off of the pills, right?

    I agree with what verylucky and Hope have said, that maybe some people use the fact as addiction being a disease as an excuse to just give up and keep using, but the fact that it is a disease doesn't mean that it's hopeless. It means that willpower alone can't cut it. Maybe thinking of it like cancer will help...cancer is a disease (although many many years ago there was a thought that it was a moral deficiency and a sign that the person was failing themselves!) but there are things that can be done to get into recovery/remission.

    To me, the fact that addiction is a disease gives me hope. Because there are things, treatments if you will, that I can partake in that will help me get into "remission."

    Again, I know that for me, my addiction is not a matter of willpower or moral lacking. I have been successful in so many other parts of my life. If it were just a matter of me setting my mind to it, and logic, then I would have been able to stop "at any time" But no matter the consequences, or how bad it got, willpower alone only got me so far, and then I was using again. Over time, and failed attempts, it became clear to me that there was something wrong on a number of levels...chemically, psychologically, mentally, physically, you name it that contributed to my "problem" with the pills. But there are treatments and things that I know can help, because I've seen them help other people, so I have hope.

    As usual, I've rambled on, and am not sure I've made any sense. But it's an important issue to me, so i can't help but add my two cents in every once in awhile. Chris, please keep posting and adding your thoughts. It helps me to hear everyone's thoughts to clarify in my mind what I believe, and being honest about the way you feel can only be helpful in the long run. I do hope that you can find some relief in your struggle, by any means that work for you.
    __________________
    "You can turn off the sun, but I'm still gonna shine..."

     
    Old 09-30-2003, 04:48 PM   #48
    trinity714
    Member
    (male)
     
    trinity714's Avatar
     
    Join Date: Sep 2003
    Posts: 56
    trinity714 HB User
    Post

    I was watching the movie "Life as a House" (with Kevin Kline) the other day. For those who haven't seen it...the general story line is a man who finds out he only has four months to live, so he decides he wants to fulfill his dream of building his own house. He "enlists" the help of his estranged and "troubled" son, and through the process they become closer and there are a lot of links between his relationship with his father, and his relationship with his son. During the movie, his son takes some of his father's vicodin on several occasions. Finally, he admits to his dad that he's done so...and his father says that he knew, and asks why. His son makes a comment to the effect of, "I like the feeling of not having to feel anything."

    I thought that was a good, simple explanation of what a lot of us have felt in terms of our using. For me, and I would assume for others as well, in my journey of sobriety, I've also recognized that I used in a dysfunctional attempt to fill a hole I felt inside. in looking at my past behaviors, I can recognize through the years that I had tried to full this "hole" in many ways...through sex, through drinking in college years, through food...and then I discovered the narcotics and how those "worked" in a sense to fill that hole. Now as I'm working a program, I'm having to face some of the uncomfortableness of self-discovery and analysis about what the "hole" in me is, and where it's origins might be.

    My point in laying all of this out goes back to the topic of why I feel AA/NA is so vital to recovery. Because it's a program that really forces one to look long and hard at themselves, their coping skills, and their behaviors in every way relating to using. I've really been discovering how the 12-step programs are really so much more than just "not using." For me at least, it's about learning who I am, and what i need, and how to get that in non-self destructive ways. That's why I think it works...because addiction is about so much more than just the act of taking too much of whatever substance. It's about an attempt to fill a need (and a need on a variety of levels), to numb out or escape feelings, and I really have found that working a program can address all of that. Again, if you are really working a program.

    I fear that I'm not expressing all of this all that well, but hopefully you all can get the gist of my meaning.

    Chris, I think you may have hit it on the head when you said that maybe your reluctance to see addiction as a disease came from not wanting to admit that it's something you don't have a lot of control over, because in your experience that's been a negative thing. I think a lot of people would rather see it as a personal flaw, because then it's something more easily controlled. But if you take a good, honest look at your behavior...if it's just a matter of self-control, why wouldn't you have stopped just like that? why wouldn't it be easy to stop? I'm sure that in many other facets of your life you are successful, and driven and can work hard to get where you want. But it doesn't seem to fall that easily into place when it comes to getting off of the pills, right?

    I agree with what verylucky and Hope have said, that maybe some people use the fact as addiction being a disease as an excuse to just give up and keep using, but the fact that it is a disease doesn't mean that it's hopeless. It means that willpower alone can't cut it. Maybe thinking of it like cancer will help...cancer is a disease (although many many years ago there was a thought that it was a moral deficiency and a sign that the person was failing themselves!) but there are things that can be done to get into recovery/remission.

    To me, the fact that addiction is a disease gives me hope. Because there are things, treatments if you will, that I can partake in that will help me get into "remission."

    Again, I know that for me, my addiction is not a matter of willpower or moral lacking. I have been successful in so many other parts of my life. If it were just a matter of me setting my mind to it, and logic, then I would have been able to stop "at any time" But no matter the consequences, or how bad it got, willpower alone only got me so far, and then I was using again. Over time, and failed attempts, it became clear to me that there was something wrong on a number of levels...chemically, psychologically, mentally, physically, you name it that contributed to my "problem" with the pills. But there are treatments and things that I know can help, because I've seen them help other people, so I have hope.

    As usual, I've rambled on, and am not sure I've made any sense. But it's an important issue to me, so i can't help but add my two cents in every once in awhile. Chris, please keep posting and adding your thoughts. It helps me to hear everyone's thoughts to clarify in my mind what I believe, and being honest about the way you feel can only be helpful in the long run. I do hope that you can find some relief in your struggle, by any means that work for you.
    __________________
    "You can turn off the sun, but I'm still gonna shine..."

     
    Old 09-30-2003, 04:54 PM   #49
    verylucky
    Veteran
     
    verylucky's Avatar
     
    Join Date: Jul 2003
    Posts: 364
    verylucky HB User
    Post

    Very well said Trinity. Great post.

    Take care,
    verylucky

     
    Closed Thread

    Related Topics
    Thread Thread Starter Board Replies Last Post
    Retin-a-micro success stories.... Dom Acne 2 01-18-2003 07:06 AM
    Rules of the Board - please read moderator2 Acne 0 06-10-2002 08:06 PM
    If you feel suicidal, please read here.... moderator2 Acne 0 05-29-2002 06:54 PM
    All members..... moderator2 Acne 2 05-16-2002 08:18 PM
    How to use this message board.... moderator2 Acne 0 04-17-2002 07:33 PM




    Thread Tools Search this Thread
    Search this Thread:

    Advanced Search

    Posting Rules
    You may not post new threads
    You may not post replies
    You may not post attachments
    You may not edit your posts

    BB code is On
    Smilies are On
    [IMG] code is Off
    HTML code is On
    Trackbacks are Off
    Pingbacks are Off
    Refbacks are Off




    Sign Up Today!

    Ask our community of thousands of members your health questions, and learn from others experiences. Join the conversation!

    I want my free account

    All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:25 PM.





    © 2020 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved.
    Do not copy or redistribute in any form!