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    Old 03-17-2005, 07:34 PM   #1
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    Rapid heart rate and Toprol and scared!

    Hello -

    I want to thank everyone who reads my post and responds because I really don't know what to do and am scared.

    I've been on Toprol XL 25mg since the end of October. I want to get off but can't and am scared.

    First of all - I was diagnosed with moderate high blood pressure two years ago. I am now 38.

    On sunday night in October I was sitting watching TV, thinking about nothing and quite happy I may add, when my heart started to beat extremely fast (120), my face got flush, my chest hurt and I generally felt that I was going to die.

    These episodes started happening every few days, then every other day then just about every day. I was scared out of my mind and everyone around me kept telling me that it probably is anxiety, panic and that I was doing this to myself. Of course I got anxious when this happened (which added to the whole thing) but I DID NOT want this happening to me! I was getting depressed, confused and scared and could not figure out why this was happening to me with such frequency.

    I went to the emergency room - found nothing on the EKG or blood work. I went to a cardiologist who gave me Toprol. He did an EKG too by the way and that showed nothing. I asked WHY this could be happening if my heart is okay, and he said that "it just does and no one knows why". Take the pills and see if they help. They did. I never had an episode again while on them.

    Almost 4 months later, I went to visit my doctor again and asked if I could get off Toporol (I don't like taking medication and had no episodes while on this drug). He told me to take a pill every other day for two weeks to get off the medication.

    The 1st day I lasted only 2 hours after a missed dose before I got light headed, slight chest pain and of course a rapid pulse....I popped the pill and within 1/2hr felt better and with an hour felt great again.

    The next day I tried 1/2 a pill and I lasted 6 hours before I needed to take the other 1/2.

    The next day I tried 1/2 a pill again and lasted only 4 hours this time.

    I gave up so on the 4th day I took a whole pill at my usual time and 1/2hr into the dosage I had a full blown attack. The rapid heart, the chest pain (this time sharp) and feelings of doom. This lasted for 1/2hr and then the rest of the day I was soooo tired and the next day I continued with being tired and sooo depressed.

    I CANNOT BELIEVE THAT "THIS HAPPENS AND WE DON'T KNOW WHY". Could there be something wrong with my heart or could I have a blockage somewhere? I plan on looking to see another cardiologist to get a second opinion. Am I wrong? I don't want to be on "heart" pills for the rest of my life without a solid reason why.

    Anyone else tried to get off Toprol with problems?

    Thanks to anyone who responds.

     
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    Old 03-17-2005, 09:34 PM   #2
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    Re: Rapid heart rate and Toprol and scared!

    Insist on an Event Heart Monitor for 30 days. Also, EKG's do not show all that much. Ask the doctor also about a Dobutermine Stress echocardiogram. Getting another opinion is a good idea! You need some Peace of Mind.

    Good Luck To You.

     
    Old 03-18-2005, 08:27 AM   #3
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    Re: Rapid heart rate and Toprol and scared!

    I don't know why doctors just use an do an E.K.G. and that's it. I mean, an E.K.G. has it's olace put as mentioned it doesn't show everything. My E.K.G. was fine and I too had a high resting pulse at 90. With my other symtoms, a little different from yours along with other factors, my doctor did a heart cath. and I had a blocked artery. So I agree with more tests.

     
    Old 03-18-2005, 10:01 AM   #4
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    Re: Rapid heart rate and Toprol and scared!

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Elda
    Almost 4 months later, I went to visit my doctor again and asked if I could get off Toporol (I don't like taking medication and had no episodes while on this drug).
    Your heart beats badly when it reacts to hormones released by your neuro-hormonal system. When your system is not releasing those hormones, your heart will beat fine. That is why your heart can go for long periods of time without misfiring, and then all of a sudden, WHAM, your heart goes nuts.

    Drug manufacturers have made medicines that "block" or "inhibit" those hormones from causing the heart to misfire. Toporol is a beta "blocker". It attempts to block certain hormones from effecting your heart.

    Quote:
    I plan on looking to see another cardiologist to get a second opinion. Am I wrong? I don't want to be on "heart" pills for the rest of my life without a solid reason why.

    Anyone else tried to get off Toprol with problems?

    Thanks to anyone who responds.
    You have learned that Toprol XL 25mg works very well at keeping your heart from misfiring, and with few side effects. There are many people who would love to be able to control their heart rhythm problems with only one drug.

    Best of luck with your health!

    Last edited by Machaon; 06-20-2005 at 05:45 AM.

     
    Old 03-18-2005, 02:04 PM   #5
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    Re: Rapid heart rate and Toprol and scared!

    Hi,
    I also have skipped beats and my doctor wanted me to take toprol 25 mg.
    He told me that the dose is so low that I shouldnt have any problems starting or stopping at any time. He sees problems when you start and stop toprol at 50 mg and up. I would get a second opinion, Or tell the cardo who you are now seeing to do more testing, such as the 24 hour holter or event 30 day. plus did he give you a Echo, along with a stress test. You have a lot more testing that can be done...Do not take no for an answer. I am sure everything will work out just fine...Keep us posted....

     
    Old 03-18-2005, 02:47 PM   #6
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    Re: Rapid heart rate and Toprol and scared!

    Thanks for all the feedback, it was so needed and appreciated.

    I am in the process of getting a second opinion and will start fresh with another cardiologist. One assocaited with a good hospital in New York City.

    It just seems to me that my current doctor may think that I am an anxious and depressed person and that that is my problem. Well of course I am anxious and depressed because NO ONE CAN GIVE ME ANSWERS! And I feel my body is out of control.

    Hugs to all!

    Will keep everyone updated!

     
    Old 03-19-2005, 07:02 PM   #7
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    Re: Rapid heart rate and Toprol and scared!

    This message is for beerzoid....how do you know so much about the possibility that the cause of my rapid heart may be due to my neurohormonal system?

    If you are correct, what should I do to correct this? Or what should be my next step?

    Any info would be appreciated.

     
    Old 03-20-2005, 06:52 AM   #8
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    Re: Rapid heart rate and Toprol and scared!

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Elda
    This message is for beerzoid....how do you know so much about the possibility that the cause of my rapid heart may be due to my neurohormonal system?
    I've got advanced heart disease and high blood pressure. I've spent countless hours researching my own heart and health problems, in order to improve my own health and stay alive. It's taken me years to find out which meds work best for me, the best dosage and schedule to take the meds, and what types of foods interfer with my meds. It's been very difficult because I have absolutely no medical training or education, and most of the stuff I read is totally GREEK!

    You were on the beta "blocker" Toprol XL. Toprol XL blocks certain hormones, like renin, norepinephrine and epinephrine, and tries to stop these hormones from causing the heart to misfire, and from causing high blood pressure. In your case, the hormone blocking actions of Toprol XL seemed to work very well for you because, while you were on the medicine, your heart seemed beat better and reduced your blood pressure.

    Quote:
    If you are correct, what should I do to correct this? Or what should be my next step?

    Any info would be appreciated.
    Well...... first of all, you might recognize that medicines like Toprol XL are really medical miracles and marvels. Before these modern meds were developed people had to live with their hearts constantly misfiring, and with uncontrolled high blood pressure, and with their health getting worse because of it.

    If you are concerned about a blockage, or more advanced damage to your heart, you might consider an ICG test (impedance cardiography). It is a new "non invasive", fairly inexpensive test which shows cardiac output, systemic vascular resistance, contractility (whatever that is), and fluid status. It can be done in a doctor's office, similar to how they do an EKG. Before this machine was developed, the only way to find out this type of information was by going into a hospital and having a heart catherization, for about $12,000.

    Other things that you can do is to be on a healthy diet and do daily exercise. Just walking 30 minutes a day does wonders to one's health. If walking outside is not convenient, then put on some music and walk up and down your hallway for 15-20 minutes, twice a day.

    Regards, and best of health!

    Last edited by Machaon; 06-20-2005 at 05:47 AM.

     
    Old 03-20-2005, 09:25 AM   #9
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    Re: Rapid heart rate and Toprol and scared!

    Heartful thanks BEERZOID for the quick response. You have given me more answers and hope than any of my doctors. I just couldn't believe the "no one really knows what this happens" line!

    I also have a thirst for knowledge like you. It's so important to be pro-active with ones health all the time. Anod not to reply on others so much; especially doctors. Obviously some know more than others.

    As I stated before I intend on seeing another cardiologist in NYC. If you are in this area and know of someone I should see, please let me know. It's a longshot I know but I had to ask.

    Second, I know that eating right is important but I have bad food allergies that stops me from eating any kind of fruits and some vegetables but I do my best. Eating can be so frustrating at times for me. And to add to the eating issue I aslo have NES - Night Eating Syndrome (I get up once a night to snack and cannot remember 1/2 the time). This is BAD and I've been a suffer for almost 20 years now; there is absolutly no control issue with this disorder.
    I am 20lbs overweight because of it and I know that THAT could be a major reason my heart is misfiring! All the doctors I speak to about this, brush it off because they know nothing about it. It is a recognized disorder now and they are currently doing a study in PA but are offering only high doses of Zoloft to patients and I don't feel comfortable taking another pill, especially an anti-depressant. I'm considering taking a sleeping pill for 2 weeks, on and off to see if this help jump start me into some regular sleeping patterns.

    And excercise...well to be honest I am scared of getting my heart pumping fast again, especially when I am supposed to be supressing it. But I kinow it's for the best really and will try to be more active then usual.

    Thanks for the feedback. Best of health to you too!

     
    Old 03-20-2005, 11:36 AM   #10
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    Re: Rapid heart rate and Toprol and scared!

    Hello there,

    I would ask for an event montior , or 24 hour monitoring. These things can tell alot. My resting HR is almost always 130bpm and up, for no reason. I have had many test and all show nothing wrong with my heart. Symptoms can be tough sometimes when HR gets stuck around 170bpm for days or hours.

    Take care,
    Leslie

     
    Old 03-20-2005, 04:46 PM   #11
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    Re: Rapid heart rate and Toprol and scared!

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Elda
    I also have a thirst for knowledge like you. It's so important to be pro-active with ones health all the time. Anod not to reply on others so much; especially doctors. Obviously some know more than others.
    My first problem with doctors is that they don't have the time to completely research their patient's health problems, so they have to take a "one size fits all" approach to each patient. Our medical system is similar to our fast food system.

    My second problem is that most doctors do not suffer the complex diseases that we suffer, so they can only go by what they read in books and witness with their patients.

    Quote:
    As I stated before I intend on seeing another cardiologist in NYC. If you are in this area and know of someone I should see, please let me know. It's a longshot I know but I had to ask.
    I am far, far away from NYC. But, going to a cardiologist sounds like a good idea. It would be interesting to find out what tests he runs and what he finds.

    Quote:
    Eating can be so frustrating at times for me. And to add to the eating issue I aslo have NES - Night Eating Syndrome (I get up once a night to snack and cannot remember 1/2 the time). This is BAD and I've been a suffer for almost 20 years now; there is absolutly no control issue with this disorder.
    You certainly have difficult health problems. I can see why you get so frustrated!

    How much control do you have over what you eat during the night? What if you set out a meal of cup of whole grains, like cereal and milk, and cup of veggies, and perhaps apple? If you could do this you might be able to turn this NES around so that it works FOR you instead of working AGAINST you.

    I am on a diet which calls for me to eat 5-6 times per day, or about once every 2 hours. The servings consist of cup of whole grain, and cup of veggies, which is usually string beans or salad. On this diet, I have lost about 12% of my weight, and I am now within my normal weight range. I have also noticed that I feel better and eating these small healthy servings drives down my blood pressure, and keeps it down.

    (For more info on this diet read: the thread here in "High & Low Blood Pressure" named: Does an "Insulin Resistance" diet improve blood pressure?)

    Best of luck at the NYC cardiologist!

    Last edited by Machaon; 06-20-2005 at 05:50 AM.

     
    Old 03-21-2005, 09:11 PM   #12
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    Re: Rapid heart rate and Toprol and scared!

    Hi BEERZOIDS!

    Thanks for responding once again! You have given me more knowledge and hope than anyone in a long time and I really appreciate it! Your the best!

    I found a Heart Rythm specialist that I am going to see this Thursday afternoon. I am excited and will keep you posted on what he says. I will be intereted in hearing what he thinks of the neorhormonal & allergy theory.

    I must admit that your theory sounds like me so much! Now how does one stop the epineprine from constantly going off? Am I doomed to be on beta blokers forever? It would be difficult to pin point what the allergy actually is, it's such a large spectrum of things from enviroment, food, skin etc....it's kinda overwhelming actually.

    The only thing I WAS taking a few months ago (this past summer) was Natural Progesterone cream...and it worked for me. No PMS, regulated my periods, made me happier etc...I stopped because it was TOO effective and I though it may be best to be monitered by a MD before I continued with it. Actually I am still trying to find a MD who believe's in and treats with Natural hormones but was having difficulty finding someone and then this rapid heart issue kicked in etc....

    I am sure that being peri meopausal is not helping and / or effecting these episodes too. I was always was thinking this in the back of my mind but when you brought it up, I smiled.

    About my NES control - I have somewhat control over it these days. I know not to eat bad stuff or alot of anything, it's usually a quick hit in the kitchen and I am out of there. A cookie, a piece of cheese, breadsick or a ....glass of milk.

    I'm getting better and could probably eat cereal and milk if I left it out. But I feel I really should NOT be eating anything and should be sleeping with REM sleep which I do not have. Eating everynight MUST be causing stress on my body in some way. My body should be resting not digesting food. When it gets bad it's usually when I am stressed or mad then I can eat chips, chocolate, cake etc...but that doesn't happen often these days because I've scared myself into believing there is a link between the rapid heart and NES somehow.

    I'll keep you posted as promised.

    Best of health to you too!

     
    Old 03-24-2005, 09:17 AM   #13
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    Re: Rapid heart rate and Toprol and scared!

    undefinedlots of toprol i have had 2 heart ablations. one for atrial fib and atrial flutter. it eliminated the fib and a flutter still remained. 2nd ablation for flutter and another flutter showed up. i am on 200 mg of toprol xl so the person that was worried about 25mg sounds lucky if it works for her/him. i don't know how many ablations they can perform on me since i am almost 65. atleast i feel good. if the next ablation does not work (sometimes people have more), perhaps a pacemaker is in my future. it won't stop the flutters but it will control my beat per minute. the bad side of it all, i would have to be on coumadin for the rest of my life.

     
    Old 03-24-2005, 08:06 PM   #14
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    Re: Rapid heart rate and Toprol and scared!

    Okay, I went to see a Heart Rhythm specialist in NYC and he was wonderful. Explained it all to me and now I feel some hope.

    My rapid heart beat could be related to a condition called Supraventricular Tachycardia (SVT) where a series of rapid heartbeats begin in the heart's upper changers. An extra pathway may exist and this can be removed permantly using a procedure called Catheter Ablation. Doctors insert an electrode catheter into the heart and position it close to the abnormal electrical pathway then pass radio-frequency energy through it. This destroys the small area of the heart tissue that contains the abnormal pathway. Scar tissue forms and scar tissue cannot transmit electrical impulses therefore one no longer is caple of producing arrhythmias in that area. Ironically I see that the last post from BABAG was talking about this procedure.

    My rapid pulse could also be related to something in my cells,....I don't really remember what he said about this part of our visit other than it would be difficult to figure out where it is coming from. IE: nerohomonal (as BEERZOIDS suggested).

    I have to decide if I will stay on the beta blocker for as long as I can since it is working. Or if I should risk this (non-invasive) yet scary (to me) procedure. I need to do some homework here. But one thing I am glad about is that I pushed on for answers and got them and didn't rely on my local doctor to tell me "we just don't know why it happens". Now I feel in control instead of my body controling me in a way.

    I just wanted to ask the previous poster - BABAG about your ablation's. You said you had a few of these procedures done and obviously they were successful (no damage to the heart or vessels, blood clots or infection) because I am worried that doing this procedure for someone like me who needs such a small dose to keep my rthymn in control now may be a step taken a bit prematurely. What do you think if I may ask?

    I have alot of research to do here before I decide what I will be doing.

    Thanks for all that posted and thanks in advance for anyone who can offer more advise or guidance on my choices. This web site is simply awesome!!!

     
    Old 03-25-2005, 03:34 PM   #15
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    Re: Rapid heart rate and Toprol and scared!

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Elda
    Okay, I went to see a Heart Rhythm specialist in NYC and he was wonderful. Explained it all to me and now I feel some hope.

    My rapid heart beat could be related to a condition called Supraventricular Tachycardia (SVT) where a series of rapid heartbeats begin in the heart's upper changers. An extra pathway may exist and this can be removed permantly using a procedure called Catheter Ablation. Doctors insert an electrode catheter into the heart and position it close to the abnormal electrical pathway then pass radio-frequency energy through it. This destroys the small area of the heart tissue that contains the abnormal pathway. Scar tissue forms and scar tissue cannot transmit electrical impulses therefore one no longer is caple of producing arrhythmias in that area. Ironically I see that the last post from BABAG was talking about this procedure.

    My rapid pulse could also be related to something in my cells,....I don't really remember what he said about this part of our visit other than it would be difficult to figure out where it is coming from. IE: nerohomonal (as BEERZOIDS suggested).

    I have to decide if I will stay on the beta blocker for as long as I can since it is working. Or if I should risk this (non-invasive) yet scary (to me) procedure. I need to do some homework here. But one thing I am glad about is that I pushed on for answers and got them and didn't rely on my local doctor to tell me "we just don't know why it happens". Now I feel in control instead of my body controling me in a way.

    I just wanted to ask the previous poster - BABAG about your ablation's. You said you had a few of these procedures done and obviously they were successful (no damage to the heart or vessels, blood clots or infection) because I am worried that doing this procedure for someone like me who needs such a small dose to keep my rthymn in control now may be a step taken a bit prematurely. What do you think if I may ask?

    I have alot of research to do here before I decide what I will be doing.

    Thanks for all that posted and thanks in advance for anyone who can offer more advise or guidance on my choices. This web site is simply awesome!!!
    my first ablation for atrial fib and flutter was successful they said. i go to a university that has some of the best electrophysogists in the country. within 7 months, another flutter showed up. i guess it can be another one and not the one they said they had repaired. my first ablation was unsuccesful, still and existing flutter. i wouldn't even mind the "bumps" but over the years they have made me intollerant to any amount of exercise. i am retired and my hobby is gardening. it was in the garden that i first fainted and have had many like fainting episodes. weakness, faintness, fatigue, and just plain being tired is not what i want. another ablation may be in my future. if this problem can't be fixed, i will probably get a pacemaker. it won't do this any good but will control my heart rate. down side- coumadin for the rest of my life. i dread the thought of having a stroke from this problem. if you want me to tell you the exact details of my ablations i will. just let me know. and.... they weren't bad.

     
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