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  • Suboxone Effective Treatment for IBS Symptoms

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    Old 10-25-2012, 04:52 PM   #16
    Isotope
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    Re: Suboxone Effective Treatment for IBS Symptoms

    Terry,

    As a sufferer myself I certainly don't want anyone to be denied therapy that works. I hadn't heard of the off-label uses of Suboxone in IBS. So, from my perspective it sounded pretty dramatic. I have a long history of Gi issues, first Ulcerative Colitis then surgery and now Pouchitis and Crohn's Disease. I recently had to stop working because I was basically not functional in a work environment any longer.

    I'm in discussions now with my PCP regarding a switch in my pain meds due to the cost when my insurance ends in a week.... Buprenorphine has been discussed and is on the table. Generic Subutex Sub lingual is a definite possibility, and affordable if I can limit my intake to 8mg a day.


    Suboxone is a blend of Buprenorphine and Naloxone. It is one of many anti-abuse products. My question for you, I assume that the Buprenorphine and not the Naxalone was/is responsible for the positive GI effects? Why were you and Orange not prescribed one of the no-Naloxone added products, like Subutex?

    Any info appreciated.

    Iso~

     
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    Old 10-25-2012, 05:02 PM   #17
    Isotope
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    Re: Suboxone Effective Treatment for IBS Symptoms

    Hello-

    Also, in my reading about Buprenorphine I understand that one must start the drug from a state of mild withdrawal due to the fact that Buprenorphine tends to knock other opiates from the receptors. Can breakthrough meds be used while taking Buprenorphine? Are they as effective? Sounds like Buprenorphine wants to be the one and only in the receptor battles that take place. Also, this blockade effect has some negative cognitive consequences, and blocks endorphines. Has anyone had any memory issues, or other mental problems.

    Any info appreciated.

    Iso~

    Last edited by Isotope; 10-25-2012 at 05:04 PM.

     
    Old 10-25-2012, 05:43 PM   #18
    TerryX
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    Re: Suboxone Effective Treatment for IBS Symptoms

    Iso,

    You are correct, you need to be in a mild state of withdrawal before you start Buprenorphine, or you risk precipitated withdrawal. Once you have gone through this induction phase a feel stabilized (you feel normal and alert), then breakthrough meds can be used; however, I do not know if this is an acceptable practice or legal, but in using breakthrough meds, I believe it takes more than you would normally use, as much of it doesn't get to your receptors since the bupe already occupies the majority of them and won't give up their position. A danger in doing this is though is it is very possible that you can take too much of the breakthrough med and shut down you breathing and die. My doc told me I can take additional bupe in certain breakthrough situations, but this only will work up to a certain ceiling. I have found that Motrin w/ bupe is more effective for breakthrough, but, I have to be extremely careful and sparing with it because of what it will do to my gut. I would imagine you shouldn't touch Motrin with your more severe situation.

    Another word of warning, don't use bupe with meds like xanax, except under physician direction and with extreme care, or coma and death is a very possible result.

    I believe that bupe does not block the endorphines to the extent that the full opiods and opiates do, from what I remember my doc stating about it. I may be wrong on this. I can say, in my experience, that I am far more cognitive than I was on the full ops, although certainly not as alert as before I started on anything but I can function in my job now which requires long periods of concentration, this didn't seem possible pre-sub.

    One other thing, the bupe and all the full ops, stop most of your testosterone production, if you're middle age or older, its compounded. My doc referred me to a urologist who put me on the Androgel treatment, which although libido has improved, far more important to me as it has help things such as my motivation, mental alertness, muscle tone etc. I was dubious at first, but have experienced this for myself.

    Of course all this is expensive, anxiously awaiting more generics.

    Best Wishes.
    Terry,


    OTE=Isotope;5078631]Hello-

    Also, in my reading about Buprenorphine I understand that one must start the drug from a state of mild withdrawal due to the fact that Buprenorphine tends to knock other opiates from the receptors. Can breakthrough meds be used while taking Buprenorphine? Are they as effective? Sounds like Buprenorphine wants to be the one and only in the receptor battles that take place. Also, this blockade effect has some negative cognitive consequences, and blocks endorphines. Has anyone had any memory issues, or other mental problems.

    Any info appreciated.

    Iso~[/QUOTE]

     
    Old 10-25-2012, 06:14 PM   #19
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    Re: Suboxone Effective Treatment for IBS Symptoms

    Iso,

    Yes, the bupe is responsible for the positive GI effects, because I take the generic bupe which does not contain the Naloxone. In my earlier messages I was using the term Suboxone to mean both, since it is more well known that buprenorphine. I think that perhaps I've had such good results with bupe is because of its long half life, although I have no proof of this, but the shorting acting meds didn't work as well, even in their time release formulas.

    You may find it more effective to split the 8mg to 2 or more doses a day, each probably effective for 6-8 hours on the pain, depending on how much pain you're in. Since you're situation is much more serious, perhaps your doc would consider one of the other bupe related products, I think there is a time release patch for cancer patients and a nose spray, but I don't know anything about these products.

    On your last question, I think generally docs do the induction on subutex in case there are any adverse reactions or allergies to Naloxone, then switch you to Suboxone a little later if you're a recovering addict. I thought I read that Subutex had been discontinued since its patent ran out, and my script always says Buprenorphine, generic for Subutex. There is probably no point in you taking Suboxone, it is no different in effectiveness than generic buprenorphine, other than the brand name and the Naloxone.

    Let me know who this turns out for you and if it works for you.

    Best wishes,
    TerryX

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Isotope View Post
    Terry,

    As a sufferer myself I certainly don't want anyone to be denied therapy that works. I hadn't heard of the off-label uses of Suboxone in IBS. So, from my perspective it sounded pretty dramatic. I have a long history of Gi issues, first Ulcerative Colitis then surgery and now Pouchitis and Crohn's Disease. I recently had to stop working because I was basically not functional in a work environment any longer.

    I'm in discussions now with my PCP regarding a switch in my pain meds due to the cost when my insurance ends in a week.... Buprenorphine has been discussed and is on the table. Generic Subutex Sub lingual is a definite possibility, and affordable if I can limit my intake to 8mg a day.


    Suboxone is a blend of Buprenorphine and Naloxone. It is one of many anti-abuse products. My question for you, I assume that the Buprenorphine and not the Naxalone was/is responsible for the positive GI effects? Why were you and Orange not prescribed one of the no-Naloxone added products, like Subutex?

    Any info appreciated.

    Iso~

     
    Old 10-25-2012, 09:30 PM   #20
    Isotope
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    Re: Suboxone Effective Treatment for IBS Symptoms

    T-

    I sure appreciate all of that information. As you may already know, middle age is frustrating, seems the Testosterone is already taking a hike.... You say Bup kicks the remains to the curb... Yikes. Nothing is simple anymore is it. When I do conversions I need closer to 16mg/d Bup but just can't afford it... I was hoping to take 8mg/d and sort of tough it out with BT meds.... Toughing it out with two drops of Testosterone left will be difficult. Are you familiar with Levorphanol? That is another drug under consideration, very long acting, and quite potent -so I hear. Did the Testosterone product help? Was it noticeable?

    I will let you know if I give Bup a trial run.

    Iso~

     
    Old 10-26-2012, 12:12 PM   #21
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    Re: Suboxone Effective Treatment for IBS Symptoms

    Iso,

    I don't know how to do the conversions. I take 16mg/day, I've heard that is the equivalent to 180mg/day of oxycodone, but really don't have a clue. I sure wish the price would come down for sure. I've heard of Levorphanol but don't know anything about.

    Yes, the testosterone works. I was skeptical, but after a few weeks I realized I had a lot of motivation back and generally felt less depressed about things in general, less fatigue etc. I've ready where it also helps the body deal with pain too, which maybe why my doc wanted to to try it out.

    I'll let you know if I can find anything about lower priced bupe. I know Rickett had some coupons for Sub, but that was just about $ 50 off their full brand name price of $ 350 + or -. At those levels, $ 50 isn't much.

    Hang in there.
    Terry.

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Isotope View Post
    T-

    I sure appreciate all of that information. As you may already know, middle age is frustrating, seems the Testosterone is already taking a hike.... You say Bup kicks the remains to the curb... Yikes. Nothing is simple anymore is it. When I do conversions I need closer to 16mg/d Bup but just can't afford it... I was hoping to take 8mg/d and sort of tough it out with BT meds.... Toughing it out with two drops of Testosterone left will be difficult. Are you familiar with Levorphanol? That is another drug under consideration, very long acting, and quite potent -so I hear. Did the Testosterone product help? Was it noticeable?

    I will let you know if I give Bup a trial run.

    Iso~

     
    Old 10-26-2012, 05:43 PM   #22
    Isotope
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    Re: Suboxone Effective Treatment for IBS Symptoms

    T-

    Type the following words into your google search => Good RX

    Generic Bup (Subutex), 8mg, $80, 30#. That is why I would like to keep it down to 8mg a day. 16mg a day is $150.

    Levorphanol, 2mg, 60# = $45. I've seen a couple different conversions. One claims that 4mg Levo is equal to 40mg Oxymorphone.


    Iso~

    I looked up the Testosterone, wow, $360 a month!

     
    Old 10-26-2012, 05:50 PM   #23
    Isotope
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    Re: Suboxone Effective Treatment for IBS Symptoms

    T-

    Too funny. There are ads all over my browser now for Suboxone, Cialis, and Androgel! Wow, they are fast those banner ads!

    I may have just stumbled onto something in GoodRX, when I typed in Testosterone replacement it showed me a list of options, and one generic called Testosterone cypionate

    I'll need to investigate further. Let me know what you find.

    thnx,

    Iso~

     
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