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  • I got placed on a "pain med HOLIDAY"

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    Old 04-14-2008, 07:13 PM   #31
    JoJo921
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    Re: I got placed on a "pain med HOLIDAY"

    Tony,
    Wow!! Im so sorry to hear of your dilemma. I just dont understand some doctors today. I realize that addiction to narcotic pain medication is at epidemic porportion, but come on what your going through is totally uncalled for. What kind of a professional doctor would just leave you hangin like that? I'm not sure if your a believer or not and I certainly dont want to stir up controversy, but if you are, reach out to him and he will see you through this.
    Peace & Grace brother......................

     
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    Old 04-14-2008, 08:30 PM   #32
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    Re: I got placed on a "pain med HOLIDAY"

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tbreeze27 View Post
    Anyone guess how long it will take for my body to recognize this amount again?
    Not long.....Unfortunately.

    I participated in this thread very early, and have been reluctant to add anything because I knew I would get very critical and crass....And I really try not to these days as it's not an admirable trait. I would much rather support people via positive advice. However, I can sit on the sidelines no more.

    Unfortunately, it won't take long...A couple of weeks....Maybe longer. You will experience a temporary improvement in your tolerance due to the med holiday. However, since you've been on narcotics for 4+ years as you state in your first post, it would take about 6 months to completely reset your biological clock...Maybe longer.

    What this Doc did to you was nothing short of torture and abuse. It is very obvious that he knows NOTHING about pain management. You don't give chronic PM patients med holidays! In fact, you do the opposite...You increase their dose due to tolerance, which is clearly explained as an inevitable part of PM 101. In addition, he didn't even have the medical foresight to taper you down....Just cut you off....Which can cause a whole different set of serious medical issues if left unmonitored. What a psycho. He should be investigated by your state medical board...And, I am very serious about that.

    See.....I knew it would get ugly....This is why I should have stayed away. I'm very sorry if I've discouraged you, or made you scared in any way. My knee jerk reaction is to run as far as you can from this quack. However, that may not be realistic. Only you know how you feel after the month long holiday, and will have to make the best decision you can. What if he does it to you again? What if 6 months from now he says "well....time for another holiday."

    Sorry to cut and run, but I'm getting a panic attack myself here....I will pray for you and I really sincerely hope it works out....You deserve sooo much better.

    Ex

     
    Old 04-15-2008, 01:15 PM   #33
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    Re: I got placed on a "pain med HOLIDAY"

    Tbreeze - Sorry that doctor is giving you such a hassle with the Oxycontin. I was on 80 mg of Oxycontin 3 x a day plus 8 /day Oxy IR 5 mg for break through pain. I'm not trying to compare my need for pain meds vs. you, however, I did want to point out you still have room to grow in increasing your dose. I too developed a huge tolerance to the Oxycontin and had to come off of it a while. I went on Suboxone for a year and see a Pain Management specialist on 4/22 to talk about going back on pain meds.

    I had the same pain issues as you do now when I built up a tolerance over 5 years of taking pain medication. I felt like I was going into withdrawl every 4 hours on the Estended Release Oxy that was supposed to last 12 hours.

    I still think Oxycontin is a great medication, however, it is a double edged sword. It appears yo can gain a tolerance fast on this medication. I know I did. I ran out 30 days early on a 90 day supply and my former pain management told me to "just make it work" when I told her I was having tolerance issues. I'm starting to wonder why the Pain Management docs. have suach a lack of knowledge of how to handle tolerance and dependance issues. It would appear that periodically that they could switch you to a different medication when you build up a tolerance on one.

    I would find another pain management doctor if you have that capability. That's what I had to do.

     
    Old 04-15-2008, 04:30 PM   #34
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    Re: I got placed on a "pain med HOLIDAY"

    Thank you everyone! I know. Even though I have been on Oxycodone for 4+ years. . . I am young to the way the system works. My primary doctor never did this to me. But dropped me as a patiant because I am under the care of my back doctor. My PCP will not treat me anymore because he does not do that for extended amounts of time. He says I have been on medication too long and he actually wants me off of them. Again, he is another person who does not support chronic pain sufferers. Oh well. I am going to stand my groud this Friday and I will not leave my back doctors office until I get a stronger does. If he will not comply, I will be getting a referal from him personally to a pain doctor and starting with him. They are playing games with me and my surgery. I need a fusion, but I am not sure that I need this when I am having pain in different areas now. In my upper back, my joints, my arms. . . . I am suppose to have this done in July. . . But I will not be chopped open when I am not confident that there are more things going on right now. I will not be rushed into this. What they are playing with is. . . telling me I cant have stronger medication, or, that I need to move my surgery appt closer. . . . It's a form of black male I think. I dont know if I should tell him that today, my medication is back to not working. . . So, I did not follow the prescription order. . . I took two Oxycontin 10mg . . making it a 20mg. I did great on that. It is starting to tapper off now. I am going to take a 10mg as prescribed right now, wait, see what the results are. . . and if needed. . . . I will not hestitate to take another. Even though I have only 60 Oxycontin 10mgs. . . I will not live like this anymore. If I take it at the rate I am going. . . I will be out in 15 days. But calling them and speaking with them over the phone does me know good. So, I am thinking that I go to him this Friday for my appts and tell him honestly. . . So he trusts me. I want to tell him. . . "doctor, I am an honest person, you would not listen, I have called and called, I have begged and begged, I then spoke with a pharmacy. . . questioning if taking two were safe, they said yes. . . and because I have a life. . . I made the final desciion to up my does. Thats what I want to tell him. . . I dont want to lie. I just dont know if its in my best interest to do something like that????? What is all your suggestions?

     
    Old 04-15-2008, 04:56 PM   #35
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    Re: I got placed on a "pain med HOLIDAY"

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tbreeze27 View Post
    So, I am thinking that I go to him this Friday for my appts and tell him honestly. . . So he trusts me. I want to tell him. . . "doctor, I am an honest person, you would not listen, I have called and called, I have begged and begged, I then spoke with a pharmacy. . . questioning if taking two were safe, they said yes. . . and because I have a life. . . I made the final desciion to up my does. Thats what I want to tell him. . . I dont want to lie. I just dont know if its in my best interest to do something like that????? What is all your suggestions?
    Hi Tony:

    JMHO, but I'm afraid if you go in like that, that this doc will cut you off 100% right then and there, and you will be left with nothing. Your seeing a back doctor right, and not a PM?? I know my PM would cut off and hold the door for ya on the way out, and sometimes the orthopods, and neuros are far more opoid "nervous" than the PM's are.

    Just be careful how you approach him. You don't want to come off as desperate. I know you want pain relief, so in that sense you are desperate, but he could mistake your behavior for drug seeking behaviors.

    Either way, good luck, I hope you get the relief you deserve.
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    Old 04-15-2008, 05:28 PM   #36
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    Re: I got placed on a "pain med HOLIDAY"

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tbreeze27 View Post
    I am going to stand my groud this Friday and I will not leave my back doctors office until I get a stronger does. If he will not comply, I will be getting a referal from him personally to a pain doctor and starting with him.
    So, I did not follow the prescription order. . . I took two Oxycontin 10mg . . making it a 20mg. I am going to take a 10mg as prescribed right now, wait, see what the results are. . . and if needed. . . . I will not hestitate to take another. I will be out in 15 days.
    You go in there and tell him that you have been using more than prescribed and demand an increase, I can tell you with 95% certainty that he will drop you as a patient, possibly label you as a drug addict(which will follow you to EVERY doctor that you go to), and notify your pharmacy(to label you as a drug seeker). He sounds like he is definitely stingy with the meds as ALMOST ALL SURGEONS are. You definitely need to get into see a PM doctor. Make sure you find out whether this PM doc also prescribes medication. Tell him what your pain level is at(when you are taking it as prescribed) and how much it limits you. If he is not willing to increase it, then ask for a referral to a PM doc but be aware that sometimes it takes more than 1 month to get into see one. I would ask if you could possibly try the fentanyl patch(25mcg) to see how that would do and to last you until you get into see a PM doc. This would give you much steadier and probably better relief than what you are getting currently. I know how difficult it is considering my PM doc would only give me Ultram and I was taking 400mg/day and telling him I couldn't stand the pain. However, since I am a recovering addict he treated me like I was 3rd class and wouldn't help me. You can better believe I wanted to go in there, get ****** off, tell him how I felt, and then I would probably never be able to see another doctor again. However, I gritted my teeth, took extra ibuprofen & tylenol, and did whatever it took until I found someone who was caring and understanding(my current doctor). Now if I had been stupid or reacted quickly, then I had to sign releases with my current doctor, and you can better believe he never would have prescribed to me. You really just need to think about what you say and how you say it.

    brian

     
    Old 04-15-2008, 06:57 PM   #37
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    Re: I got placed on a "pain med HOLIDAY"

    I have to agree with Brian and Spinal in terms of disagreeing with your approach with your Doc. My strategy would be one of telling him how much you suffer (in general) and how much pain you're in. I would also tell him how hard the WD was and how it was torture and suffering all rolled into one. Even getting a tad emotional (sad not angry) would help....Really trying to emphasize how tough it was. Actions speak volumes, more so than words. I would even maybe go as far to "plead" with him in terms of something like "please help me." I'd even tell him "please, please help me....And, if you can't, can you please, please refer me to someone who you think can....I am really suffering each and every day."

    Brian and Spinal are right in that if you go in and "demand" or get angry, you may get cut off. For what it's worth, PM Docs have been taught "warning signs" of drug abusers. A simple on line search will show lots of results or lists that are published at seminars & etc.. One of the top "signs" or tell tale examples of a drug abuser is the "angry" patient or one that makes demands. All I'm asking is you to step back and think about it. I'm not saying by any means that you are an abuser, but rather if you get angry, the Doc may think you're one.

    As I said in my early post in this thread, OC 10 isn't a great pain fighting med. 10mg spread out over 12 hours isn't very strong at all. Many patients who have minor surgerical procedures almost all get 5mg Percs every 4-6 hours. Not only do chronic PM patients need stronger meds in many cases, but factoring in tolerance, almost all need something with some kick.

    My biggest fear going forward is that this pain holiday becomes a semi-routine. The last thing I think you should do is tell him that the OC 10 is now working well....He'll respond with "see.....the holiday worked."

    Sorry to be repetitive, but I'd plead and beg....Stress the suffering and pain.

    Good luck.

    Ex

     
    Old 04-15-2008, 07:10 PM   #38
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    Re: I got placed on a "pain med HOLIDAY"

    Another idea is to start a pain diary now, if you haven't already. In the diary or journal, talk about what the pain prevents you from doing. Talk about how the pain affects your activities of daily living. Describe your pain on a scale of 1-10 with 1 being barely any pain and 10 being totally intolerable.

    Bring the pain journal with you to the Doctor's appointment and ask him to read it. OR if he won't relate to him from what you've written what some of your limitations are, or how your pain is limiting you, such as on this day I couldn't cook or clean the house due to pain, or I could do nothing but lay in bed all day on heat and ice, etc.

    Good luck. I agree with Ex that the approach you are considering will do nothing but get you "labeled" as a drug seeker. And that label will follow you for the rest of your life!
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    Old 04-15-2008, 07:33 PM   #39
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    Re: I got placed on a "pain med HOLIDAY"

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SpinalMalady View Post
    Another idea is to start a pain diary now, if you haven't already. In the diary or journal, talk about what the pain prevents you from doing. Talk about how the pain affects your activities of daily living. Describe your pain on a scale of 1-10 with 1 being barely any pain and 10 being totally intolerable.

    Bring the pain journal with you to the Doctor's appointment
    YES! And use this diary as a supplementation to your "pleading" strategy (I this sound desperate, but you really are!). This may be just the thing you need to convince your Doc you're not a drug seeker. Drug abusers don't keep journals.

    Great idea, IMO.

    Ex

     
    Old 04-16-2008, 01:18 PM   #40
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    Re: I got placed on a "pain med HOLIDAY"

    I feel so badly for you, being in this situation. I know I would be devastated.
    I have to agree with the last three posters in all areas. Each one has super information for you to hopefully get some relief and maybe this doc will help you more.
    I have to honestly say, that I have one of the nicest,most generous, calm, dear, sweet male doctors I will ever have. AND I would have to lose my mind totally to ever, ever demand anything from him. I know this man has had ppl abuse scripts before [keep in mind, lots of docs considering upping your dose on your own w/o asking is abuse] and hes cut them flat off.
    I know when I have had to do anything I always ask. Always. and if I have done it and NOT asked, its once and I make it up later that week or day.
    Its too risky any more to even play with what we have even if its not working to our best needs at the moment, unless you have a plan mapped out or someone else to help you, because you could be left high and dry. Im not saying to not get the relief you need, Im just saying please be careful what you do until you get a plan. Please. I know I have said in my mind "well its almost like nothing, and then when you're out it IS terrible." I remember in my early few weeks of PM I was impatient, and I just had to have faith in my doc, and its paid off greatly.
    I agree with keeping a diary, and really showing just how much your life is being affected w/o the extra meds. If he cant see you are suffering and cannot help then have him help you find someone else.
    Please dont get angry, and I know its so hard...when I found out my doc was moving across the state, I was so devastated, but he told me he would love to have me still be a patient if I could make the drive every 3 months or so.
    I would have been SOL here where I live. So I hope something works out for you and fast~
    xoxoxoxo,
    IZZY'SMOM

    Last edited by IZZY'SMOM; 04-16-2008 at 01:24 PM.

     
    Old 04-16-2008, 05:51 PM   #41
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    Re: I got placed on a "pain med HOLIDAY"

    OK. . . I promise you will all be happy with what I have done to better myself and my current situation Me going into my doctors office with a "demanding attitude" obviously was not the smartest thing to think of doing. It is so difficult to be new at this "chronic pain treatment and medication plan." I have never needed my medication dose changed and have never had problems in the past. That may be due to my more recent switch from Percocet for years to Oxycontin. Now that you kinda know me and my messed up challenge I face a-head. . . I am feeling much better and have gained so much information on my medicine and working with my doctors. Although, it does not mean they will work with me. I read stories and people sound in some cases, like, we are all in the same body. . . Feeling the need for medication, feeling chronic pain, not wanting to be on medication, wanting to live and enjoy life, realizing that medication is what allows us life, defending ourselves, learning how to deal with being on constant medicine, getting down, messing with our emotions when people are treated poorly, and finaly, helping others out there by teaching them the correct approach when dealing with doctors and medication, guiding them and giving direction so that newbys do not make mistakes that could jepordize their need for help, treatment, and medication (long-term).

    The "DIARY" Well, I am pleased to say that I started one two weeks ago. I used my computer to make detailed notes, what I spoke to the doctor about, the medication I am on, the status of my situation, the medication dose not working proporly. . . and so on. . . . It looks great, but it will also help me keep track of my crazy life along with appointments.

    This Friday is my appointment with my back doctor, who's treating my pain. My Mother is going to go with for the first time ever!!!!! I am so excited. I am excited because she is always scared, freaked out, telling me Oxycontin is killing me, thinks I can do without medication, thinks I do not need surgery. . . Yeah, you all get it. . . She thinks she's the doctor. . . But I do know she loves me, and wants to make sure her son is safe. . . She doesnt want anything bad to happen or she would feel guilty and probably like she was not there for me as a Mother should be.

    I will talk to the doctor proporly. Letting him know that I can not take the current medication dose I am on anymore. That I have no life, That I am tired, that I am missing work, That I am spending more time on the couch (who is now my best friend in the world. I can go to him for anything, he always listens and never talks back " and that my quality of life as diminished. but all of this is the truth.

    My next plan after telling him that. . . assuming he will not increase my medication... . Will be to ask him if you can send me to a pain doctor, release me from his binds and contract. . . but of course, I would still see him regularly for my ongoing back problems. . . . That way, I could get propor treatment.

    Is this a good plan? Anyone else thing of something I should or should not do?

    Thanks for everything you all have helped me with,
    This means the world,
    with out you guys/galz, I probably would be denied medication, slaped around a bit,
    and who knows what else,

    Thanks agian,
    Tony :

     
    Old 04-16-2008, 06:02 PM   #42
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    Re: I got placed on a "pain med HOLIDAY"

    I think your plan is sound. I would really stress how much pain and suffering you face and how it severely effects your life. Tell him that you cannot spend the rest of your life on the couch.

    Taking your mother, or some other member is also a good idea...To back up your sentiment. However, you mention that she has been anti-OC...Make sure you have her "in check" and that she doesn't fire a torpedo at you at this appointment. The last thing you need is the Doc thinking one of your parents supports him and things there is a problem. Candidly, if she can't be supportive, then leave her home.

    Plead, beg...Do whatever you have to convince your Doc that you are sincere. I know some may not agree, with me, but this appointment may be everything. If it goes sideways, you may be out on your own.

    Best of luck to you and I look forward to hearing from you afterwards.

    Ex

     
    Old 04-16-2008, 06:07 PM   #43
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    Re: I got placed on a "pain med HOLIDAY"

    All I can say is wow you took nearly every issue that gets talked about and put it in one paragraph, talk about concise. I think that we need a thread at the top that says "THINGS THAT EVERY CHRONIC PAIN PATIENT NEEDS TO KNOW". How do we do that??? This would help out so many people and allow people to get the proper care and know how to speak with their doctor. Maybe you could print out something that talks about dependence versus addiction and give it to your dear mom. Or have her come to our board and she can see that we are people just like you looking for treatment of the pain. I think that you have everything under control as far as I can tell. You might want to contact your insurance company and find out a list of pain management doctors in your area(so that you can make sure whoever your back pain doc suggests is actually covered). Good luck and post back with an update.

    brian

     
    Old 04-16-2008, 09:02 PM   #44
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    Re: I got placed on a "pain med HOLIDAY"

    I wanted to add in something that I have included in my pain log, that my pm really liked was a separate column of non-narcotic things I have tried for pain relief. I include items like laying on ice, laying on heat, tens unit, walking out cramps, hot bath, using the spa, using the pool, bengay, relaxation tapes, meditation, stretching, accupuncture, watching a movie, playing a game, massage, etc. This is important because you are showing that you are trying many different things for pain relief in addition to pain meds.

    I too tend to agree that if your Mom is not fully on board with you taking meds that I would not take her to your appt. You need someone who is going to be strong in that room with you. Sometimes as patients we can become overwhelmed or to close to the situation that a doctor can say something that causes us to become emotional or tongue tied. I know my hubby has stepped up and taken over the conversation for me when I am upset/not making my self clear.

    Good luck and I pray that your pain mgmt issues are resolved soon. Uncontrolled pain is the pits. Been there and done that myself.

     
    Old 04-16-2008, 11:35 PM   #45
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    Re: I got placed on a "pain med HOLIDAY"

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by 123dietdrpepper View Post
    I too tend to agree that if your Mom is not fully on board with you taking meds that I would not take her to your appt. You need someone who is going to be strong in that room with you.
    I agree on the mother thing. The first thing mine would do is say to the doctor "I think she takes too much medicine".

    Hope all goes well.

     
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