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    Old 10-25-2005, 10:34 PM   #1
    shining_star
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    Question Open Question for all diagnosed with BipolarI&II

    Hi there everyone,
    I have become really, genuinely concerned over the MEGA HIGH DOSES OF MEDS that other's seem to be on. How can this occurance be happening?? It concerns and distresses me to know that there are some out there on such high med doses psychiatrist's have an obligation to care and work holistically with their patients in an ethical manner. Is it that we become immune to meds so they are upped and upped? I just worry that some are on such high doses&have side-effects that the high dose could be the probelm not the med itself == I am concerned for you all so much please take care of yourselves Caring for humanitity
    Shining_Star

    Last edited by shining_star; 10-25-2005 at 10:41 PM.

     
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    Old 10-25-2005, 11:14 PM   #2
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    Re: Open Question for all diagnosed with BipolarI&II

    it is disgusting the amount and high doses of medication that people with BP disorder and any other mood disorder are being prescribed.
    but...doctors are paid to prescribe medication. they are selling it to the patient as a product because that is their job. to diagnose problems and prescribe something for it. and wouldnt you think that drug corporations will do anything to get a doctor to prescribe its brand of medication.....its all about money, even medicine. dont think that the medical community is not driven by money just because they're in the business of caring for peoples' health. its still a business
    im not saying that every doctor is doing this. i know there arent because i have found a doctor i trust and who genuinely cares about his patients. but ive been through 4 bad ones to find a good one. that speaks for itself.
    just warning to you all. ive been through it and i wouldnt want any of you to make uninformed choices concerning your mental health like i did.

     
    Old 10-26-2005, 09:18 PM   #3
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    Re: Open Question for all diagnosed with BipolarI&II

    Yeah, i definitely think that pdocs are getting perks from drug companies to up there doses of this and that drug. Meanwhile, the bipolars (i'm a BP I) suffer from ever-changing moods and terrible side-effects. It's pretty f___'in shameful.

     
    Old 10-27-2005, 03:04 AM   #4
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    Re: Open Question for all diagnosed with BipolarI&II

    Meds are a big issue for me right now...... and I think that the meds have made me become the queen ****** and that's not me at all..... I'm SO close to stopping them but I'm scared cause I don't know what it's like not to be on meds!!! I would rather be throwing things and punching things one minute and cying the next than to be the queen of all ******es ( LOL not like scratch itch add a b) I have bp 1 but in the other hand i've never gotten into trouble been in one fight never been to jail or had a speeding ticket (knock on wood) Im almost 23. I was diagnosed with depression and given zoloft at the age of 16, Let me add that they told me this after only 1 session with a doc and i couldn't talk cause i was so nervous, never went there again....... How can someone tell me im depressed after only one session?????


    Anyway, Yes I think some are over medicated...... and i think im one of them....

     
    Old 10-27-2005, 01:23 PM   #5
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    Re: Open Question for all diagnosed with BipolarI&II

    I am over-medicated. I am sick and tired seeing the world in beige.

     
    Old 10-27-2005, 01:47 PM   #6
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    Re: Open Question for all diagnosed with BipolarI&II

    Yes I also agree about meds. I know i'm on to many.I take meds for bp and depresstion and mantic mania and seisurezs I take so many it's hard to spell right lol.just kidding i just can't spell very good . after my doctors give me a certine med i look it up on the internet to see if it counter acts with my other meds and how .yes I usally have to tell my doctor that it doesn't go with one of my other med and he will tell me take it's not going to effect the others being seizure meds so i take it and like always i get sick and have to start all over agine doctor's arn't on the top of my list.

     
    Old 10-27-2005, 04:50 PM   #7
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    Re: Open Question for all diagnosed with BipolarI&II

    I agree with everyone, it's not right that Pdoc' and/or family doc's are dipping their hands in the med companies pockets. What about our health?? What about ethic's they agree to in med school?? What about active listening?? Thankyou for responding and having your say, it's nice to know that I'm not the only one concerned with those on high med doses. Some Pdoc's prefer patients that are in a medicated sedation, because they feel we are easier to manage. It is sad, it breaks my heart and I think of the break-down and horrible depression I had last year, a walking corpse, living in a daze and there is no way ANYONE should have to live like that.
    WE ALL DESERVE QUALITY OF LIFE. I would like to advocate for this to happen.
    ~desparately dispises human suffering~
    Shining_Star

    Last edited by shining_star; 10-27-2005 at 05:00 PM.

     
    Old 10-27-2005, 07:16 PM   #8
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    Exclamation Re: Open Question for all diagnosed with BipolarI&II

    I'm soooooo glad someone finally posted this issue.
    I'm also one of those who went to the doctor and they asked like 7 questions and, of course, prescribed Paxil, surprise surprise. Do you know how many people go through that exact pattern of going to the doctor and getting an SSRI??????? It makes me sick.
    I have been on: Epival, lithium, olanzipine, Remeron, Paxil, Seroquel, tryptophan pills to help me sleep, immovane, clonazepam, Adivan, Xanax (not all at once)...and I'm currently on Manerix and lamotrigine.
    I'm 20 BP 2 and I have been treated with one of as many as 6 of these medications at once, since I was 16.
    WHAT IS GOING ON?!?!?!? I'm so unbelievably happy to see others concerned about it...this is a serious issue and EVERYONE who takes any of these kinds of medications should be aware of this!!!
    The thing someone wrote about doctors preferring to keep people in a sedated stupor is disgusting but true and it makes sense- overworked stressed out doctors means theyre jeopardizing our mental health.
    IMFORM YOURSELVES. dont let others manipulate your minds into thinking what THEY want.

     
    Old 10-28-2005, 07:38 PM   #9
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    Re: Open Question for all diagnosed with BipolarI&II

    I do believe that you all have valid points, but the money that you are talking about in the med community may not all be for the doc's benefits. A person I work with helps doc's fund the building of medical facilities and we have had the same discussion as you all here, doc's are getting rich and are too directed by the pharmacutical corporate giants that lobby the government and want to push their drugs. I believe this is true to a certain degree however the doc's are also subject to malpractice insurance that eats up half their incomes, then if they belong to a hospital they owe the hospital a portion of your payment, then the nurses that make $36K working 25 hours a week need paid, then the rent and other costs and after all that the doc gets paid. Many doc's would like to see massive restructure in the medical system in the US, but the only other system model is like that of a socialistic political environment where people wait 3 mos. to see a doc about cancer (that can in that time turn terminal). We need to find a doc not afraid of the change in the system to get the system changed. Sorry to go on a tangent, I agree with you all but we can force change through writing our politicians and being proactive in voting in politicians that will promote change (they do not have to be radical, just proactive).

     
    Old 10-28-2005, 10:35 PM   #10
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    Re: Open Question for all diagnosed with BipolarI&II

    I think everyone is being a little too quick to judge here. If you feel over medicated it is your responsibility to do something about it. There are crummy doctors out there just as there are crummy cops, plumbers, teachers,
    and presidents.

    The current direction treatment for Bipolar Disorder is taking is towards pharmaceuticals. More and more doctors who practiced therapy are becoming
    pharmacologically oriented. And there is a trend for doctors to shy away from treating Bipolar patients due to the difficulty in achieving any kind of stability for a suspended length of time.

    Frankly, doctors make plenty of money on their patients rather than rely on the pharmaceurical companies. You can blame our government rather than the doctors for the outrageous costs of prescription medicines. Our government has it's hand in the pockets of the drug companies and visa versa. Doctors haven't a thing to do with the costs of drugs or what our government allows as far as price and availability to the public. If doctors were to take kick backs from drug companies it would be very easy to discover and they'd find their butts without a medical liscense cooling in jail with a roommate named Bubba.

    The reason we, as people with Bipolar Disorder, are subject to such seemingly
    random and irresponsible medication assignment is because nothing is really known about Bipolar. Drugs that work great for some people don't for others and more often that not stop working within months. Look at the drugs you've taken or are taking; most of them were created/designed for other illnesses. It was simply an after affect that caused someone to notice their effect on Bipolar.

    I think the only thing doctors can be certain about is that drug cocktails have
    some success on Bipolar. Given the complexities of Bipolar and it's individualistic nature, nothing is going to work for everyone and those drugs
    successful for one person are not going to work for another.

    Basic treatment is for a mood stabilizer, an antidepresent, anti psychotic (if
    needed), anti anxiety(if needed), and something for sleep (if needed). Often
    one medication for a sympton will not be enough so another is added to
    supplement the other. This is normal for all of the above medicines.

    I take 2 antidepressants, 2 mood stabilizers, one long lasting anti anxiety and
    one short term, I'm off anti-psychotics currently but any day I will need one or 2 again. If there were a specific drug designed for Bipolar it would address most of these issues if not all. You wouldn't consider yourself over medicated
    if you had only one pill to take everyday even though it contained all these
    medications, would you?

    I fear those who tell me I take too much medicine and try to worry me into stop taking them. Telling someone they are over medicated simply because they take a number of medications isn't helpful or responsible. Everyone of us
    (at least those who responded to this thread) admitted to taking many meds and feeling, if not worried about, being over medicated. That should tell you right off the bat that it is common for people with Bipolar to experience this
    form of therapy: pharmaceutically based.

    My concern is that it is becoming harder to find psychiatrists who still do therapy (talk therapy). More and more psychiatrists have narrowed their practices to drug maintance only. Talk about making money $90-$150 for a 15-20 minute visit. They don't need drug company kick backs to become wealthy. Therapy is essential in order to reach a stable state and working through issues that have come about due to having Bipolar. We didn't become this way overnight, there are lots of deep issues resulting from having Bipolar that no medication is going to fix. For me it is learning coping skills and salvaging what I consider to be a wasted life.

    I agree that I feel definitely over medicated. However, it stands to reason that I would feel something being I am taking some very powerful medications. I hate feeling this way. I hate having to live dependent on medications that are harmful to my body's wellbeing. I hate everyday waking up to another day of beige-ness, no highs no lows, everyday nothing special.
    I hate the way the meds sap my creativity, my initative, my desire to be alive. I am stable somewhat not but I am not happy, nothing inspires me, nothing brings me joy. I have no interest in anything. Without medication?
    Well I'd probably be permanently housed as a patient at the state mental hospital.

    The smartest decision I made regarding my Bipolar was to stop playing around with my medications, start taking them regularly and as prescribed. I take an active role in what I am being prescribed and make a point to know about not only the meds I take but others out there as well. Don't be afraid of your doctor, don't fear challenging him/her about issues you feel are not correct. If he/she acts like a jerk then find another doctor because odds are this one doesn't care about his patients. Some doctors are intimidated by intelligence and a well informed patient, if yours is dump him.

     
    Old 10-29-2005, 06:33 PM   #11
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    Re: Open Question for all diagnosed with BipolarI&II

    for the most part, I agree with the previous post. Maybe i should clarify what was meant by "over medicated" "high med doses"...it's wasn't meant to mean the number of med taken that had nothing to do with it. What was meant was the number of mg of that drug.
    It's well known that bipolar is a hard disorder to treat and be successful for the long term. I don't even beleive that comes into mind when treating, I feel that it's more about the short to mid term as far as treatment is concerned. We all require tweaking of meds too and that is acceptable. But, when someone writes complaining that their down, and sleepy all the time taking 600mg p/day of seroquel when all that another is taking is like 75mg p/day seroquel having a sedating mood stablizing effect...no other drugs were perscribed for that person ==how is that going to give them quality of life, the feeling that you can function throughout the day...without needing to sleep for the most of it rarely seeing the light of day and the sunshine and enjoying children if you have them, being able to concentrate long enough so as not to fall offf to sleep or in a dazy dream-like state. THAT IS WHAT I AM ELUDING TOO.
    ANYONE THAT HAS BEEN THROUGH SIMULAR WOULD BE WORRIED ABOUT THAT PERSON, ANYONE WITH AN OUNCE OF COMPASSION AND/OR EMPATHY WOULD WANT TO MAKE SURE THEY ARE OK, THAT YOUR THERE FOR THEM, TO VERBALISE THESE CONCERNS AND BRING ATTENTION TO THE DIFFERANT LEVELS OF MG'S IS BEING RESPONSIBLE. TO DO NOTHING IS IRRESPONSIBLE. TO TALK ABOUT IT SO THEY CAN QUERY THE DIFFERANCE IS ALSO BEING RESPONSIBLE IN CONCERN FOR YOUR HEALTH CARE.
    I have been through one of these medicated stupor; unable to function thoughout the day; unable to pull myself outta bed for the sleepy feeling far too strong; i had my b/f worried sick that i was like a corpse day in day out; he was worried that because of this effect that i would take my own life - after 2 attempts - he was **** scared to say the least. Yes it is a problem. I have being through it and thankfully although female had the balls to demand a med change, stood up to my Pdoc, and told him I still hated that med and the way it made me feel and I was more likely to suicide if he continued with that treatment. There are so many other's here that feel like I did, and I worry about them every single day, I come in here every day to make sure they are still posting, I come in here and see if by chance they feel slightly better.....more often they don't and it really worries me.

    When I was corpse-like I would have done anything for a beige-day better then almost 2 years of black, so black you can't see your hand in front of your face. So black that your child is scared and wondering why his mother can't get outta bed, so black that your b/f comes home for lunch JUST TO MAKE SURE YOUR STILL ALIVE! A depression so deep so black and feeling like it's pulling you further and further down that's what I'm talking 'bout. How I managed to keep alive i really don't know, thanks to my b/f and my son otherwise i would have been another bipolar suicide statistic.

    Shining_Star ** that now shines but once didn't even spark**

     
    Old 10-29-2005, 11:08 PM   #12
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    Re: Open Question for all diagnosed with BipolarI&II

    although i agree with the last few posts, in being too quick to judge, im not speaking from the perspective of someone who is witnessing this, im speaking from someone who has lived through it.
    i just find the people who are informed about the dangers and side effects of mind-altering medications are few and far between.
    telling someone who is on the verge of life and death from their own actions that a pill will make them feel better is in my mind, manipulative unless you tell them that one pill leads to 3 and then to 6 if they dont work...and the other option is to wait until you go out of your mind .most people who are in the early stages of being treated and diagnosed with depression or any other mood disorder are desperate to feel normal again, but are usually ignorant to both sides of the story..when doctors told me this will cure your anxiety, this will make you sleep, this will make you less depressed, this will curb the mood swings, i jumped at the chance. it didnt matter how many pills i was on, i just wanted to feel better.
    this goes to say that although people are responsible for their own actions and decisions about their treatment, its hard to see through the fog clearly to be able to make any choice at all....you want out. at whatever cost.
    of course there are those who arent so far in the hole that they can make clear and informed choices....and those of us who are on the medications that are working for them....
    i would like someone to please explain to me the EPIDEMIC of people being prescribed anti depressants and SSRIs. do women with bad PMS really need antidepressants?? why are these "disorders" suddenly appearing after the discovery of SSRIs??
    my mom has been telling me this for years now, and im only now realizing that shes been right the whole time...i was in denial that doctors could do anything wrong...it just pisses me off to see people with such authority toying with us like we're lab rats.
    i think realistically that i would rather be dead than to walk around like a zombie, popping pills like candy just so i can continue to have vital signs...

     
    Old 11-03-2005, 09:11 AM   #13
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    Re: Open Question for all diagnosed with BipolarI&II

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by batmatic
    I think everyone is being a little too quick to judge here. If you feel over medicated it is your responsibility to do something about it. There are crummy doctors out there just as there are crummy cops, plumbers, teachers,
    and presidents.

    The current direction treatment for Bipolar Disorder is taking is towards pharmaceuticals. More and more doctors who practiced therapy are becoming
    pharmacologically oriented. And there is a trend for doctors to shy away from treating Bipolar patients due to the difficulty in achieving any kind of stability for a suspended length of time.

    Frankly, doctors make plenty of money on their patients rather than rely on the pharmaceurical companies. You can blame our government rather than the doctors for the outrageous costs of prescription medicines. Our government has it's hand in the pockets of the drug companies and visa versa. Doctors haven't a thing to do with the costs of drugs or what our government allows as far as price and availability to the public. If doctors were to take kick backs from drug companies it would be very easy to discover and they'd find their butts without a medical liscense cooling in jail with a roommate named Bubba.

    The reason we, as people with Bipolar Disorder, are subject to such seemingly
    random and irresponsible medication assignment is because nothing is really known about Bipolar. Drugs that work great for some people don't for others and more often that not stop working within months. Look at the drugs you've taken or are taking; most of them were created/designed for other illnesses. It was simply an after affect that caused someone to notice their effect on Bipolar.

    I think the only thing doctors can be certain about is that drug cocktails have
    some success on Bipolar. Given the complexities of Bipolar and it's individualistic nature, nothing is going to work for everyone and those drugs
    successful for one person are not going to work for another.

    Basic treatment is for a mood stabilizer, an antidepresent, anti psychotic (if
    needed), anti anxiety(if needed), and something for sleep (if needed). Often
    one medication for a sympton will not be enough so another is added to
    supplement the other. This is normal for all of the above medicines.

    I take 2 antidepressants, 2 mood stabilizers, one long lasting anti anxiety and
    one short term, I'm off anti-psychotics currently but any day I will need one or 2 again. If there were a specific drug designed for Bipolar it would address most of these issues if not all. You wouldn't consider yourself over medicated
    if you had only one pill to take everyday even though it contained all these
    medications, would you?

    I fear those who tell me I take too much medicine and try to worry me into stop taking them. Telling someone they are over medicated simply because they take a number of medications isn't helpful or responsible. Everyone of us
    (at least those who responded to this thread) admitted to taking many meds and feeling, if not worried about, being over medicated. That should tell you right off the bat that it is common for people with Bipolar to experience this
    form of therapy: pharmaceutically based.

    My concern is that it is becoming harder to find psychiatrists who still do therapy (talk therapy). More and more psychiatrists have narrowed their practices to drug maintance only. Talk about making money $90-$150 for a 15-20 minute visit. They don't need drug company kick backs to become wealthy. Therapy is essential in order to reach a stable state and working through issues that have come about due to having Bipolar. We didn't become this way overnight, there are lots of deep issues resulting from having Bipolar that no medication is going to fix. For me it is learning coping skills and salvaging what I consider to be a wasted life.

    I agree that I feel definitely over medicated. However, it stands to reason that I would feel something being I am taking some very powerful medications. I hate feeling this way. I hate having to live dependent on medications that are harmful to my body's wellbeing. I hate everyday waking up to another day of beige-ness, no highs no lows, everyday nothing special.
    I hate the way the meds sap my creativity, my initative, my desire to be alive. I am stable somewhat not but I am not happy, nothing inspires me, nothing brings me joy. I have no interest in anything. Without medication?
    Well I'd probably be permanently housed as a patient at the state mental hospital.

    The smartest decision I made regarding my Bipolar was to stop playing around with my medications, start taking them regularly and as prescribed. I take an active role in what I am being prescribed and make a point to know about not only the meds I take but others out there as well. Don't be afraid of your doctor, don't fear challenging him/her about issues you feel are not correct. If he/she acts like a jerk then find another doctor because odds are this one doesn't care about his patients. Some doctors are intimidated by intelligence and a well informed patient, if yours is dump him.
    Bravo,what wonderfull insight into bi polar.I'm like you in many ways.I do know that i need my meds , hate my meds,but trust my dr. after many hospitalizations he's not pushin drugs,he's seen my dark side and is just as affraid of it as I am.Thank you for your post
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    Old 11-11-2005, 09:54 AM   #14
    Picali
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    Re: Open Question for all diagnosed with BipolarI&II

    A really interesting post that I felt I'd like to respond to.

    I had similar concerns about the meds I was on. At my illest, I'd have allowed them to cut my limbs off if someone had told me it would stop the depression, and my relief when, finally, a combination worked and the depression lifted, is indescribable.

    However, I quickly found that the side effects soon became as problematic as the depression. I gained a huge amount of weight, my memory was poor, I was unable to work as my brain just didn't funcion like it used to (I'm a teacher - you need to be on the ball!). I was constantly hungry, had awful headaches, dry mouth, dizzy spells, felt exhausted constantly (despite being unconscious for 10 to 12 hours a night). I was forever on the toilet and generally felt like a shadow of my former self.

    I started researching alternatives and found that a combination of homeopathy and talk therapy restored me to my usual self and I have now been med free for six months with no problems at all. I obviously keep a close eye on myself and work closely with my homeopath so that, if I feel a wobble coming on, I can call her immediately and she treats me straight away. She was happy to treat me whilst I was on my meds and I worked in conjunction with her and my psych regarding coming off the conventional stuff when we all felt it was safe. I am prepared to go back on meds if, at some point, the homeopathy doesn't work, but at the present time I feel better than I've felt in a long time.

    I'd highly recommend people researching complementary therapies and most complementary therapists are very happy to work with 'regular' docs. At the very least, they can often counteract the side effects which at least gives you some respite from that. It is, obviously, vital that you never, ever just stop taking meds and that anything you do is discussed in full with all people concerned before any decisions are made. There is a lot of information available and it is well worth wading through some of it.

    I hope that this is helpful to some people. To give you an idea of how well I am these days, I rarely post here anymore as i just don't have a need - I used to be on here several times a day and post regularly.

    Hoping all are well

    Best wishes

    Picali x

     
    Old 11-12-2005, 06:46 PM   #15
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    Re: Open Question for all diagnosed with BipolarI&II

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Picali
    A really interesting post that I felt I'd like to respond to.

    I had similar concerns about the meds I was on. At my illest, I'd have allowed them to cut my limbs off if someone had told me it would stop the depression, and my relief when, finally, a combination worked and the depression lifted, is indescribable.

    However, I quickly found that the side effects soon became as problematic as the depression. I gained a huge amount of weight, my memory was poor, I was unable to work as my brain just didn't funcion like it used to (I'm a teacher - you need to be on the ball!). I was constantly hungry, had awful headaches, dry mouth, dizzy spells, felt exhausted constantly (despite being unconscious for 10 to 12 hours a night). I was forever on the toilet and generally felt like a shadow of my former self.

    I started researching alternatives and found that a combination of homeopathy and talk therapy restored me to my usual self and I have now been med free for six months with no problems at all. I obviously keep a close eye on myself and work closely with my homeopath so that, if I feel a wobble coming on, I can call her immediately and she treats me straight away. She was happy to treat me whilst I was on my meds and I worked in conjunction with her and my psych regarding coming off the conventional stuff when we all felt it was safe. I am prepared to go back on meds if, at some point, the homeopathy doesn't work, but at the present time I feel better than I've felt in a long time.

    I'd highly recommend people researching complementary therapies and most complementary therapists are very happy to work with 'regular' docs. At the very least, they can often counteract the side effects which at least gives you some respite from that. It is, obviously, vital that you never, ever just stop taking meds and that anything you do is discussed in full with all people concerned before any decisions are made. There is a lot of information available and it is well worth wading through some of it.

    I hope that this is helpful to some people. To give you an idea of how well I am these days, I rarely post here anymore as i just don't have a need - I used to be on here several times a day and post regularly.

    Hoping all are well

    Best wishes

    Picali x
    thank you so very much for the info.
    Maybe you could post here more i mean that you are well.the boards aren't here only for perplexed illness with mmedication questions.It might be self sacrificing but i'm sure it would be worth it to you.
    you may be in the need to post 2 or 3 timmes a day again,i hope not.stay well god bless your taking time. things change sommetimmes
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    Last edited by 5alive; 11-12-2005 at 06:47 PM.

     
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