It appears you have not yet Signed Up with our community. To Sign Up for free, please click here....



Back Problems Message Board

  • Help please. I am in the ARMY and pending Spinal Fusion

  • Post New Thread   Closed Thread
    Thread Tools Search this Thread
    Old 01-01-2004, 08:34 PM   #1
    daveusarmy
    Newbie
     
    Join Date: Jan 2004
    Location: Ft. Leonard Wood, MO
    Posts: 6
    daveusarmy HB User
    Help please. I am in the ARMY and pending Spinal Fusion

    I am a 33 year old male and I have been in the US ARMY for over 15 years and I have been diagnosed with DDD in addition to a large herniated disc. My neurologist has recommended a two level fusion at S4-S5 and L1. I have been in pain for years, with the most intense pain occuring the last 6 months. I am scheduled for the 2 level fusion on 31 March 2004. My concern is the mid to long term effects of the operation. I will be automatically reviewed by a Medical Board a few months after operation to determine if I am fit to be retained in the ARMY, or if I should be medically retired, reassigned to a different job or retained as a Military Policeman. I am currently a Military Policeman, which is physically demanding. I retire in 4 years and 7 months anyways, so an early medical retirement won't be a major disappointment, as long as I can still have fun with my kids I will be happy. Can someone please let me know how a two level fusion affects the body in the mid to long term (1-4 years)? I know that I won't be able to perform strenuous activities, but I was wondering how restrictive the operation leaves the body. The message board has really helped me gain a good knowledge of the whole spinal fusion process.

    Sincerely,

    David

    Last edited by moderator2; 01-04-2004 at 08:11 PM.

     
    Sponsors Lightbulb
       
    Old 01-02-2004, 05:37 PM   #2
    MPT
    Member
     
    Join Date: Sep 2003
    Location: New York
    Posts: 63
    MPT HB User
    Re: Help please. I am in the ARMY and pending Spinal Fusion

    Daveusarmy,

    Hi dave,
    I would like to know why they feel a fusion is so necessary. It seems like a drastic move. Did they talk about a microdiscectomy or laminectomy? What about artificial disc replacement surgery or nucleoplasty? They are procedures for herniated discs that are much less serious (with the exception of the disc replacement).
    My boyfriend's mom had a fusion 15 years ago on two levels. She is now having problems at the levels above and below the fusion. You see, the fusion limits the movement in those levels so the levels above and below have to take on more work. So down the road they too get unstable because they have been on overload for such a long time. If I were you, I would do some research to find out what is the best plan of action for your situation. Is it possible for you to get second and third opinions from other doctors/surgeons? Don't take the advice of just one doctor. I went to five. Not that you have to go to that extent.
    Don't rush into surgery. Know everything you can about what is available for your situation before you rush into surgery. Now, if you have a medical emergency where a disc is pressing badly on a nerve and it is severely affecting your muscles and or organs that is a different story. From what you wrote, that doesn't seem to be the case. Talk to your doctor, ask questions.
    A fusion is the last thing you want to do. I haven't had surgery, but I have read some stories on this site as well as people I personally know who have had a fusion.
    Hope this helps.
    By the way, I went to college at Rockhurst in Kansas City, MO. Great town.
    MPT

     
    Old 01-02-2004, 06:02 PM   #3
    MarianJ
    Senior Veteran
    (female)
     
    Join Date: Jul 2003
    Location: Australia
    Posts: 1,335
    MarianJ HB User
    Re: Help please. I am in the ARMY and pending Spinal Fusion

    [COLOR=Navy][B][CENTER]Hello David,[/CENTER][/B]
    [INDENT]Welcome to the Healthboards for Back Problems. I am sorry that you are in so much pain. I also have DDD and I am 6 months post op of a two level fusion. My recovery hasn't gone to well but I also have other medical complication's. Their are certain factor's that can play a role in a patient's recovery. I think one of the most important facts is the physical shape of the patient. I am thinking that since you are in the army that you may very well be in pretty good shape. Also you are only 33 so you are young. But the most important is having more than one opinion and having a very good surgeon. My surgeon had told me that my recovery could take from 3 months till one year. I don't work and if I did I still would not be able to return to work. But like I said I have been having a difficult recovery. But their are other member's on this board who have returned to work in a shorter amount of time. But I don't want to get your hopes up on returning to your job as a Military Policeman. I am not sure as to when if ever you surgeon will give you the release for that particular employment. But I could be wrong..... I wish you the very best.[/INDENT]
    [B][CENTER]Jeanne[/CENTER][/B][/COLOR]

     
    Old 01-03-2004, 06:07 AM   #4
    ktshobe
    Junior Member
     
    Join Date: Sep 2003
    Posts: 48
    ktshobe HB User
    Re: Help please. I am in the ARMY and pending Spinal Fusion

    Dave,
    Hi! Your post caught my interest because I am in the Navy! I also have DDD at L4/L5 and L5/S1. I have been dealing with this for a few years, back and forth between civilian and military docs. Civilian docs didn't seem to understand that being my job depended on my being physically fit - they didn't do anything for me - said to wait it out and keep taking meds. Finally went to a military medical facility at the urging of my Executive Officer. What a difference! I just had Nucleoplasty, and will have IDET soon. They are very apprehensive about surgery (the spinal fusion) and have talked me out of it every time I bring it up. They must know something.....I am also young. So far nothing has made a big difference in the pain, but I feel that I am getting better care. I also have spondylothesis (?), so that's why they'd have to do fusion.

    Is it possible for you to travel to Walter Reed?

    Best of luck,
    Katie

     
    Old 01-03-2004, 12:32 PM   #5
    SusanPLIF
    Member
     
    Join Date: Sep 2003
    Location: Tulsa, OK, USA
    Posts: 77
    SusanPLIF HB User
    Re: Help please. I am in the ARMY and pending Spinal Fusion

    Greetings Dave!

    Glad you found this site! I had a PLIF on Aug 1, 2003 and wish I'd seen this site beforehand - if only for all the supportive info. This board has a lot more positive stories than negative (than other sites).

    I had my fusion done because of low-back pain confirmed by discography (had an annular tear AND DDD at L4-5). I was involved in an auto accident in 1998, and had tried everything to rid myself of the low-back pain. I am about your age - 34. I don't have a physically demanding job like yours, though sitting at my desk (I'm an accountant) is hard on the back. That sounds funny, but it's true.

    So far, I am doing really well. I'm 5 months post op. I returned to work in 11 weeks (part time at first, while attending physical therapy). The physical therapy part of recovery is ESSENTIAL. You must retrain your body to strengthen and stabilize your CORE musculature. I was lucky in that my therapist was very good about making me do the exercises and gently progressing me to the point where she could confidently release me from treatment. I do my exercises at least 3x a week while also doing some aerobic exercise (ideally every day...ha ). I walk... and just recently I've set up my bicycle on a trainer indoors - that's going well, albeit slowly.

    I believe that if you are vigilant about keeping your core in control, you can minimize the strain that the fused joint will have on the levels above and below the fusion over the span of years post op....to the effect that you [U]may[/U] never need a second surgery.

    My last visit to the neuro for check-up revealed that my fusion is complete - 5 months out!! I had good bone action, eh?? If you smoke - you need to stop. Smoking truly inhibits bone growth. Also - NSAIDS (anti-inflammitories) have been shown to reduce the rate of fusion. Just use the narcs for the first month or so.. then I think they say its ok to use NSAIDS.

    My biggest complaint is bone graft donor site pain. I thought it was SI joint distress, but my surgeon told me its really the donor site on my hip. So...hopefully that will subide soon. It seems to react to weather fronts. Still - my pain used to be so draining... and I would use 2-3 4mg dilaudid a day to have some relief. Now.... if I use anything, I'll only use 1mg.. and that's not everyday. Sometimes, just a simple naprosyn will control the inflammitory pain.

    All things considered...at our age, and if it's [U]truly[/U] indicated.. fusion is not terrible. Its not a 'joy' either, but it's been helpful to me.
    Susan

     
    Old 01-03-2004, 03:03 PM   #6
    musicmaker650
    Inactive
     
    Join Date: Jan 2004
    Location: Montana
    Posts: 689
    musicmaker650 HB User
    Re: Help please. I am in the ARMY and pending Spinal Fusion

    [QUOTE=daveusarmy]I am a 33 year old male and I have been in the US ARMY for over 15 years and I have been diagnosed with DDD in addition to a large herniated disc. My neurologist has recommended a two level fusion at S4-S5 and L1. I have been in pain for years, with the most intense pain occuring the last 6 months. I am scheduled for the 2 level fusion on 31 March 2004. My concern is the mid to long term effects of the operation. I will be automatically reviewed by a Medical Board a few months after operation to determine if I am fit to be retained in the ARMY, or if I should be medically retired, reassigned to a different job or retained as a Military Policeman. I am currently a Military Policeman, which is physically demanding. I retire in 4 years and 7 months anyways, so an early medical retirement won't be a major disappointment, as long as I can still have fun with my kids I will be happy. Can someone please let me know how a two level fusion affects the body in the mid to long term (1-4 years)? I know that I won't be able to perform strenuous activities, but I was wondering how restrictive the operation leaves the body. The message board has really helped me gain a good knowledge of the whole spinal fusion process.

    Sincerely,

    David [COLOR=Red][real name removed][/COLOR][/QUOTE]

    Hi Dave and other repliers...

    I have Cerebral Palsy from birth, I am 6 feet 1 inch tall and 53 years old. I have some curvature of the lower spine. Exercise and physical thearpy of all types, has saved me from great pain, and spinal surgery. I have had back problems throughout my life. I do use two canes to walk. I just wanted to say how sorry I am for all your pain. Fusion was an option presented to me when I was in my early 30's and I am so thankful that I never had it done. I know injuries and hereditary weeknesses play a large part in how each persons back problems are treated. I can't say how strongly I feel about spinal fusion being done ONLY as a LAST RESORT! I do know that modern surgical techniques have come a long way since I was young. My very best wishes to all of you...

     
    Old 01-03-2004, 03:59 PM   #7
    SusanPLIF
    Member
     
    Join Date: Sep 2003
    Location: Tulsa, OK, USA
    Posts: 77
    SusanPLIF HB User
    Re: Help please. I am in the ARMY and pending Spinal Fusion

    [QUOTE=musicmaker650]Hi Dave and other repliers...

    I have Cerebral Palsy from birth, I am 6 feet 1 inch tall and 53 years old. I have some curvature of the lower spine. Exercise and physical thearpy of all types, has saved me from great pain, and spinal surgery. I have had back problems throughout my life. I do use two canes to walk. I just wanted to say how sorry I am for all your pain. Fusion was an option presented to me when I was in my early 30's and I am so thankful that I never had it done. I know injuries and hereditary weeknesses play a large part in how each persons back problems are treated. I can't say how strongly I feel about spinal fusion being done ONLY as a LAST RESORT! I do know that modern surgical techniques have come a long way since I was young. My very best wishes to all of you...[/QUOTE]


    Oh yes, and sorry I didn't make it more clear at the end there, but YES - fusion [B]only[/B] as a last resort. I say that on a lot of my posts, but since I had a positive outcome - I guess it just looks like I'm pro-fusion on all cases. Not true.

     
    Old 01-04-2004, 06:06 PM   #8
    daveusarmy
    Newbie
     
    Join Date: Jan 2004
    Location: Ft. Leonard Wood, MO
    Posts: 6
    daveusarmy HB User
    Re: Help please. I am in the ARMY and pending Spinal Fusion

    [QUOTE=ktshobe]Dave,
    Hi! Your post caught my interest because I am in the Navy! I also have DDD at L4/L5 and L5/S1. I have been dealing with this for a few years, back and forth between civilian and military docs. Civilian docs didn't seem to understand that being my job depended on my being physically fit - they didn't do anything for me - said to wait it out and keep taking meds. Finally went to a military medical facility at the urging of my Executive Officer. What a difference! I just had Nucleoplasty, and will have IDET soon. They are very apprehensive about surgery (the spinal fusion) and have talked me out of it every time I bring it up. They must know something.....I am also young. So far nothing has made a big difference in the pain, but I feel that I am getting better care. I also have spondylothesis (?), so that's why they'd have to do fusion.

    Is it possible for you to travel to Walter Reed?

    Best of luck,
    Katie[/QUOTE]


    Katie,

    Thanks for the reply. Its good to hear that your chain of command and military docs know something about whats going on with you. The military docs here don't know much about spinal disorders, and they automatically refer patients to civilian doctors. They have told me that they could send me to a military neurologist, but I would have to go to San Antonio or Walter Reed. That would be almost impossible because I would have to fly back and forth too often. No one has really tried to talk me out of the surgery, my neurologist has said that the fusion is totally voluntary (obviously), but the only other options are to: 1) deal with the pain, 2) have the herniated disc cut out or 3) have the spinal fusion. The doc has said that even if have the disc cut out, it will not relieve the pain in my lower back (S4/S5-L1 area) because it is caused by the deterioration of my discs. The majority of the pain is in that area, I could acrually deal with the pain from my herniated disc. The doc says that the pain in my lower back isn't going to get any better (I have been to PT, steroid injections and chiropractor), so I have decided to have the fusion so that I can enjoy some "less painful" times with my kids. I already have osteoarthritis in both kness and shoulders (which aren't getting any better), so it's of no surprise to find out that I had DDD.

    Thanks,
    David

     
    Old 01-04-2004, 06:14 PM   #9
    daveusarmy
    Newbie
     
    Join Date: Jan 2004
    Location: Ft. Leonard Wood, MO
    Posts: 6
    daveusarmy HB User
    Re: Help please. I am in the ARMY and pending Spinal Fusion

    [QUOTE=SusanPLIF]Greetings Dave!

    Glad you found this site! I had a PLIF on Aug 1, 2003 and wish I'd seen this site beforehand - if only for all the supportive info. This board has a lot more positive stories than negative (than other sites).

    I had my fusion done because of low-back pain confirmed by discography (had an annular tear AND DDD at L4-5). I was involved in an auto accident in 1998, and had tried everything to rid myself of the low-back pain. I am about your age - 34. I don't have a physically demanding job like yours, though sitting at my desk (I'm an accountant) is hard on the back. That sounds funny, but it's true.

    So far, I am doing really well. I'm 5 months post op. I returned to work in 11 weeks (part time at first, while attending physical therapy). The physical therapy part of recovery is ESSENTIAL. You must retrain your body to strengthen and stabilize your CORE musculature. I was lucky in that my therapist was very good about making me do the exercises and gently progressing me to the point where she could confidently release me from treatment. I do my exercises at least 3x a week while also doing some aerobic exercise (ideally every day...ha ). I walk... and just recently I've set up my bicycle on a trainer indoors - that's going well, albeit slowly.

    I believe that if you are vigilant about keeping your core in control, you can minimize the strain that the fused joint will have on the levels above and below the fusion over the span of years post op....to the effect that you [U]may[/U] never need a second surgery.

    My last visit to the neuro for check-up revealed that my fusion is complete - 5 months out!! I had good bone action, eh?? If you smoke - you need to stop. Smoking truly inhibits bone growth. Also - NSAIDS (anti-inflammitories) have been shown to reduce the rate of fusion. Just use the narcs for the first month or so.. then I think they say its ok to use NSAIDS.

    My biggest complaint is bone graft donor site pain. I thought it was SI joint distress, but my surgeon told me its really the donor site on my hip. So...hopefully that will subide soon. It seems to react to weather fronts. Still - my pain used to be so draining... and I would use 2-3 4mg dilaudid a day to have some relief. Now.... if I use anything, I'll only use 1mg.. and that's not everyday. Sometimes, just a simple naprosyn will control the inflammitory pain.

    All things considered...at our age, and if it's [U]truly[/U] indicated.. fusion is not terrible. Its not a 'joy' either, but it's been helpful to me.
    Susan[/QUOTE]

    Susan,

    Thanks for your help. Good to hear that you have fusion and your PT is going well. I won't have much of a choice in "slacking" off from my PT, as it will be my place of duty. The ARMY has a good PT program for the most part. I am currently on 5 mg of oxycondone (direct release) 2 tablets every 4 hours. They don't seen to work very well, either has percoset, LORACET or Norco. I think that the Norco did work better than all of them though. I have never heard of dulaudid before, what is it's active component?

     
    Old 01-04-2004, 06:17 PM   #10
    daveusarmy
    Newbie
     
    Join Date: Jan 2004
    Location: Ft. Leonard Wood, MO
    Posts: 6
    daveusarmy HB User
    Re: Help please. I am in the ARMY and pending Spinal Fusion

    [QUOTE=MPT]Daveusarmy,

    Hi dave,
    I would like to know why they feel a fusion is so necessary. It seems like a drastic move. Did they talk about a microdiscectomy or laminectomy? What about artificial disc replacement surgery or nucleoplasty? They are procedures for herniated discs that are much less serious (with the exception of the disc replacement).
    My boyfriend's mom had a fusion 15 years ago on two levels. She is now having problems at the levels above and below the fusion. You see, the fusion limits the movement in those levels so the levels above and below have to take on more work. So down the road they too get unstable because they have been on overload for such a long time. If I were you, I would do some research to find out what is the best plan of action for your situation. Is it possible for you to get second and third opinions from other doctors/surgeons? Don't take the advice of just one doctor. I went to five. Not that you have to go to that extent.
    Don't rush into surgery. Know everything you can about what is available for your situation before you rush into surgery. Now, if you have a medical emergency where a disc is pressing badly on a nerve and it is severely affecting your muscles and or organs that is a different story. From what you wrote, that doesn't seem to be the case. Talk to your doctor, ask questions.
    A fusion is the last thing you want to do. I haven't had surgery, but I have read some stories on this site as well as people I personally know who have had a fusion.
    Hope this helps.
    By the way, I went to college at Rockhurst in Kansas City, MO. Great town.
    MPT[/QUOTE]

    MPT,

    Thanks for your reply. I have already been through PT, chiropractor and steroid injections. I have been offered an operation to cut my herniated disc, but the doc said that will not releive the pain in my S4/S5-L1 region, which is where most of my pain is.

     
    Old 01-04-2004, 06:24 PM   #11
    daveusarmy
    Newbie
     
    Join Date: Jan 2004
    Location: Ft. Leonard Wood, MO
    Posts: 6
    daveusarmy HB User
    Re: Help please. I am in the ARMY and pending Spinal Fusion

    [QUOTE=Tomorrow][COLOR=Navy][B][CENTER]Hello David,[/CENTER][/B]
    [INDENT]Welcome to the Healthboards for Back Problems. I am sorry that you are in so much pain. I also have DDD and I am 6 months post op of a two level fusion. My recovery hasn't gone to well but I also have other medical complication's. Their are certain factor's that can play a role in a patient's recovery. I think one of the most important facts is the physical shape of the patient. I am thinking that since you are in the army that you may very well be in pretty good shape. Also you are only 33 so you are young. But the most important is having more than one opinion and having a very good surgeon. My surgeon had told me that my recovery could take from 3 months till one year. I don't work and if I did I still would not be able to return to work. But like I said I have been having a difficult recovery. But their are other member's on this board who have returned to work in a shorter amount of time. But I don't want to get your hopes up on returning to your job as a Military Policeman. I am not sure as to when if ever you surgeon will give you the release for that particular employment. But I could be wrong..... I wish you the very best.[/INDENT]
    [B][CENTER]Jeanne[/CENTER][/B][/COLOR][/QUOTE]

    Jeanne,

    Sorry to hear that your recovery isn't going so well. I really don't have many choices on getting second opinions. The ARMY just refers me to a civilian doctor then I go and see them. To get a second opinion, I would have to fly to a military neurologist in either Texas or Washington, D.C. My "primary care" doctor really doesn't know much about spinal disorders, he just follows what the neurologist dictates. The decision for spinal fusion is totally voluntary, but I have decided to have the fusion so that I can be "less painful". Currently, I can somewhat handle the pain, it's the fact that the pain is continuous and not going to get any better that sucks for me. My herniated disc (which is rather large, as the doc says), is painful but not near as bad as my lower back pain from my DDD on a bad day.

    Thanks,
    David

     
    Old 01-04-2004, 07:54 PM   #12
    SusanPLIF
    Member
     
    Join Date: Sep 2003
    Location: Tulsa, OK, USA
    Posts: 77
    SusanPLIF HB User
    Re: Help please. I am in the ARMY and pending Spinal Fusion

    [QUOTE=daveusarmy]Susan,

    Thanks for your help. Good to hear that you have fusion and your PT is going well. I won't have much of a choice in "slacking" off from my PT, as it will be my place of duty. The ARMY has a good PT program for the most part. I am currently on 5 mg of oxycondone (direct release) 2 tablets every 4 hours. They don't seen to work very well, either has percoset, LORACET or Norco. I think that the Norco did work better than all of them though. I have never heard of dulaudid before, what is it's active component?[/QUOTE]


    I'm not sure about "active components", but I do know it's derived from morphine and it's a schedule II drug - like morphine....very strong - and usually hard to get b/c doctors freak out about someone possibly getting addicted.
    I tried over 6 drugs - like percocet , darvocet, hydrocodone (Lortab)...and all of those are codeine based...they make me projectile-vomit. I also tried fentanyl (sp?) (the Duragesic patch AND the fentenyl sucker/lollipop). Fentenyl started out ok, but first put me out like a light for 12 hrs..then I woke up and threw up. Nice, huh?

    Last edited by SusanPLIF; 01-04-2004 at 07:59 PM.

     
    Old 01-04-2004, 08:18 PM   #13
    SusanPLIF
    Member
     
    Join Date: Sep 2003
    Location: Tulsa, OK, USA
    Posts: 77
    SusanPLIF HB User
    Re: Help please. I am in the ARMY and pending Spinal Fusion

    [QUOTE=daveusarmy]Jeanne,

    The decision for spinal fusion is totally voluntary, but I have decided to have the fusion so that I can be "less painful". Currently, I can somewhat handle the pain, it's the fact that the pain is continuous and not going to get any better that sucks for me. My herniated disc (which is rather large, as the doc says), is painful but not near as bad as my lower back pain from my DDD on a bad day.

    Thanks,
    David[/QUOTE]

    Your description of your pain sounds VERY much like mine was. I dealt with that draining pain for 5 years. It got a little better at one point, and I tried to return to my activities (sports n such) - then the pain came back and just continued to get worse.
    I wasn't unable to work because of the pain, but it got to where I was really distracted and started to use my strong stuff by lunchtime if I felt it getting bad. I knew after that (using narcotics while at work), that I was just going to have to get something done about it. My attempts at getting IDET approved went over a year - with appeal - and was turned down.
    So...for trying to save the insurance company 80K, I went ahead and revisited my neurosurgeon and decided to get the fusion.

    Might as your surgeon to consider whether your case would be better served by an anterior approach rather than posterior. In your active position...I think the recovery might be faster, with less chance for the battles of posterior. There are probably just as many risks in an anterior.. but.. your surgeon will know best.
    I watched a REALLY very interesting webcast from the discovery health channel website - it was a recording made of an minimally invasive ALIF surgery at L5-S1. If you have broadband...it takes about and hr and a quarter to watch. Really cool.
    Not sure if the monitors let us say stuff like that or not - this may get cut from my message.. Hopefully you can go watch..
    Keep the faith - it gets better
    Susan

     
    Old 01-05-2004, 05:56 PM   #14
    SusanPLIF
    Member
     
    Join Date: Sep 2003
    Location: Tulsa, OK, USA
    Posts: 77
    SusanPLIF HB User
    Re: Help please. I am in the ARMY and pending Spinal Fusion

    That link was kinda tough to find... so I went back and snagged it.

    [url]http://health.discovery.com/centers/surgery/surgeryarchive/surgeryarchive.html[/url]

    Hope its ok to post that, since its more educational than anything else..

     
    Old 01-13-2004, 12:13 AM   #15
    musicmaker650
    Inactive
     
    Join Date: Jan 2004
    Location: Montana
    Posts: 689
    musicmaker650 HB User
    Re: Help please. I am in the ARMY and pending Spinal Fusion

    [QUOTE=SusanPLIF]That link was kinda tough to find... so I went back and snagged it.

    [url]http://health.discovery.com/centers/surgery/surgeryarchive/surgeryarchive.html[/url]

    Hope its ok to post that, since its more educational than anything else..[/QUOTE]

    Hi SusanPLIF,
    thank you for the link... very informative indeed. With the free version of RealPlayer 10, the video presentations are amazingly clear. I learned a lot about the new surgical procedures available. I was once considered for a spinal fusion, and now I am not so afraid, if I ever need such a procedure.

     
    Closed Thread

    Related Topics
    Thread Thread Starter Board Replies Last Post
    Need help understanding the meaning and severity of my MRI results on my lower back foxymom1play Back Problems 3 07-27-2009 10:48 AM
    spinal surgery,6-11-08, feel alone, please help me! Kimba620 Back Problems 13 07-25-2008 06:54 AM
    Spinal Fusion at age 23 and no info,please help!! Brett5141 Back Problems 10 09-08-2005 11:59 AM




    Thread Tools Search this Thread
    Search this Thread:

    Advanced Search

    Posting Rules
    You may not post new threads
    You may not post replies
    You may not post attachments
    You may not edit your posts

    BB code is Off
    Smilies are On
    [IMG] code is Off
    HTML code is Off
    Trackbacks are Off
    Pingbacks are Off
    Refbacks are Off




    Sign Up Today!

    Ask our community of thousands of members your health questions, and learn from others experiences. Join the conversation!

    I want my free account

    All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:03 PM.





    2019 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved.
    Do not copy or redistribute in any form!