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  • I don't know what more to do ?????

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    Old 12-24-2004, 04:59 PM   #1
    SternFan
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    I don't know what more to do ?????

    Hello everyone,
    I'm new to these boards
    I had a heart attack at 40 on Nov-17-01
    I'm a vegan No milk, Eggs or meat, I have tryed to cut out all caffeine, I take about 32 pills daily most are vitamins and fish oil & red rice yest, 6 are pills the doc say's I will have to take for the rest of my life.
    I use flaxseed meal in my cereal everyday. And my cholesterol is still to high
    Total 217 again. I honestly don't know what more to do.......If anyone has anything they know to help, I will give it a try,,,,,,,,,
    Happy Holidays everyone ~*

     
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    Old 12-24-2004, 09:34 PM   #2
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    Re: I don't know what more to do ?????

    Welcome to the boards.

    You say the doctor has you on six pills. Are any of those cholesterol-lowering medications?

     
    Old 12-24-2004, 11:32 PM   #3
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    Re: I don't know what more to do ?????

    Yes Lipitor 20mg.....

     
    Old 12-25-2004, 03:12 AM   #4
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    Re: I don't know what more to do ?????

    So what's wrong with 217. I'm at 222 and pleased. At one time it was much higher. I remember when 239 and below was the guideline. It was dropped to 200 for obvious reasons. We have been taught that we must achieve a goal of 200. This number has now become and obsession and is fixed in our brain. You didn't mention LDL, HDL, Trig and Ratio.

     
    Old 12-25-2004, 03:45 AM   #5
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    Re: I don't know what more to do ?????

    217 does sound good to me. I'm at 223 and I'm happy with it. I've tried a variety of cholesterol pills with different doses and what I'm taking now is the only thing that doesn't cause me back pain. I'm not trying anything else because I did try something new for 3 days and my back was in pain for a month.

     
    Old 12-25-2004, 05:20 AM   #6
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    Re: I don't know what more to do ?????

    SternFan,

    Don't take red yeast rice if you are taking Lipitor...both are statin drugs and the more is definitely NOT the merrier.
    What kinds of TC numbers were yoou getting before the Lipitor? Usually that amount of Lipitor will drop TC 100 or more points???

     
    Old 12-25-2004, 08:32 AM   #7
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    Re: I don't know what more to do ?????

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SternFan
    Hello everyone,
    I'm new to these boards
    Welcome.

    Quote:
    I had a heart attack at 40 on Nov-17-01
    Sorry to hear about that. What was your diet and physical condition like back then? Have you made any significant changes since?

    Quote:
    I'm a vegan No milk, Eggs or meat, I have tryed to cut out all caffeine, I take about 32 pills daily most are vitamins and fish oil & red rice yest,...
    No offense, but how can you be a vegan and take fish oil? Just curious. Are you attempting a vegan diet for ethical or health reasons?

    Quote:
    And my cholesterol is still to high Total 217 again.
    217 is a perfectly normal cholesterol level. 217 mg/dl is not high cholesterol unless your HDL levels are low. With a total cholesterol of 217, as long as your HDL is > 55 (TC/HDL ratio <4.0) then you are fine. What is your HDL, LDL, and Triglyceride levels?

    Quote:
    I honestly don't know what more to do.......If anyone has anything they know to help, I will give it a try,,,,,,,,,
    How much sugar (both natural and processed) and starch do you eat? Excess quantities of these can raise your insulin levels which can elevate the amount of cholesterol that your liver produces. You might try cutting back on the sugar and starch and eating more high fiber vegetables, legumes, nuts, and natural fats. Try to eat as much unprocessed food as possible since these often have added sugars, refined carbohydrates, and chemical additives. Also, exercise including weight training can improve your lipid profile by lowering insulin levels among other things.
    __________________
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    Old 12-25-2004, 02:06 PM   #8
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    Re: I don't know what more to do ?????

    After having a heart attack, They want my cholesterol at or below 150.....And the vegan part is due to my health not because I wana to be a vegan, It's just easier to say I'm vegan then running down the list of what I dont eat.....I also do eat Solmon on the advise of my cardioligest ok! When I had the heart attack I was going to the gym 5 days a week for 2 hours a day, and I have never eatin much red meat my whole life. I was in the best health I have ever been in when I had the heart attack. I quit smoking almost 2 years before the heart attack
    So you see 217 is not good for anyone especially me or anyone who has had a heart attack
    Total= 217
    HDL= 42
    LDL= 147
    Risk ratio = 5.2
    Everything I have learned is your cholesterol needs to be under 200
    I had mine down to 150, I guess I will have to go back to taking 8 fish oil caps a day instead of 4 a day thats what got it down before. I just get so much heart burn with them.

    Last edited by SternFan; 12-25-2004 at 02:13 PM.

     
    Old 12-25-2004, 02:38 PM   #9
    Michael01
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    Re: I don't know what more to do ?????

    Ref: Quote from a 25 page booklet written (1988) by Jacobus Rinse, PhD on improving circulation and preventing heart disease. "It should be remembered that low cholesterol levels double the risk of death from cancer, especially in men. This was based on a 10 year study of the medical history of 5,125 men and 7.363 women between the ages of 25 to 74. One of the startling conclusions by the researchers is that the risk of cancer increases the longer the low cholesterol levels are maintained." This conclusion was reported in the August 8, 1987 issue of Lancet, and recapped in a Bulletin from the National Cancer Institute. Comment: When this booklet was written 239 was considered fine for cholesterol and eventually it was lowered to 200. It's not indicated in the booklet what low is but again the range was up to 239 back when the study was taken. Draw your own conclusions. I plan to focus on cholesterol/hdl ratio which should be 4.0 or below for males.

     
    Old 12-25-2004, 08:09 PM   #10
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    Re: I don't know what more to do ?????

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SternFan
    After having a heart attack, They want my cholesterol at or below 150.....And the vegan part is due to my health not because I wana to be a vegan, It's just easier to say I'm vegan then running down the list of what I dont eat.....I also do eat Solmon on the advise of my cardioligest ok! When I had the heart attack I was going to the gym 5 days a week for 2 hours a day, and I have never eatin much red meat my whole life. I was in the best health I have ever been in when I had the heart attack. I quit smoking almost 2 years before the heart attack
    So you see 217 is not good for anyone especially me or anyone who has had a heart attack
    Total= 217
    HDL= 42
    LDL= 147
    Risk ratio = 5.2
    Everything I have learned is your cholesterol needs to be under 200
    I had mine down to 150, I guess I will have to go back to taking 8 fish oil caps a day instead of 4 a day thats what got it down before. I just get so much heart burn with them.
    It sounds like you are trying to follow a near vegetarian diet, not vegan (pronounced Vee Gan). Vegans are generally very strict and abstain from all animal products (even leather shoes and belts), usually for moral reasons more so than health concerns.

    How many years did you smoke before you quit? Even though you quit 2 years prior to the heart attack, I wouldn't discount the damage done to your arteries by smoking.

    A total cholesterol of <150 is too low in my opinion and places you at increased risk of mortality from other causes such as cancer previously mentioned. Like I said previously, your total cholesterol of 217 isn't that high and just a few years ago would have been considered normal (160-240 being normal). Your HDL (good cholesterol) is on the low side of normal, especially given your total cholesterol. Has your HDL always been 42 or was it lower in the past? Your risk ratio of 5.2 is your total cholesterol (217) divided by your HDL (42). The recommended risk ratio is <4.0. To get there, you can do one of two things, either lower your total cholesterol or raise your HDL. The problem with attempting to lower your total cholesterol, especially if you are trying to do it following a low-fat, high-carbohydrate diet is that your HDL will generally fall right along with the total cholesterol if you get any results at all such that your risk ratio rarely improves at all (often times it gets worse).

    If the fat levels in your diet are too low then you risk futher lowering of your HDL. Although, there is one kind of fat that you really need to avoid, that being trans fatty acids found in partially hydrogenated vegetable oils. Trans fats tend to raise LDL while lowering HDL levels which can signficantly raise your heart disease risk. Partially hydrogenated vegetable oils are found in margarine, shortening, and almost all processed foods and snacks (just read the labels).

    Fish oil is a good thing to take due to the Omega 3 essential fatty acids and the lack of these in most diets. If you get heartburn and/or fishy burps from the capsules, I suggest you try a different brand and I generally avoid the capsules. I have found that Carlson's Lemon Flavored Cod Liver oil is very easy to take (I even kinda like the taste) and gives me none of the fishy burps like the capsules did. It is also a high quality product that is high in EPA and DHA (the usable forms of Omega 3). The recommended dosage is 1000 mg to 3000 mg of EPA + DHA. With the Carlson's, this is 1 teaspoon to 1 tablespoon per day (I generally take 1 tablespoon and my HDL is 73).

    Niacin therapy has been shown to improve HDL levels, so that would be worth considering.
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    Old 12-26-2004, 06:16 AM   #11
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    Re: I don't know what more to do ?????

    SternFan,

    I repeat, what kind of total cholesterol numbers were you getting BEFORE the Lipitor, and/or, heart attack.
    Perhaps 40 mg. is necessary. Perhaps stay at 20 and add ezetimibe.

    I agree with your cardiologists who want your numbers VERY low considering your proven heart disease. Your total cholesterol looks even worse when paired with a low HDL.

    Last edited by Lenin; 12-26-2004 at 06:18 AM.

     
    Old 12-26-2004, 11:15 AM   #12
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    Re: I don't know what more to do ?????

    Sorry about not answering your question,
    Anyway I have high cholesterol now for about 10 years

     
    Old 12-26-2004, 11:51 AM   #13
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    Re: I don't know what more to do ?????

    SternFan...


    WHAT numbers did you get in cholesterol readings BEFORE you started taking a statin drug?

    I'm tryingl

     
    Old 12-26-2004, 01:54 PM   #14
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    Re: I don't know what more to do ?????

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Lenin
    SternFan...


    WHAT numbers did you get in cholesterol readings BEFORE you started taking a statin drug?

    I'm tryingl
    It's been so long ......But I think it was around 255 .... The statin's do not help me very much

     
    Old 12-26-2004, 01:59 PM   #15
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    Re: I don't know what more to do ?????

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by arkie6
    It sounds like you are trying to follow a near vegetarian diet, not vegan (pronounced Vee Gan). Vegans are generally very strict and abstain from all animal products (even leather shoes and belts), usually for moral reasons more so than health concerns.

    How many years did you smoke before you quit? Even though you quit 2 years prior to the heart attack, I wouldn't discount the damage done to your arteries by smoking.

    A total cholesterol of <150 is too low in my opinion and places you at increased risk of mortality from other causes such as cancer previously mentioned. Like I said previously, your total cholesterol of 217 isn't that high and just a few years ago would have been considered normal (160-240 being normal). Your HDL (good cholesterol) is on the low side of normal, especially given your total cholesterol. Has your HDL always been 42 or was it lower in the past? Your risk ratio of 5.2 is your total cholesterol (217) divided by your HDL (42). The recommended risk ratio is <4.0. To get there, you can do one of two things, either lower your total cholesterol or raise your HDL. The problem with attempting to lower your total cholesterol, especially if you are trying to do it following a low-fat, high-carbohydrate diet is that your HDL will generally fall right along with the total cholesterol if you get any results at all such that your risk ratio rarely improves at all (often times it gets worse).

    If the fat levels in your diet are too low then you risk futher lowering of your HDL. Although, there is one kind of fat that you really need to avoid, that being trans fatty acids found in partially hydrogenated vegetable oils. Trans fats tend to raise LDL while lowering HDL levels which can signficantly raise your heart disease risk. Partially hydrogenated vegetable oils are found in margarine, shortening, and almost all processed foods and snacks (just read the labels).

    Fish oil is a good thing to take due to the Omega 3 essential fatty acids and the lack of these in most diets. If you get heartburn and/or fishy burps from the capsules, I suggest you try a different brand and I generally avoid the capsules. I have found that Carlson's Lemon Flavored Cod Liver oil is very easy to take (I even kinda like the taste) and gives me none of the fishy burps like the capsules did. It is also a high quality product that is high in EPA and DHA (the usable forms of Omega 3). The recommended dosage is 1000 mg to 3000 mg of EPA + DHA. With the Carlson's, this is 1 teaspoon to 1 tablespoon per day (I generally take 1 tablespoon and my HDL is 73).

    Niacin therapy has been shown to improve HDL levels, so that would be worth considering.
    I think I'm more like a vegan because I do not eat meat, cheese, eggs, milk, No dairy products. Vegatarian do. So thats why I say, I'm more like a vegan, But I'm not here to debate whether or not I'm a vegan or vegetarian.
    I'm starting to think this place is not so friendly

    Last edited by SternFan; 12-26-2004 at 02:00 PM.

     
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