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    Old 03-18-2009, 09:12 AM   #1
    5years
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    Suboxone, suboxone...

    hey folks, i stumbled across this board & was instantly glad i did.
    Me AND the wife were hooked on oxys/tabs for 2 years, then HOOKED on suboxone for the past 3 years.
    Have tried coming off a few times in the past (unsuccessfully)
    Been on 20mg/ day forever it seems, and you can imagine what we've paid for TWO addicts on ONE income.
    Now we're at a point where we have no choice but quit or risk losing everything because i can no longer get the overtime needed to pay the wonderful doctor who'd rather we stay hooked on suboxone for the rest of our lives as long as we keep shoveling the money his way.

    So i'm posting today to share these past few weeks of tapering & hoping I can officially beat this damn disease.

    as i said earlier, have been prescribed 20mg/day for sometime now, but have taken less for the most part. On average, I was probably somewhere around 12-16mg/day for the past year.
    For the past month or two, I've been tapering down gradually.





    (THIS IS THE PART I NEED ADVICE ON)
    I eventually got my body to accept half a pill (4mg) a day for a couple weeks, then a quarter (2mg) once a day for a week or so.
    I had w/d but not unbearable.
    For the past 7 - 10 days I have only took a crumb when absolutely unbearable and have suffered non-stop the whole 7 - 10 days, but feel like I'm doing better yesterday & today.
    So my question is this: Are the worst days over or yet to come if I'm still taking a sliver of a crumb every other day or so.

    Last edited by 5years; 03-18-2009 at 09:18 AM.

     
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    Old 03-18-2009, 01:18 PM   #2
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    Re: Suboxone, suboxone...

    Trying to go from here on out with absolutely nothing.
    Should i really go & get the clonidine filled? Don't remember it helping at all before. Would love to get some opinions on all o' this.

    Thanks in advance of course

     
    Old 03-18-2009, 02:33 PM   #3
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    Re: Suboxone, suboxone...

    5years. I never took SUB but was on 100mg of OXY just a few weeks ago. I have vast knowledge on all this OPIATE stuff and one thing I do know is that SUB really sticks to the opiate receptors and the WD symptoms linger for a while. --HOW long has it been that you have taken the little pieces or crumbles? The hard truth is that your body will continue to have WD symptoms as long as you are feeding it an opiate even just a little. I learned that the hard way last week. Take a peek at my HOW I GOT OFF OXY thread. It shows that I CT from the oxy and used a dinky little bit of codeine to help me with the withdrawals and it wasnt till I was 6 days TOTALLY clean (no codeine or any opiate at all) that I started to feel better. So, that is the hard truth, sorry. BUTTTTTTTTT --YOU HAVE COME SO FAR. Do not stop now. Just hunker down and get through this! NO OPIATES! You can do it.

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    Old 03-18-2009, 09:03 PM   #4
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    Re: Suboxone, suboxone...

    thanks. Yes, Im finding this out thr hard way too. Kinda makes me sick that i went a whole week feeling miserable for nothing. Guess i was hoping that the w/d would be a little easier if i totally stopped after taking crumbs for awhile rather than stopping cold turkey. Maybe it has been, i'm not sure. But thanks again. 2 days TOTALLY clean. Where's my time capsule?

    Last edited by mod-anon; 03-18-2009 at 11:31 PM. Reason: Please use the Quick Reply button instead of Quote Reply.

     
    Old 03-19-2009, 09:48 AM   #5
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    Re: Suboxone, suboxone...

    This is just a suggestion why don't you try doing it every other day. So your body can get used to going without the drugs then continue the taper every 2 days etc. Just a suggestion it might be easier this way. I know some ppl on this board who did it that way. Also are you involved in any kind of support system. It has helped me immensely. I have to tell you I am very proud of your drive you don't know it yet but you are a real success story. Cutting down the way you have!!!! You are an inspiration to us all. Stay Clean & Sober & Stand Tall we are all proud of you!!

    Lori

     
    Old 03-19-2009, 08:57 PM   #6
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    Re: Suboxone, suboxone...

    3 days with nothing = feeling horrible, but i keep telling myself that it would've been much worse had i not tapered. Too late to change plans now, I WILL NOT START THIS ALL OVER AGAIN! I've been an addict far too long, & i think my mind is finally where i need it to be.

    Today was very bad. No sleep last night (nonstop twisting, turning, stretching & cramping). Finally fell asleep 9:30 this morning, had to go to back to work today at 2. Thank God i've got a job now that i can take care of myself if i need to. (lots of hiding!)
    i still don't know if the clonidine helps anything or not. That insane panic feeling in the center of my chest has subsided a little but maybe it would've anyhow. Probably gonna lose some weight, forced myself to eat one time today & couldn't finish.
    This is the hardest thing i've ever had to do in my life and i've had some hard times before. I've held back the tears all day long, but i'm farther than i've ever been and i absolutely refuse to give in. I've only got one 8mg sub left anywho (been tapering the wife with whats left hoping that i'm over the hump when she starts)((she'd NEVER do it unless i do it 1st)).

    Anyway, thanks for the replies. This helps more than you'd ever know. Thanks for listening. and btw, we stopped counseling a long time ago.

     
    Old 03-20-2009, 06:54 AM   #7
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    Re: Suboxone, suboxone...

    Hi 5, just went through the whole thing with suboxone 2 months ago. I took my last addicted dose Friday, January 22, 2009. Why this day? My prescript was to be picked up that day and the whole cycle would begin again. I was done! I realized that I could not live the life I wanted always being focussed on my next pill. Anyway, doesn't matter. We can save those stories for the campfire.
    I'm sure right now you would just appreciate some real info. I'll share what I know from my experience with this stuff and how I came off of it. Maybe it will help you.
    I remember the first three days being ok. I was missing the level of high that I was use to. As I later learned, the level of drug in my body was still pretty high even after 3 days.
    At the time of my last dose I was still taking 4mgs around noon everyday. That's about the time of day I would begin to feel my system wanting a bit and in need of it's fix. Day 3 was also the day I could first tell that "oh sheet", this is going to be a long hard ride.
    The question of tapering really came into play here.
    I think day 4 I was totally consumed with the thought that I should taper instead of cold turkey. Was I crazy? Was I a total lunatic? Why should I stop c/t and suffer? Is it really necessary to suffer? I can do this different I felt.
    THANK GOD FOR MY WIFE! and her ability to keep me focussed. Her ability to not whimp out. Her shere determination to get her husband back or let him die ( just joking ). But really, she continued to remind me that after 4 days, now going on 5, there was no turning back! Things continued to progress and of course the suffing continued to get worst.
    Here is some of what I began to experience early on.
    - no appitite, none.
    - no sleep for any length of time, at this stage an hour or two at most.
    - my whole body began to ache, I mean really ache all over.
    - my hair, skin, eyes began to have this really weird burning, especially against the sheets or blankets.
    - I began to get diarrhea and bad stomach cramps.
    - my whole attitude was progressively becoming more emotional, angry then sad, like a rollercoaster, humorous then very serious. I was not in control!
    - figiddy, I don't know, is that a word? up, down, in, out, I could not sit still.
    - energy? what energy? besides not being able to sleep this was the worst of all! No, absolutely, no energy. If I had to defend myself in any way at this time I could not, period.
    What a dilema. Can't be still, have no energy to do anything but exist, tired as hell, can't sleep, no appitite, need to eat, loosing weight. Feel like anything would be better than this hell I'm in!
    From day 6 to about day 15, all of these symptoms continue to get worst, then better, then worst. Each day that goes by though, I become a little stronger mentally and more determined.
    Emotionally, I'm not in control, a total wreck but, I know this so, I just let it be. This part is a little funny to me now looking back. I felt and acted like Robert DeNiro in the movie Analize That.
    I'm sure I have left some of the hell out from my description above. What I wish to say now is that I made it through and you can too. It is what it is. It's kind of like jumping into a very cold pool of water. You grab your nose and jump in, knowing that it will hurt and you are going to get wet and cold. But, the sooner you get in and get out, the sooner you will begin to dry off and warm up!
    Some things I did and some suggestions that I believe may help.
    I asked for help from someone I could trust. For me I was lucky to have my wife. Others will work, a good friend, brother, sister.......
    Put this person in charge and do not do anything without their knowledge and approval.
    You can not trust yourself !!! You are not in control no matter what you think.
    This is where people in rehab fail. They begin to think they are in control before they are through. AND you are never through! It is a work in progress and you will begin to take back control of your life's choices, little by little but, you are not and never have been in control.
    You will come to realize that you only have choices, focus on your choices and don't waste your time on control issues.
    You and your "partner in crime" come up with a plan and stick to it. Write it all down and use a calendar to keep track of the days.
    I wrote everything in my journal. Some days pages of writing, some days just a few words.
    (enrty from day 13, " today sucks ! ") This helped get things off my chest, so to speak.
    It takes discipline, a good starting point and takes little energy. Very theraputic.
    I made myself eat. oatmeal, cereals, fruits, vegetables, fish, nuts, chicken, lots of protien and protein supplements.
    Vitamins, natual supplements, Imodium, Ibuprophen, meletonin, valerian root.
    There is much more you can take. You can spend hundreds of dollars and at this point you will because if there is anything you could buy to make you feel better, well, you get my drift. I took what I had. I'm not from Beverly Hills.
    I tried to exersice, no real luck, just did not feel up to it. It took everything I had just to maintaine my existance.
    Hot baths good for the legs. I wanted to cut my legs off and be done with them!
    Hot baths good for sleep. I slept in the tub, sitting up many nights.
    Valerian root helped with the jitters.
    Meletonin helped with sleep, I think?
    Food and eating definitely helped with overall recovery.
    Fresh air and sun made me feel better I think. I sat like a toad outside in the sun when I could.
    To sum up.
    It was a personal walk through hell.
    Suboxone withdrawls, physically more difficult than any other withdrawls I have been through before on other opiates. Mentally, easier. I don't know if it was easier because I was ready or the drug itself made it easier, because of it's design.
    Maybe both?
    In all I think for me it took about 20 days before I felt like I was rebounding and on my way up. The emotional rollercoaster continued pretty good for another 20 days, then began to level off.
    I feel pretty strong now both physically and mentally. I put back the 20 pounds I had lost and I now feel like excersizing and have a routine. I strongly recommend mental excersizes too. Meds dull our brains! Emotionally and spiritually, I feel like I am just beginning.
    I think I finally understand what a long road this is. Even though addicts may consider their addictions an accident or whatever, it is no accident or whatever.
    Your planets have to align AND for some reason our planets aligned. That is why we are here. We contributed to this alignment by the choices we have made and even though we do not control the universe we have influence.
    I am glad you have made the choice you have, to get off dependency. Life on drugs is tough to say the least. Much tougher than withdrawls. I hope I could help in any small way. I try to find value in the suffering of my experiences during withdrawls by sharing them with others who are going through addiction and/or withdrawls.
    Life is for the giving. Good luck and blessings.

     
    Old 03-20-2009, 09:39 AM   #8
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    Re: Suboxone, suboxone...

    Hey 5,

    Welcome! I have never had experience with this drug but I wanted to say hello and welcome. I am Secrets, nice to meet you!

    I wish you great success on your journey to sobriety!
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    Old 03-21-2009, 04:23 PM   #9
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    Re: Suboxone, suboxone...

    Subtrain, it really bummed me out when i read ur post. 20 + days???
    You broke it down so detailed & it was EXACTLY the same with me those first few days so after reading ur post, i was not very happy.

    UPDATE: still not sleeping, slept a grand total of about 40 minutes last night. had to work 12 hours today with about 3 hours sleep in 3 or 4 days. i was expecting the worst.
    Well, here i am 5 days in and I FEEL ALMOST GOOD AGAIN! that might change tomorrow but for now i'm pretty excited. Forced myself to eat this morning, then eat again a few hours later. actually had alot of energy comparred to the past few days of non-existence. still havin some trouble with the legs and hands. (keep wanting to bend my hands as hard as i can to get em to stop whatever they're doing) but as long as i'm doing something, it's not so bad. the legs wanna wake up when i try to go to sleep so i'm really hoping i can sleep tonight. still a little anxious, jittery (really think the clonidine helps this)

    Anyway, no turning back however long this takes.

     
    Old 03-21-2009, 05:36 PM   #10
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    Re: Suboxone, suboxone...

    CONGRATULATIONS! While I haven't been posting here because I don't have experience with Oxy or Sub, I have been reading your thread over the past few days and cheering for you. It's amazing to turn that corner; even if you're not feeling great, the relief of it being so much better than it has been feels like a strange euphoria!

    Keep going, keep staying strong. You should be so proud of yourself!

    Holly

     
    Old 03-21-2009, 09:58 PM   #11
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    Re: Suboxone, suboxone...

    Hey 5, I can't be much help, but try potassium for the restless leg syndrome. That is horrible. I never really had it during detox, but had it horribly during a hard time I was having a few years back ( had a 2nd trimester miscarriage) There is also a prescription medication you can use too, not sure of the name, but I heard it works good as well.

     
    Old 03-23-2009, 04:20 AM   #12
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    Re: Suboxone, suboxone...

    well, tomorrow will be one whole week. feeling a little better everyday i think. sleeping a little longer every night. still have fatigue & some jitters in my chest & stomach. but for the most part, i think i'm officially over the hump.
    Good luck to everyone on this board. thanks for everything.

     
    Old 03-23-2009, 07:00 AM   #13
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    Re: Suboxone, suboxone...

    indeed you are over that hump my friend.....hey, whats a few jitters compared to a few days ago, huh? great job.

    Last edited by mod-anon; 03-24-2009 at 12:15 AM. Reason: removed quote

     
    Old 03-23-2009, 07:44 AM   #14
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    Re: Suboxone, suboxone...

    Hi 5, my sincere apologies. I did not intend to bum you out. Everyone is different in sum respects. You could blow through in half the time it took me. Many different variables effect the whole proccess. I'm glad to here you are doing better now. 1 week tomorrow, no turning back is right! Just stay on target.
    My point in being so detailed in my reply was that as I began w/ds from subox I wanted to know everything. I remember wanting to know exactly what to expect, that was important, real important. I think it helped me in the long run because I could prepare. I knew I was going to feel like hell or worst. I wanted to know "how long?" Withdrawls for me from oxys took about 10 days, piece of cake compared to the subox, which took twice as long for me. I didn't suffer the emotional rollercoaster going through oxy w/ds. Hell, I'm still, to a small degree, going up and down emotionally after suboxone.
    You seem very strong in your determination at this point. I pray for your continued success and a speedy recovery in total. Good luck 5 and many blessings.

     
    Old 03-23-2009, 07:55 AM   #15
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    Re: Suboxone, suboxone...

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by milksnake View Post
    indeed you are over that hump my friend.....hey, whats a few jitters compared to a few days ago, huh? great job.
    for sure, those first 4 days were insane. Thanks!

     
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