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    Old 12-11-2005, 08:48 AM   #61
    skyguy
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    Re: Aspartame Urban Legend

    In regards to aspertame...It doesn't matter. If you care about your health at all, you shouldn't drink pop at all, diet or regular. Both have enough bad chemicals and are so acidic that you should never put them in your body. It's no wonder this(The USA) is pretty much the sickest country in the world, the way we eat and drink.

     
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    Old 12-11-2005, 03:37 PM   #62
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    Re: Aspartame Urban Legend

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by skyguy
    In regards to aspertame...It doesn't matter. If you care about your health at all, you shouldn't drink pop at all, diet or regular. Both have enough bad chemicals and are so acidic that you should never put them in your body. It's no wonder this(The USA) is pretty much the sickest country in the world, the way we eat and drink.
    Good point. we Argue about the safety or not.......but Sky guy is right...if you want to be healthy dont drink either.


    But I will say....I have started to have Kefir...and If I dont add some splenda to it it tstes like crap!

     
    Old 12-11-2005, 05:13 PM   #63
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    Re: Aspartame Urban Legend

    Pip..why don't you just add fruit and get the natural sugars out of it instead of the aspertame?

     
    Old 12-11-2005, 06:09 PM   #64
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    Re: Aspartame Urban Legend

    Or stevia, which is derived from a plant. I don't know how well raw honey mixes with kefir, but if it mixes well, you could also add that. It is best to avoid all artificial sweetners. They MIGHT do no harm, but they certainly do no good, while real food that is sweet in moderation(honey, fruit) can be good for you.

     
    Old 12-11-2005, 09:07 PM   #65
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    Re: Aspartame Urban Legend

    Yes...but I like the Taste of splenda...and as I mentioned before. ...Being a diabetic I feel the benefit IT gives out weighs any possible Potential problems with it. I might try stevia If I can fin it anywhere near me....but as wee all know from this Topic..the safety of Artificial sweetners does not really concern me that much.

     
    Old 12-12-2005, 10:13 AM   #66
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    Re: Aspartame Urban Legend

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by skyguy
    In regards to aspertame...It doesn't matter. If you care about your health at all, you shouldn't drink pop at all, diet or regular. Both have enough bad chemicals and are so acidic that you should never put them in your body. It's no wonder this(The USA) is pretty much the sickest country in the world, the way we eat and drink.
    Hmm, well i don't know about the sickest country in the world. Maybe the most obese, but despite what we hear in the drama-loving media every day, Americans have been shown to be healthier than we have ever been. Our life spans keep increasing and the other day the news was reporting that deaths from cancer, heart disease and stroke have decreased in the last few years.

    I'm pretty sure drinking soda isn't going to be a cause of death in an otherwise healthy person - more likely culprits are junk food, smoking, sedentary lifestyles, etc. Let's not go crazy now - I care about my health and am a very healthy person who enjoys a diet coke a few times a week.

     
    Old 12-12-2005, 02:06 PM   #67
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    Re: Aspartame Urban Legend

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mjewell
    Hmm, well i don't know about the sickest country in the world. Maybe the most obese, but despite what we hear in the drama-loving media every day, Americans have been shown to be healthier than we have ever been. Our life spans keep increasing and the other day the news was reporting that deaths from cancer, heart disease and stroke have decreased in the last few years.

    I'm pretty sure drinking soda isn't going to be a cause of death in an otherwise healthy person - more likely culprits are junk food, smoking, sedentary lifestyles, etc. Let's not go crazy now - I care about my health and am a very healthy person who enjoys a diet coke a few times a week.
    If pop is not a junk food then junk food doesn't exist. Deaths from all those things may be decreasing, but diagnosises are increasing. Of course it's good to treat these things, but it's a heck of a lot smarter to prevent them.

     
    Old 12-15-2005, 12:43 PM   #68
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    Re: Aspartame Urban Legend

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by skyguy
    If pop is not a junk food then junk food doesn't exist. Deaths from all those things may be decreasing, but diagnosises are increasing. Of course it's good to treat these things, but it's a heck of a lot smarter to prevent them.
    You know, I think there is a very important issue being overlooked here. As a rule (I will speak from the point of view of the USA) the average person in todays society has a relatively poor diet overall. We have accepted the fast food and prepackaged processed foods as the norm. We even gravitate towards processed "healthy" foods in boxes when we decide to eat healthier. We resort to manmade, un-natural chemicals to replace the natural alternatives in our diets.

    I think it is fair to say that an individual who is drinking diet soda, in all likelyhood has a poor overall diet to go along with it. Now, please don't go asking me for scientific research because my data is 100% empirical. I have been around for 38 years and have witnessed this. I once had a horrible nutritional plan. I have learned my lesson that poor diet leads to poor health. As my blood pressure began to rise, and my weight began to rise, and then I had a ministroke at age 32, I realized that there was a good chance my nutrition was the biggest culprit in this deterioration.

    I researched, and found the ways to go as natural as possible in my environment. I eat natural foods, drink water and juices (and of course beer). I eat plenty of fruit and lots of vegetables and limit the intake of meats. Subsequently, my blood pressure dropped dramatically, my weight has decreased to the low end of my "healthy range" and I have had no further indications that another mini stroke is in the future. Of course this is one of those things that you never know about, however just the overall better health, I believe will reduce that possibility.

    The point I am trying to make is that if you truely evaluate your nutritional plan as it is, you will likely find that it is poor. If you are battliing to support the use of Aspartame, your diet probably has many other aspects of it that are quite unsound. I realize that some of you have diabetes, and that is why you use artificial sweeteners. In such case I say find something else that satisfies you. For instance, my blood pressure was high and that makes salt an enemy. I love salt. I was one of those people who would give away the pretzels so that I could dump the salt and crumbs from the bag into my mouth. But the re-vamp of my diet did not include a spot for salt. I replaced the desire for salt with spice. Hot peppers and such.

    Additionally, I would not doubt that when you evaluate your nutrition and fix your diet such that it is excellent, you may find that the symptoms of the diabetes will reduce. Remember, your body is only as healthy as the nutrition you give it.

    Are man made chemicals anything but bad for your body? Your body has evolved through time to tolerate and require certain substances. When you pump manmade substances into it, the body MUST respond in some manner. When man made chemicals are considered for human consumption we must immediately assume that they are not good for us. This thread should not be about whether Aspartame is bad for you or not. This thread should simply be about whether or not the risks are severe enough for you to not use it. We seem to place a lot of stock in "research". As a scientific person, my education has taught me that your research can show you what you desire it to (within reason). I am a test engineer and I know that I can craft a test procedure to show that our product has endured thorough testing and has passed them all. However I know that I can craft the testing of the weaknesses to not show their negative impact.

    One thing that I have found through the improvement of my diet is that when you remove sugar as I have, after the initial shock of no longer having it (as well as salt) you really begin to desire the tast of that which the sugar and salt were hiding. I regularly eat air popped pocorn. Now that my tastes have learned to not require heavy doses of salt, fat, and sugar, I can relly taste the popcorn. It does have taste. Normally it is considered to be very bland because our bodies have become so acustomed to floods of flavor, that we can no longer taste subtle flavors.

    Eating healthy is a lifestyle change.

     
    Old 12-15-2005, 12:58 PM   #69
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    Re: Aspartame Urban Legend

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by fiskj
    You know, I think there is a very important issue being overlooked here. As a rule (I will speak from the point of view of the USA) the average person in todays society has a relatively poor diet overall. We have accepted the fast food and prepackaged processed foods as the norm. We even gravitate towards processed "healthy" foods in boxes when we decide to eat healthier. We resort to manmade, un-natural chemicals to replace the natural alternatives in our diets.

    I think it is fair to say that an individual who is drinking diet soda, in all likelyhood has a poor overall diet to go along with it. Now, please don't go asking me for scientific research because my data is 100% empirical. I have been around for 38 years and have witnessed this. I once had a horrible nutritional plan. I have learned my lesson that poor diet leads to poor health. As my blood pressure began to rise, and my weight began to rise, and then I had a ministroke at age 32, I realized that there was a good chance my nutrition was the biggest culprit in this deterioration.

    I researched, and found the ways to go as natural as possible in my environment. I eat natural foods, drink water and juices (and of course beer). I eat plenty of fruit and lots of vegetables and limit the intake of meats. Subsequently, my blood pressure dropped dramatically, my weight has decreased to the low end of my "healthy range" and I have had no further indications that another mini stroke is in the future. Of course this is one of those things that you never know about, however just the overall better health, I believe will reduce that possibility.

    The point I am trying to make is that if you truely evaluate your nutritional plan as it is, you will likely find that it is poor. If you are battliing to support the use of Aspartame, your diet probably has many other aspects of it that are quite unsound. I realize that some of you have diabetes, and that is why you use artificial sweeteners. In such case I say find something else that satisfies you. For instance, my blood pressure was high and that makes salt an enemy. I love salt. I was one of those people who would give away the pretzels so that I could dump the salt and crumbs from the bag into my mouth. But the re-vamp of my diet did not include a spot for salt. I replaced the desire for salt with spice. Hot peppers and such.

    Additionally, I would not doubt that when you evaluate your nutrition and fix your diet such that it is excellent, you may find that the symptoms of the diabetes will reduce. Remember, your body is only as healthy as the nutrition you give it.

    Are man made chemicals anything but bad for your body? Your body has evolved through time to tolerate and require certain substances. When you pump manmade substances into it, the body MUST respond in some manner. When man made chemicals are considered for human consumption we must immediately assume that they are not good for us. This thread should not be about whether Aspartame is bad for you or not. This thread should simply be about whether or not the risks are severe enough for you to not use it. We seem to place a lot of stock in "research". As a scientific person, my education has taught me that your research can show you what you desire it to (within reason). I am a test engineer and I know that I can craft a test procedure to show that our product has endured thorough testing and has passed them all. However I know that I can craft the testing of the weaknesses to not show their negative impact.

    One thing that I have found through the improvement of my diet is that when you remove sugar as I have, after the initial shock of no longer having it (as well as salt) you really begin to desire the tast of that which the sugar and salt were hiding. I regularly eat air popped pocorn. Now that my tastes have learned to not require heavy doses of salt, fat, and sugar, I can relly taste the popcorn. It does have taste. Normally it is considered to be very bland because our bodies have become so acustomed to floods of flavor, that we can no longer taste subtle flavors.

    Eating healthy is a lifestyle change.

    Applause Applause..not only a well educated post but also one that was written from experience. My sentiments exactly.
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    Old 12-15-2005, 02:42 PM   #70
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    Re: Aspartame Urban Legend

    Welp, I am afraid I am going to have to call B.S. on this one. You can in no way generalize people that way. I take offense to this post. I am a very healthy person, I have a very well rounded healthy, mostly natural diet, and i do enjoy a few diet pops a week. And for the record, I am in excellent physical health and my dentist thinks I hold the record in his practice for the person with the healthiest teeth and zero cavities.

     
    Old 12-15-2005, 02:44 PM   #71
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    Re: Aspartame Urban Legend

    oh, I also forgot to mention that the original topic of this post was about aspartame specifically, not the American diet in general, so to your comment about "overlooking the point," I call B.S. on that as well since the topic was written specifically regarding aspartame.

     
    Old 12-15-2005, 04:59 PM   #72
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    Re: Aspartame Urban Legend

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mjewell
    Welp, I am afraid I am going to have to call B.S. on this one. You can in no way generalize people that way. I take offense to this post. I am a very healthy person, I have a very well rounded healthy, mostly natural diet, and i do enjoy a few diet pops a week. And for the record, I am in excellent physical health and my dentist thinks I hold the record in his practice for the person with the healthiest teeth and zero cavities.
    Some peoples' bodies are better at dealing with the bad things we put in them. I have a friend that can drink as much pop, eat as much sugar as he wants, not worry about brushing his teeth afterward, though he does brush everyday I think, and still not get any cavities. I have bad teeth because I did that. I also get acne if I eat like that. He does not get acne, AND he's fat compared to me. But, something being harmful doesn't depend on an obvious physical menifestation. Some things take time, and some symptoms are hard to correlate to a specific cause.

     
    Old 12-16-2005, 11:06 AM   #73
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    Re: Aspartame Urban Legend

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mjewell
    Welp, I am afraid I am going to have to call B.S. on this one. You can in no way generalize people that way. I take offense to this post. I am a very healthy person, I have a very well rounded healthy, mostly natural diet, and i do enjoy a few diet pops a week. And for the record, I am in excellent physical health and my dentist thinks I hold the record in his practice for the person with the healthiest teeth and zero cavities.
    I don't quite understand why you would take offense. I clearly stated that "the majority" of people have a poor diet. I never said "all" or "you". If you take the population as a generality the nutrition is terrible overall. You can witness it by the overwhelming number of obese people. You can witness it just by looking at other peoples shopping basket when you are in the supermarket. You can witness it by looking at peoples lunches as you walk through the cafeteria at work or in school.

    My statement that most people who drink diet sodas, or any sodas on regular basis typically have poor supporting diets can be pointed out by conversing with people who ave made a concerted effort to eat well. Primarily, people who plan excellent nutrition have identified what are the poor aspects of their previous diets. Without fail sodas of any type are on that list.

    I am not questioning your diet, nor am I challenging it. I am sorry if I have violated some board rule that we must only discuss the primary point of a thread. In the future I will avoid doing so. I don't think I am alone. Conversation wanders by nature.

    OK, so back to the subject of Aspartame. It is a manmade chemical that the human body is not prepared to accept. Whether you can see the impact, or not, you can bet that there is one. Anyone who tells you that pumping man made chemicals into your body does not have some negative impact is blatantly shoveling some your way. Anyone who will accept that eating man made chemicals into their body is not causing some negative impact is simply choosing not to acknowledge the fact because they desire the "benefit" they get.

    Every action has an equal and opposite reaction. It's a fact. You cannot get away from it. Every good has an equal and opposite bad. Natural sweeteners such as sugar make your food taste good. Thats the good. They have many calories and that causes you to gain weight. That's the bad. Artificial sweeteners make your food taste good. They have no calories and so do not cause you to gain weight. Well, now we have an action without a reaction. Where is the reaction? Do you know what it is? I don't, but usually if there is a reaction, and you cant see it, and you don't know what it is, there is a good chance it will be unwelcome. When will you find out what the reaction was? Who knows. Will you ever? Who knows.

    In this country over the past 20 or so years, we have seen a steady rise in the incidence of cancers. Nobody seems to be able to pinpoint why. Many want answers. I hear very often of "cancer hot spots" and people are always calling for government research into why these occur. Everyone is calling for government research into why cancer rates are increasing in general. My not too far fetched theory (and I believe shared by others) is that it's the general trend towards pumping our bodies with all these chemicals. Maybe its not Aspartame alone. Maybe it's no individual chemical. Put them all together and pump them in and what you have is a body that is dealing with a lot of stuff it was never acustomed to. Then suddenly we have blood cancers in 40 year olds who were otherwise healthy. Higer rates of diabetes. Higher rates of heart disease. Higher rates of high blood pressure.

    The general population is always crying for more research into "cures for cancer". Don't you think that instead of looking for a new manmade substance to fight cancer, we should first look to see if there are manmade substances we can remove that will reduce the occurance in the first place? We are spending billions on cancer research worldwide, while the cure may be to just quit pumping all the junk into our bodies. Wouldn't that be ironic?

    I am a software engineer. I regularly modify existing software to add new functionality. Sometimes the additions I make cause things that were working before to stop working correctly. When I find that something no longer works riight, my first step is to say, "OK, it worked right before, what did I change to make it work wrong now". 50 years ago, the incidence of cancer was lower than today. It was very uncommon for a 40 year old man to get lymphatic cancer. Now it is not that uncommon. What changed? More chemicals in our diets. I learned of this through a friend of mine who has just gone through the treatment for his lymphatic cancer. He also told me that his doctors informed him that here on Long Island a man has a 60% chance of experiencing some sort of cancer by the age of 65. Those are bad odds. He was told that the statistics are showing an increse as time progresses. Why? Back to my theory. More junk in = more disease out.

    So in closing here, don't take my statements as any personal attack. I am stating information here that is really not disputable. You can see the evidence of most of my statements by just opening your eyes and looking around. We generally treat our bodies poorly, and expect good health anyway.

    I am not asking you to just accept any statements that I have made. If you doubt anything I have said, take a good hard look. You will most likely see that my points are quite on target. The key is to take a real objective look. People in general have a tendancy to not look objectively, but rather to look so that they can affirm their desires.

     
    Old 12-16-2005, 11:10 AM   #74
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    Re: Aspartame Urban Legend

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mjewell
    oh, I also forgot to mention that the original topic of this post was about aspartame specifically, not the American diet in general, so to your comment about "overlooking the point," I call B.S. on that as well since the topic was written specifically regarding aspartame.
    Just had to respond to this one. I don't believe I said we were "overlooking THE point". I believe I stated "I think there is a very important issue being overlooked here".

    It was all part of the assertion that overall, the chemical assault on our bodies is in overdrive.

     
    Old 12-16-2005, 12:24 PM   #75
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    Re: Aspartame Urban Legend

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by pipermac
    Good point. we Argue about the safety or not.......but Sky guy is right...if you want to be healthy dont drink either.


    But I will say....I have started to have Kefir...and If I dont add some splenda to it it tstes like crap!
    Sheesh that's an oxymoron kefir and aspartame together..healthy and unhealthy in my view.
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