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    Old 12-04-2005, 03:55 AM   #1
    Spanish
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    Anyone tried the no-cry sleep solution?

    I'm quickly coming to realise that I'm not cut out for controlled crying. I tried it again this morning. I know DD wasn't too tired because we took her up to her cot after she'd been awake 2.5hours only. She fussed for a bit and I ignored that but when she started crying properly I went in and soothed her then left and sat and held my hands over my ears for 2 minutes and then went back in and she calmed down again so I left and she started screaming so I waited 3 minutes and went back in and stayed with her until she fell asleep...but I didn't pick her up which is a start!!!

    I'd really like to find a way of helping her nap during the day without having to resort to crying (night times aren't such a problem for some reason she's much better at putting herself to sleep at night). Has anyone tried any of the books (no-cry sleep solution / baby whisperer etc) and if so do they work. Also do they just tell you what to do every second of the day? I read Gina Ford's contented baby book and she was telling me what to do roughly every ten minutes and I know that's not going to work for me.

    I've had a bit of a thought and I'd be interested in you opinions. I wonder if she goes down better at night because we have more of a routine (bath, pj's, story, last feed and then to bed). I don't get her up at a regular time each day and I'm thinking that if I always got her up at the same time and put her down for a nap at the same time she might learn that it's sleep time and drop off on her own. What do you think?

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    Old 12-04-2005, 05:46 AM   #2
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    Re: Anyone tried the no-cry sleep solution?

    Hi Spanish,

    I bought the No-Cry book and it is not for me. Who has time to read a whole book let alone take on a ten step process for geting baby to sleep?

    We are now sleeping through the night because we did CIO. I tried to use CIO in the day before trying it at night and had NO success. He naps better in the day now and I do nurse him or give him a bottle to get him to fall asleep and many days now he will take 2 one hour naps - not much but with him sleeping through the night, it is better.

    You will find something that works for you. Have you tried CIO at night?

    -Jen

     
    Old 12-04-2005, 02:51 PM   #3
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    Re: Anyone tried the no-cry sleep solution?

    My DD is 15 months old now. I have found that routine routine routine is the best for her any ways. You can tell when her routine is off. She isn't a very happy girl. We have had the same routine with her since she was like 6 weeks old. She is our first baby and i don't know how but we got very lucky. She has been the easiest baby. She was sleeping through the night at 6 weeks old and so we just got her on a routine and it helps that i work. So we have to get up at the same time everyday. Everyday she eat breakfast at the same time, morning nap same time, lunch same time, afternoon nap same time, dinner same time and bath story bed all the same time. It really does make it hard when you have some where to go or it's the weekend and you want to sleep in. It's what works for her and she is doing so well with it. I have upset her schedule before and it not fun for her or me. So we follow her schedule. It may be off a little bit a few days, but never hours off. I just try to schedule all doctor appointment and thing around nap times. Now she is getting old i think we can start taking out the morning nap. We haven't tryed yet, but i think we are going to try it soon. You just have to find out what works with you and your baby. Something that works for one doesn't always work for another. I was always told that a routine is really good for children so that is just what we decided to do. Like i said before i think we are pretty spoiled with our DD. Sleeping throught the night so easy, getting on a schedule so easy, off the bottle a six months and she hardly ever cries or gets upset about things. I keep telling my husband she has been so easy for us the second one is going to be diffcult. Good luck with your baby.

     
    Old 12-04-2005, 02:54 PM   #4
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    Re: Anyone tried the no-cry sleep solution?

    My son has CIO since he was about 6mths old. He has his favorite bear and blanket. I just have to lay him down and he may make a little fuss, but for the most part he is out in a few minutes. It's very difficult for people (relatives) because they want to rock him to sleep and that doens't work at all for him. He wants to lay still and have his Mr. Crunchy (bear) and blankie and some peace and quiet.

    You are just going to have to figure out what works well for you and the baby. It also depends on her age if you want to let her CIO. You are doing a good job, it's hard not to pick your baby up when they are crying and upset. So keep up the good work and next time wait a few more minutes before you go in and check on her, I know it's hard but it will be good for the both of you.

    Good Luck

     
    Old 12-05-2005, 02:59 PM   #5
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    Re: Anyone tried the no-cry sleep solution?

    You just have to be brave and let them CIO for a few times. It sucks and you feel like a horrible parent but its so much quicker than trying all the other stuff. We got some earplugs and let her go. After about 45 minutes I felt like we were just trying to ignore her so we could get some sleep and I felt really bad about that so I went in. The next night was less crying and each night after was better and better. Just stick with it! Those little stinkers know you'll come in so they cry all the more. Be tough and it'll all work out. Good luck!

     
    Old 12-07-2005, 07:26 AM   #6
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    Re: Anyone tried the no-cry sleep solution?

    I read secrets of the baby whisperer while I was pregnant and really liked that book. It gave me more confidence that I can really do this mom thing and a better understanding of babies, even though I have a 10-year-old too, we fumbled our way through the baby stage with her and she was a difficult baby, and given the age difference, I don't remember much anyway so I'm starting all over again.

    How old is your baby? Our doc told us we could start letting DD cry it out when she started on solid foods 3 times a day, which was 4 months for her. I didn't find that out until 5 months when I called in desparation because DD still wasn't sleeping through the night and was cat-napping for 20 minutes at a time in her swing which she was getting too big to be comfortable in. I was desparate to try anything at that point but crying it out was a last resort if necessary.

    I was very against letting DD cry it out and personally have a hard time listening to her cry without picking her up, so I thought the no-cry sleep solution was the perfect answer to solve all our sleep problems. It didn't work for my DD because when I went in to soothe her, she would scream louder if I didn't pick her up. The premise of the book is to go in when they're crying and calm them down without picking them up, but my DD would scream bloody murder if I went in there and didn't pick her up, no matter how clam she was when I was leaving the room. It was very frustrating and didn't work without crying for us - both of us.

    I was at my witts end and called my husband's buddy's wife who has 3 kids to see if she had any suggestions. Boy did she and it has changed our lives so much for the better. She first of all suggested putting DD on a schedule. I am against rigid scheduling (I can't stick to a schedule myself so it would be impossible for me to try to enforce one with my baby anyway) but she insisted that I try a loose schedule of food and naps so DD can predict them, even if it's not at the same time every day. That made sense to me and I was desparate to try anything to get some sleep and have DD get enough sleep to wake up rested (the lack of quality sleep was not only a problem for me, but also for DD, which is why things really needed to change). Just having a loose plan for the day (not scheduling every minute, but scheduling mealtimes, snacktimes and naptimes around the same time, within an hour or so) made a huge difference and DD got into the groove very quickly. We still go out and do things, we just stick to mealtimes and naptimes around the same time every day and plan the rest of our day around those. In addition, she recommended the Ferber book solving your child's sleep problems. I had been against crying it out before then too but we tried the no-cry sleep solution and it was clear that wasn't going to work and we were desparate to get some quality sleep. The Ferber method was a little easier for me (it's still not easy to listen to your baby cry) than the harsh "just let her cry and eventually she'll go to sleep" method that our doc suggested. There is a definite method that you follow in the book and it really worked with DD, along with the loose schedule. I really think it was the predictability of the schedule and knowing what comes next that made a big difference, and the Ferber sleep method just helped DD learn to put herself to sleep when it was naptime (bedtime was always easier for us too, maybe because we had a routine for bedtime). The combination of the 2 has really made our lives soooo much easier, including DD's who now wakes up rested and in a good mood. She's always been an easy-going baby but she's even better now that she's getting enough quality sleep.

    DD is 7 months old now and we can put her down for naps wide awake and she just puts herself to sleep in her crib, almost always without crying. For me, it was soooo worth a week or 2 of being diligent and listening to some crying and even mad screaming when I left the room without picking her up. She learned quickly that when it's naptime, it's naptime and no matter how much fussing and how many tantrums she throws, it's still naptime and she's in there until she takes a nap, or at least as long as a nap would be. At first I thought that was very harsh but I realized that I was inadvertently teaching her that if she screamed loud enough and long enough, I'd eventually go and get her, which was compounding the problem. Believe me, they have waaay more stamina than we do. It took about a week of good days and rough days to get her to realize the expectation and to sleep when it's naptime. It wasn't easy but it ws so worth it! I look for her sleep cues and don't just put her to bed because the clock says it's time, but I have found that by having a routine, she generally gets tired around the same time every day now so it's predictable.

    DD's schedule is as follows:
    between 7am and 8am - wake up (if she wakes up before 7am, we go in there and reassure her we're there but let her know it's not time to get up yet, so she'll go back to sleep)
    breakfast - solid foods
    between 9am and 10am - bottle and naptime (we rock her in her room while we're feeding her, then burp her and put her in her crib - awake)
    between 11am and noon when she wakes up - lunchtime - solid foods
    between 1pm and 2pm - bottle and naptime
    between 4pm and 5pm - dinnertime - solid foods
    7:30pm - bathtime
    8pm - bottle and bedtime

    This is the routine we try to stick to, but some days the times are off depending on what we have to do that day. The routine is the same but occasionally she'll nap in the car or at grandma's house.

    I'm sure some people may disagree with some of these things, but this is what has worked for us and my DD. Hope this helps.

     
    Old 12-07-2005, 04:36 PM   #7
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    Re: Anyone tried the no-cry sleep solution?

    Hi,

    l agree with JMCUMMINS. I have tried this with my dd and it does work.

    7 am she will wake she will have her milk and then l put her back in her cot. She will play and then fall asleep.

    She may wake up at 10 am and then l change and feed her and let her play in her bouncer l then feed her like every 2-3 hours. I bath her around 7.30 pm ish and try to put her in bed at for about 8 pm ish.

     
    Old 12-08-2005, 01:29 PM   #8
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    Re: Anyone tried the no-cry sleep solution?

    Hi there.

    Thanks for your replies. The problem with leaving my DD to CIO is that like JM's daughter she doesn't cry she absolutely screams. I've just spent a few days with my mum and she is always telling me leave DD to cry...but...she'd never really heard her go off on one until now - now she's heard how she cries she also says that she would have a hard time leaving her to cry like that!

    I think routine is going to be the key and I have a cunning plan! I'm going to spend two or three weeks, up to Christmas say, trying to get her into a regular routine, up at the same time, morning and afternoon naps at the same time and bed at the same time each day. Even if I have to rock her to sleep or take her out in the car or buggy to get her to sleep, she will hopefully learn that those are sleep times. Once she's got the hang of that I can then work on getting her to go to sleep on her own. One step at a time I think because, after all, she is only four months old and I just think she's too young to be left to scream.

    Spanish

     
    Old 12-08-2005, 02:18 PM   #9
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    Re: Anyone tried the no-cry sleep solution?

    Spanish, my DD used to scream bloody murder if I went in there and didn't pick her up, and I realized that letting her cry for a little bit and then picking her up because she was screaming, only made her scream harder because that was what I was inadvertently teaching her to do. I would highly recommend the Ferber book Solve Your Child's Sleep Problems to get them to sleep when they need to sleep. It is a cry it out method, but if your baby won't go to sleep without falling asleep in your arms (they wake up the instant you put them down and cry anyway) or crying, I found that I really didn't have any other choice because she was going to cry anyway. I liked the idea of having a plan and not just listening to her scream. Ferber recommends letting them cry for 5 minutes before going in to reassure them that you're there but NOT picking them up since they're supposed to be sleeping, even if they scream bloody murder when you walk out of the room (you know there's nothing wrong with them, they're just mad), then wait 10 more minutes before going in next, then 15, then 20 and after an hour if they're still not sleeping, you pick them up and "naptime" is over. The next day, you put them to bed and if they're still crying you go in after 10 minutes, even if they're screaming. They get mad, but you can't give in to their tantrums and need to teach them the expectations. It's hard, but I just forced myself to do something else until it was time to go in there. DD did eventually fall asleep (at first after 50 minutes of crying and me going in there at the set intervals) and it got easier. After about a week (some days were better than others), she was able to put herself to sleep with no crying when I put her in bed awake. She knows the expectation. Having a schedule helped because she knew it was coming and what to expect.

     
    Old 12-08-2005, 02:20 PM   #10
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    Re: Anyone tried the no-cry sleep solution?

    BTW, I forgot to mention that or doc said they are old enough to cry it out when they are on solids 3 times a day, which is 4 months for most babies in her practice. That was the guideline that we were given.

     
    Old 12-08-2005, 09:35 PM   #11
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    Re: Anyone tried the no-cry sleep solution?

    Spanish,

    I read the "no cry sleep solution", it made sense to me. I bought it a month ago, my DS is also 4mo old. At the time my son napped well and woke up 2x/night. My problem was that my DS would not fall asleep w/o his pacifier,, so at night if he woke up w/o it, I would have to go in to put it in his mouth. I've been working on it for a month but still no luck, but it is getting better. He will now sleep w/o out it, but sitll needs it to fall asleep. I don't have the same problems as you, if I put him in his crib w/ the pacifier in his mouth, he'll be out very quickly.

    Some good tips that the book gives besides sticking to routine, are being very vigilant to baby's signs of being tired, the need for a nap can vary by an hour. If you don't put them down at that point and keep them up because it's not their schedualed nap time yet, they will then be overtired and resist it. So my son's first nap is around noon, but on some days it can be at 11:30 or 1pm. From around 11am, I watch for those signs, yawning is the obvious but rare sign, but usually he will quiet down, start looking blankly into the distance, and rubbing his eyes and fussing. The last two usually mean he's been tired for a while. If I put his down immediatly, he usually will fall asleep right away.

    I'm not sure if having your baby go to sleep in the car or swing is a good habit to start. If your DD resists sleeping in the crib, I would just start fresh and do it right from begining. If she learns to sleep well at noon in the car, but doesn't like sleeping in the crib, she will then not start sleeping well in the crib adn you will then have to start all over. You don't want to replace one bad habit (not sleeping) w/ another (sleeping only in the car)

    You said that she will fall asleep if you stay with her in the room, is that how she usually falls asleep. Let me know, I will tell you what the "no-cry sleep solution" recommends from that stage.

     
    Old 12-10-2005, 03:08 PM   #12
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    Re: Anyone tried the no-cry sleep solution?

    Hi and thanks for replies again.

    My DD is a funny one with sleeping. At the moment she needs to be cuddled to sleep when she goes down for the night. But, when I feed her in the middle of the night I just put her back in her cot awake and she takes herself right off to sleep with no problem at all.

    During the day she used to nap in her bouncy chair sometimes but hasn't done that for a while. At the moment I can't even seem to be able to get her to go to sleep in my arms but she'll usually fall asleep in the pram or the car quite easily. Today i took her out in the pram morning and afternoon so she had two naps.

    It was stressing me out so I've decided to be a bit more relaxed over her sleeping. I realise that I can't make her sleep exactly when I want her to, but I'm trying to make sure that she has some regular quiet time so that she has the opportunity to go to sleep if she wants to. I've been watching for her sleepy signs but when I see them I might pop her in her bouncy chair rather than in the cot to see if she'll sleep there for a while.

    An interesting point about when they are ready to CIO - DD is still on just breastmilk as where I am they don't recommend weaning until 6 months. However the main problem with CIO, or even the Ferber controlled crying method is that I find crying and screaming exceptionally upsetting. I know no one likes to listen to crying but I'm so sensitive to it that I can't even watch soap operas on the TV because I can't bear all the shouting and screaming that goes on!

    Kiedy: She used to sometimes fall asleep if I just stayed next to the cot and rubbed her tummy but hasn't even done that for a while. Now she'll just fuss on and on and needs a pick up just to get her over that last hurdle and off to sleep.

    Last edited by Spanish; 12-10-2005 at 03:10 PM.

     
    Old 12-10-2005, 08:01 PM   #13
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    Re: Anyone tried the no-cry sleep solution?

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by vsmom
    You just have to be brave and let them CIO for a few times. It sucks and you feel like a horrible parent but its so much quicker than trying all the other stuff. We got some earplugs and let her go. After about 45 minutes I felt like we were just trying to ignore her so we could get some sleep and I felt really bad about that so I went in. The next night was less crying and each night after was better and better. Just stick with it! Those little stinkers know you'll come in so they cry all the more. Be tough and it'll all work out. Good luck!

    I have to disagree with this. I think allowing your child to cry for 45 minutes is really not good. If we, as adults, were upset or needed comfort, how would we like it if the person we loved left us alone to cry ourselves to sleep? We wouldn't like it at all, right? Why should we expect a helpless child to have to do it?

    I've rocked my son to sleep since he was born, and I enjoy it thoroughly. It isn't a chore, as some people think. It's extra bonding time, and I help him learn that going to sleep is a pleasant experience, not one to be spent in tears.

    Not trying to be rude here, so I hope no one takes offense. Just a difference in opinion!

    Amy

     
    Old 12-10-2005, 10:24 PM   #14
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    Re: Anyone tried the no-cry sleep solution?

    Hi Spanish,

    This is the summary of what the book suggests. You first have to develop a key word/phrase that you use when you put DD to sleep (such as "shh or sleepy sleepy"). YOu may already have something you say to her when you put her down. Next you follow Six Phases, if your DD falls asleep in your arms, you seem to be at phase 1. The key is to progress to phase 6 to have your DD fall asleep. Here they are:

    Phase 1: Breast feed and hold until baby is asleep. Gently put baby in crib. If baby wakes up while puting down, pick her up and nurse until she falls asleep again. Repeat until baby is able to stay alseep in the crib. Then start trying phase 2

    Phase 2: Breast feed and hold baby until baby is 'sleepy' but not asleep. Then place baby in crib. If baby cries pick up and nurse more, and try again until you are able to put baby to sleep in crib. If doesn't work after couple of tries, go to phase 1. Once this works move to phase 3.

    Phase 3: Comfort without pick ups. When baby wakes up after you put her down or starts cryign after you put her down, try to comfort by massaging, saying "key" word/phrase BUT don't pick up. If that doesn't work after couple of minutes go to phase 2 or even 1

    Phase 4: Continue to sooth. Pat back gently, stay quite. (to me it's the same as phase 3)

    Phase 5: Soothe baby verbally (next to her crib), don't touch. Say your key words. If this doesn't work go to phase 4 or 3

    Phase 6: Soothe baby from the doorway or outside the room. You want the baby to hear you but not see you. Again if this doesn't soothe her go and do the same next to her crib. Keep on trying until she falls asleep just by hearing you. By now, she should just falls asleep once you put her down, but should she fuss or wake up later, you'll be able to just comfort her from the distance.

    Once you find that the baby falls asleep well at one phase you move up to the next, and try that couple times until it's successful. If it doesn't work you always move back to the prievious one or two phases that worked. Hopefully w/ time being able to move all the way to phase 6 and eventually not even needing it at all. Let me know if this is not clear.

    Last edited by Kiedy; 12-10-2005 at 10:29 PM.

     
    Old 12-11-2005, 12:50 PM   #15
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    Re: Anyone tried the no-cry sleep solution?

    Oh Kiedy. That's fantastic! Thank you so much! I think we are at Phase 1 with occasional success at Phase 2. Actually right at this moment, I've put her down in her cot wide awake and left the room and she's been quite happy lying there listening to Classic FM for 5 minutes with no crying. I expect she'll start to cry as she starts to be ready to sleep but at least I was able to lay her down in the cot without tears. I think maybe it's because she had a really good 2 hour afternoon nap (in the pushchair) so she's not too overtired. I left her sucking on her muslin so I must pop in in a moment and make sure it's not over her face!

    I'm going to print out this page and see how we get on with the stages. I'm so grateful! Thank you!

    Spanish

     
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