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staceyy
12-29-2003, 04:48 AM
I come here every day I love comming here you guys have so much heart so I hope know one gets pived at me for what I need to say. I am not going to preted that I know every thing because I don't and I have said it befor maybe I have no room to talk because I take benzo's to sleep but I don't think all the advice on useing other narcotics to kick just so you won't feel what god has intended you to feel is just wrong (personal opinion!) When I got clean it was the hardest thing I will ever do I my life and I had friends who helped me But they were hard core recovered addicts not thing for me! but I had hit bottom I was looking at my fourth term in the joint and I was not going back and I was willing to do anything! It just seems to me like it is trading one addiction for another. Am I wrong about that? :wave: and remember this is just my opinion.
Goddess Bless You All
Stacey

John 808
12-29-2003, 05:16 AM
What are you talking about- trading one narcotic for another? The sub? I will respond to you when I am sure if you are referring to the sub.

Michelle

staceyy
12-29-2003, 06:22 AM
John what I mean is trading vicodin for somas, xanxe,valum all atr narcotics are'nt they? It just leads to an addiction to another pill. I mean that is what I have been told that is why after my surgery I did not take the vicodin I was give or the ultram If I am wrong I am sorry like I said just what I've heard
Goddess bless
Stacey

greymatter
12-29-2003, 06:54 AM
Michelle, I m pretty sure she is talking about sub, or methadone etc... - but I may be wrong. Hope you are doing well as you have inspired me to stay clean many times over the last several months. (It's almost a year!)

Stacey
Everyone has there own experience and their own opinion. No one here should judge you or I believe will. However others have there own beliefs and there own ways of doing things. I went cold turkey off a severe 4 year opiate habit and have also taken occasional Benzos (including Ambien) for sleep since. I felt the week to two of severe physical and mental withdrawals and that was my journey. Others have different reasons for not wanting to take that route. I am not going to judge them on their reasons be them fear, time, job, life, or whatever.

You and I are clean. I don't take drugs when they are not absolutely necessary (even otc's), to get high or escape, my bank account is no longer being drained, I am no longer perpetuating lie after lie to feed my addiction and, in turn, I am being honest and true to my life, those who love me and myself. And I got there my own way. Others have done differently at times and if it has worked for them or is working for them, I will not judge.

I hope you continue your journey successfully and even if you continue to disagree with the way some others handle their addiction, make sure you remember that everyone here supports you no matter what, because your opinon does matter. We can all give advice as to what worked for us, but in the end as I'm sure you know, it is up to that person to decide for themselves when, and how to get clean, and most importantly, if and how they are going to stay that way.

And on a personal note, I enjoy your saying 'Goddess Bless'. I have read The Da Vinci Code and while I realize the book is a fictional thriller and I am not sure exactly where my spirituality lies, there is no question in my mind that throughout history the 'Sacred Feminine' has been horribly supressed.

So dark the con of man.

Take care both Michelle and Stacey

grey

Philster2003
12-29-2003, 07:15 AM
Stacy;

Agree to disagree with you on your opinion. In my opinion it is not trading when you use the supplementary drugs for a short duration (3-5 days) to help mitigate some of the withdrawal side effects. I also think you can probably get into some very deep philosophical discussion related to the use of supplementary meds in treating and detoxing from opiates. Also, no matter how many benzo's or clonidine or Soma or whatever you consider helpful (outside using Sub or Methadone) you will still feel the pain of withdrawal; and that pain is not necessarily a bad thing to feel; as previously stated. Kind of a reminder of the "dark" side. I would also like to add while opiates were an incredible high for me benzo's did absolutely nothing for me and when you are in full withdrawal you are probably not going to equate any effects from benzos as being pleasant. Just because a drug is addictive does it equate to a person getting addicted to them with short term use as many folks may be predisposition or susceptible to one particular drug family (opiates, benzoís, nicotine, muscle relaxers, sleep aids, etcÖ)

JMHO but as long as the supplementary meds are used short term then itís perfectly acceptable.

As long as the end result is drug free and the use is meds to help is short term no harm no foul in my book but itís perfectly OK to disagree with me. I know what worked for me and others and I know what worked for you and the end result is the same, which is goodness.

Be good

phil

John 808
12-29-2003, 07:20 AM
Stacey,

Soma is not a narcotic- it is a muscle relaxant. Xanax and valium are neither narcotics- they belong to the "benzo family-" which is a central nervous system depressant. Ambien is not a narcotic- it is a hypnotic sedative. They are all controlled substances but none of these you mentioned are narcotics. I firmly believe that if one needs the the aid of any of these drugs to help withdrawals, then so be it- being that is for the purpose of getting through the withdrawals and used for a short period of time. Unless ofcourse, you have been diagnosed with something from a doctor that requires this medication to be taken daily or as needed. For example, I have been diagnosed with anxiety disorder and have to take Xanax daily. It has been a lifesaver for me. I do not abuse this drug and take it exactly as prescribed- am very careful with it as I know the addiction potential.

I believe whatever route a person choses to take to get themselves clean- being with using sub, methadone, cold-turkey with aids from other medications is their choice and should be applauded for taking the step to getting their life back in order. I don't think someone should have to hit rock bottom, although it may take that for alot of people to realize they have a problem, but I realized I had a problem and I never really hit rock bottom. I mean, I didn't lose my family or steal or get arrested or whatever. I just realized I needed help and choose to get it through subutex. If someone can avoid putting their bodies through physical hell then, YEAH for them. No one wants to have to experience that and just because someone may not, doesn't mean they aren't really getting clean. Does that make sense? Granted, I will eventually have to come off the sub and that make not be fun for me physically- from what I have been hearing...it is pretty tough. I'll cross that bridge when I get there.

I am proud for your success and hope that you can continue to stay clean as it is a daily battle each of us face!

God Bless,
Michelle

Banker
12-29-2003, 01:02 PM
Staceyy - Thank you for stating your opinion. I think we all do a good job in valuing everyone's opinion here. However, I would like to say that feeling the pain of withdrawing doesn't mean that it is going to make someone stay off of drugs. I can't tell you how many times I went through withdrawals after withdrawals and continued to go get more drugs after 5 days, 2 weeks or even 6 weeks. The point is, you forget about how bad you felt or you don't care because your primary focus is getting high. Some people (and I was one of them) feel like the trade off was worth it. One or two weeks taking 20 lortabs a day and then 4 days of pure hell. I don't think it matters how much pain you feel when you're withdrawing and considering this is a disease, if you can make a person feel as comfortable as possible, then I think it's only humane. What do you recommend for someone who is a single parent and has small children to take care of, i.e. getting them to school, getting to work, cooking dinner, bathing everyone, washing clothes and so on. What if they have nobody to help them take care of the kids? What do you think they should do during withdrawals?

I believe I have addressed your issue. Are you saying that someone using Suboxone/Subutex and Methadone are wrong for not just stopping drugs without any other medication? Remember, not all medication is bad. I believe if a person can be made more comfortable during withdrawals by taking a specific type of medication, why not take it? The pain of withdrawals are not the primary reason someone decides to stay off of drugs. It may play a small role, but not the only role. Again, I've gone through withdrawals so many times I can't count them all and I continued to use and abuse as much as I could get my hands on. I knew that after I went through all of the lortabs, that I would be sick but I didn't care. I just wanted the high!! This is just my experience and I respect your opinion. One additional comment, if I had not got on Suboxone exactly one month ago today, I would still be abusing lortabs, hurting my family, spending all of my money (and I have kids to feed), and all of the other horrible things that go along with abusing drugs.