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    Old 03-13-2006, 04:10 PM   #1
    NHone
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    New Crestor trial

    Just heard on the CBS evening news that a recent Crestor trial decreased plaque in the arteries. They gave the participants 40 mg of Crestor a day...a high dose. Something that wasn't quiet right about the study was that NONE of the participants reported any side effects. Thats not quiet right. Even with the best medication, someone will have a side effect. Of course, none of the information on the participants was told on the news. The really important information was missing. It is also contrary to what we read on the message boards. Looks like it is close to time to report 1st quarter earnings and sales...?????

     
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    Old 03-13-2006, 04:38 PM   #2
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    Re: New Crestor trial

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by finres
    Just heard on the CBS evening news that a recent Crestor trial decreased plaque in the arteries. They gave the participants 40 mg of Crestor a day...a high dose. Something that wasn't quiet right about the study was that NONE of the participants reported any side effects. Thats not quiet right. Even with the best medication, someone will have a side effect. Of course, none of the information on the participants was told on the news. The really important information was missing. It is also contrary to what we read on the message boards. Looks like it is close to time to report 1st quarter earnings and sales...?????
    I saw that on ABC WNT. Seems kind of strange to me as well, as even folks who take statins say Crestor is the strongest and worst. Oh well, maybe sales were down..........

    As I have said before, believe half of what U hear and see.....
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    Old 03-13-2006, 05:38 PM   #3
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    Re: New Crestor trial

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by finres
    Of course, none of the information on the participants was told on the news. The really important information was missing.
    You noticed that too, huh? It seems like whenever they come out with one of these studies, there are always far more questions than answers. Besides, this isn't the first time a regression of plaque was observed. A Canadian physician, G.C. Willis, observed a similar effect on human subjects by administering 1500mg vitamin C. And this was back in 1954!
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    Old 03-13-2006, 06:02 PM   #4
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    Re: New Crestor trial

    Of course Statins clean plaque.. That's just common knowledge anymore.

    Johns Hopkins University already has done the research..BUT the numbers gotta get LOW...LOW...
    And the ONLY way to do that is with Statins.
    Plaque cleaning drugs.


    I doubt very much that G. C. Willis observed much of anything. They didn't have magnetic imaging like they do today back then.

    Last edited by Stumper; 03-13-2006 at 06:05 PM.

     
    Old 03-13-2006, 06:57 PM   #5
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    Re: New Crestor trial

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Stumper
    Of course Statins clean plaque.. That's just common knowledge anymore.

    Johns Hopkins University already has done the research..BUT the numbers gotta get LOW...LOW...
    And the ONLY way to do that is with Statins.
    Plaque cleaning drugs.


    I doubt very much that G. C. Willis observed much of anything. They didn't have magnetic imaging like they do today back then.
    That is not common knowledge.. Especially since plaque has very little cholesterol in it. In fact Researchers at St. Louis University say that it is impractical to think this. In 1954 there were other ways to observe conditions. Some of the ways were called autopsy.

     
    Old 03-13-2006, 07:13 PM   #6
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    Re: New Crestor trial

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Stumper


    I doubt very much that G. C. Willis observed much of anything. They didn't have magnetic imaging like they do today back then.
    I disagree. In fact, Dr. Willis did see a reduction or stabilization in most patients, but that a smaller number of patients experienced no reduction in plaque size, or that it got worse. But overall, the results were quite positive. And he only used 1500mg vitamin C, which is a very modest dose. Higher dosages would probably have resulted in even greater benefits. As I understand it, he tried to persuade the medical profession to further examine his findings, and conduct further studies, but his efforts were ignored.
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    Old 03-14-2006, 04:23 AM   #7
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    Re: New Crestor trial

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by finres
    That is not common knowledge.. Especially since plaque has very little cholesterol in it. In fact Researchers at St. Louis University say that it is impractical to think this. In 1954 there were other ways to observe conditions. Some of the ways were called autopsy.

    Yeah, riiight....

    How many times you gonna kill a person to discover how much plaque is reduced ? Twice?

     
    Old 03-14-2006, 04:26 AM   #8
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    Re: New Crestor trial

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ARIZONA73
    I disagree. In fact, Dr. Willis did see a reduction or stabilization in most patients, but that a smaller number of patients experienced no reduction in plaque size, or that it got worse. But overall, the results were quite positive. And he only used 1500mg vitamin C, which is a very modest dose. Higher dosages would probably have resulted in even greater benefits. As I understand it, he tried to persuade the medical profession to further examine his findings, and conduct further studies, but his efforts were ignored.

    Yes, and just HOW was Mr. Willis determining plaque reductions?
    This sounds like just another rumor from the supplement industry with no actual facts or data !
    From 1954 yet !

    Back then Cholesterol was hardly or never brought up !

     
    Old 03-14-2006, 05:42 AM   #9
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    Re: New Crestor trial

    I was pleased to hear about the superb reductions from Crestor that were apparent after only 2 months od dosing (high dosing alas.)
    My only worry is that as a plaque is reduced does it retain its integrity. I'd hate to think that while reducing them we are making them less stable and thus mor prone to ruture.

    Oh, the Vitamin C cures everything again argument. No, 1500 mg. Ascorbic acid doesn't reduce plaque...not in 2 years nor in 30.

     
    Old 03-14-2006, 07:29 AM   #10
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    Re: New Crestor trial

    I know only one person who has taken Crestor. She is a borderline diabetic and after taking Crestor she developed permanent neuropathy in her feet. I don't think I will be buying stock anytime soon. I have noticed that not too many people on this board are taking Crestor. Are doctors reluctant to prescribe it or it is only for people known to have plaque buildup? I would imagine after this study it will become the statin of choice for doctors.

    Jane

     
    Old 03-14-2006, 08:01 AM   #11
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    Re: New Crestor trial

    The Journal of the American Medical Asssociation, JAMA, has given a more cautious welcome to the Crestor(ASTEROID) Trial.

    [url]www.jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/full/295.13.jed60019v1[/url]

    Among its reservations and comments are;

    Only subjects with a coronary stenosis of under 50% were included in the trial.

    The mean values of the subjects on the start of the trial were HDL43 LDL 130 which indicated that the effect on more acute coronary cases could not be evaluated from this trial.

    There was no adverse clinical symptoms reported.

    Another recent trial (REVERSAL) examined the effects of plaque regression using IVUS (intervascular ultrasound), the method used in this trial, on coronary lumen size.

    In the REVERSAL trial a decrease in the cross sectional area of the external lumen area was associated with no change in coronary lumen area.

    No data regarding change in lumen volume or size was reported in the ASTEROID trial leaving open the possibility that changes in atheroma volume may have been deduced from the reduced cross sectional area of the external elastic membrane, with potentially unchanged or no reduction in coronary lumen size.

    It was also reported in Reuters that the main author of the report stated that reducing the cholesterol to that level would leave behind a 'mainly fibrous plaque tissue."

    This I would have thought would increase the chances of destabalising the plaque.

    The mean reduction in atheroma volume was from 39.6% to 38.6% which doesnt seem a lot, considering in my view, the possible increased plaque instability.

    Perhaps it would be more prudent in non chronic cases, to reduce LDL to a level were there was no reduction in plaque and no increase either, a happy median....
    .

    Last edited by liverock; 03-14-2006 at 08:43 AM.

     
    Old 03-14-2006, 09:57 AM   #12
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    Re: New Crestor trial

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Lenin
    I was pleased to hear about the superb reductions from Crestor that were apparent after only 2 months od dosing (high dosing alas.)
    My only worry is that as a plaque is reduced does it retain its integrity. I'd hate to think that while reducing them we are making them less stable and thus mor prone to ruture.

    Oh, the Vitamin C cures everything again argument. No, 1500 mg. Ascorbic acid doesn't reduce plaque...not in 2 years nor in 30.

    That is an excellent , excellent point. It has been looked at before, and some data shows that while there is a reduction, the plaque did become unstable. I guess its kind of like taking dirt off of one side of the dam and saying, guess we didn't need such a big dam anyway. Some day you'll cause a dam break.

     
    Old 03-14-2006, 02:58 PM   #13
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    Re: New Crestor trial

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Lenin

    Oh, the Vitamin C cures everything again argument. No, 1500 mg. Ascorbic acid doesn't reduce plaque...not in 2 years nor in 30.

    Evidently vitamin C has been shown to reduce plaque, and the results of the Willis study appeared in the Canadian Medical Association Journal.
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    Old 03-14-2006, 03:24 PM   #14
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    Re: New Crestor trial

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by janeslk
    I know only one person who has taken Crestor. She is a borderline diabetic and after taking Crestor she developed permanent neuropathy in her feet. I don't think I will be buying stock anytime soon. I have noticed that not too many people on this board are taking Crestor. Are doctors reluctant to prescribe it or it is only for people known to have plaque buildup? I would imagine after this study it will become the statin of choice for doctors.

    Jane
    A friend of mine has taken Lipitor, even at 80 mgs., but when her dr. switched her to Crestor she got quite ill from it, and it was not a high dose. Dr. switched her back to the Lipitor but it still didn't bring her numbers down much, so they are trying her on Vytorin. Like U, I know noone on Crestor, so maybe drs. just aren't comfortable with it???

    She has a horrible time trying to get her numbers down, yet she had a cath 2 years ago and it showed her with NO plaque. Only thing she did get was the PN and she isn't a diabetic, but got that while on Lipitor, not Crestor. Even with the high doses of statins, she hits maybe 255 and can't seem to get lower. I know she tries to eat well, is only maybe 15 lbs. over weight, but her biggest downfall is being from the south, she loves her stuff fried. Like I told her, bout time she started giving that up, it just might help.
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    Old 03-14-2006, 07:24 PM   #15
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    Re: New Crestor trial

    Hi all, I follow this board regularly, but this is my first post here. I've had high LDL that I've always been able to lower with diet. My HDL is high, with numbers in the 70's and 80's. Also very low trig levels. I feel pretty fortunate so far, but intend to keep getting checked every year or two. The study about Crestor was in our morning paper and caught my eye. Whenever anything comes out like this, I make sure to check who paid for the study. In this case, the sponsor was AstraZenecaPLC, Crestors maker. I have no idea whether this makes any difference or would skew the results, but I found it interesting. Any way, good luck to everyone....balleteach

     
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