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    Old 11-19-2007, 01:21 PM   #1
    love2fish
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    Cut Statins or Zetia

    I'm going to my Cardio tomorrow and ready for the fight of my life. I currently take vytorin 10/10, and 2000 mg of Niaspan.

    TC= 140
    HDL=67
    LDL=56
    TG=84

    I am 52 and in great shape. I eat right and work out 5 days a week. I have a family history of HD, and have a calcium score that is worsening. I tolerate the Niaspan well. I am having side effects of muscle pain, fatigue, and kind of a mental fog (forgetfulness). I want to drop one (or two) of the drugs. Should I try a lower dose of statin plus the Niaspan, or Zetia and Niaspan? Or should I drop both statin and zetia and just take Niaspan and RYR? I'm not sure I can keep my LDL and HDL at acceptable levels with just Niaspan, but I would be willing to try! My dr. is not going to be happy about my wanting to do this, but OH WELL!

     
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    Old 11-20-2007, 08:54 AM   #2
    Guy1_USA
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    Re: Cut Statins or Zetia

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by love2fishfork

    I am having side effects of muscle pain, fatigue, and kind of a mental fog (forgetfulness). I want to drop one (or two) of the drugs.
    Very typical side effects of statins. Statins are nasty... I would stop them immediatately. Been there... done that!


    Quote:
    Should I try a lower dose of statin plus the Niaspan, or Zetia and Niaspan? Or should I drop both statin and zetia and just take Niaspan and RYR?
    Since you tollerate Niaspan well... I would ask you Doctor to up your dossage to 3000 mg at bedtime and drop the statins. I have heard Zetia is just as nasty as statins. I have been taking 3000 mg of Niaspan for well over a year and have lowered my cholesterol 50%.

    The key is to only take the Niaspan at bedtime... you will achieve much better results.


    By the way... RYR IS a statin!

    Best of luck.

    Last edited by Guy1_USA; 11-20-2007 at 08:55 AM.

     
    Old 11-20-2007, 02:28 PM   #3
    love2fish
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    Re: Cut Statins or Zetia

    Yes I'm aware that RYR is a statin, just thinking I may need a low dose to keep my LDL low.

    Just got back from the doc. He took me off of the zetia and changed me from zocor (vytorin 10/10) to lipitor 10mg. Retest in 90 days. He wanted to put me on 40mg! We will see if the side effects subside, but I have my doubts.

    Last edited by love2fish; 11-20-2007 at 02:29 PM.

     
    Old 11-20-2007, 08:05 PM   #4
    Guy1_USA
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    Re: Cut Statins or Zetia

    There is nothing wrong with telling your Doctor you will not take a medication any longer.

    Sorry... I think statins are that nasty... I tell my Doctor NO every time regarding statins. Been at this for 16 years and have been on 3 different statins as well as some other meds. And folks who take statins for a long time report they end up with irreversible side effects. I heard here and on other boards all the time about folks taking 6 months...a year... or 5 years to get back to normal. Seems the biggest issue is nerve damage or the like... not just simple muscle aches.

    With your current numbers... I'd drop statins like a hot rock and up the Niaspan. The only side effect of Niaspan is the flushing... not the nerve and muscle damage... and sexual side effects... that statins can produce.

    Again, best of luck.

     
    Old 11-21-2007, 11:39 AM   #5
    Lord_Taff
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    Re: Cut Statins or Zetia

    Hi love2fishfork


    You may be getting away from several current side effects by stopping statins, but could be letting yourself into something a lot more serious.
    <Here is> information from reputable medical institutions about the side effects from taking between 1.5 and 6gms of pharmacological doses of Niacin.

    I have always advised that 2 grams per day should be the absolute maximum intake of any form of Niacin.
    Here are some facts for you and all the other board members here about high intake of Niacin.

    Besides dermatological and gastrointestinal complaints here are a few serious dangers.

    Fulminant hepatic failure (Acute liver failure). - Liver function loss 80-90%.
    Doses over 2 grams per day have been associated with liver damage, particularly with slow-release formulations. (ie: Niaspan)

    Cardiac arrhythmia - Some arrhythmias can cause cardiac arrest and sudden death.

    Hyperglycemia - High blood sugar.

    Hyperuricemia - High level of Uric acid in the blood.

    Niacin at extremely high doses can have life-threatening acute toxic reactions.

    One patient who took 5 x 500mg niacin over a 48 hour period was unresponsive for several minutes. (Only one report.....but one, could be any one of us.)

    High doses can cause thickening of the macula and retina which can lead to blurred vision and even blindness.

    Don't forget high doses as classified here are >1.5gms per day.

    Tip: Try the proven 'Portfolio eating plan'.

    The choice is yours.

    Lord Taff.

    Last edited by mod-anon; 11-21-2007 at 11:54 PM. Reason: do not instruct members to do outside searches

     
    Old 11-21-2007, 06:29 PM   #6
    Arizona77
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    Re: Cut Statins or Zetia

    This is of great concern to me at the present time. Since August my Doctor has me taking 2,000mg immediate release Niacin at bed time. I take (2) 1,000mg immediate release capsules together per his orders. I will see my Doctor in February for another lipid panel and will share my full results then. This will give me a sold six months on Niacin.

    What I am concerned about now is my liver function. In the past I have had no issues with my liver. I am concerned as my enzymes can be extremely elevated now and I may know nothing about it. My Doctor advised he does not want me to come in till February and he said he will do my lipid panel and check my liver function and blood glucose then. Just concerned as to why my Doctor is making me wait six months as he currently has me taking 2,000mg. But my Doctor said he is not concerned that's why he advised six months is fine. Any comments would be greatly appreciated.

    Last edited by mod-anon; 11-21-2007 at 11:55 PM. Reason: editing quote

     
    Old 11-21-2007, 06:54 PM   #7
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    Re: Cut Statins or Zetia

    What type of nerve damage--been on satins for 6 months--have problem now with ulmar nerve--small finger and hand-any experience with this?

     
    Old 11-21-2007, 07:20 PM   #8
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    Re: Cut Statins or Zetia

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Lord_Taff View Post
    Hi love2fishfork


    Fulminant hepatic failure (Acute liver failure). - Liver function loss 80-90%.
    Doses over 2 grams per day have been associated with liver damage, particularly with slow-release formulations. (ie: Niaspan)
    I know that slow-release Niacin (e.g., Slo-Niacin brand) above 2000 mg has definitely been associated with the Liver damage potential... but you are absolutely wrong to lump Niaspan... or immediate release niacin for that matter... with the likes of Slo-Niacin.

    I'd like to see your proof that Niapsan 3000 mg and below is likely to cause liver damage... I don't think you can produce this proof. The FDA would have never approved Niaspan if this was true.

    Niaspan is extended release... not slow-release... and Niaspan is the only FDA approved extended release niacin available. To be an FDA approved medication... there is a lot of study and science and double blind testing that goes on. And I have not been able to find any issue with Niaspan through all my research and personal experience, other than the flushing... and yes, in some cases, the elevated glucose lever that you have mentioned. But an elevated glucose level... or even uric acid build up... is a far cry from liver damage. Niaspan is only likely to cause uric acid build-up and increased glucose levels when taken 3000 mg a day. It is extremely unlikely when only taking 2000 mg a day.

    Sorry... you need to specifically address the product that causes problems and not lump all products into one generalized barrel.

    Even more specifically... immediate release niacin does not cause any of the issues you describe. For the folks that can take the flushing of immediate release niacin... you have nary a worry on the world taking doses above 2000 mg.

     
    Old 11-21-2007, 08:42 PM   #9
    Arizona77
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    Re: Cut Statins or Zetia

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by VentureMan View Post
    I know that slow-release Niacin (e.g., Slo-Niacin brand) above 2000 mg has definitely been associated with the Liver damage potential... but you are absolutely wrong to lump Niaspan... or immediate release niacin for that matter... with the likes of Slo-Niacin.

    I'd like to see your proof that Niapsan 3000 mg and below is likely to cause liver damage... I don't think you can produce this proof. The FDA would have never approved Niaspan if this was true.

    Niaspan is extended release... not slow-release... and Niaspan is the only FDA approved extended release niacin available. To be an FDA approved medication... there is a lot of study and science and double blind testing that goes on. And I have not been able to find any issue with Niaspan through all my research and personal experience, other than the flushing... and yes, in some cases, the elevated glucose lever that you have mentioned. But an elevated glucose level... or even uric acid build up... is a far cry from liver damage. Niaspan is only likely to cause uric acid build-up and increased glucose levels when taken 3000 mg a day. It is extremely unlikely when only taking 2000 mg a day.

    Sorry... you need to specifically address the product that causes problems and not lump all products into one generalized barrel.

    Even more specifically... immediate release niacin does not cause any of the issues you describe. For the folks that can take the flushing of immediate release niacin... you have nary a worry on the world taking doses above 2000 mg.
    That is the same as my Doctor advised. He said I would have no issues with 2,000mg immediate release besides the flushing . I talked to him about this and he told me not to worry about any other side effects. What he did say however is to stay away from Slo-Niacin. When I began my Niacin therapy I asked him about Slo-Niacin and he said he would not allow me to take it. But yes immediate release and (RX) Niaspan are extremely safe.

     
    Old 11-21-2007, 09:57 PM   #10
    Guy1_USA
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    Re: Cut Statins or Zetia

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Arizona77 View Post
    This is of great concern to me at the present time.
    What I am concerned about now is my liver function.

    There are no issues with immediate release niacin. It is the benchmark of niacin therapy. It's not in wide use because most can't tollerate the flushing... not because it has been proven harmful.

    Let's not lump all forms of niacin into the one pile... especially immedaite release... and Niaspan... and certainly not with out sustainable proof.

     
    Old 11-23-2007, 08:28 AM   #11
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    Re: Cut Statins or Zetia

    Yes, have been on Lipitor for about 9 months now and just recently began to have issues with the ulmar nerve with pain, numbness and tingling in the right hand and thumb. I went to my primary doctor and he sent me to a Ortho specialists ? They took exrays and decided I may have an issue with the C-5\C-6 disk of my neck, even though I'm not expericing any neck pain. The ortho doctor also performed a nerve test and MRI which display some wear on the C5-C6 disk but in my opinion not enough to be causing the type of pain that I am having. I just recently posted my problems on this board and have found so many folks who have been taking a statin (Lipitor) and had the same symptoms that I am having. Most of them quick taking the statin and their symptoms went away. I have had pain in my right shoulder, arm and hand. I have just decided to stop taking the Lipitor on 11\21 and will wait to see what happens. Don't expect for the pain to go away quickly because it will take a while for the statins to be removed from your blood. Based on the information that I have read on this board, it will take weeks or months before the pain will go away. Good Luck with you issue stop taking the statins NOW!!

     
    Old 11-23-2007, 04:58 PM   #12
    HubbleRules
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    Re: Cut Statins or Zetia

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Lord_Taff View Post
    Hi love2fishfork



    Cardiac arrhythmia - Some arrhythmias can cause cardiac arrest and sudden death.


    Lord Taff.
    Lord Taff,

    I personally experienced cardiac arythmia while on Niacin - and when I stopped it the arythmias went away.

    I was taking 750 mg Inositol Hexanicotinate.

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    Old 01-15-2008, 12:30 PM   #13
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    Re: Cut Statins or Zetia

    Venture Man stated he knew of someone with nerve damage from Zetia.

    I took Vytorin (with Zetia) for one month and my left wrist and hand became paralyzed. A month later, my right arm was affected exactly the same way, only it occurred during the day while I was doing dishes and the first time it happened in the morning right after I got up. About the same time, my right leg began to show signs of neuropathy. My condition, confirmed by an EMG, is still not completely healed after 8 months.

    I discontinued the vytorin after 1-2 months and slowly began to have symptoms improve. I began taking zocor alone at the same time I discontinued the Vytorin.

    I would NEVER take Zetia again. This has been a horrible experience.

     
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