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View Full Version : Giving Up On Trazodone !!!!


kindaunwell
12-30-2003, 06:46 AM
goodmorning to all !!!,

Well, I just spent another sleeplees night here on the couch.I have absolutely "no desire" to go to sleep. That is why I stay out here in the living room, so at least my wife isn`t disturbed by all my moving around and wanting to talk all night long. But, she still complains that it doesn't feel right, without me laying down next to her. Amongst all my other complaints, that on top of my list too!!!!
I just finished my 9 day of using TRAZODONE! 3days at 100mg., 3days at 150mg., and the last 3days at 200mg. all taken around normal bedtime.
This is going into 5th week of this Insomnia, ( only 2 maybe 3 hours sleep around this time of day ). But on alot of days I have morning DR. appts. and other appts., so I will go for 36-40 hours straight without even a nap.(like my good old Army days ha,ha)
I am about to call the doctor up, and let him know that the Trazodone didn't work any better than that Ambien...I am starting to feel that "grogyness--slow mind and reflexes, that some of you said I might get from triing that Trazodone!! Even though I am on day 16 of the 21 day wean-down program from originally being given Kolonopin, Catapress, and 2mg of xanax I feel absolutely calm, cool, but wide awake all the time now. I still haven't taken a pain pill of any type in over a month now, and I feel no craving to do so. (guess I am very lucky in that regard!!)
What do you'll think about this ???. Well, time to make that phone call now..... SEE Ya !!

Kinda-unwell

yinksy
12-30-2003, 07:52 AM
Kinda

Sorry I have not been following your story. But - you seem to be quitting the use of benzos? Viz, xanax and klonopin?
I tapered off ativan this year by first substituting valium (longer half life) and then tapering down the valium very slowly. It took me 7 months to come down from 30 mg valium (equivalent to 3 mg ativan or1.5 mg of xanax or 1.5 mg of klonopin).
It was a difficult time - but the greatest and most lingering of all the withdrawals was insomnia. The insomnia plagued me for the best part of 4 months after quitting finally, but I am now 6 months off and sleeping well again. By insomnia - I mean that some nights (or days) I did not sleep at all - on others - the maximum I managed was 3 hours from about midnight until 3.00 am when I was wide awake again. It was very debilitating and I got very depressed. All I can advise is giving it time. Seems to me like you are reducing these drugs at a very fast rate. But you dont seem to complain of other withdrawal symptoms and so you may just be very lucky. My advice would be to take no further medications but to let your body and mind adjust. This it will do in time. I wouldnt recommend the use of trazodone or any other drugs during this period of adjustment.
I wish you well - it appears that you are doing remarkably well - just give it some more time? These are strong psychotropic drugs - they alter brain chemistry - it takes time for the adjustments. Your brain will sleep when it has to - it has failsafe mechanims for survival!
Good luck - I will follow your journey with interest!
Never lose hope or give up - if I can do it - then anyone can!!!!
yinksy

Happy Father
12-30-2003, 09:12 AM
wow Trazadone puts me out ASAP and is totally non addictive.......Good luck friend.

Jennita
12-30-2003, 12:02 PM
This is classic benzodiazepine withdrawal. It can last long, but it will definately go away...taking other prescription meds may delay it, other than the antihistamine group, which is fairly harmless and won't delay recovery from benzos. But OTC antihistamines work only sometimes. I think they have prescription antihistamines which could be used short-term. Also, chammomile tea triple bagged, and a calcium supplement might help. Sometimes a tylenol may drop body temperature to induce a bit of sleep. But nothing will work better than prescription drug-free time, although it is frustrating to wait through! :yawn:

willow123
12-30-2003, 04:39 PM
Tell Your Doc To Give You Halcion ...it Works You Will Sleep Or Restoril

yinksy
12-31-2003, 09:15 AM
Halcion is now banned in the UK. Causes memory blackouts and is highly addicitve.
FWIW - I agree with jennita in this - I reckon you should cut the use of all chemicals now and allow your brain and body to heal. It will - just give it some time. Dont invite further addictions.

kindaunwell
12-31-2003, 07:02 PM
Hi,yinksy,HappyFather,Jennita willow123

MY doctor prescribed for me
Ativam (Lorazeppam ) at one or two tablets (1 mg. Each ). He only prescribed for 5 days worth. He feels that is enough time to see whether or not this med will work on me . And if not, that amount is not enough time to become addicted to or dependent on. I took 2 pills last night,along with valrium(SP)root and meletonin.I also drank a cup of "sleepy-time" tea.I slept for 6 and1/2 hours!!!! thats the most in quite along time. I might have slept even longer, but I was awoken by a terrible cramp in my left leg. Whata hurtful way to wake up. I still have some Lidoderm patches left and when I put it on the two worst places it stopped the pain almost immediately.
I have 4 days left,out of a 21 day wean-down process,that will put an end to my Kolonopin,catapres and xanax taking. I didn't really feel they helped me very much. I feel very much normal and am not expirencing any type of widrawals. So far,so good! I only took them once before, and I over-medicated myself. I went through 90 pills of both xanax and Kolonopin in 14 days!!The pharmicist said I should Of been dead or at least in a coma! and i still could not fall sleep. Strange, but True!!!!!!!
Pretty much the same thing (no sleep ) when he tried me on Ambien, restoril and this last one Trzadone (200mg. )

Jennita
01-02-2004, 12:37 AM
I don't know how Ativan will help, except cause more dependancy...it is in the same drug class as Xanax and Klonopin. You already have developed what sounds like severe tolerance to these types of meds. Your brain not only can't make the chemicals to sleep as a result but the brain has been fighting the chemicals by setting up tolerance, which is creating more excitatory chemicals. Look up benzo withdrawal to find sites explaining this, and the Ashton Manual.

What you read on those sites will sound a bit scary, but it isn't a permanent condition. With time and lots of patience, your brain will learn to sleep again. The drugs, however, should always be weaned off very slowly; starting/stopping abruptly can cause longer withdrawals and might be dangerous to boot. Good luck.

mdla
01-02-2004, 01:57 AM
Halcion is what Burt Reynolds was on when he suffered from severe TMJ pain, he had to go to detox

Be careful with the Ambien too, Im SOOO addicted to that I cant even nap without it,

kindaunwell
01-04-2004, 01:37 PM
Kinda

Sorry I have not been following your story. But - you seem to be quitting the use of benzos? Viz, xanax and klonopin?
I tapered off ativan this year by first substituting valium (longer half life) and then tapering down the valium very slowly. It took me 7 months to come down from 30 mg valium (equivalent to 3 mg ativan or1.5 mg of xanax or 1.5 mg of klonopin).
It was a difficult time - but the greatest and most lingering of all the withdrawals was insomnia. The insomnia plagued me for the best part of 4 months after quitting finally, but I am now 6 months off and sleeping well again. By insomnia - I mean that some nights (or days) I did not sleep at all - on others - the maximum I managed was 3 hours from about midnight until 3.00 am when I was wide awake again. It was very debilitating and I got very depressed. All I can advise is giving it time. Seems to me like you are reducing these drugs at a very fast rate. But you dont seem to complain of other withdrawal symptoms and so you may just be very lucky. My advice would be to take no further medications but to let your body and mind adjust. This it will do in time. I wouldnt recommend the use of trazodone or any other drugs during this period of adjustment.
I wish you well - it appears that you are doing remarkably well - just give it some more time? These are strong psychotropic drugs - they alter brain chemistry - it takes time for the adjustments. Your brain will sleep when it has to - it has failsafe mechanims for survival!
Good luck - I will follow your journey with interest!
Never lose hope or give up - if I can do it - then anyone can!!!!
yinksy


HI, yinksy,
Its been a couple days since we last posted to each other ,and I wanted to let you know how my "pill taking and insomnia" have been doing...
When I called my Doctor and told him the TRAZODONE didn't seem to be helping (it was at 200mg) it seemed to be giving me severe head aches he suggested triing ativan (lorazepam,1mg.). take two at bedtime. He only called into the pharmacy a 5day emergency amount. He told me that wouuld be enough time to see if it worked for me, but not enough pills to get me dependant on ,or to have withdrawals from.
well, they did seem to work, cause that first and second night ,I got about 6 and a half hours of straight sleep. Boy, did that feel good! the third and fourth night I got about 5 hours of sleep. And yesterday afternoon I was feeling tired, so I only took 1 pill (1mg.) around 5:00pm, and my wife woke me up from laying on the couch, and went right back to sleep in our bedroom ,and didn't wake up until about 7:00 AM !!!>>>> thats like 14 hours STRAIGHT SLEEP! i GUESS MY BODY REALLY NEEDED THAT AFTER SO MANY DAYS-WEEKS OF ONLY GETTING 2,MAYBE 3 HOURS OF SLEEP. I Have one pill remaining that I DON'T plan on taking tonight. I want to see if my body and mind can do it naturally like it use to!
By the way, yesterday, was the last day of my weaning off program of that XANAX, KOLONOPIN,and CATAPRES. AS of today, I am "Pill Free" !!!! Now, I guess>>> we will see what happens...... After being on so many pills (there were a series of Pain Pills, I just recently got over, hydros, oxys ,fentanal patches,ect., its been 30 something days clean for them!) for so long>>>YEARS, it feels great not having any pill bottles on my desk, or charts to remember which ones i took and when. All I have left now IS 20mg. of CELEXA taken once in the morning. <<<< Next,I will start to try and stop (WEAN- DOWN) from them ,and that will be that, as they say!!!! Maybe 2004 will really be "MY YEAR !!!!!......
Anyway, yinksy, that brings you up to date on my "PILL" life. If you can find the time (I know we are all so busy nowadays ), please post to me and let me know how you are doing>>>>for better or worst, and I will always respond to you.....

Take Good Care,

(use to be) Kinda-unwell

yinksy
01-04-2004, 02:23 PM
Hello Kinda-unwell,
Nice to hear from you. You have made an astoundingly good recovery, I think! I suspected that the pain pills would have been the easiest to get off - all over in 5 to 7 days - but I really thought you might have more trouble with the benzos. But you seem to have a well clued up doctor? So you are free now of all the benzos from ativan to xanax etc. WONDERFUL! Only the celexa to taper off now. Well, Kindaunwell - you have done pure dead brill! (as we say here!). My only warning is: its easy to get off but much more difficult to stay off! How about some sort of support group - like NA?AA or any addiction group?
Its so good that you are not having insomnia (from which I suffer from time to time) - as it is so depressing.
Hey kindaunwell - yours is a wonderful and inspiring story - you will help so many on these boards.
I wish you just all you wish for yourself in this coming year!
yinksy

kindaunwell
01-04-2004, 03:30 PM
Hello Kinda-unwell,
Nice to hear from you. You have made an astoundingly good recovery, I think! I suspected that the pain pills would have been the easiest to get off - all over in 5 to 7 days - but I really thought you might have more trouble with the benzos. But you seem to have a well clued up doctor? So you are free now of all the benzos from ativan to xanax etc. WONDERFUL! Only the celexa to taper off now. Well, Kindaunwell - you have done pure dead brill! (as we say here!). My only warning is: its easy to get off but much more difficult to stay off! How about some sort of support group - like NA?AA or any addiction group?
Its so good that you are not having insomnia (from which I suffer from time to time) - as it is so depressing.
Hey kindaunwell - yours is a wonderful and inspiring story - you will help so many on these boards.
I wish you just all you wish for yourself in this coming year!
yinksy


HI yinksy,
So kind of you to reply so fast!! Is it late over there in the U.K., or are you having another "insomnia" night???
I know exactly what you mean when you say the physical withdrawals hurt bad enough, to get them over with, but even if you're lucky enough to have a good and slow taper, like me >>>>> the hardest part comes now (and maybe for always) , when it comes down to having strong willpower!!! Even though it has been about 35 days since I came off Pain Pills(a 5 day de-tox in hospital) they gave me 3 times day something called a Methadone Cocktail with some other stuff added to it that the doctor wouldn't tell me what it was because he said he was in the process of "pattening(sp) it. The first day or two ,I still needed a couple shots of Demerol(low dosage, i'm sure), but by the fourth and fifth day ,I was walking around the hospital like I own it(ha,ha) I even was taking two showers a day , shaving clean-faced, and even helping the staff when they would let me.The doctor released me with a script for 5 day wean-down to come off the methadone , and I had no physical problems....But as you said ,Once in a while I think about the high I use to get from the hydros, mostly the oxycontins, and even the Fentanal patches(at one point I got a double script for 50ug/h and 75ug/h, and I use to cut the 75's open and suck and lick all that 72 hour medicine out all at once!<< Boy did that ever send me on a Rush and knock me down on my butt!!<<<I think of it now and it makes me sick...) . But whenever those "bad thoughts" comes, I make myself busy (exercise if possible) and they pass soon enough. Besides ,I seem to have found a new kind of 'High" called Life, and I really am enjoying it!!!
I know ,as you said, I probally should be attending
some type of N/A meetings ,but I don't know if I would fit in there.I'm basically quiet(except on the Web, as you can see by the lengths of my posts,ha,ha) but maybe I should look into it. Its hard to tell people you love,and may have hurted durring my drug years, how I feel and weather or not they CAN ACTUALLY UNDERSTAND.
Sometimes it takes a "FORMER" druggie to know "EXACTLY" how and what I feel, and what kind of emotions I am still feeling. YEAH, maybe I just might go to one of them meetings afterall???.......

Anyway yinksy, "thanks" for responding to me. You must be "one of the Good Guys (GALS) from the other side of the "POND" !!!
Take Care,and feel free to post me whenever you feel like it.....

Kinda-unwell

Smile4uhun
01-06-2004, 10:52 AM
I have serious insomnia problems, I am bi-polar and manic depressive, and take Trazodone...I am on 300 mgs. a night, but in the past was on 500 mgs. a night (I stopped taking it for a few years). Trazodone as explained by both Pscyhiatrist and PCP is NON addictive and can be raised. Discuss your situation with your healthcare provider.

Ambien is for short term usage. I was on that when I first started back getting help after thinking I was fine with the all of the above mentioned. Ambien is also HIGHLY addictive. It stops working and can have reverse effects, I believe that is also mentioned in the pamphlet that comes with the medication. Please talk to Dr. about raising the Trazodone...don't go with the Ambien.

Smile4uhun
01-06-2004, 10:58 AM
or Adivan for long term if Dr. gives you more. I am on Adivan 1 mg. for nerves and stress, it doesn't make me sleepy. It just calms me, however, my Psychiatrist already told me that she will not give it to me long term bc of of the addictive nature of the drug. I am not dependent on it as a 8 day supply will last me weeks, simply bc I fear addiction. I am already having some other major health issues and am on a bunch of meds...so I try to use it only if I am extremely stressed or starting rage (bi-polar, manic).

kindaunwell
01-06-2004, 01:27 PM
Hi, Smile4uhun

I hope you are doing well today!!
My medical(Drugs Too) history began near the end of 1999, when I started feeling my sioctic nerve beginning to go down from my lumbar region(L5/S1) to my left calf. I went to the ortho, he proscribed vicoden 5's, and had an MRI done. BAM!!!>>>> I had herniated the disc. As the pain kept getting worse, the drug dossage kept going up also, just to control the pain. Anyway to make this short, I had 2 Spinal operations that were only partially successful. By the time 2003 came around, there was nothing more that could be done,surgically, so I was just given physical therapy and lots and lots of pain medication>>>like oxycontin (40mg. 3x aday) oxy IR for breakthrough pain , the fentenal patches( 50's, 75's ug/h) xanax,>> plus so much more I can't recall them all.End of this sad sob story>>>> it took most of the year, a 5 day de-tox at a hospital 6 weeks ago,and finally my opiate drug problems were finished. But I started showing signs of depression, anxiety, and insomnia. I would be awake for 30 something hours, fall asleep for only 2-3 hours and then another 30 something hours awake and so on and so on. They tried me on the herbal stuff,Ambien, xanax(again!) Kolonopin, and Trazodone. Nothing changed a thing. And sometimes, it felt like those meds (not all taken together, of course!) would get me even more wired up!! It took me a 21 day "wean-down" to stop them all.That went smooth enough for me, but the insomnia was still constantly going on. I've never had insomnia before, and I don't have any sleep disorders. Thats when my Pain Doctor deceided to try me on a 5 day trial of Ativan. Take 2 pills right before what would be considered normal sleeping time (11:00 PM). Each pill is 1 mg.
And BAM!! I started sleeping a normal 8 hours. Like you, I am "very affraid" of having another addiction. But what am I to do?
When they ran out saturday night into Sunday, I went back to the herbal teas and melontonin, But I've only got about 3 hours sleep in the last two days (again!!!).
Even as I am posting to you, I am deceiding if I should call the Doctor and ask for another 5 day script(?????).
Well,Smile4uhun, thats my story (or dilemma). I got a feeling I'm gonna call him, because my body is exhausted, but my mind just keeps racing along... After all the "other trials" I have been through and beaten, I can't believe This is gonna start all over again....
I've written enough, Sorry my post was soo long. Sometimes I have to write all this stuff out, because I won't let my wife and family know how much this insomnia is really killing me. I just tell them its a normal reaction from my past drug ussage, that it will stop soon, and that it doesn't really bother me-- I feel great. On the other side of the coin, I really do feel good about being able to stop all other drug ussage, and can handle my back pain. Life is crazy,sometimes...
Okay Smile4uhun, thats it!
If you feel like it, you can post back to me anytime. I'll probably be awake!!!!! ha,ha.../...

Kinda- unwell (sometimes)....

John 808
01-06-2004, 01:42 PM
Hey Kinda....I just read your story-finally! :) Hang in there! I do have sleep problems- have way before I ever abused pain meds. Went to see a sleep disorder doctor and he prescribed Ambien. I worked great and I kinda alternated between Ambien and Melatonin as to not to get dependant. Strange thing is- my sleep disorder doctor said he had no problem with me taking them every night. He said they were not addicitve. One doctor says one thing and another says another thing. :confused:

Talk with you later,
Mcihelle

kindaunwell
01-06-2004, 02:22 PM
Hey Kinda....I just read your story-finally! :) Hang in there! I do have sleep problems- have way before I ever abused pain meds. Went to see a sleep disorder doctor and he prescribed Ambien. I worked great and I kinda alternated between Ambien and Melatonin as to not to get dependant. Strange thing is- my sleep disorder doctor said he had no problem with me taking them every night. He said they were not addicitve. One doctor says one thing and another says another thing. :confused:

Talk with you later,
Mcihelle

HI,John 3:16 <<<< Although I was born and raised in an Irish Catholic family, (8 years in Catholic school) somewhere along the road I've kinda lost my religion. I don't mean to say I don't believe, I just don't believe in the same way it was taught(more like Beaten into me). So I have to ask you ,>>> what does John 3:16 mean ????
And by the way, this version of my "drug history" was kinda "whitewashed". The whole story is alot uglier and longer than 1999. But like I said before ,I don't want to down you out when you are in the beginning of your battle. But the ending is still the same and true. And I am filled with alot of pride (humble pride ,that is). Now it is just this insomnia that is driving me crazy!! Keep posting, Michelle >>>> hmmm first time I ever used your given name (???). I will probally be awake alot longer. I'm only into the 20 somthing hours now without sleep. I still have 10 or 15 more to go, "before I sleep, before I sleep" (Isn't that from a poem or something ?) And this whole Board will always be awake for you......

(Sometimes) Kinda-unwell

John 808
01-06-2004, 03:14 PM
Hey Kinda,

John 3:16 is one of my favorite Bible verses...."For God so loves the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him, will have everlasting life."

My faith is very important to me, but I must say it has taken a back seat since my drug abuse started. These pills consumed my whole life. I know I need God's help to get through this, because I have failed one too many times on my own strength.

One day, you can share EVERYTHING with me. I would love to hear! If you don't mind me asking, what do you do for a living? Do you have family? children? I don't mean to get too personal, I just find it interesting how these drugs affect all walks of life. I mean, look at me, a little born and bred Baptist with an academy education and master's from college with a "picture perfect" white-collar lifestyle hooked on pain pills???? Who would have ever thought? My friends at church would probably faint if they ever knew....but, who knows? Maybe one of them has a drug problem???

I really hope you can get some sleep. Did you call your doc for some more Ativan? I will probably be up alot during the night these next few days...I'll post ya in the middle of the night! :)

Take care of you,
Michelle

yinksy
01-06-2004, 03:19 PM
Hello Kinda-unwell
Well. There's a thing! I was a convent school girl - raised as an Irish Catholic too! Perhaps that explains a lot! LOL
Kinda - I know - that reading between the lines - your story is long and hard - but here you are at last getting clean. I so congratulate you!
The only thing I want to say is - if you can - steer clear of the ativan/xanax/klonopin. These benzos are so addictive - even in small doses. I took ativan as preseribed at 1 mg at night for sleep for 2 years - never abused - but was I addicted!!!!!!! Took me 8 months to taper off. I am not lecturing! Just want to warn you. In the past I have found that insomnia does finally solve itself. The brain has built in survival - and will sleep when it needs to. I have managed not to sleep for a whole week - but then sleep gradually adjusts again. So - if you can - just leave ALL the chemicals out of the equation and let the brain cope all on its own again. It will. But not until it is clear of all these psychotropic drugs. If you take pills to sleep you will just lengthen the time it takes to regain natural sleep. I am living proof of all this!
Hey Kinda - wot's that remark about one of the good gals over this side of the pond? Should I smack you? LOL
Keep well, my friend
yinksy

Jennita
01-06-2004, 08:25 PM
kindaunwell, yinsky has a point. Benzos will only work so long for sleep. Been there myself, done that. I have almost completely recovered my old sleep but it took very long time (drug free) to happen.

Good news is, your natural sleep will get better. Bad news is, it won't happen as fast as you would like. That is the tough part. It can take a very long time for some people....this type of insomnia (and wired up tendencies) is very typical for drug withdrawals....it's not any new condition like depression and such, it's just drug withdrawal related insomnia (which can make you feel depressed and anxious, however).

Time is the only cure. Most people will not or feel they can not wait for nature to fix this, because unfortunately it can take months to years to finally be fully recovered...the brain can do it, I assure you, it's a thinking organ and it has survival instinct. Drugs will mess it up good, but the brain will recover with enough drug-free time.

The chammomile teas, even calcium supplements and milk can help you along. Tylenol can also lower body temperature enough to maybe induce sleep, but again these are only helpful things...one must wait intil the brain itself recovers. Good luck!

John 808
01-06-2004, 08:58 PM
Hey friend....it is midnight...are you up? :)

I truly hope you are sleeping and having sweet dreams of sobriety!

Michelle

kindaunwell
01-06-2004, 11:48 PM
Hi, John 3:16

NO,still not sleeping. One of the other side effects of my drug ussage and beating it is, I tend to tell the truth to most people nowadays(So un- NYC Like,ha,ha) So to be honest with you,after my last post, I did call my Pain Doctor,about the insomnia, and he called into the pharmacy a 5 day script of Ativan(1mg.) Only 5 pills, to take 1 at bedtime tonigh none tomorrow, than one every other night. HE wants to see if I can fall asleep on the days I don't take any. HE feels there is only a slim chance of this happening. But as so many people have already stated, this Ativan stuff is very addictive, and he is rightfully concerned about me and my past drug abusing. Taking these pills is a real let-down to all that pride I had before. Its just that the insomnia was really killing my body, and bringing those bad thoughts back constantly. I took it about an hour ago, and I am begining to feel real drousy now. It will be nice to go into the bedroom and lay down and sleep next to my wife again...I"LL talk more to you tomorrow.... But I will still be thinking of you and what you are going through.....

(A Sleepy) Kinda-unwell....

kindaunwell
01-07-2004, 10:41 AM
Top of the Morning to ya,yinksy! I hope you are feeling well, today.....
An Irish Catholic school-girl(Lass) from the convents, eh!!! I bet you would of been one of the girls, we boys use to climb the ivory covered fences just to get a smile from the girls on the other side. Funny ,how that thought brings back memories. Out of the hundreds of times I did that, I only got caught twice (we use to make the"weasel" kids stay on the ground and keep a look-out. The first time caught was by one of our younger priests(Teacher) and all he did was to tell me to keep away any "impure-thoughts" out of my mind until I was married to one of them girls. I'm sure he knew we boys were climbing the fences all the time(like generations before us!) and I'm sure He had a smile underneath His stern face. He was a "cool dude", as far as priests go. The second time caught was by those "dreaded Nuns".
She ended up pulling me down from the fence by my foot, landing hard on my rear end!LOL she than gave me a good hard slap in the face(not the last time I was hit by either a Nun or a Priest...) and went on shaking me by my shirt and tie, all the while screaming at me that I was a sinner and was going straight to Hell. Finally she got tired,and told me to go right over to the Church, find a priest, and "confess my sins". Heck, I just went to the local malt-shop and bought myself an ice-cream soda and told the owner why I was all scruffed-up and bleeding.>>>> Just like years later ,when I would belly-up to the bar and tell the bartender my problems. (Innkeeper by you eh???)
Anyway, it was worth it because the shop owner had gone to the same school in his youth,he said, and use to climb the fences too!
He gave me the ice-cream soda for free, and walked away muttering something under his breath about "Nuns>> LOL!! And I did finally go out with one of them girls. First girlfriend, first kiss,and all that "innocent" stuff. Her name was Claire and I'll never forget her.......
Hey! Wait a minute! this is suppose to be a "Drugs and Addictions" Board! What am I doing telling old 1960's school-boy stories for???. Ya see how just a simple little thing you said"I'm an Irish Catholic girl taught in a convent by Nuns" can set my mind off racing ? Well, at least I haven't lost all my memories to drugs.....
There is one confession I will make here. If you read my last post to John 3:16 you will see that yesterday, I did end up calling my Pain Doc. and got another 5 day script called in to the pharmacy. Ativan (1mg.) to take one, every other night, and see what happens on the nights I don't take any!! He didn't sound too positive about it, but he said he has seen this work on"some" of his patients before, but usually not. I guess I'll wait and see. At least today ,I can go to physical therapy and really give myself a long workout .That should help, Right?... So now I have gotten my Pride taken aback alittle,thinking I was going to stay completely drug-free... I guess that "Brill" wasn't entirely"Pure Dead" after all???????. Anyway, Whats-Up with you???. Any problems or funny stories you care to write about ???? I'll probably be awake here at anytime.(Except for when I head out to the gym. Otherwise its just too damm cold out for me (in the 20 degree area with the wind. ) I believe many,many,many generations ago, Irish Vikings (Yea, right!), came to the Fiji Islands and kidnapped my actual ancestors, and brought them back to Ireland. Over a thousand years went by and we became assimilated into the Irish culture and that after so many generations went by, we completely forgot where we originally came from. All of us that is, except for me. In my brain I carry the only DNA left from sooo long ago, that tells me I belong in Fiji, on a white sanded beach, in a hammock, susppended between two palm trees, sipping on a coconut drink, with the trade winds keeping me cool, and just starring out at the blue-green water. And my wife next to me running her fingers through my hair...... I call that my Dec., Jan., Feb.,and March, in NYC winter days, Fantasy!!!!! LOL,LOL
Write back when you can. Take good Care,yinsky.....

(Just a little) Kinda-unwell

John 808
01-07-2004, 06:13 PM
Hey Kinda,

Just checking in on you today- the Ativan is in the same "family" as the Xanax- I have to take that for anxiety and the sleep issue. When I get all this other opiate "stuff" settled and get myself cleaned up...my next step will be to wean off the Xanax. Although, I do not and never have abused this drug, I have read alot of stories on the board that have me a little concerned. I will say though, it does wonders for my anxiety and believe you me, when you have a five, four, and one year old that anxiety can slam you in a New York minute (ha, ha some NYC humor :) ) or should I say can slam you quicker than dew dripping off the honeysuckle (ha, ha some southern humor)!

I really hope you can get your sleep issues worked out- being a "zombie" is NO FUN- been there!

Take care,
Michelle

kindaunwell
01-07-2004, 09:20 PM
Hey, John 3:16

WOW! If you are posting,at this point, then, you are doing alot better than me, on the first time I tried cold- turkey from the oxys a couple years ago!!! Pretty good ,so far, but has "Casey's" freight train come for you yet??? And with all the little ones around, I couldn't handle that many even if I was straight and sober....
If you are awake , post back and let me know whats happening with you, I havn't gone to the main Board yet, so I don't know if you have been posting your fight to others. I'll stop now and take a look.

(A not sleeping again) Kinda-unwell.......

kindaunwell
01-10-2004, 12:54 PM
Hi, John 3:16

How are you doing today >>> I am interested ,ya know....
I just saw some of your other posts on this Board and was wondering if you were awake (and capable) of posting ????? If you are , give me a quick hit and let me know. IF not,I will understand, and keep waiting..... I miss ya...

Kinda-unwell

John 808
01-10-2004, 01:13 PM
Yep, I am up...

I think it took me about ten minutes to get up the stairs to the computer :) ! I am not kidding, I feel like I am ninety years old. I ache!

Last night was so-so. Woke up often with chills or sweats and finally made it to the shower and tried to put my makeup on and blow dry my hair. That took all my energy, after that, I went back to bed.

I have a killer headache- just took a Zomig and starting to get some relief.

I think if I can make it just four or five more days (as the sub stays in your body longer than hydro's), I will be okay! We'll see!

Thanks so much for checking on me. How are you? Did you sleep last night? How many more Ativan do you have left- do you sleep on those? Let me know how you are and thanks again,

Michelle

kindaunwell
01-10-2004, 01:49 PM
Hi, yinksy

How have you been?? Is it as cold over there as it is here in NYC. Frrrreezing !! Thank goodness my wife and son don't get too much bothered by this kind of weather . But my Fiji DNA/GENES (DREAMS) are in full blast today. Even though we are lucky enough to have good heat in my building, I still have "long-Johns under my sweat pants, and a sweat shirt on under my flannel top pajama. Strange, because all my jobs since the age of 23 have been working in the outside enviorment all year long. The guys would always make fun of the way I was over-dressed, and always saying "How cold it was ", anytime the weather is below 60 degrees !!! LOL! But I was one of the very few who never got sick.....(And you would get extra money for not using any sick days!!) But come summer time, when every one else was sweating and saying how it was too hot to work (In the 90's, even 100's sometimes). I would be the one with my shirt off and a bandana tied around my head, ready to do anything. Work or play!!!!
How are you, with the different types of weather ???
Post back when you get time.....
Sorry, No Drug stories this posting......

(A little bit cold) Kinda-unwell....

yinksy
01-10-2004, 02:54 PM
Hello Alittlebitcold Kinda-unwell
Nice to hear from you! Well - dont know about your Fijian genes (and dreams!) - but my West of Ireland (father from Limerick) genes cannae cope at all well with the cold. Has been jolly cold over here - but now just very wet, dark, cold and windy (100 mph gusts tonight!) So - my secret? Long sleeved thermal vests! And drawers! ha ha ha ha ha - so very romatic, dont you think? Aw - who cares? But - we live in an old victorian house - very drafty - poor heating system - so lots of snuggling in front of an open log fire! We have 4 children you know! LOL
Hope you are as well as you sound? Hoping the withdrawals are leaving you in good shape?
Y

kindaunwell
01-10-2004, 08:27 PM
hey, john 3:16

Well, its good to hear from you, even though you are not "at the top of your game". Does it help you to lurk and post on this Board when you are feeling "the effects" ??. And do you antiscipate the W/D's getting worse as more time goes by ??? I wish I could help you somehow,Kiddo....
As i've told you before , I've W/D from hydro use (it was kinda bad) ,but when I W/D from just a few months worth of oxy use, I damm near felt like I was crawling out of my skin for a few weeks...... But it never did stop this Blockhead from going back on them and using other, worse stuff for alot more years... And the last De-tox kinda made me think how close I almost came to the "real end" using all this stuff,both legally and illegally. When you sit down and really tell the truth to an addictionologist and another Psyc doctor your whole Drug history up till now , and they both kinda look at you seriously, and say "you should of died by now", thats when it really hit me. So, with their help, and my will, Its somewhere around day 40 something since I touched any kind of Opiate. Heck, I still even have that same, last,bottle of HEINEKEN in the fridge. I promised myself I wouldn't drink it till I felt good about myself again, was satisfied I was gonna stay Drug-Free, And was just plain ole enjoying life again naturely... How can anyone in their "right mind" throw out a perfectly good bottle of Heineken?
I figure by the time this FRRREZING weather lets up and my normal hormones come back to me in the Springtime, I'm gonna walk that 2miles to the park,with the fishing pond in it, find me a shaddy tree and finally pop open that Heineken and slowly sip it down. I'LL Look around at everything in nature(Life) and raise my bottle and just say "Thanks" to no one in particular......
I guess we all have our own ways of praying, or thanking Whoever, knowing that from either the inside or the out side, we all had some kind of help getting this far, safely and straight....... Sorry, again!! I don't know why my posts always turn out to be so long. Its just thinking of what you are going through, reminds me of my own purgatory, which reminds me of other things ,and so on and so on.
Anyway the true heart of this post is I hope you stay fighting "the good fight", I'm always here looking for you, and hopeing I can give you any support you need, Michelle..... Ya see, this here Yankee did spend some time in "The Good Ole South" in my younger days. I still have family in North Carolina and Texas, although nowadays, we only talk by phone, mostly around the Holidays. So, ya see, I've got Rebel kin down south, who I love just as much as my Northern family....
I hope that made you smile!

Take Good Care,
Michelle,

(Cold and feeling) Kinda-unwell..

Tobias12
01-10-2004, 10:51 PM
You know, I didn't think the lack of sleep thing was so common amongst us until I took the time to read all this. Here I was thinking I'd be back to normal in a couple weeks.

Chamomile tea helps you say? Where could I go about finding that? Doesn't it contain caffeine? Pardon my ignorance on that, I've no experiance with it and am nearing hour 40 with no sleep...and that was only an hour or so. It's good to know I'm not alone. I'm with you.

Tobias12
01-10-2004, 10:58 PM
(deleted as it made no sense) insomnia induced babblings were originally here. Also an apology post from where i referred to john 3:16 as a guy. Seems i deleted THAT one before i hit submit.

kindaunwell
01-11-2004, 01:22 AM
Hi, yinksy

I hope this post finds you warm and well-off...
IN your last post you said the best way for you to stay warm in that victorian house was to snuggle up to the roaring fire place with your husband, on nights like these. Does that mean we may have another little yinksy running around in about 9 months or so ??
LOL! Just kidding ... You said you lived in western Ireland, near Limerick. Isn't that close to the SHANNON Bay,and is that where these 100 mile an hour gales come from??? My Dads'grandfather came from county CORK, and my Mom's side from Tipperary. I don't recall their exact history over there, but both Great-grandparents somehow managed to hook-up,get together and made their way to America.Back in them days ,a poor Irishman either became a cop, a carpenter, A priest or a crook. They settled in Hell's Kichten NYC, MY greatgrandfather becomming a good carpenter, my grandfather a crook, who luckily had his children before being killed by another Irish gang and although my father ran with a tough crowd ,he stayed alive long enough to join the Irish carpenters union, serve his time durring WW2, and come back to his old job for another 30 years. But he still acted in the old Irish ways ---working and then drinking,and then telling us that any real Irishman could drink and fight better than any other group. MY Mom cotinued in her Irish tradition by staying at his side no matter what. I don't blame either of them for not really "americanising. He even got involved when that IRA stuff was big over here.... He just couldn't understand when me and my two older brother became americanised and didn't really care about his old ways. WE went off and found the drug culture and started hanging out with and getting in trouble with friends from other cultures. He about died when I came home with my girlfriend at the time(I was 16) who was a beautiful Puerto RICANgirl. One of my Brothers was getting serious with a Black woman,And my oldest Brother married an English girl he met while he was over there in the service( HE tried his best to raise us to hate the English,in the most vile Irish ways) But he just couldn't change what growing up in a diversified America (NYC), was doing to his children. He wouldn't come to our weddings, ( I ended-up marrying a fantastic Philipino/French girl who always did her best to be kind to him.)
Mom died first,in her 70's and he followed her 2 years later. BUT BEFORE HE WENT, in a half drunk frame of mine, he sat us brothers down, and he tried to explain that he didn't mean to be cruel to our wives and some of our children, but he was just triing to keep the"Old Irish Traditions" going on after he left us. I knew he was getting near the end, so I just couldn't argue with him. But I did tell him I would keep some of the stories alive with my son, and one day we would go back to ole ERIE, And visit Cork and Tipperary and other places. That soothed him somewhat, and soon after he passed on. All our family and our children attended his mass and furneral. Although our wives knew, of course, we never have told our children about his true feelings on things. They have only known him as a huge,boistorious grandfather who was sometimes nice to them. My oldest brother kept his promise and did bring his wife and 3 children to Ireland ,where he did meet people with our name from the same Counties, but no one could really be sure of our relationships. I have yet to do it, but as I get older, I think about it more. And my middle brother did,in a way, follow his footsteps, by becomming a hard drinker, a crook, a druggie but dying before having children so many years ago. I guess comming from dirt farming Irish heritage can seem terrible to other people, but I just didn't mention all the good times we had and the sacrificing he did for the family to stay together. Maybe some other times ,it will pop up in a post.
Anyway, I don't what it is yinksy, but it seems when I post to you,I forget my drug problems for the moment,and just remeniss on old times!! Thats because I think if you knew my whole story, you might not think I was so nice and funny anymore....
But I do like posting to you, so what do you say, shall we keep it going??????

Take Good Care, my friend

(just) kinda-unwell.....

kindaunwell
01-11-2004, 04:48 AM
hi,Tobias1

I am into about 30 something hours now,myself. Its 4:37 AM as i start this post to you .Man, let me tell you >>>INSOMNIA SUCKS...I know (because it has in the past) this would go on for afew more hours. BUT I just get soo stinking tired of it, that Ijust now gave in and took a Ativan pill, so I expect to get kinda sleepy soon. In my case they tell me its from all my previous years of Drug ussage. It may take weeks, months, no one really knows for sure.ITs not like having the W'D's. Its more like slow BURN IN. Keep sting to the Board >Aloto people have gone thgough this.
sweet dreams and good luck.

( a sleepy ) Kinda _unwell....

yinksy
01-11-2004, 04:55 AM
You know, I didn't think the lack of sleep thing was so common amongst us until I took the time to read all this. Here I was thinking I'd be back to normal in a couple weeks.

Chamomile tea helps you say? Where could I go about finding that? Doesn't it contain caffeine? Pardon my ignorance on that, I've no experiance with it and am nearing hour 40 with no sleep...and that was only an hour or so. It's good to know I'm not alone. I'm with you.
Yep Tobias - the insomnia is a brute and not easy to deal with! I would only say to try not to worry about it and go on about your life without giving it any place in your conscious thoughts! Dead hard - I know - been there - got the t shirt!! I guess it results from messing up the neurons in the skull! Takes time for everything to sort itself out and get - re-tuned! That's why I always say to people avoid all other pills - sleepers - benzos, soma, ambien etc etc - as further chemicals will slow down and prevent the natural balance of the brain happening. My sleep has taken months really to come back on line! But the longest spell of insomnia - total lack of sleep - only ever happens to me for 2 nights. Then I tend to get nights with only 2 or 3 hours of sleep for some time -perhaps a week or two - then the time slowly lengthens. It till come - but you have to give it time. And you have to give your brain a chance and not bombard it with further pills/alcohol etc.
I drink chamomile tea by the pint! It is extract of the chamomile plant - pure - has absol NO caffeine in it - it your country (US?) it is known as "sleepy time tea" and it is readily available in stores. Do try it. Another natural remedy is Valerian. And yet another is St John's Wart (Kava Kava). This is considered so good that doctors in Germany actually prescribe it - on prescription - for patients - for treatment of mild depression. All above are natural remedies and non addictive. Another tip is to drink warm milk before bed as it contains tryptophan which induces sleep! You see - I have suffered with insomnia and done my homework!!!! Hope you find something to help. But your biggest friend by far is time!
Happy dreams
Y

yinksy
01-11-2004, 05:38 AM
Top o' the mornin' to ye, sir!
Well - hello just kinda-unwell!
Nice - as ever - to hear from you!
You have no idea just how many things rang bells with me when I read your post! We have had many similar familial experiences - just geographically different!
No - we dont live in Eire. We live in Scotland. My father came from Limerick - went to a Jesuit school - studied to be a priest - ditched that - studied medicine and finally settled down as a GP here.
My mother is pure anglo-Saxon English. What an explosive combination?
My father was very very Irish catholic in all his views - served him well in some areas of his life I am sure - but I can so empathise with your thoughts on some of the old Irish traditions and beliefs being clung on to by the older generation. It seems to me that what happened was that these views became so extreme so as to become almost "perversions" of what they were originally meant to be -dont u think? Emmigrant mentality? He was, as you can well imagine, very pro IRA. But that is fair enough I think? If people simply read the facts in Irish history - the treatment of the Irish and in particular the catholics by the English and Scottish was savage. Really the IRA was inevitable. Human Rights in Northern Ireland are still not all they should be - but I hope that their society is evolving in the right direction. Tis simply racism.
Can you just imagine my father and his views coming up against my mother's english protestant views! LOL. I assume you know about the Orange Walk and all the music associated with it? Well - my mother is a wonderful pianist and would thump out stirring versions of "The Sash" and other well known anti-catholic songs - just to wind him up! And you wonder why I have an addiction problem? LOL
But - my father never managed to instill into us his own views - we are of our own generation............ but he sounds so much like you own father!

"Anyway, I don't what it is yinksy, but it seems when I post to you,I forget my drug problems for the moment,and just remeniss on old times!! Thats because I think if you knew my whole story, you might not think I was so nice and funny anymore...."

And - kinda - dont think I cant read between the lines and realise you have had/are having just a perfect life? Do you really think that you could shock another addict? Naw. I dont know anything about you - but all of us in here are here for the same reason? No judgements? We are all just trying to get better. So - no worries there then?

Back to Ireland? Yes - you should go and visit Eire. Its a sort of destiny for many Americans? It is a wonderful place. Avoid the tourist traps - laid specifically for people from the US! But - you must kiss the Blarney stone! That west corner of Ireland - Shannon - down to Dingle Bay (where Ryan's Daughter) was filmed - is wonderful. The Ring of Kerry etc. Very atmospheric/spiritual. Soft, green, lush.....and wild and romantic too. Having had a father as you have - you would appreciate it all the more I think. You can have a vision back thro the years and see what it must have been like.
"I must arise and go now
And to to Innisfree......."
Bing Crosby even sang about it. The poetry of the country too is wonderful. Do you read any?
Ho hum.......... I am rambling on............. must go cook - have a son who is a wild surfer arriving here with some pals for dinner.................and poor ol hubby has flu!
Would love to hear more from you?
My brother married a white Russian in Paris................ but more, much more ......... later! LOL

Speak soon?
Hope you are keeping well? Hope the Heineken doesnt evaporate! LOL
Y