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    Old 10-11-2007, 09:56 AM   #31
    emsmom
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    Re: Quicksand: My addiction story

    Hi diezel,

    I sat and read your last post with tears in my eyes...

    Not because I was scared, but because I was encouraged. I saw your life, and felt what you've been through. You are such a strong person, so adamant about your recovery. You encourage me to be a better person. Whenever I have thoughts of those pills, I come back to read your original story (quicksand). I copied it to a folder in my laptop, and read it at least once a day.

    I can relate to your part about everyone in your life NOT knowing about your addiction. NO ONE knew about mine. I hid it from everyone in my life for over two years. I would lie about where I was going, about money that was missing, ALL the time. A few times, someone would question me about something relating to pills - I'd get paranoid and try to cover it up. My life was based around those pills. It was always about "how many I had left, and making sure I called to get more so I didn't run out."

    Now, I'm at a point in my life where I'm slowly accepting my addiction and doing everything in my power to make myself a better person. I'm almost done my taper, and I find myself excited to be clean. There was a time in my life where I thought I'd never stop taking the pills. Honestly, I assumed I'd do this for the rest of my life.

    I have an appt this afternoon with my oncologist, hopefully things are looking up for me - I'm very depressed lately - not only cause of the addiction, but cause of the medical situation I'm facing. I'm 31 yrs old but I feel like I'm 75. I have to go get ready and head down to the hospital. I'll let you know how things went today.

    Just know how encouraging you are to me, and I hope all is well.

    Hugs,
    emsmom

    Last edited by emsmom; 10-11-2007 at 09:58 AM.

     
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    Old 10-14-2007, 11:15 AM   #32
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    Re: Quicksand: My addiction story

    Hey em how are you doing? Are you hanging in there? What's the word for this weekend? Are you going to be home or are you going to be in the hospital again? How did your other appointments go? I meant to ask you, after I read the last thread you started, but forgot once I started writting. I am doing well just plan on doing a lot of studying this weekend for my securities license exam as I take it on the 22cnd. The twelve step program that I go to is run by my church, and last week when I was there the man who is the class coordinator talked to me to see how I felt about talking to the youth throughout the church, and whether or not I was comfortable sharing my story with them. So that one if there are youth out there who are struggling and need help they will know that they can come to the meetings and try to get help, and two so that those kids realize that it is ok to make mistakes and that if you want to you can get better and live a good life, and lastly so kids can see how dangerous getting into that kind of stuff can be and will hopefully learn from my mistakes and not make the same ones. It made me feel pretty good that he asked me out of all the people that he could have maybe asked. I think part of it has to do with the fact that I am still pretty young and that the youth my be able relate to me a little easier then with someone older as well as I think he can probably tell that I ok talking about it to other people and having people know about my past. I hope that they do set something up, because I actually would really like to do it. I think it would be good for me as well as for the youth. I know it would give me strength and hope that it would give any of them that might be struggling with something the strength to come foward and get help and those that don't have any problems with it the strength to say no if an opportunity ever came their way. Anyway I got to run and get back to studying, but I hope you are feeling well. Stay strong and be well. Taper, g8tr, granny, how are you all doing? Hope to hear from you all soon.

     
    Old 10-14-2007, 12:29 PM   #33
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    Re: Quicksand: My addiction story

    Hey Diezel,thanks for asking about me. I'm pretty much taking one day at a time. I did get some hydro in the mail last week that I had ordered in early September, before I realized the extent of my addiction. They would arrive when I had a horrible headache so I took 2 right away. I was so mad at myself for going 5 weeks without and then taking them at the first opportunity. I did not feel high from them so I have only been taking them for the headeaches and neck pain I've experienced lately. When they are gone,they are gone. I have no more access to the dam pills and don't really think I'll withdrawal because I have not taken them on a daily basis. Trying to get straightened out on my othe meds. Couldn't take the Cymbalta becuase of the side affects, but have been tapering off that and at same time starting a low dose of Lexapro. I see the doc Friday, so we'll see. I really believe the headaches are still from the Cymbalta as I'm not completely off of them yet due to the need to taper. Neck pain is another story. Anyway, I really appreciate that you keep me in your thoughts. You are a real inspiration to me and I hope I feel as good as you soon. If you were here, you'd get a big kiss from me LOL
    JB

    Last edited by granny0; 10-14-2007 at 12:30 PM.

     
    Old 10-14-2007, 07:02 PM   #34
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    Re: Quicksand: My addiction story

    diezel,

    Thanks so much for asking, you are very thoughtful and that really helps and feels good to know someone is wondering how you are doing since you have been on this long road.

    I am still on my taper. My pm dr really slowed me down at this point. He does not think I can go with no pain meds so I am trying it at the current dose to see how things go. I had a major flare up ( tmj) this weekend and I took aspirin as extra instead of extra pain meds and just toughed it out in bed with heating pad, ice and rest. I felt so empowered. My husband is incredibly supportive as is my son. It makes you feel good to know you can deal even though I am prescribed many more pain meds, I now know I am not trustworthy of having them around and I must deal with the pain when it hits.

    My dr wanted me to try oxy in a few months because my pain had gotten so bad and I am SO glad I have realized this massive problem I have before I ever touched that stuff.

    I also watched my husbands co-worker go through a living he** because of an oxy addiction, he has lost his job, his wife and his whole life, kind of puts it in perspective, no?

    How are YOU doing? Look at you, getting ready for your securities test, giving talks, I admire you and can't wait to be on your side of the road.

    My husband is a youth pastor and I think it would be ideal for you to talk to the kids about this, you'd be surprised at the things kids are doing by the age of 14 already.................

    God bless

     
    Old 10-14-2007, 09:40 PM   #35
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    Question Re: Quicksand: My addiction story

    I am so impressed with your writing. I have to ask a question. How much of the "pills" were you sniffing...just sniffing or also inducing? When you found the "oxygen" meaning suboxone.....what did it do from first ingestion and as days/weeks followed? No withdrawrals? Able to function as if you weren't detoxing from the pain killers? ANy symptoms at all? Hands shaking etc>? I am about to begin getting off of percocets (was on up to 80 mg's daily). I am planning a time to do it so I have work off & my child gone for a few days? I don't know whether to go suboxone route or the route of tapering my dose down (I'm on half that dose now) as low as possible then using this physician who helps people detox at home without the use of suboxone or methadone...other drugs like naltrexone? I think....any info you can give will be GREAT! I need to be able to function and questioning which way to go? Thanks & CONGRATS to you!!!! You are giving hope with this post!

     
    Old 10-15-2007, 06:37 AM   #36
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    Re: Quicksand: My addiction story

    Hey diezel! Hello all,
    I am doing well, starting to taper off of the sub this week and am a little nervous. But with God, strength, and trust in the Dr, I will get through it. Something funny happened to me this weekend. I was cleaning my car out and guess what I found? Yep, a methadone. I think it's happened to most of us, you are faced with what you once had a love affair with, and now you sort of hate it. And honestly, I think if I wasn't on sub I probably would have taken it. So it's a good thing I'm taking it. It's encouraging to come on here and read everone's daily posts. It's always better when you have someone to relate to and that understands what you are going through. Diezel, it's good to hear you are doing well and staying busy. I think it would be great to talk to the youth. It could really help someone. I think that's why we go through the hell we do, so we can help someone else before they get sucked in the quicksand.. Stay Strong everyone!! I'll talk to you soon..

    g8trgrl

     
    Old 10-15-2007, 08:39 PM   #37
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    Re: Quicksand: My addiction story

    g8trg & taper so good to hear from you both! I am so glad you both are doing well. Sweetie welcome to our little family! Seriously everybody checking in on me here and letting me know how they are doing as well has been the biggest strength for me. I have never seen any of your faces and don't really know any of your real names, but having walked in one another shoes feel that I know you and that you know me better then most. Sure maybe you don't know my favorite food, color, movie, what color my hair or eyes are, but we have walked familiar paths and that makes me feel familiar with where you have been and which direction you are heading, and most people probably do not know those things about you, that is if you were as secretive as I was during my addiction. Your stories inspire and encourage me, they make me sad and happy, they make worry and hopeful. I cant thank all of you enough for sharing with me and allowing me to share with you. Sweetie any time you need an ear to listen or an encourage word feel free to post me a message. I check this thread everyday or two, and will always get back to you, and I am sure the others will give you words of support and encouragement as well. Taper I am sure you would love to be off the meds altogether, but everything comes in time and as long as you are following what your doc says and you and your loved ones feel good about it then that is exactly how you should feel, Good about it. My father is an addict, but due to some pain issues he has (he goes into seizures he gets headaches so bad if he does not take something) he has to take something occasionally, but he has my mom give them to him and hold onto them when he does not as he knows that as helpful as they can be medically they can hurt him again. I must admit it is not easy at times for me knowing that there are pills in the house and I almost went looking for them a time or two, but it seems to get a little easier as each day passes. G8trg oh how similiar our stories as addicts often become as I can't tell you how many times I have found drugs or drug paraphenallia since becoming sober. I hid things every where, and still find things occasionally. I have found little stashes of pills in old bags, or pill powder inside of things that were specifically designed to hid it. Most recently I was going through some stuff in my garage and found an mini altoids case that I used to store razors for cutting my pills and pens I had cut into thirds to use as sniffing tools. Obviously finding the actual drugs made it extremely hard to not want to take them, but even finding the other things made me tempted to go out and get some. It is hard very hard, and even if the fact that you are on suboxone was a big reason why you did not take the pill I am sure there was a small part of you that said not anymore. It was like you saw the quicksand and thought will it's just a little bit I could get through, but then said you know I will take the long road, the hard road, which is staying sober so congrats to you that is awesome I am so happy for you!!! Sweetie I suggest going the suboxone route if at all possible. There are people out there who can taper off what they are using to the point where they can stop, and to those people I say wow you truly amaze me, because I could never do it. Everytime I tried I would get sick, or angry, upset, sore, down, depressed whatever and take a more pills. If you are able to go the suboxone route you honestly should not have to worry about taking a tone of time off work or having time to yourself as it works (well at least in my experiance extremely well). The first day I took it I had only one 7.5 mg vicoden and I had been up to almost 150mg of oxy so I was not feeling all that hot and infact by the time I left the doctors office and got to the pharmacy I was running for the bathroom and was soaking wet yet freezing cold and needed a tissue for my eyes and nose, and within a half hour of taking one of a tablet disolved under my tongue as prescribed by my doctor I was feeling a world of a difference, and although I did not feel 100% I felt better then I had in almost two weeks of having low doses of vicoden handed out to me by family and I compared to how I felt the two days I was without anything before getting the vicoden to help hold me over till my appointment for my suboxone I felt 100% and some better. For me suboxone got me through the physical part of getting sober pretty easy. One of the first things my doctor warned me about was this. He said you are going to start taking suboxone and physically you are going to feel better pretty quickly and within a few days feel fine, and after a few weeks, and a month you will feel like you are fine, but your not because it is the little demons inside of you that you must truely conquer so don't think this is going to be quick and easy. I am still on my suboxone, but have had little to no problems slowly reducing the amount that I take as prescirbed by my doctor. I have a withdrawal symptom here or there, but I think in a way we all need to face the music a little bit or else we are not going to stay sober. It is a cliche, but it is a cliche because it is true, and that is anything that is worth doing is not going to be easy. Remember though no matter what you decide to do whether its a taper or suboxone, which will evenetually lead to a taper as well, that you don't make the decision alone. Make it with your doc with your family, friends, loved ones. I was never more alone then I was when I was at the bottom of my addiction, and the greatest thing is that you don't need to be alone anymore. People want to help you they want to be therfore you, let them in and let them help. Remember also that the physical aspect of over coming addiction is only honestly the easy part as bad as I felt the two days that I went from being on 150 mg of oxy down to nothing were and as much as I felt like I saw hell it that was easy compared to having to over come the little demons in my head everyday that try to tell me today it is ok to have a pill or two again. Everyday I have to cage them up and shut them out, and everyday I have to make a choice not two do drugs, everyday I think about them everyday at some point something happens or something reminds me of when I did drugs that makes me think I want them, and everyday I have to say no not today. Now that is hard! What is really hard is not knowing if a day where I don't have to tell myself "no not today" will ever come. It is hard knowing that I did this to myself, and that I might have to live with this everyday. It is hard to think that there might never be a day in my life again where I don't think of pills and then have to fight that thought away. Until a day comes when I don't think about it then I can do is take it one day at a time, and everyday when I think about pills tell myself "no not today". Whatever you decide to do I wish you the best of luck. You can do it, I can do it, we all can do it! Keep us posted, everybody keep us posted and I will do the same. I hope to hear from you all soon, and let me know ever if you need anything. You are all in my thoughts and in my prayers. Stay strong and be well. Tyler

     
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    Old 10-15-2007, 10:43 PM   #38
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    Re: Quicksand: My addiction story

    Hey diezel - and everyone else

    Sorry its taken me so long to reply. I've been having a really hard time with my other situation (cervical and uterine cancer). I've been so sick these past few days (throwing up profusely, no energy, can't eat etc) that I can barely get out of bed to come to the computer. My hubby is getting me a laptop so I can keep up with my emails and with this board. I've really missed you all

    I don't want to get into my personal situation too much - as this board doesn't really allow it, so I'll just say quickly that I'm not doing so well, appt didn't go well, infection is still very prominent so I'm sorta on hold for the time being. My oncologist has booked me for another day surgery (cryotherapy) to remove the cells once more and give my body a chance to fight off this infection (with anti-biotics, of course) before they return again.

    As for my addiction (yep, thats why we're all here lol), I've hit a plateau for now... My doctor wants me to stay on 40mgs for a few weeks until this other stuff is cleared. Normally, I'd question his motives however, I feel its the best situation for me - as I'm just at my wits end. I have been having a pity-party lately "Why me? What else can go wrong? What did I do to deserve all this?" You know, all the "what if's" and "why did I let this happen?" Blah blah blah. I'll get over it soon, in fact, I think I'm almost over it. I just can't stop wondering why one person can have so much on their plate. I know people say "things happen for a reason" and "you'll be stronger in the end" but I just can't seem to stay positive anymore I've been crying my heart out and just want to curl into a ball and sleep for a few weeks.

    Has anyone else been in this situation? I feel like I'm taking it to extremes and I need some encouragement I need to hear those words from someone else - that I'm not alone - that I'm not the only one who has ever felt this way. It just seems like its WAY too much

    The other day, my five year old daughter said to me "Mommy, I still love you even though you can't take me to the park." I lost it. I got out of bed, got dressed and took my daughter to the park. Well, I wasn't there 15 minutes - all of a sudden my head was spinning and I started throwing up. I had to call my mom from my cell and ask her to come get us. Another woman had to help me get back up and over to a bench. I pushed myself because I felt SO guilty. I just have to find a way to be stronger - emotionally and mentally - yet accept the fact that I CAN'T be physically.

    I read your quicksand story (the original ) this morning... I read it a few times and realized that I'm never going to be "that" person again. I wanted to make a call SO bad - get some pills and feel human again. I knew I would feel great, but for how long and for how much? I can't and won't let it happen! My life is just too important to me. My life = my husband, my daughters, my friends, my family, my dreams, my goals, my future!!!

    I'm so grateful to have you all to write to. I'm so grateful to have your encouraging replies. I just wish I knew how to stay positive when I get those phone calls from my doctors I have tried SO many times to say "It could be worse" or "Someone would give their left arm to trade positions with me," however something keeps happening to me when I receive more bad news... I fall deeper and deeper into this horrible depression.

    I've been fortunate enough to have my mom around me. She takes my girls whenever I need time alone. She thinks its because I'm upset that I have cancer at age 31. She has no idea about my addiction. I'm not ready to tell her just yet - but I feel so guilty that I haven't. Am I wrong to keep this from certain people? Am I a coward for not telling my own mother??

    I am going to get some sleep - its 1:30am and I have to get up early for a doctors appt. I genuinely hope everyone is doing well - please let me know if I'm a basket-case or if this is completely normal. I just need to know - one way or the other. Maybe, if I'm going to extremes and someone points it out, then I'll just have to smarten up lol, a good ole' kick in the arse.

    With love and hugs,
    emsmom

     
    Old 10-16-2007, 04:23 AM   #39
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    Re: Quicksand: My addiction story

    Dear ems mom,
    You just break my heart. You have every right to have a big pity party with the health issues you are dealing with along with little girls saying things that break your heart. The rest of us are having pity parties simply because of our addictions and look what you are dealing with. I assume that besides surgery, you are getting chemo and possibly radiation? I've know too many people with all kinds of cancers and you amaze me with your will to quit the addiction. My Mom and the rest of my family do not know of mine and I don't blame you for not telling Mom. I imagine she is in agony for you because of the cancer and it may upset her more. Although, she may not give a crap about the addiction until you get over the cancer as I'm sure that's her greatest wish. EMS Mom, I will keep you in my prayers. Please feel better.

    JB

     
    Old 10-16-2007, 08:41 AM   #40
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    Re: Quicksand: My addiction story

    Everyone here is so supportive and if not for that support, I don't know where we would turn. I just want to thank everyone.

    emsmom: I know exactly where you are with the guilt. But listen, I had full blown agoraphobia when my son was young, from ages 2-6 and you know what, he is FINE. The guilt I ate myself up with then was not worth it. They don't know what normal is, normal is just a mommy and daddy who love them. I dont' want to tread off too far into another subject, but know it will be fine, your kids will be fine.

    I am so sorry about your cancer. I admire your strength and will be praying for you. God never gives you more than you can handle and he sees the big picture, we only see today.

    Diezel: Thank you so much for all your kind words and support. You are a very loving, good soul and you are so needed, too bad you can't come to a real support meeting and talk face to face. I need someone like that in my life, someone who has been and is on this road. I have a ton of support, but you almost need an addicts support, ya know? Someone who truly knows not only how you feel but all the symptoms and feelings of addiction and wd's...............thanks for being faithful to us here.

    There is so much to say, but I suppose it is best to stick to topic.

    Thanks again

     
    Old 10-17-2007, 08:59 AM   #41
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    Re: Quicksand: My addiction story

    Hello all,
    emsmom, your courage amazes me. Most people would just stay doped up with good reason with your condition. But here you are in pain, and trying to get off of the pain medicine. You don't know how much that inspires me. I hope everything gets better for you soon, and just remember God has a plan.. it may not seem like it now, but he does. I'll be praying for you!!

    diezel, your encouragement makes me want to stay strong and beat this!! I've officially "graduated" from my program, I've been off of methadone for 34 days.. Now I'm on 12 mg's of sub, and will go to 10 next week.. so on until I get to 6 mgs and then go down 1 mg a week.. In your experience, will this work ok? Dr tells me if I exercise the small w/d symptoms will no be bad at all.. of course I fear the unknown, but I try to keep that beast down as I know fear can consume me. My family is so proud of me, and for that reason alone I will stay clean and sober. Take care everyone..

    Brandi

     
    Old 10-17-2007, 11:36 AM   #42
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    Re: Quicksand: My addiction story

    Thank you g8trgrl,

    That means alot - SO much - to have you say that.

    I wrote a long reply to Diezel last night, but something happened with my computer. Just as I was finishing my reply, my computer crashed and I lost everything!! I was so upset, since I had poured my heart out in a very long story. I was at my computer for over an hour, writing to you all about whats going on lately, my feelings, my depression... I was so happy with what I wrote, and now its gone lol.

    I don't have alot of time to sit and write this afternoon so I'll try again tonight. My mom is with my older daughter (she's five, in Kindergarten) on a school trip today. I was supposed to go as a volunteer, but my doctor wouldn't allow me this time (understanding of course) - so my mom took my place. I am heading to the zoo with my two year old, which has a nice playground and a small petting zoo as well I'm really looking forward to getting outside for an hour. The zoo is only a few minutes from my house, so I'll be close to home (and taking it easy). My favorite part about this park/zoo is the train ride It goes through the entire park - takes about 25 - 30 mins. Should be fun.

    So...I'll write more tonight. I hope everyone is doing well, and thank you all for reading.

    Sincerely,
    emsmom

    Last edited by emsmom; 10-17-2007 at 11:39 AM.

     
    Old 10-17-2007, 08:48 PM   #43
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    Re: Quicksand: My addiction story

    I think it is funny that when ever I post on this thread I push the quick reply button, and my post are anything but short. I would be pretty upset if I lost one of my postings after all that typing as well so I know how you feel Em. So until the last two post the more recent ones have been pretty rough and it seems like many of us our going through some pretty tough personal challenges. The cliche "when it rains it poors" is a cliche for a reason and that is because it is true. Many times in my recovery I have felt not only like it was pooring, but that I was stuck in it with out a rain coat or an umbrella. As if the task of getting sober is not hard enough everything that could go wrong in my life seemed to. Whenever I thought things could not get worse they did. When I was at my absolute lowest of lows I said to one of my best friends in the whole world, who is like a brother to me, "well bro it can't get any worse so things should go hill from here", and he answered with "you know what as bad as it seems it actually could be worse. It can always get worse." I thought about it and as I think about it now realize he is right it could always be worse. So what can you do when things are so bad that you think they could not get any worse, but know that in reality they could? I will tell you what I do, and what I have learned. I hope this helps all of you as you deal with your individual challenges. I am going to start by telling a story and will try to para phrase as much as possible, but if this post is even longer winded then usual I apologize ahead of time. Basically there are two men in the same prison. One of them has a cell with no windows, and sits and thinks everyday about how awful his situation is, and to make it worse the prisoner next to him has a window with a view. Through a small hole in the wall the prisoner with the window tells the one without a window everyday about how beautiful the sunset and sunrise is, how blue the sky is, and about the beautiful birds and other things he sees. Finally the prisoner with the window passes away, and the man without the window is going to be moved into the cell with the window. When he is finally given the cell he is extremely disappointed to find, that there is no window after all. just four stone walls exactly like the ones in his previous cell. The moral of the story is this our situations don't change so much as our perceptions do. I have come to realize that when things seem as bad as they can get the only thing I can do is change my perception of the situation I am. The two men in the story were staying in the exact same cell they were in the exact same situation, but the difference was that when one looked around he saw four stone walls, but when the other looked around he saw a window, he saw sunrises and sunsets, he saw blue skies, and beautiful birds. He changed his perception not his situation, and that made it bearable. I hope no one feels like I am trying to make light of there situation, and in fact can't not believe how well some of you are doing under the circumstances. What I am trying to say is that when things are that bad all we can really do is change our perception our attitude. Whenever I get down on myself or feel like things are pretty bad I try to change the way I am looking at things. I hope that this helps, and I am so grateful for all of you who share with me, and who allow me to share as well. Please continue to share as I will, because a problem shared is a problem halved. So the more people we share with the smaller our problems will seem. I hope you are doing well and staying on your road to recovery, if any of you ever need anything let me know. I am pretty tired and am starting to nod off as I type this, but Stay strong and be well. I will keep you all in my thoughts and prayers, and keep me posted on how you are all doing.

     
    Old 10-19-2007, 09:07 AM   #44
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    Re: Quicksand: My addiction story

    Hi diezel,

    Wow, you know...that really hit home for me. I've been sitting here moping around, miserable, and making those around me miserable as well

    I never thought, for one moment, that I could try "looking up" and try thinking of the positive part of all this. Its amazing how we perceive certain things in life. I've essentially been waiting for more bad news. Basically, every time the phone rang, I'd say "thats my doctor with more bad news." Pretty sad huh?

    I've been living in this bubble of regret and remorse. Its time for me to cheer up and look at the bright side. For example, when I was in the hospital, I was so miserable, couldn't wait to get home, so I sat there crying every minute of the day. The nurses felt sorry for me - I could see it in their eyes. My doctor kept apologizing to me for making me stay. When I finally got to go home, I was ecstatic. But...then the misery came and I fell deeper into this depression

    Thanks diezel for your encouraging words - you've helped me open my eyes to a better life, a more optimistic point of view, and a different outlook on my while situation.

    I am going to the mall for awhile I probably won't last too long, but a little "retail therapy" never hurt anyone

    All the best,
    emsmom

    Last edited by emsmom; 10-19-2007 at 09:09 AM.

     
    Old 10-22-2007, 09:41 AM   #45
    g8trgrl15
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    g8trgrl15 HB User
    Re: Quicksand: My addiction story

    Hi Em and Diezel,
    Hope both of you are doing well today.. I've found myself in a little dilemma. You know how when you are going through w/d's, you don't have any energy? Well, someone offered me a diet pill that gave me energy.. I've taken them before, no problems being addicted to them or anything there, I didn't take them every day, and could stop anytime. I just want to be careful, ya know? I don't know if taking suboxone I should not take anything else, if it will hurt me or not? I dunno. Guess I'm just a little leery of taking anything else.. Down to 10 mgs of sub.. will do that for a couple of more days then go down to 8 for a week.. and so on. I haven't really been depressed, just sort of irritated at everything. Lol.. that's so bad too! I don't like to be that way. Diezel, please keep the posts up, they are more encouraging than you could ever know.. Ems, I hope you are feeling better!

    g8trgrl

     
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