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  • Back Pain Stopping Life & Spoiling Relationship - HELP ANYONE??

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    Old 03-30-2004, 10:53 AM   #16
    injured betty
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    Re: Back Pain Stopping Life & Spoiling Relationship - HELP ANYONE??

    Mistina,

    Why go through a surgery when there are other alternatives?

    This is a young person. If there is scar tissue or her disks don't fuse, that is worse than the pain that she is in now. I wouldn't take that chance unless it was the absolute last chance. I was looking at surgery and instead opted for Prolotherapy and arthritis. The Prolo helped and now my disks aren't sliding around and and causing me more pain. The ligaments are all tightened up. I was skeptical at first but in so much pain that I was willing to try anything short of surgery. Believe me, Prolo is no walk in the park and you take the chance of the doc hitting a nerve if he doesn't know what he is doing. Mine did.

    You were lucky to find a doc that was willing to open up your back and take a look around. But, even though they remove bone spurs, the chances of them growing back is not something that I would bet on. Mine grew back in my shoulder in one year's time.

    Before this person has someone cutting them open they need to do the tests to see what is going on such as the EMG and the discogram.

    Once they cut you open there is always the issue of scar tissue, which one didn't have before. That can press on nerves and then you are back at square one. Then you have to live with that or have another surgery to try to remove that.

    There is an experimental procedure where they put a needle into the disk to try to suck the bulge back in but it is hard to find out who is doing it. That is better than being cut open.

    Fusion would be my ^^^absolute^^^ last option, ever, for anyone.

    Even though I hate pain management, I would take that over surgery. Once you are opened up that opens up a whole new can of worms and most end up on pm anyway.

    just my two cents.

     
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    Old 03-30-2004, 11:58 AM   #17
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    Re: Back Pain Stopping Life & Spoiling Relationship - HELP ANYONE??

    You've completely missed my point.
    I was mostly stating that noone is too "young" for surgery, IF it is needed. I'm disagreeing with the doctor mainly here. Secondly, I don't think fusion is EVEN a choice right now. This IS the absolute last option, believe me, I know this.
    I mean other than injections, chiro, PT, duro patches, you name she has tried everything and it's time to get a doctor to understand her and search out the alternatives to this. When I say "surgery" that certainly doesn't mean fusion. Can be IDET, discectomy's, laminectomy's or whatever. Very possible there is a tear and can be mended. Only thing is IDET's success rate is so slim.
    I also do not count on being free of bone spurs forever. My point was that mine were not showing up on any tests at all and were causing major nerve damage due to the spurs rubbing and sawing away at my nerves.
    Moral to my story: Doctors don't always know the best solution. It is up to you to do your research and search out your options. I self diagnosed myself from the beginning and knew all along what was going on it was just finding the right person to listen to me. Not saying that will happen to everyone, just stating that it helps alot to be educated. Doctors are there to help but only have so much time alotted to one patient.
    I believe that out of 100 percent that doctors only know about 30-40 percent about the central nervous system and are consistantly trying to methods to "fix" back/nerve problems and there is just no telling why one treatment will work for one and not the other. Not only are we puzzled about it, you can bet that the doctors are too.

    I didn't mean to be misunderstood. I just simply think that there is help in the right places aside of the obvious.

     
    Old 03-30-2004, 12:15 PM   #18
    injured betty
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    Re: Back Pain Stopping Life & Spoiling Relationship - HELP ANYONE??

    Mistina: I am sorry for missing your point

    I had to pretty much diagnose myself also and seach out someone who was willing to listen. I also did this for my husband as insurance limits a lot of people but since we wanted help at any cost and were willing to try alternatives, we finally found help.

    This is pretty much what a person has to do. If we had not had the money and had to rely on on PPO (insurance) we would have never found answers.

    I found out about using Neurontin through a friend. I researched it on the net and talked to a lot of people about it before trying it and it is actually working for us at 3000 mg a day. We manage to get it for $35 through a mail order prescription company on our insurance so we are lucky there. The doc who prescribed it had never done so before so we had to educate him.

    Then we found out about Prolotherapy. No doctor who had ever adjusted my back had ever even mentioned ligaments and how they stretch out and never go back and cause back problems. (Mine caused arthritis in L4/L5). I researched that, talked to people, got the success rates, and had that done and solved the pelvis, L5/SI, L5/L4 problem. All that I have there now is arthritis and I can live with that. No doctor diagnosed that for me before hand, they were looking at surgery. $$$

    All of the procedures that you named are invasive, if only minimally and can cause scar tissue. Again, the success rate on these are iffy at best in the long term. I would find out what caused the disks to rupture, was it a structual problem, an old injury, and is the pain actually coming from the disks? Although I have a bulging disk and a herniated disk, they were totally unrelated to any pain that I was experiencing and at my age, 50 those are normal. This is why I suggested the discogram and the EMG. If asked, a Neurologist should do these. If for nothing else, peace of mind for the patient.

    I am never going to let someone cut on my back as I don't want to end up on the pain management board. Well, I do go there, but I have not been cut on. I have done countless hours of research on back surgery on the net and with doctors and the long term success rate just does not justify it unless there is nerve damage involved and you need it in an emergency situation.

    In your case, it sounds like you did. Something in your body is causing the bone spur growth. For me it was repetitive movement in my shoulder that caused mine to grow back. If it were me, I would research the reason behind why they are growing in your back as it is not a natural occurence like herniations and DDD is.

    I seem to recall it had something to do with the body's processes after an injury. Might be wrong though.

     
    Old 03-30-2004, 01:40 PM   #19
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    Re: Back Pain Stopping Life & Spoiling Relationship - HELP ANYONE??

    My facet joints are dysfunctional. I do on the other hand believe that I have ligament problems and as does my doctor. He told me that he thought that my problems now are mostly myofascial (muscle/ligament). I have problems "moving". I can't like get in and out of a car like "normal" people do and just plain have problems upon rotation of my spine. I can't twist but that is probly my joints, I don't know. I have researched the web on ligament problems and found nothing. I have no answers in that area. I'm really dead set on the fact that my facets are shot and I'm not sure why.

     
    Old 03-30-2004, 04:00 PM   #20
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    Re: Back Pain Stopping Life & Spoiling Relationship - HELP ANYONE??

    Mistina:

    Ah, now we are getting somewhere

    I got a whole mini-lecture and demonstation on facets yesterday. When the facets are toast they can interfere with the nerves. The nerves get caught up in them. That is what is happening in my husband's neck and what was happening in my back. When they get all giggly, the nerve gets caught in there. That is what is wreaking havoc with my husband's neck.

    If you can go to a doctor's office, it can just be an MD and look at the model that they will have in their office. Look at where the facets are and where the nerve roots are. It is fascinating.

    He showed me how when my husband bends his head up or down, the nerve is trapped in there because of his facet joints. Did your MRI mention facet joints? His didn't but that was the trouble. They figured it out with the EMG and X-Rays of him moving in different positions.

    My facets wore out from me dancing, along with my ligaments and my disks. It is all connected for me. Once I saw a model of it, on not on a picture, but actually got to hold it while looking at the MRI and then feeling my back, it all made perfect sense. I had been suffering for a year.

    I can't tell you why your facets are shot. I knew immediately what happened to mine. I had gone to concerts and danced hard for years and years. The way that I danced stretched out my ligaments, which in turn wore on my facets and disks.

    Go go Google and look up lax ligaments, loose ligaments, ligament laxisity, or just Prolotherapy. That should send you in the right direction. The surgeon general had this treatment done so it has to be okay.

    There are dozens of site in regards to Prolotherapy and that is what they deal with, loose/lax ligaments and torn ligaments. I had torn a ligament back in June 03, which started my quest to see what to do about it as it didn't heal properly.

    I hope that this helps

     
    Old 03-31-2004, 06:22 AM   #21
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    Re: Back Pain Stopping Life & Spoiling Relationship - HELP ANYONE??

    I guess I'm confused, I know it is my facet joints killing me so and in your case so why did you have prolotherapy? On my MRI it showed slight facet joint hypertrophy. Just slight though, that was lying compared to what the doctor found when he operated. I just know that my facets are shot and terrified of the future as I'm only 28.
    I could have sworn that I wrote your last post though, I also love live music and have had a bit of those wild days. You can say I was a bit of a wild child and I KNOW absolutely KNOW that the whole concert thing has gotten me to where I am now. I have been caught up in the 'slam dancers' on accident. I really regret this and feel that is the biggest mistake of my life. I don't admit that to my friends and family though. I would look like the biggest a** and I think that they would feel I just brought it on myself. Which I did. Noone with a long fusion should have been in the midst of that.
    But anyway, I just pray that I don't get a whole lot worse or anything, I hope to get better and better but know that the pain that I still feel is my facet joints pinching "things".
    Thanks for the info though!

    Last edited by Mistina; 03-31-2004 at 06:25 AM.

     
    Old 03-31-2004, 03:21 PM   #22
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    Re: Back Pain Stopping Life & Spoiling Relationship - HELP ANYONE??

    Mistina:

    I had been to doctor after doctor who were more than willing to take my money and not even mention ligaments. Ligaments are what holds you together. If they are stretched out, they do not go back to their original shape and they make everything loose and jiggly and then the problems start. Had I not decided that I liked to dance and when I danced, rotated my hips (the way that a stripper does) this would not be a problem. Now I know that you have to move your feet, not your hips. That is what the twist was all about. If you look at someone doing the twist, they move thier body using their feet to make the twisting motion. I twisted at the waist and then did this whole hip rotation thing. That wore out my facet joints on one part of my spine as well as causing arthritis in another. ( we are old Dead Heads at our house, thirty plus years of touring).

    Ask your doc about your ligaments. If they are loose, then research Prolotherapy in your area on the net. I found a guy who was only one town away. It helped me get my ligaments back. They are now as tight as they were before I started. I still have arthritis, but I am not jiggly anymore and they should not wear on themselves anymore unless I stretch out those ligaments again, then I will go back in for a tune-up.

    There is a report called The Burton Report. It is worth reading. It deals with the backs, myths and misconceptions about what is going on in the world of backs today.

    hope that this helps.

    And no, a person with fusion should not go into the mosh pit but you did, and not here you are, so no one is judging you. You had fun and that is what life is all about. I had thirty plus years of touring with the band that I would never want to change, bad back and all. I could get hit by a car tomorrow and don't want to think that I wasted my life and didn't have fun

     
    Old 03-31-2004, 08:50 PM   #23
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    Re: Back Pain Stopping Life & Spoiling Relationship - HELP ANYONE??

    Papillonisback -

    I hear ya girl! I have been there so many times as well. I am married, and this all began shortly after my husband and I met. He was very supportive at the begining, but things have really changed. I have sat home alot while he enjoys the life I cannot have right now. He is mostly turned against supporting me I believe due to the drugs. I have had to take so many for the past to years, and had a close call when I accidently took too many pills after a miserable trip to the hospital, where I was in so much pain I couldn't even see straight. The paramedics and the doctors said that I did not OD, they said I just couldn't really tell that another pill wouldn't help. My shrink did not even believe that I tried to OD, it was just simply an accident, but not to my husband. He has since pretty much written me up as a drug addict, even though I have tried every non-medicinal approach as well as my meds. I have had more epidurals and nerve blocks than I can remember, and even have stopped taking my meds just to prove I can. Then I remember who is hurting in this picture and do what my doctors tell me no matter what he thinks. I refuse to try and justify myself anymore! I hope things are not this crappy w/ your boyfriend by far, but he should always remember who is really suffering here. I really just believe that no one can understand unless they are right here with us. It used to really hurt that my husband thinks like this, and still does, but I am doing the best I can and if he keeps it up, I know I will need to make a change. I am going through enough w/ out his sarcasm and negativity. He is not missing out on life, I am. He does what he wants, I do what I can.

    Sorry to ramble, it just kind of all came out! Just remember that you need to look out for you, and if someone cannot support you, they absolutely don't need to add to the problems!!! You may think it would be over w/ out someone, but that is never true. Our lives are given to us, and we have to live it right? I hope this does not come across all angry and mean sounding, I have just made a decision to only let people help me, not add to my pain. I have some wonderful, and very supportive people in my life and my husband can either be one or not. Easy to say huh! I am still trying to get that through to him!

    Well, good luck to you, and just be true to yourself first!

    Karmon

     
    Old 04-01-2004, 06:26 AM   #24
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    Smile Re: Back Pain Stopping Life & Spoiling Relationship - HELP ANYONE??

    Hi Betty!
    I've researched prolo on the web but I'm not quite sure what it really consists off. You had it right? I will ask my doctor about my ligaments and all. So you are saying that you were in terrible pain and that it has made you disabled to an extent and now your doing well? I'll have to look into that book too. I know with a long fusion already there will be exceptions but I also believe that there has to be an explanation for all this!
    Back to the band, Not to go way off the subject of this thread but I can relate to the fact of not regreting the fun you've had. I grew up with a single mother and had a sister and it was nothing for my mom to cart us around with all those hippie friends that she hung out with! But, I did grow up listening to The Dead and once I got into high school I obviously was hanging out with the 'in crowd' and listening to what was 'popular' but it wasn't until I got out of school the I myself got into the dead again and then it kinda played on me cause it also reminded me of my moms hippie days, and maybe mine too! But,I fell in love with them as obviously you know how they made the atmosphere their own, I went to one conert of theirs once I really started having a love for them and then Jerry died. I do wish I had been reintroduced earlier. But atleast I can say I was there and it was a feeling I'll never forget. But anyways, I totally don't regret where I've been that has made me who I am and I do regret some things but I'll always have those memories. At 28 I can say that I've been around the world and back, so to speak.
    Now I'm rambling.
    But I'll have to check out that book, there are so many books that people have posted on here and I don't know which one to go for and which is the best. I hate to read too so it's gotta be good!

    Christina

    Last edited by Mistina; 04-01-2004 at 06:31 AM.

     
    Old 04-07-2004, 11:20 AM   #25
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    Re: Back Pain Stopping Life & Spoiling Relationship - HELP ANYONE??

    Just remember you are not alone girl. We all are suffering and have gone through these same emotions. Never give up!!!

     
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