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    Old 03-14-2006, 05:29 PM   #1
    theweaver2
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    Question Would Percocet be good breakthrough drug while using vicodin?

    Ive been asking about types of pain meds the past few days. WOW is there a lot to know and understand about just hydrocodone itself...

    Seems like I might be stuck with vicodin 10/660 every 6-8 hours which helps my mild pain but often, usually towards the end of the day or after any activity (like cooking dinner or doing laundry) my pain shoots up.

    My pain doc is seemingly looking to me to know what the hell I need - weird... Maybe she is used to people coming in asking for this or that. What I might ask her tomorrow is whether she will prscribe a breakthrough drug for me..

    Would percocent be a good breaktrhough and how big a dose would be good. I would prob only need it once a day and prob not everyday as some days Im not that active. It would be grand if I knew I had back up.

    Does anyone in here use that kind of combo - Vicodin ES with perc for breakthrough?

    Thanks

     
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    Old 03-14-2006, 06:03 PM   #2
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    Re: Would Percocet be good breakthrough drug while using vicodin?

    Hey Weaver,

    Its probably going to be fairly uncommon to prescribe Vicodin and Percocet at the same time. Mainly because they are both short acting drugs. A PM Dr may have some explaining to do if he were to prescribe a patient to short acting opiate meds, and the pateint OD on accident. I'm not saying you are going to take them in an irresponsible manner.

    Generally when someone is prescribed BT meds it is in addition to a long acting med and it used for just that, BT. I understand where you are coming from and actually using two different types of opiate meds, will generally give better coverage. However, its not likely you get both SA meds.

    You could go with a low level OxyContin which is a time-released oxycodone (same drug as percocet) and vicodin (hydrocodone) for BT.

    Anyway, thats my opinion. Hope it all works out well for you. Take care

     
    Old 03-14-2006, 06:04 PM   #3
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    Re: Would Percocet be good breakthrough drug while using vicodin?

    Hi Weaver....generally, docs don't prescribe 2 short acting meds at the same time. Percocet and Vicodin are both short acting. I've never heard of any doc prescribing any type of b/t med while taking Vicodin or while taking Percocet. Percocet and Vicodin are both prescribed (not at the same time) as b/t meds while taking long acting meds like Oxycontin, Duragesic, or Morphine. If your pain is not being well controlled, maybe it's time to switch to a long acting med and use the Vicodin as a b/t med. Just a thought.

    P.S. Aranger...we posted at the exact same time. Anyway, ditto!

    Last edited by friendly_one; 03-14-2006 at 06:06 PM.

     
    Old 03-15-2006, 05:51 AM   #4
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    Question Re: Would Percocet be good breakthrough drug while using vicodin?

    Thanks again for your quick reply before my appointment this morning...

    Geesh, I know NOTHING about how pain meds are prescribed. I won't even embarass myself now by asking her that. You would think during my 2 consults with her and explaining WHY I'm there in the first place she would explain some of these things to me.

    I guess what I need to tell her is that my pain levels are just too high most of the time for the vicodin to work. Then, she will have to decide whether I need perc as needed for pain or the time release. lol I'm still have trouble wrapping my mind around why she prescribed LESS than I was currently taking.

    I have another question though.... As I have surgery in 6-7 weeks, will using these drugs affect how they will work for me after surgery as that is the regime the surgeon uses??? My surgeon uses longterm plus perc as a breakthrough, as you were talking about.

    Actually, what I should be hearing from my doctors is "We will give you what you NEED for pain until you can find out and help correct the problem in your shoulder..." Is THAT too much to ask???

    Seriously... I'm not just seeking pain meds for the sake of it. If the other ten doctors, neuros, orthos and misc doctors I've seen over the past 2 and half years had only spent a month like this current ortho (new surgeon) and zeroed in to the pain I wouldn't be in the pain cycle I'm in.... AND, I had to go to a clinic 2 hours away to find this one... another story (I really need to write a short story about my past 3 years...)

    I hope I can get some pain relief for the next 6-7 weeks. Hopefully, it will allow me to comfortably do some PT I need to strengthen a bit before this next surgery. My muscles haven't recovered from the first surgery that didnt fix all the problem.

    Wish me luck today and later with my surgery - I'm feeling pretty lost and helpless right now because I havent been able to find doctors who will listen and respond. I do have a little hope with this new surgeon as he seemed to get right to the problem.

    OK - I will stop rambling for now. Thanks again for your quick replies and I will let you know what my pain doc says today.

    Keep your fingers crossed.......

     
    Old 03-15-2006, 06:03 AM   #5
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    Re: Would Percocet be good breakthrough drug while using vicodin?

    Maybe just completely switching over to the percs alone would do the trick.you would have better pain control with using the percs than you would with the vicodin anyway,and who knows,you may not need quite as many as you were having to take while on the vicodin?also,if you have to ,for some reason,stay on the vics,go to something with a bit less tylenol like norco.it has the same 10mgs as what you are currently taking,but only has 325mgs of tylenol as compared to the 660mgs you are taking now.

    but unless your pain is constant and unrelenting,I really would go with the percs instead of going right to the oxycontin,espescially if this doc is a bit leary of the oxy as most seem to be.the percs would work well for intermittant pain such as you somewhat described.just some thoughts.it does sound like you have a good doc though much more 'workable" than most.some docs have this preset way of treating pain in all their patients regardless of how their pain presents and how it realistically should be treated.Let us know how it all goes.good luck,Marcia
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    Old 03-15-2006, 09:33 AM   #6
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    Re: Would Percocet be good breakthrough drug while using vicodin?

    Percocet and Vicadin are the same class of medications. I don't think a DR will give you both. I think a longer acting medication like oxycontin would be a better choice for you but if you ask for it by name your Dr may not give it to you. Tell the Dr the vicadin is not lasting long enough to control your pain and than ask if there is anything that might las longer for you.. both percocet and vicadin only last an hour for my pain control and than it shoots right back up to the same pain level I was at before I took it. I just started oxycontin and it helps me for about 4 hours and I don't have any side effects from it, nor does it make me feel tired like the percocet and vics do. that fuzzy feeling doesn't happen for me on the oxycontin. I really like it so far. Let us know what your DR says when you ask for something that will last longer.

    good luck.

     
    Old 03-15-2006, 04:04 PM   #7
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    Re: Would Percocet be good breakthrough drug while using vicodin?

    thanks for the replies...

    When I asked for something stronger than the vicodin she gave me, she got a little upset with me... She said - it is more - you can now use it 4 times a day instead of the 2 you were doing. Well, I said the doses I was using werent helping much unless pain was low.

    She is like you didn't want to do what I suggested (which was the MSContin or Morphine longacting) the first time. And, I reminded her thats because I wanted to try the Lidoderm patch just "in case" in helped - which was futile... cuz it did squat.

    What I finally told her in tears was that I wasn't trying to be difficult I just dont want to take the stronger drugs if something else would work and that I don't know about pain meds other than the nasty rumors I hear about them.

    She didnt offer percs on an as needed basis as I do have pain round the clock maybe that is why she didnt consider them. AND, maybe all pain docs do start with this regime.

    What she said is that I would be "committed" to her. Go every 2 weeks, plan on going through withdrawal when I cut back or go off of them.

    I told her I don't have a problem with the commitment I am just having trouble accepting I NEED these drugs. I guess society has worked a number on me. I feel like I HAVE to be tough and deal with the pain.

    However, now that I have surgery in 6 weeks I am praying it will help get me going in the right direction and there will be an end in sight w/o narcotics.

    I always have to find a "silver lining" in the choices I make lol - and my silver lining in taking the meds now is that it will give me a chance to find the right dose before surgery rather than coming out of surgery and needing them and having to go through all the dose changes I may need. Better to find out now than after when I have surgical pain.

    I think my biggest problem is mental - I feel weak and, now, dependent on a doctor to take care of me. I hate that feeling.

    How do you all cope with the mental aspect of using narcotics round the clock???

     
    Old 03-16-2006, 07:21 AM   #8
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    Re: Would Percocet be good breakthrough drug while using vicodin?

    So ,just what did she end up doing then as far as your meds?marcia
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    Old 03-17-2006, 05:20 AM   #9
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    Re: Would Percocet be good breakthrough drug while using vicodin?

    She prescribed hydrocodone 40 ER which I guess is the MScontin...

    I took one last night and then one this morning. Either my pain levels are just on the low side or this stuff really works.

    However, I feel soooo drained. But that might be because I had a migraine the other day and used phenergan for nausea. That drug will sometimes drain me for a while. So, for now I will chalk it up to that.

    But, the pain levels have dropped so low I could actually lay on my back and right side last night. I haven't been able to do that comfortably for almost 2 years.

    So, now I'm wondering if the dose is higher than I need. lol Here I am begging for pain relief and when I get it I worry that the dose is too high. Guess I'm just terrified the higher the dose the harder it will be to get away from.

    I see her in 2 weeks and she can adjust as needed then I guess.

    I don't know if using percs as needed would work as she went straight to wanting me to use the time release and since she thought I wasn't letting her "help" me to begin with since I asked if I could try the Lidoderm patch first, I didnt even mention it.

    Lots of doctors don't want their patients telling them what they need. AND, we don't want to **** off our pain docs now do we? lol

    I love this board - its educational see what people have gone through. I have learned a lot from here already.

     
    Old 03-17-2006, 11:55 AM   #10
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    Re: Would Percocet be good breakthrough drug while using vicodin?

    Stay at the dose that you are at for awhile and see if your body adjust to it the way it is. You don't want to call and have her lower the dose only to find out in a week that after some adjustment time that the new dose is TOO low and have to call them back again! I know when I first started methadone it was at 30mg and I felt like that worked perfectly...but that was just because I had been in pain for SO long that my body was just grateful for the stronger meds! After a couple of weeks I actually had to have an increase! So just see how it goes. I'm so happy for you that the meds are working!!! That is just great!

    Tina

     
    Old 03-17-2006, 02:04 PM   #11
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    Re: Would Percocet be good breakthrough drug while using vicodin?

    Tina,

    I just think it's sad we had to wait so long that the feeling of no pain was just a memory for us....

    And, yes, I'm going to wait. I may be going through some good days where my pain levels are just easier to treat right now, thus the good result. I rather think as needed meds might have been better tho.

    But, I'm just grateful for the pain relief for a while...

     
    Old 03-19-2006, 06:23 PM   #12
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    Re: Would Percocet be good breakthrough drug while using vicodin?

    I am learning bit by bit about pain meds. I only suggested that as I know percocets are stronger than vicodins. I just didnt know they were in the same family. Might be why she switched me out of that family to give me a break from the tylenol. I used the oxycodone 40ER 3 times (once every 12 hours) then had to take a break because I was sooo nauseaus, tired, and headache that wouldn't go away. About a day and half later had to take another oxy because pain had become so bad and again the vicodin did nothing... It didn't seem to hit me as hard this time nor did the pain dissapate as quickly (darn). It still disagrees with me quite a bit. Maybe like one person suggested - I shouldn't be to eager to drop down in strength until I give myself time to adjust to this one tho it seems a bit high.

    arrrrrgh - I just hate the whole concept of using narcotics for pain I'm trying to remedy in every way I can.

    Last edited by moderator2; 03-22-2006 at 06:53 PM. Reason: do not quote posting rules violations

     
    Old 03-20-2006, 05:41 AM   #13
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    Re: Would Percocet be good breakthrough drug while using vicodin?

    You should be on a sustain release pain killer for chronic pain.Weak pain killers like vicodin are only useful for mild to moderate acute pain......Dave

     
    Old 03-20-2006, 05:56 AM   #14
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    Re: Would Percocet be good breakthrough drug while using vicodin?

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mpvt
    You should be on a sustain release pain killer for chronic pain.Weak pain killers like vicodin are only useful for mild to moderate acute pain......Dave
    Dave....

    I'm getting to that understanding. I've told my doctors for almost 2 years... I repeat 2 years that I have pain 24/7 - not one of them has suggested anything other than vicodin (and not even the strongest dose I have since found out) for my pain. Now, when my pain has grown and cause other problems they finally decide to use the longaction and jumped to a strong dose that is giving me huge side effects lol - tho it DEFINITELY helps the pain...

    I took my last longacting at 3am and the nausea and fatigue are better but since I also suffer from chronic transformed migraine this med is causing havoc with my migraines. Funny how one drug can eliminate whole body pain but cause such xtreme HA pain....

    I just hope I have the strength to withdraw from them in the future and that has me terrified... For now, I just want to enjoy feeling halfway normal again.

     
    Old 03-20-2006, 06:29 AM   #15
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    Re: Would Percocet be good breakthrough drug while using vicodin?

    Hey weave,just a thought here as I had the same reaction to the generic type of OC that you are currently taking.either ask your doc to write DAW on the next Rx so you can at least give the name brand a try before just settling for the symptoms you are currently having.for some reason,the particular generic(the endo brand)is becomming rather notorius for giving people the exact same symptoms you are having.I don't know why,or how but there IS definitely something in that particular generic that seems to give people alot of problems.I was on that crap for two weeks and it was absolute hell.i had horrid nausea and felt just crappy and the pain relief just was not up to the same level as with the name brand that I was used to before they came out wih the generic.

    If you had never been on the 'real' oxycontin before trying the generic type,the pain relief issue is not as apparent,but when you have actually had the pleasure of being on the name brand from the start and almost a year before the switch,it really makes a huge difference.The other issue could be that this dose is just a bit too high for you and because you never really had been on any oxy type products,it is just hitting you a bit harder than someone who had been "graded up' from the usual vics to percs and then the oxycontin,do you know what I mean?

    I just don't want to see you end up giving up on this med at some point just because of the side effects you are currently having that may be stemming from that particular generic and not the actual OC.try asking for that DAW written on your next Rx and give that a try and see how it goes.honestly the endo version of the OC is just horrible for me.i will not take it gain.

    Since you are kinda new at this,i just wanted to give you the heads up on this crap.i hope it will eventually all settle down and you get that good control without the nasty side effects.Marcia
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