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Genabeena 05-25-2004 08:44 PM

Re: From Man Apart.............To Geena and anyone else who cares.
Hi Enoch. I loved your pottery wheel story. I think you should have it published. I love your little thing about Man Apart in bunny slippers too. You make me feel really happy. Do you really have a pitbull? Yikes!

I'm doing the "small-talk" thing because I'm waiting up for Man Apart, and I noticed you were here.

Man Apart 05-25-2004 10:47 PM

Re: From Man Apart.............To Geena and anyone else who cares.
Go home and go to bed Gena.

Man Apart 05-25-2004 10:50 PM

Re: From Man Apart.............To Geena and anyone else who cares.
I love you Gena..... go home.

lori j 05-25-2004 10:51 PM

Re: From Man Apart.............To Geena and anyone else who cares.
[QUOTE=sgibson]Man Apart,

I don't mind answering your questions. My physical health has deteriorated over the years. I had a spinal fusion with titanium cages in January of this year. I have been suffering with my back problems for several years and took the big leap to have surgery. We have always had a very active lifestyle. We believed in "living" life to the fullest with our children. Took them camping, hiking, boating, basically anything that had to do with being outside. We have always been very involved in little league sports with our children. Not just sitting on the sidelines, but getting involved. Coaching and different things. I guess the reason our marriage has worked as long as it has is because we are both so devoted to our children. Anyway, as my back got progressively worse, I had to withdraw from "participating" in these activities. We would also take mini-vacations every month. Our financial situation has changed dramatically for a number of reasons so we are no longer able to even take the mini-vacations. (Hubby lost his job of 16 years in June of 03 due to company closing. Then in November of 03, I had to quit work for good due to my health. I am still fighting for my SSDI benefits. Because of all of this we are now living on about 50,000 less a year.) Hubby did find another job almost right away because of his experience. The company he now works for found out about the other company closing and called him. He never even applied to them. So we were thankful for that, but he did have to take a large pay cut. We live in a very rural area and there just aren't any jobs around here that pay what he was making.

You mentioned that you never want to hurt this bad again. Well, that was my reason for settling. You see, I was scared to death of ever feeling that way again. I never wanted to hurt like that again and I knew he didn't have the power to do that to me. Maybe I was wrong for looking at it like that, maybe not. I do love my husband. I realize I didn't make that clear in my original post. No, I was not "in love" with him when we were married, but our marriage grew to something more comfortable. It's more like a mutual respect and devotion not that heart pounding, palms sweating, hormones racing type of "love". Things are not that great for us right now because of my health and the added stress of the financial situation. But we just have to adjust to this new way of life. Our children will also have to make some adjustments. But the type of marriage we have will survive this "breach of contract". It's what works for us. Because our marriage doesn't depend solely on what other peoples definition of love is, it can survive things others cannot.

In my opinion the marriages that last eventually settle into more of a strong commitment to one another. I don't think the head over heals can't live without the other person type of love stays that way, I think over time it sort of fades. If you are one of the lucky ones,it grows into the strong commitment, if you are in the majority, one of the people in that relationship searches for that heart pounding love elsewhere. I think if you are in the later group, you will spend your life chasing that initial "love". Personally, I could not stand going through the ups and downs of that. I prefer a more stable commitment. And no, I don't mind being the "trophy wife". It's actually flattering. To this day, if someone stares a little too long, my husband will scream at them "what in the hell are you looking at?"

Who knows, maybe when the children are grown, the variables in the "contract" may change too much to adapt to. And just maybe, we may find it still works for us.

If you don't think you can live without that heart pounding love, then by all means go for it. I, however, could not take the chance of being hurt that deeply ever again. I'm the once burnt, twice shy type of person.

Good luck.

God Bless,

Just read this post, I also have been fighting back problems for years. Had a herniated disc 4 years ago & luckily physical therapy McKenzie method fixed it,but now I am fighting horrible sciatica pain & am grounded to the couch for a week. I also suffer from depression & panic attacks. Boy, it's never just one thing, is it. How is your back since the surgery, do you still have pain?

lori j 05-25-2004 10:53 PM

Re: From Man Apart.............To Geena and anyone else who cares.
[QUOTE=Man Apart]Lori J. I appreciate so so much that you would put yourself in a painful situation just to recommend a book for me. I have ot admit, the way my mind is now its hard fo rm eto sit and focus on a good read. Bu till try. Um, the lexapro um, ummm, I um, kind of um, stopped taking it. I know, its very counter-productive of me. I started back taking them today. Ive falling completely off the wagon. Im binging on food, i lay around all day now that i lost my job and exercising is a after-thought. I had my most potent anti-depressant taken from me basically and im just in bad shape right now. Keep me up to date with everything, I hope it all goes well.[/QUOTE]
Man, I was in horrible pain all day, not a good day for me at all. I am over my limit for being on here, but I want to say "get back on the wagon"! NOW!!! I always have more than one thing wrong at a time, never can be just one. Figures, I finally find an AD that works & my back acts up! That sure doesn't help my depression at all & could not read any of the book today at all, was in too much pain. You keep on keeping on & try the book, what have we got to lose??? :)

Man Apart 05-25-2004 10:57 PM

Re: From Man Apart.............To Geena and anyone else who cares.
And dont worry, please. Im not worth losing sleep over, im not worth sheding a single tear, im certainly not worth the sorrow or anxiety. I wouldnt be so cruel and uncaring to write my last words on this board and hurt any of you. Im sorry if you deciphered that to be the case. Its not. Im not gonna deny right now im in a world of pain. But, i wouldnt do that to any of you. Im fine for tonight. Hope for tomorrow.

enoch 05-25-2004 11:08 PM

Re: From Man Apart.............To Geena and anyone else who cares.
glad to see your post man apart

Genabeena 05-26-2004 01:13 AM

Re: From Man Apart.............To Geena and anyone else who cares.
[I]How can I sleep[/I]? How can anyone expect a person to sleep when things are not right? That's one thing I never got about my husband. We could be in the middle of a terrible fight. I could be absolutely in tears and beside myself, and then all of a sudden, with the drop of a hat, without resolving anything, he could just turn over, put his head down and be asleep within seconds. Maybe some people think that makes me dramatic and unreasonable, but the truth is, I'm an insomniac. If something's not right- especially with a close friend- it's not a matter of [I]I won't sleep[/I], it's a matter of [I]I can't sleep[/I]. I don't understand how people can be any different.

enoch 05-26-2004 06:38 AM

Re: From Man Apart.............To Geena and anyone else who cares.
hey geena - your not alone - I know exactly what your saying my third wife did this to the tee - fighting - arguing and then at the most intense moment -she would just say goodnight roll over and go to sleep in moments - later it was discovered that she was a borderling personality disordered gal. Which means she could not really feel my emotions but only mimic responses to them like she knew from the reality of life around her - when I left her I was running to save total destruction of my self esteem and emotions.
years later by way of friends of friends i have hear that even though she remarried she is still reporting how she once loved a man very deeply but it did not work out - she never even understood why I ran away so fast. I have never in all the years since ever felt even a twinge of sorrow in getting the heck away from her..

now geena we can wait for man apart together. like sitting in a bus station in detriot waiting for an old friend to arrive back.. feeling safety in number from the crustaceans and other bottom feeders of emotion that makes us fear for his safety.

Genabeena 05-26-2004 07:07 AM

Re: From Man Apart.............To Geena and anyone else who cares.
You are very sweet and sympathetic, Enoch. I'm lucky to have a friend like you. I feel much better just having heard from Man that he was o.k. That's all I wanted to hear. I do still fear losing him, but it's not as urgent as last night when I saw that one morbid post. I know he cannot help it. I don't blame him at all. But I still have to do my job as a friend. It's called devotion.

Man Apart 05-26-2004 12:15 PM

Re: From Man Apart.............To Geena and anyone else who cares.
:'(....... Saying sorry wont matter. My sorry's are empty, lack substance. I seem to always make the same mistakes over and over. No matter what i do. No matter how hard I try. The only people that get hurt, is those I care about the most. If I cant be a productive member of this board then what I am. Just a whiny little kid. I take you guys for granted. I cant anymore. I want to say something now but, Im speechless, yeah imagine that. I dont know what to say. I could never imagine I could have come to this board and be so greatly influenced by people. I truly care about you all.

Last night I read the post from Gena worried about me and I backspaced to the board homepage where at the bottom of the page it lists all of the usernames of those online. And there was Genabeena and Enoch right next to each other. I looked at the time and I cried. What am I doing to these people. They care about me so much. :'(..... And all I do is bleed on them. Im defiant to anything they say, Im difficult and pessimistic and now, i did the one thing i feared most and thats hurting you.

Im sorry, I just cant find the words right now. I feel so grateful. Yet, im concern. You have no idea how much I care about you Gena. And how grateful I am to you and enoch, and merf, and lori, mouse, angel, and etc. I want to be a better friend. And someday i will. But right now I cant help feeling that im a cancer on this board. I sit here and feel my tears and my anxiety and darkness and i just type it all out. Dumping all my problems out.

Ill be ok. Im in a better mood. I talk to you guys more than I talk to my own family. I feel ashamed. But last night I think I realized, I need to learn to accept love when its being given to me. Thank you for this love.

enoch 05-26-2004 12:20 PM

Re: From Man Apart.............To Geena and anyone else who cares.
geena - you seem so famished for just one friendly hand - and man apart wants one real opened heart to find him. all enoch has is some words to give but they seem real enough - perhaps they fall short but I am throwing them as hard as I can to reach you - in this life for some of us the mystery of bad chemistry combines with trying to see so deeply into the mystery of why? and this is heavy weight that meds can treat but never cure - saint john of the cross addresses this in his book DARK NIGHT OF THE SOUL and the unknown author of the book THE CLOUD OF UNKNOWING also addresses it - we can look into the mystery of it all and only see more mystery. and both at some point say "do not pray with words" - so words are useless to reach past the mystery - what is left? moments shared as best we can while waiting for the bus. and we have words and we have what they might mean - but often even that is a mystery. so then we have feelings but even feelings leave us stranded - how many times have our feelings been miss understood -and not just by others but even by ourselves. more mystery.

but we have freewill in how we spend our time on the bench waiting for the bus - we can worry it will not arrive - we can fidget - we can smile at each other or crack a newspaper and ignore each other or we can hold hands and be aware of each other.
I dont post many responses to med questions although I have been on just about all them at some time or another have researched them and could respond but how can I say to others who pin their hopes on them that sometimes as in my case they are worthless. some states are static and some states come to stay - how do you tell others the best med you have found is spending time learning to not fidget on the bench and to enjoy the conversation that is there - while it is there - and if they have to go or you have to go when your bus comes - note it and smile and wish them luck.

man apart you have never been far off the mark regarding the realness of what love can do in a heart - I am 25 years ahead of you in time - and you see it clearly enough. for me just the fact that it could happen at any moment in time has been enough to keep me here - trying not to fidget - because sometimes we are blessed with a smile that meets ours at the exact same moment in time - where they arrive right on time.

man apart you have brought so many thoughts of god into my life and beyond the thoughts the feelings -- more than church has brought to me in a long time - never know who god will use to preach through - or in despite of. lol

geena I hope your doing okay - I don't know why but something about you reminds me of the fisher king story. as I see you helping man apart.

so you show me god too.

man apart just read your last post - listen don't be ashamed of your feelings as you feel them - what kind of friends would we be to you if we only wanted you when you was on top of things? would rather have you bleed on me than have you bleeding alone on yourself - and when you get dark thats the time to light a candle and write - before it consumes you into its loneliness for ever. trust me I would bleed on you all over the place in order to try to keep living.. so say what your feeling - we will not turn away from you.

Genabeena 05-26-2004 01:49 PM

Re: From Man Apart.............To Geena and anyone else who cares.
I am sorry I flew off the handle a little bit last night. I will try harder to keep cool. I know I can do this. Because turning on the panic light will never be helpful. It's just the mother in me that makes me prone to do that.

You are 100% correct about everything you said, Enoch. I am desperate- "famished," as you put it. And I don't like to go around telling people that, but I have to admit my feelings. When I found you people here on this board, it felt like I had discovered the cure for cancer. It makes no difference to me that it's "only through a computer screen." It is what it is. To me, it's a community- something that I very much need.

The fact that we're all depressed doesn't make this community any less valuable to me (in many ways it's better that way.) And I accept every part of this community- the positives, the negatives, the things I gain from it, the things I give to it. I guess I just want to say, that you folks can never do wrong by me.

And I also want to give a reminder now that I will be venturing off for my job interviews from June 1st through the 6th or 7th, so for that week I might be rather scrunched as far as Internet time goes. Also, I'm going to be hunkering down to prepare for the trip from now through the first. You'll all be in my heart.

BTW, check out this lady on Her username (or handle) is polyonymous. I don't know how much access you can gain w/out membership, but standard membership is free anyway.

Take Care!

enoch 05-26-2004 05:07 PM

Re: From Man Apart.............To Geena and anyone else who cares.
just had a friend who moved from chicago after 22 years to osprey florida - he reports its muggy then laughs and says that is suppose to go away in a couple of months - he had forgotten the humidity from our seabee days when we lived in mississippi and puerto rico - I interviewed for job in saint petersburg back when i was still working - very pretty all around there - stayed in sarasota for a few weeks and then slept in some bushes in miami for a few nights - yes it was a well rounded adventure.. hope all goes well with your quest for better life - and if nothing else enjoy the newness and adventure of it all geena -

Ishq 05-26-2004 05:41 PM

Re: From Man Apart.............To Geena and anyone else who cares.
hey man apart...
I am new to this board. I have been reading many of your and other's posts here. my two cents you get a chance to exercise a lot? Daily exercise, both muscular and aerobic (running works wonders), has greatly increased my confidence, energy and outlook on life. I'm sorry, I know you don't know me too well and vice versa...but I know that exercise, especially cardiovascular, really makes my life a lot easier, and I am just trying to help u out a little bit :). Give me a reply if you like.

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