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    Old 07-22-2005, 06:37 PM   #1
    hungryjacked
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    Question methodone withdrawl info please

    I'm am currently on subutex on my 9th day, detoxing from methodone. I tapered methodone from 85mg. to 25mg, before I started subutex, which I understand that this was proper protocol. It is my 9th day and the subtex is not giving me any relief or is not agreeing with me. When I take my dose, it makes me feel worse and then I stay that way. I dont ever get any comfort from it at all. Originally my doctor told me I would be feeling up and down for about the first 24 to 48 hours but then I should start feeling some relief as the bupernorphine overrides the methodone that remained in my system. It is day 9 now and I still feel VERY BAD INDEED! I knew this was not going to be easy but do think something is wrong.
    I need to know if anyone out there(either a person going or went through this or person with some strong medical knowledge) can give me a clue of what might be going on, because Im loseing the trust of knowledge in my doctor. Could I be allergic to this? Is it not enough time yet? Anyone knows about how many days or months it takes to kick this way. I need some knowledge input about this, for my life is at stake, at this point.
    And in conclusion, anyone out there thinking of switching or trying methodone, you better take a hard look, for this is a mean drug to kick! All the short acting opiate withdrawls or difference from monkey to gorilla.

    DAV

     
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    Old 07-22-2005, 09:26 PM   #2
    penniedad
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    Question Re: methodone withdrawl info please

    i really dont know about those other drugs your on but i have bEEN off and on methodone for 15 yrs,i never had a problem , i went down SLOW,NEVER GOT SICK, i really think those other drugs must be doing it? i messed up going back on drugs then back on meth! right now iam going off ,but like i said slow,3or 4 every few weeks,how fast are you going off?do those others drugs take the meth out of your body? i wish you the best, i know what it is like being sick!!! i will ask in the morning, you have me wondering now?

     
    Old 07-23-2005, 01:42 AM   #3
    hungryjacked
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    Re: methodone withdrawl info please

    penidad,
    Thanks for your reply! Subutex is suppose to take or push the methodone from your receptors(Kappa) from what I understand. Im at the point of almost giving up, Im so sick I can barely type. IM so run down. I did taper from methodone, but not that slow (3-4 mg) Help

     
    Old 07-23-2005, 06:59 AM   #4
    Twinlynn
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    Re: methodone withdrawl info please

    Hungryjack -

    I am so sorry you are so ill. Is your doctor a psychiatrist specializing in addiction? Or is he/she a GP, who may have just taken the minimal one-day study course? It sounds like you need good, solid medical help from a doctor who knows all the nitty-gritty about switching such strong drugs.

    Just hazarding a guess...it almost sounds as if the methadone is reacting negatively with the Subutex...drawing you further into addiction. I take Subutex. I was taking oxys--at the end about 160 mg a day--and decided to get out of this mess with Subutex. The night before I started the Sub (I started at 12 mg), I stoped taking the oxy....so I was about about 14 hrs into withdrawal, when I took my first Sub.

    15 minutes after it dissolved under my tongue, I was totally shocked to realize that all the withdrawal symptoms were gone! It was like I'd never taken the oxys!! My doctor had me take 12 mg Subutex for a week, then down to 10 mg for another two weeks, eventually getting to 6 mg a day--which is what I am currently on (and will stay at for now.) I started them in January.

    You are probably feeling way too sick to even read the above story right now--but I just wanted to give you an example of how the Subutex can work in overriding other opiates.

    As you say--youi may be allergic to something in the med. Or you may not be taking enough Sub to override the methadone withdrawals. There are several possibilities, and I hope you can get some good answers from a doctor, even if you can to get a second opinion.

    Also--go to the web and use a search engine to find a forum or site on Subutex, where you can ask specific questions. Read everything you can about Sub and possible interactions with other drugs. There is so much information out there on this new drug that soon you will feel as if you've learned far more about Sub than your doctor!!! LOL! (Not that I think you should eliminate the phone call to your doctor asap.)

    I know how it feels to be so sick with withdrawal....and I hope you will be able to get some relief very, very soon. But, first, you need to talk dosages with your doctor...don't let her/him be vague! If you sense he doesn't know the answers....try to find another doc. It just seems as if the Subutex should be giving you some relief by now, if you were taking enough. I hope a more "medical" person comes on here very soon, to help you.

    Let me know how you're doing. I'll be back checking the board later in the day.

    Lynn :-)

     
    Old 07-23-2005, 09:25 PM   #5
    penniedad
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    Unhappy Re: methodone withdrawl info please

    hi sweetie, hang in there, i talked to our nurse at the clinic???she said they dont do that here, it puts you in a bad withdraw,she has worked a long long time, she said if you get back on meth , just meth, you will feel better right then and there, but dont take anything else, then come off meth real slow!!! we saw a movie on how our brain starts needing meth or dope ,, my god we really mess up once we start drugs, but there is hope, never give up!!!can you get back on?? every state is different, iam in CT.but they should have known how sick you would be? alot of people just dont know how sick we can get!!they said its like the flu!!!!!!!no way, its hell,i can remember wanting to just die,i prayed alot also, iam going to pray for your pain, i feel what you feel, let me know

     
    Old 07-23-2005, 10:40 PM   #6
    AllenSD
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    Re: methodone withdrawl info please

    I'd like to offer my input on this and get information as well. The two things that could help you feel better are to take good multivitamins every day and an antihistamine (for running nose - it helps stop the chills). My doctor told me that if I ever wanted to stop it, to stop it at a rate of 10% every 3 weeks - and not faster. That is pretty slow, but they give that advice for good reason.

    If you are being forced to cut down faster because you can't get it, you need to go to a methadone clinic now and be honest with them. They are in most major cities and the more informed and well trained facilities can help. If you go to one that wants to cut you off cold turkey - leave and find another one. If you are taking it because of pain, you may wish you hadn't even bothered to try cutting down because the pain that you took it to stop may come back.

    I have severe lower back problems - I'm usually okay standing up, but once I sit or lay down, within 10 seconds, something shifts and I go from no back pain to intollerable. This has been a problem for over 10 years now and I went through the aspirin, physical therapy - everything they could do, they did but it didn't help. I even let them burn through some nerves to try to stop it. I had CT scans done but they could not see what was causing it. I was put on codiene at first, and after a year it would work an hour, then stop and I'd wake up in pain and have to wait 3 hours to take another dose. I was sent to a pain clinic and immediately put on methadone. At 30mg, I am pain free, but my ankles and lower legs swell often and I get very tired easily. I also really wonder what this will do to my liver and kidneys if I take it the rest of my life. To make sure that my back problem hadn't corrected itself, I have cut down to as low as 15 mg a day a few times by just cutting the dose all at once and within 3 days, the back pain comes back. I stayed at the lower dose anyway and just suffered through it hoping that I'd feel better if I gave it time - and I did, but my back problem was there every day and that would bother me so much I'd give up and go back to the full dose. For me, cutting down was done at my choice and without asking my doctor. I just did it and while I felt withdrawals, I could tolerate it by taking the vitamins and antihistamines. Don't take more than is on the bottles - it worked for me at that dose fairly well. That doesn't mean I felt great- but I could get by each day without being so sick with withdrawal that I'd go back for that reason. I know we are all different and some of us have more of those receptors that make us feel worse - I'm just sharing my experiences with the hope it might be of a little help. I'm lucky that it didn't take a higher dose to stop the back pain but even at the dose I take, when I had surgery last month to remove my gallbladder, the medicine they gave me did not appear to work at all and I was wide awake going into surgery (when they told me I would be out from the drugs) and I woke up in recovery after 30 minutes and was in real bad pain with the nurse telling me they had already given me all the medicine they could. I had no choice but to just deal with it and during that week when I really felt bad, I thought a lot about how much I hated being on methadone. I am on an HMO, so they had in their chart that I am already on methadone. I don't know if that affected what they gave me or not but the first week after that surgery was real rough.

    My question: Is there any kind of new drug - like botox - that can be used to stop lower back pain? I would do nearly anything to no have to take daily narcotics. My problem is pinching nerves at the lowest point where they come out of the spine and go down my legs.

    There is one bit of information I'd like to also share with everyone. Methadose (the generic) causes severe sweating with most people. Methadone usually doesn't. They are different formulations. This information came straight from my pain clinic doctor when I went in with sweating problems. When they switched me to the Roxane brand of Methadone - the sweating stopped completely. Even the pharmacist didn't believe me when I said they were diffferent, but I went from just dripping in sweat to being normal just by changing from the generic. The name brand drug is very cheap - so if you have a sweating problem - ask for the methadone instead of methadose and see how it helps you. If it does, post it here so more people know about it.
    Thanks for any information on new non-narcotic treatments if anyone knows of any.

     
    Old 07-24-2005, 11:29 AM   #7
    hungryjacked
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    Re: methodone withdrawl info please

    penniedad,

    Very week now. Probably can get back on methodone, at my clinic. Realize yesterday this is not working for me. Are you sure of this info. please reply back to me asap. Ican get a dose or two from another patient until I go to the clinic tomorrow, but want to make sure it will make me feel better and not worse withdrawal! And also when you said dont take nothing else, does that mean clonidine (for blood pressure) too?
    DAVE

     
    Old 07-24-2005, 09:20 PM   #8
    penniedad
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    Unhappy Re: methodone withdrawl info please

    when she said nothing else, she was talking about the drug subutex!thats what i had asked about,get some meth, stop any drug that can put you in withdrawl,some of my friends said they tryed that ? one said it worked but he was sick as hell, the other said he could not take it,he just stayed with meth,i dont get it why give anyone something that puts them in withdrawl??,,all i can say is get feeling good now, then think of what your going to do, i have high blood also, but i hated the way clonidine made me feel! i went to detox yr.s ago and thats what they gave me, i honestly dont know anything about taking that?? let me know, i will check back in morning before i go to meth,

     
    Old 07-25-2005, 09:44 PM   #9
    penniedad
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    Question Re: methodone withdrawl info please

    are you ok???????let me know? worryed about you, pennie

     
    Old 07-26-2005, 10:22 AM   #10
    hungryjacked
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    Re: methodone withdrawl info please

    pennie,

    I am now back on my clinic, and increasing mg., until I get to 50mg. I have implimented a plan, along with my families support to be hospitalized (3-4 weeks from now) and have a rapid detox under anesthsia from 50mg or under (less dangerous that way, I was told). But first I had to get back on my methodone (very relucktent and depressing) to build my body or health back up from the trama that I put it through, within the past several weeks. Methodone is slowly bringing me back to a tolerable state. Clinic is only increasing me 5mg/daily, until I become stable again. Its nice to know that some people, still care for the suffering and addicted. Thank You so much for all your concern!
    I have about 3-4 weeks before I am to go through a rapid detox hospital, and I am so worried, scared and confused because I have heard good and bad things about this option. But its now the only option left that I have, except cold turkey! Can you find out any accurate info on rapid detox, and I dont mean selling info from websites. They all paint pretty pictures and make it sound easy for the addict and reels him in, when he/she is week and vunerable. The one I am considering is in Tarpon Springs, Florida and cost $10,000 so this is my last chance and all my resourses will be used up. So it is important that I do my homework on this. I am still weak from the trama and I need all the help I can get!!! I have been praying for god to help me. If he answers my prayers, I would be the happiest man on the face of the earth. I want to be free from this GORILLA so bad, but I cant seem to get through the detox part of it, without threating my life, so far.

    Thanks,
    DAVE

     
    Old 07-27-2005, 10:14 PM   #11
    penniedad
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    Talking Re: methodone withdrawl info please

    well, iam glad you are back on meth for now,we have 5 people who went threw that rapid detox, all failed???i think it is that it takes time to change are brains, are mind,i wish you could see the movie we saw it explains so much,if you get up to 50, you will feel fine, then go down slow!!!take your time,it seems like your in a hurry but why spend that kind of money when you can do it ??? and you can do it!! all the hell we go threw,all we put are body threw, we are alot stonger than we know, i been back and forth for so long,i just got sick of it, but i learned the hard way that i didnt get like this over night so i cant get better fast!!!iam going down slow, and i feel good!!! we will have this for life,i dont know how long you had a problem,we mess are brain up fast,TAKE YOUR TIME PLEASE,i have had dam near all my friends die or end up in jail, pray !you can do it! let me know what happens, my prays go out to you tonight, pennie,

     
    Old 07-28-2005, 01:11 PM   #12
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    Re: methodone withdrawl info please

    methadone is some heavy stuff. really heavy. over years of major heroin addiction i realized it was better than any dope i did. i don't know what sub is like but i imagine about the same. the methadone takes about 30 days to get out of your system and for your body to stop detoxing. i detoxed cold turkey off of 200 mg and once off of 70.

     
    Old 08-26-2005, 11:32 AM   #13
    barbarian
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    Re: methodone withdrawl info please

    I know this is not a good option but it no pain option, it seem that you are the same as me, i was on heroin for a few years and i tried suboxone right at the beginning and it made me feel worse, as i found out it only worked for some people, then i tried methadose to kick heroin at 20mg for a week then nothing for 24 hour then took the suboxone and it worked great but as for most people they said the suboxone worked at the start, suboxone and the one you are taking are the same you take it under the tongue,

     
    Old 08-26-2005, 02:07 PM   #14
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    Re: methodone withdrawl info please

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hungryjacked
    I'm am currently on subutex on my 9th day, detoxing from methodone. I tapered methodone from 85mg. to 25mg, before I started subutex, which I understand that this was proper protocol. It is my 9th day and the subtex is not giving me any relief or is not agreeing with me. When I take my dose, it makes me feel worse and then I stay that way. I dont ever get any comfort from it at all. Originally my doctor told me I would be feeling up and down for about the first 24 to 48 hours but then I should start feeling some relief as the bupernorphine overrides the methodone that remained in my system. It is day 9 now and I still feel VERY BAD INDEED! I knew this was not going to be easy but do think something is wrong.
    I need to know if anyone out there(either a person going or went through this or person with some strong medical knowledge) can give me a clue of what might be going on, because Im loseing the trust of knowledge in my doctor. Could I be allergic to this? Is it not enough time yet? Anyone knows about how many days or months it takes to kick this way. I need some knowledge input about this, for my life is at stake, at this point.
    And in conclusion, anyone out there thinking of switching or trying methodone, you better take a hard look, for this is a mean drug to kick! All the short acting opiate withdrawls or difference from monkey to gorilla.

    DAV

     
    Old 08-26-2005, 02:24 PM   #15
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    Re: methodone withdrawl info please

    i'm sorry you're having such a bad time right now. my son has been on 100mg of meth for a mo. now. that has been my concern, the withdrawal from meth. he does'nt seem to be concerned about it though. he tried suboxone last summer and that did'nt help him. how long were you on the meth? he seems to think that he is in chg. of his dose and length of time he takes it. is that true? i feel that he is replacing illegal drugs with a legal one. it seems like a vicious circle to me, but, i just don't understand i guess. by the way his latest addiction was snorting oxy's. i don't know if the type of drug you are using and how, how often you were using determines the strength of and length of time for meth?
    please have faith in yourself hat you can get through this hell you are in now and live a long and healthy life...............bev

     
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