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    Old 06-25-2003, 08:02 PM   #1
    eeyoretigger
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    Post IDET / disc replacement

    hi everyone!
    i've been kneeling in front of my computer for about the last two hours browsing through all the postings trying to find some info. i'm a 24 year old female in decent health. back in january i was shoveling the snow (not even an inch)when my back gave out. i never felt such horrible pain and i couldn't stand without my legs giving out from under me. that lasted for about 3-4 days before i was just stuck with the horrible pain. since then i've had terrible pain in my lower back, typically more my right side than the left. i can't sit for more than about 2 minutes (long enough to put on my shoes) and that's only been for about 2 months, since an epidural into L5-S1. when i sit, most the pain seems to be in my tailbone area. not even donuts or coccyx/hemmeriod pillows help any. on occasion i will get tingling down my legs but that's usually after twisting or bending in a way i probably shouldn't. nights are difficult because i have pain sleeping on both my stomach and my back so i usually end up on my sides. after spending about 30 minutes on my sides though my hip area (where the butt, leg, and back all meet) which lingers even once i've switched sides.

    my doctor has tried injections into my sacrococcygial (sp??) joint, my SI joint, and also L5-S1. after my L5-S1 injection my doctor finally narrowed it down to that and i had a discogram, similar pain experienced at L4-L5 and the exact pain though not in my tailbone area with L5-S1. i've tried therapy, tens unit, been on all sorts of pain meds. for daily pain that is about an 8 and a 10 when sitting, i've been taking oxycontin and vicodin now, though they both make it hard to go to work even though i've only been working part-time since i returned mid-may.

    after my discogram i went for another ct scan which revealed a tear at L5-S1. my doctor said that my options now are fusion (which he pretty much refuses to do since i'm so young and will end up with problems later in life from), trying to get into a disc replacement study going on or starting soon at the hospital i'm going to (and hope that i get the replacement and not fusion), or IDET. because of the chance of getting stuck with fusion if i go for the study, my doctor wants me to go for the idet.

    i recently went for a second opinion and the neurosurgeon wasn't very helpful. he didn't give much advice of what to do and said that he doesn't have much experience with IDET but that he didn't think it could hurt trying.

    from what i've read, it sounds like the idet is a fairly easy procedure but has a LONG PAINFUL recovery period. has anyone had any lasting negative results from it??? my mother has been reading about it on the internet and keeps saying how since they burn the nerve ending by the disc, i'll end up with horrible effects from it such as incontinence. she keeps coming up with all sorts of negative results that can happen. how risky is this procedure??? has anyone encountered serious problems???

    also, for anyone who has had the disc replacement, how has the recovery been?? i only saw a few postings regarding this and it sounds like a better recovery period than the IDET.

    any suggestions of what to do?? i really just want to get rid of some pain and to sit again!!!

    sorry i rambled on so long....thanks to anyone who actually read this entire thing!

     
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    Old 06-25-2003, 08:21 PM   #2
    BAXTER
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    Hi Eeyoretigger,

    Welcome

    I'm not an IDET patient, but you can do some searches here on the recent IDET postings, we don't have very many IDET success stories it seems like the Nucleoplasty is a better route to go vs. the IDET.

    Hopefully that will help until somebody else comes along.

    If I could turn back time, I would have done anything in my power to hold off for the ADR, that just wasn't an option for me

    I wish you well [img]http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/heart.gif[/img] please keep us posted.

    Take Care,
    Baxter [img]http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/love2.gif[/img]

    ------------------
    Two level laminectomy fusion L5-S1 & L2-3 done on 12/6/02.
    I regret the day that I agreed to have this surgery.
    Fifteen inch scar from the very top of butt crack (sorry), to the bra line.
    BAK cages, rods & screws.(Titanium)
    My pelvic bone was used for grafting.
    Praying that the other two discs in between, won't have to be fused later, as I was told it was a possibility, due to the other two discs in between, not being in that great of shape.
    Doc didn't want to fuse four levels, unless it is really necessary.
    I would hate to repeat the surgery, as the recovery period, is so very painful.
    I also have a free fragment in my T11-12 area, that I'm still refusing surgery for, at this point in time.
    That surgery is way too dangerous for me to consider, until if affects my being able to walk.

     
    Old 06-25-2003, 09:28 PM   #3
    Telzey
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    Hi eeyoretigger and welcome!
    I'm sorry to hear about your problems and pain when you are so young. I also had an annular tear in a disc, and ended up with an IDET. I wish I hadn't had it as I am worse than pre-IDET (after 7 months)... but I am getting better and my PT thinks I will make a complete recovery, eventually. I'll believe it when I see it!

    Here are the indications for IDET:
    1. Back pain only rather than leg pain.
    2. Disc tear rather than herniation.
    3. Good disc height.
    4. Not overweight, non-smoker.
    5. In good health other than the back pain.
    6. No more than 2 bad discs.
    7. Positive indication on discogram.
    8. More than 6 months of disc pain.

    I have never heard of incontinence as a side-effect of IDET. I don't think that is a danger. Disc infection is the most serious side effect. Or the needle could hit a nerve.

    By the way, make sure your surgeon has done lots of IDETs. You really need an experienced guy. Say, minimum of 100 IDETs per year. Ask how many total IDETs he has done. What percentage of his patients get better, get worse, stay the same? Has he ever had a serious complication? It is surgery, and an inexperienced surgeon can give you life-long problems, so be careful. If you can avoid surgery, it's best to do so. You've only had the disc tear for 5 months, and discs heal VERRRRY slowly because they have no circulation. Expect a minimum of a year for them to heal, sometimes longer.

    By the way, have you tried the McKenzie exercises? I know someone who healed two herniated and one torn disc using mostly these exercises.

    I had pain from my disc tear for 4 years; it probably didn't heal because I didn't know the correct exercises & movements to do... and I was reinjuring it with my daily activity. I think if I had learned the McKenzie exercises before the IDET, they would have helped me and I could probably have healed the disc tear without surgery. Now that I know how much the IDET set me back, I really wish I could turn back time and undo the surgery!

    Fusion is really a last resort, and a big gamble. Some people end up worse after fusion, some do feel better for a while, but then later the disc above or below the fused level goes bad.

    Good luck with your decisions! Feel free to ask other questions if you need to.
    [img]http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/heart.gif[/img] Telzey

    ------------------
    4 years of back pain
    Annular tear L5-S1 diagnosed 5/02 via MRI
    IDET 12/2/02
    1/26/03 Posterior disc prolapse occurs after sitting too long after walking. Causes new pain down left leg.
    3/1/03 Leg pain reduced with exercises from the book "Treat Your Own Back" by Robin McKenzie.
    3/9/03 New buttock and thigh pain and numbness.
    3/25/03 Used McKenzie techniques to treat buttock and thigh pain -- pain reduced
    4/4/03 Started physical therapy
    5/8/03 Still worse than pre-IDET, but showing slow improvement with PT, McKenzie exercises, yoga, and Hanna Somatics exercises
    5/30/03 PT suggests buttock and thigh pain may be from facet joint

    [This message has been edited by Telzey (edited 06-26-2003).]
    __________________
    4 years of back pain, but was still able to work and maintain moderate activity (hiking, low-impact aerobic exercise)
    Annular tear L5-S1 diagnosed 5/02 via MRI
    IDET 12/2/02
    1/26/03 Posterior disc prolapse occurs after sitting too long after walking. Causes new pain down left leg.
    3/1/03 Leg pain reduced with exercises from the book "Treat Your Own Back" by Robin McKenzie.
    3/9/03 Severe, new buttock and thigh pain and numbness starts.
    3/25/03 Used McKenzie techniques to treat buttock and thigh pain -- pain reduced
    4/4/03 Started physical therapy
    5/8/03 Still worse than pre-IDET, but showing slow improvement with PT, McKenzie exercises, yoga, and Hanna Somatics exercises
    5/30/03 PT suggests buttock and thigh pain may be from facet joint
    7/6/03 Still worse than pre-IDET due to leg and thigh pain and numbness, and have become so inactive I can't tell whether back pain is better. Can't stand for any length of time, can't walk long, run at all, or do any aerobic activity. I regret agreeing to the IDET and wish I had had more patience with the natural healing process of my disc!

     
    Old 06-25-2003, 10:01 PM   #4
    eeyoretigger
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    Thank you both for your replies and advice !
    Right now, I'm not really sure what I should do....I'm willing to try just about anything to get better but I'm afraid of ending up worse

    according to all the indicators for IDET, I'm a perfect candidate. About the only variation is that I occasionally will get leg pain (perhaps once every week to two weeks and only for a few minutes)

    i definitely need to talk to my doctor more before i have anything done, i realize that. i just wanted advice/opinions from people who have gone through similar experiences. so thank you!!!!

    telzey, i know you said you're recovery is very slow and that you're regretting having the idet done. would you recommend that i wait and try to find out more about the mckenzie exercises and other non-surgical treatments like accupuncture first??

     
    Old 06-26-2003, 10:32 AM   #5
    Telzey
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    Hi eeyoretigger,
    Yes, I would definitely recommend trying all conservative treatments, like the McKenzie exercises, before you let someone burn your discs! Surgery should be thought of as a last resort when all other attempts have failed, or as an emergency treatment to prevent permanent nerve damage.

    I know it seems like forever to have been in pain, but I'm sorry to say that disc injuries take years to heal. By having the IDET, I was hoping for a quick fix, because I had become so impatient with my constant pain and my inability to lead an active life. Having the IDET injured my disc worse, so that now it will take it even longer to heal properly. Several years, probably. I wish I had just realized back in December that what I needed to do was devote several months to resting and healing my disc. If I had, I might be well and back to normal by now.

    Instead, what happened is that the IDET disabled me so badly I could barely get out of bed without excruciating pain. I couldn't even work at my desk job. I'm finally back at work, but I still can't lift over 5 lbs, walk very far, or sit very long. However, I am so much better than I was just 2 months ago that I no longer feel depressed. But I *could* do all those things pre-IDET, I just had some pain. What the IDET did for me, by making me so much worse, was adjust my attitude more than anything else. I realized how much better I was pre-IDET and how disabled it was possible to become! Now I have more patience to heal my disc. I realize that it will take a year or more, and after having been so badly disabled, I realize that there are worse things than not being able to sit on the floor or be active with my children. I now have the patience to stop looking for quick fixes.

    But, that's just my opinion and my particular story. I am anti-surgery because of how it turned out for me. There are others on this board who are very happy with their surgeries, and hopefully some of them will post so you can get other views.

    By the way, I posted a topic on an "interesting article on back surgery" a while back; you might try searching for that title.

    Best of luck,
    [img]http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/heart.gif[/img] Telzey

    ------------------
    4 years of back pain
    Annular tear L5-S1 diagnosed 5/02 via MRI
    IDET 12/2/02
    1/26/03 Posterior disc prolapse occurs after sitting too long after walking. Causes new pain down left leg.
    3/1/03 Leg pain reduced with exercises from the book "Treat Your Own Back" by Robin McKenzie.
    3/9/03 New buttock and thigh pain and numbness.
    3/25/03 Used McKenzie techniques to treat buttock and thigh pain -- pain reduced
    4/4/03 Started physical therapy
    5/8/03 Still worse than pre-IDET, but showing slow improvement with PT, McKenzie exercises, yoga, and Hanna Somatics exercises
    5/30/03 PT suggests buttock and thigh pain may be from facet joint
    __________________
    4 years of back pain, but was still able to work and maintain moderate activity (hiking, low-impact aerobic exercise)
    Annular tear L5-S1 diagnosed 5/02 via MRI
    IDET 12/2/02
    1/26/03 Posterior disc prolapse occurs after sitting too long after walking. Causes new pain down left leg.
    3/1/03 Leg pain reduced with exercises from the book "Treat Your Own Back" by Robin McKenzie.
    3/9/03 Severe, new buttock and thigh pain and numbness starts.
    3/25/03 Used McKenzie techniques to treat buttock and thigh pain -- pain reduced
    4/4/03 Started physical therapy
    5/8/03 Still worse than pre-IDET, but showing slow improvement with PT, McKenzie exercises, yoga, and Hanna Somatics exercises
    5/30/03 PT suggests buttock and thigh pain may be from facet joint
    7/6/03 Still worse than pre-IDET due to leg and thigh pain and numbness, and have become so inactive I can't tell whether back pain is better. Can't stand for any length of time, can't walk long, run at all, or do any aerobic activity. I regret agreeing to the IDET and wish I had had more patience with the natural healing process of my disc!

     
    Old 06-26-2003, 01:42 PM   #6
    bokes
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    Hi eeyoretigger,

    I think the benefit of the Idet is that if it doesn't work, you can always have the artificial disk operation later. But if it does work, great, you've avoided a very risky, major operation.

    The bad part is that you are risking a lot of time and money on a procedure with a not so great track record. The recovery for me was frustratingly looooong.

    My research led me to believe that 25% felt completely cured, 25% were somewhat worse, 25% felt much better, and 25% just a little better.

    In the end, i'd recommend the procedure if your tear isn't too bad and the disk looks like it is still in good shape. Do not do fusion!!!!

    btw, my doctor was the inventor of the Idet, dr Saal in the SF bay area. He's the best as far as i'm concerned.

    Hope this helps.

    -------------
    9/2001 Chiropractor tore 2 disks, L34 & L45 (+DDD)
    7/2002 IDET on both levels.
    6/2003 Discogram showed L34 cured, L45 still bad
    Pain level manageable, but activity causes chronic back spasms and inflammation
    Deciding on Prodisc or 2nd IDET

    [This message has been edited by bokes (edited 06-26-2003).]

    [This message has been edited by bokes (edited 06-27-2003).]

     
    Old 06-26-2003, 02:07 PM   #7
    successtory
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    Hi eeyoretigger,

    You are a perfect candidate for the IDET...however, the nucleoplasty is now in full swing to help you with your tear too. My own surgeon who specialized in IDETs is not only performing nucleoplastys because the recovery factor is half that of an IDET. I am now post-IDET (and nucleoplasty) 16 months and have been told this is as good as it's going to get. I can live with this (I guess I have to! ) hehe

    Your doctor may not be familiar with the nucleoplasty as he is with the IDET. If he were to look for candidacy elements of the nucleoplasty...he would find that you are also a great candidate for that procedure as well. The IDET gets heated up to between 70-90 C! The nucleoplasty gets heated up to between 70-90 F... which is quite hot enough thank you. This is the reason the nucleo has a faster recovery than the IDET. Good luck to you.


    ------------------
    successtory
    Oct 2000: Repetitive Stress Injury-Inverted Hernia
    Feb 2001: MRI. Shows only slight bulge at L4-L5
    Dec 2001: Discogram/CT scan shows Inverted Hernia at L5-S1. L4-L5 & L5-S1 ruptured in all 4 quadrants. Unable to walk.
    Feb 2002: IDET, Nucleoplasty, Intra-Discal Injections
    Sept 2002: Rated in the top 10% for successful patients. Retraining for new career.

     
    Old 06-26-2003, 02:49 PM   #8
    sksapp
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    Dear EeyoreTigger,

    Do not have a fusion. You are too young to shoot craps on whether you get better or worse. If you get worse, the horse is already out of the barn, so to speak, and you can never go back. There is a real risk of permanent nerve damage and chronic pain with a fusion.

    80% or annular tears heal. Try the McKenzie exercises and PT to learn how to move, sleep, sit, etc. to give the disks the best possible chance to heal. It may take a year or more, but give it more time and strengthen your key muscles and avoid positions that increase discal pressure, ie., laying on your stomach, sitting in a position where you are leaning forward, indian style on the floor, etc. A good PT can clue you in on the positions that pressurize those discs.

    Then, after a year, see where you are. Do not smoke. Do not run. Do no heavy lifting. Give it a real chance to heal. Then look at intradiscal injections and steroid injections to get it to settle down so it can heal. Then, if that doesn't work, look at nucleo and IDET. I am having a great outcome with my IDET but I know others don't feel as positive. You are young and if you want to have children you need to get this sorted out and healed up well now or you will struggle with it forever. Disc replacement may be an answer way down the line, but once your natural disc material is gone it is gone forever and you can't go back. ADR is not a simple answer or simple procedure and you are awful young to go on the cutting edge of back treatment technology.

    Others may feel differently and there is a wealth of information on this site. You will have hours of reading! I urge you to do that and do thorough research on nucleo, IDET, fusion, etc. See a thread that tennisnut started recently about pain without radiopathy and treatment options. Bottom line, see several doctors of several specialties, ortho, neuro, physiatrist, etc. Good luck and God bless. sksapp

     
    Old 06-27-2003, 11:58 PM   #9
    Steve K
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    Avoid fusion. Get an artificial disc. My recovery has been wonderful. I couldn't imagine going through the tramatic recovery involved with fusion and bone grafting. I know that ADR isn't for everyone, but I highly recommend it to those who qualify.

    ------------------
    L5/S1 Herniation from years of heavy weightlifting
    L5/S1 Discectomy/laminectomy 7/5/01 TBI
    L5/S1 Prodisc ADR 5/29/03 TBI

     
    Old 06-29-2003, 12:38 PM   #10
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    Do not get a fusion! There is no need for it anymore. Artifical Disc are proven to be the better choice, you just might have to wait a little while for the procedure to be approved. In the meantime you can give your disc a chance to heal, if you haven't already. I have had problems for two and half years now. I am 23 (so we are both about the same age). I know we are young to be having any kind of surgery on our spines, but the way I look at it is I am going to need this someday in my life. I might as well have it when I am young and I can bounce back quickly! Plus, I have tried EVERYTHING before surgery. I am not telling you to jump on the wagon that quickly. Just make sure in your mind that you know you have tried everything else out there besides surgery. It is a last resort. But if you find you did everything, and you are still in pain you should consider surgery.
    I will be having the artifical disc surgery in September and I will keep everyone updates on how it went. I go to the doctor tomorrow to fill out all the paperwork and gather all the information on it. I will be sure to share it with everyone! Take care!

     
    Old 06-29-2003, 06:37 PM   #11
    mmglobal
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    New technologies like artificial discs and dynamic stabilization (Dynesys) represent significant advances in treatment of spinal disorders. However, not all fusion candidates are good candidates for these treatments. For many, fusion still represents their best option.

    On these forums, we see poor fusion outcomes much more than successful ones. This is because the successes are out there living their lives, not hanging out on internet forums for people in pain. Fusion outcomes are not good enough, but a very significant percentage of them are successful.

    Everyone entertaining spine surgery should learn as much as they can about their options so they can make informed decisions. Unfortunately, our doctors are often the sources of a lot of bogus information. This is a very difficult process. Everyone's advice to avoid fusion is good advice, but if fusion is your best option, it must be done.

    Mark

     
    Old 06-29-2003, 09:18 PM   #12
    eeyoretigger
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    thanks again everyone for all your advice and opinions!

    all that's been said has definitely convinced me not to do fusion, not that it was much of an option for me. as far as the IDET, i think that now i'm more skeptical about having it. the recovery sounds much longer and harder than my doctor makes it out to be. the ADR definitely sounds like something that i'll need to keep an open mind about and keep looking into.

    i do go for yet another opinion for what to do but unfortunately it's not for another 3 weeks. sucks having to wait so long just to see a doctor!!! took my doctors 6 months to even figure out that i had a tear in my disc, mostly because it takes so darn long between visits!!!

    anyway, i appreciate everything people have said. it all helps me as i try to figure out what to do.
    i welcome more advice/opinions as i doubt i'll ever get enough.

    by the way, does any one who has pain while sitting having advice for what to do??? right now unfortunately the only place i can sit longer than to tie my shoes is on the toilet. not even those hemmerois/coccyx pillows seem to work.....


     
    Old 06-29-2003, 10:51 PM   #13
    Telzey
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    Hi eeyoretigger
    I was in the same position as you were with respect to sitting just a couple of months ago. What I did is buy a device called "The Back Seat" that unloads your spine as you sit. It straps around your waist and then has two hard plastic arms that rest on the chair and hold you up. It provides traction to the low back and really helped me when I couldn't sit.

    Also, I've heard of a traction vest that is a bit more complicated and expensive but works on the same principle, applying traction to the lumbar spine as you go about your daily life.

    Hope one of these devices can help you. Best of luck!
    [img]http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/heart.gif[/img] Telzey

    ------------------
    4 years of back pain
    Annular tear L5-S1 diagnosed 5/02 via MRI
    IDET 12/2/02
    1/26/03 Posterior disc prolapse occurs after sitting too long after walking. Causes new pain down left leg.
    3/1/03 Leg pain reduced with exercises from the book "Treat Your Own Back" by Robin McKenzie.
    3/9/03 New buttock and thigh pain and numbness.
    3/25/03 Used McKenzie techniques to treat buttock and thigh pain -- pain reduced
    4/4/03 Started physical therapy
    5/8/03 Still worse than pre-IDET, but showing slow improvement with PT, McKenzie exercises, yoga, and Hanna Somatics exercises
    5/30/03 PT suggests buttock and thigh pain may be from facet joint
    __________________
    4 years of back pain, but was still able to work and maintain moderate activity (hiking, low-impact aerobic exercise)
    Annular tear L5-S1 diagnosed 5/02 via MRI
    IDET 12/2/02
    1/26/03 Posterior disc prolapse occurs after sitting too long after walking. Causes new pain down left leg.
    3/1/03 Leg pain reduced with exercises from the book "Treat Your Own Back" by Robin McKenzie.
    3/9/03 Severe, new buttock and thigh pain and numbness starts.
    3/25/03 Used McKenzie techniques to treat buttock and thigh pain -- pain reduced
    4/4/03 Started physical therapy
    5/8/03 Still worse than pre-IDET, but showing slow improvement with PT, McKenzie exercises, yoga, and Hanna Somatics exercises
    5/30/03 PT suggests buttock and thigh pain may be from facet joint
    7/6/03 Still worse than pre-IDET due to leg and thigh pain and numbness, and have become so inactive I can't tell whether back pain is better. Can't stand for any length of time, can't walk long, run at all, or do any aerobic activity. I regret agreeing to the IDET and wish I had had more patience with the natural healing process of my disc!

     
    Old 06-29-2003, 10:53 PM   #14
    successtory
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    Hi eeyoretigger,

    You mentioned the hemerroid pillow. How about the tush cush? I LOVE MINE! Also, doing pelvic tilts while sitting helps relieve some of the fatigue in your back. Have you tried a TENS unit? (good only AFTER surgery). What about BioFreeze...great stuff! There is a gadget called the "BackSeat". It sounds like something that may be VERY helpful to you. Telzey has one of those, you might want to ask her how she likes hers. As far as I know, it takes her sitting time from 10-20 minutes to over an hour! Just a thought. Good luck to you.


    ------------------
    successtory
    Oct 2000: Repetitive Stress Injury-Inverted Hernia
    Feb 2001: MRI. Shows only slight bulge at L4-L5
    Dec 2001: Discogram/CT scan shows Inverted Hernia at L5-S1. L4-L5 & L5-S1 ruptured in all 4 quadrants. Unable to walk.
    Feb 2002: IDET, Nucleoplasty, Intra-Discal Injections
    Sept 2002: Rated in the top 10% for successful patients. Retraining for new career.

     
    Old 06-30-2003, 04:18 AM   #15
    mokita
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    Hi Eeyoretigger!

    You are getting great advice here. Not surprising, this is THE place to be if you need good "been there, done that" information or support from those same people [img]http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/love1.gif[/img]

    I would just add one thing. You say you did this in January? Was it 2003? It may seem like a very long time to you, but in the scheme of pain management, it's just reaching the 'time-frame' of "Long Enough". You just do NOT want to rush something that can have lifelong consequences. Read everything you can as the other posters have said. Only then can you be sure you're making best decision for YOU. You'd hate to do something and then have the "what if" floating thru your mind! :roll: I began having Serious back pain in Sept 2000. On and off... more and more... but, never got to a doctor that really tried to get at the source until March 2003. Don't get me wrong, my PCP is a very caring (overworked) man who tried to figure it out. Luckily - he finally sent me onto DO - then he sent me to NS - MRI w/ slight bulge and the PM doc finally did the discogram and found the tear. But the in-between time from appt to appt, Doc to Doc, procedure to procedure is maddening, I know. This place has given me information to arm myself with before my Next appt. Then, I too, will be playing 'the waiting game' after that, I'm sure!

    Take good care - keep asking questions - here and at docs - and Good Luck!!!

    Karen

    ------------------
    9/22/00 24 hour labor, baby posterior, left tailbone killing me
    12/00 MRI - PCP said nothing amiss - but, had to begin taking vicodin
    2/8/02 - 2nd baby born after long, painful pregnance as weight gain
    2000-11/02 various PT + pain meds
    11/02 Referred to Neuro
    3/03 NEW MRI - shows slight bulge L3-L4,slight DDD Neuro Refers to PM for ESI
    3/03 PM Doc orders ESI
    3/21,4/1,4/8 - ESI's no help
    5/9 - Discogram - shows Tear L4 w/ significant leak onto nerves, DDD
    Doc sched NEW discogram 'cuz performing doc oversedated, False Negative
    New Consult w/ Dept Head Cleveland Clinic 7/8

     
    Closed Thread

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