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    Old 07-02-2014, 01:33 PM   #16
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    Re: Being Dismissed

    Roadiez, that sounds really kind of horrible of them. Obviously it was a technical mistake, but they should have at least approached you about it instead of becoming so rude. That's the part of these doctors that REALLY upsets me. They go from pleasant to rude in like -0.00 seconds and they don't allow you to talk. I can understand why they have to take almost every situation to the extreme, but I think it is completely unfair to treat every person like a drug addict or that they are guilty.

    Part of what REALLY upsets about me too about my situation is that if I was looking for free pills and really not in pain? Then I would be doing ANYTHING to get medication. And ever since April, my problems have calmed down with the other stuff that had been going, so that's what has me also really upset.

    Also, I don't think that they had any kind of monitoring system in place until now because I have been to the ER back in march and april when the doctors nurse told me to go.

    If I can even get into a PM doctor again, I am going to ask to sit down with that doctor and go over everything in specific details about what I am not allowed to and procedures about what to do if I have to have surgery ever or anything like that. Because I refuse to go through this again.

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    Old 07-02-2014, 09:24 PM   #17
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    Re: Being Dismissed

    I do hope that you can find another PM to go to. Also you might want to research to whether you have to disclose that you were dismissed from your last PM or not. Also you said earlier that your PCP would take you back if you had a statement from your PM that you were released from him as well. I would jump on that very, very quickly. That way you could possibly see hi/her next week to explain what happened. What led you to being dismissed from the PM & to see if your PCP will fill in some kind of capacity until your PCP can refer you to another PM facility.

    Also I am not sure if it was for illegal drugs or just from going to the ER & receiving a Rx from the ER Dr. that got you into trouble. But if it was for illegal drugs then your PCP might want you to go to a consultation to see what if any other substances you might be using. If it was for the ER meds then you will want to come clean to your PCP & tell him/her what was going on from the start.

    I have another story for you that I wont take too long sharing.

    My wife was on Lortab for her back & leg pains(several bulging discs & such). Well She was drug tested at work & failed it. She then was on probation for 1 year & had to go to counseling for 2 or 3 sessions & was deemed not addicted to any legal not prescribed or illicit drugs & such. So a year goes by & we thought she was off of the probation & she was very glad of that. So I have my 2 cervical operations in April '13. I was given an Rx of Percocet for pain to go home with. Well we kept all of our meds in one drawer & one night by mistake(As far as we can tell) she took one of my Percocet's. Well here comes the UA fairy. And you guessed it she fails the UA & was immediately dismissed. She just could not be consoled at all.
    Well next thing you know she goes to her PCP & he knows that she works at a place he frequents & doesn't see her. So next appointment he asks her where she is now. She goes on to tell him the story. He goes on a tirade about it & mind you she has been going to this Dr. for over 10 years at this point. He gives her a 10 day supply of her pain med & shoves her out the door! I was there. It took everything I had to just walk out & not go off on him.

    So what I am saying is that todays doctors only think the worse in people & do not care if you had a viable excuse or not.

    Chalk it up as lesson learned & go on.
    Also at this point 6 months down the road she has yet to get into a PM because prior to April 1st we had no health insurance. Now we do & now our new PCP doesn't prescribe pain meds what-so-ever and the doctors office screwed up on the referral to the PM for her. So I do wish you the best. Also go to your PCP like I said & get that release from the PM right away. I don't want you to be in the same boat as my wife.
    Cervical:ACDF C4-C7 & Posterior Corpectomy C4-T1. Now 2 Broke Screws @ T1 level Posterior. Severe Migraine's, Multiple white spots on brain (Unknown Why).

    Old 07-07-2014, 05:30 PM   #18
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    Re: Being Dismissed

    LadyRaven, just want to say I'm sorry for what you went through.

    As others have said, you really need to know which questions to ask a PM doc ahead of time. And I know we really shouldn't be expected to know everything when we are new patients, but that's basically how it works.

    I suffered for years with under-treated pain, so I can relate to some of what you've gone through.

    When I finally got into see my great PM, I specifically asked him what I should do in case of dentist, E.R., etc. After all those years of suffering, I wanted to make sure that I never inadvertently made a mistake.

    It's very tough, though. No one is perfect. When in PM, one has to be very careful. Good luck to you.

    Old 07-09-2014, 04:18 AM   #19
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    Re: Being Dismissed

    I just wanted to add-

    Folks, please be sure to read your PAIN CONTRACT thoroughly. If there is something in your contract that seems vague or unclear to you, then you must make sure you ask so that all is clear to you.

    The first paragraph in my pain contract states the following:

    It is your responsibility to read this contract thoroughly, and if there is any terminology that is unclear to you, my staff will be happy to help you with any concerns.

    My contract also goes into detail of what to do in an acute pain situation, like an acute ER situation, like an injury(whether it be a fracture, surgery, dental emergencies, you get the picture.)

    My contract also states that I am not to use any narcotic medication prescribed for other than what I am being treated for.

    Also says:

    I must make this PM practice aware of any situation where narcotic pain medication or any type of medication that contains a narcotic is deemed medically necessary by another provider. This includes cough medications. If you are being seen by provider during normal business hours-you are required to inform provider/ER physician of your pain contract and provide them with my office phone number so that coordination of any additional narcotic containing medications can be discussed to ensure you are treated properly.

    I find my pain contract to be very informative, and it really is aimed at understanding how important it is to keep your PM in the loop, cuz even the most innocent sounding meds, if you think about it, can cause serious/adverse drug reactions=it goes over thing like that too.

    I am pretty darn lucky that I do have a very compassionate physician and this is really key.

    To all PM patients-be well, and be safe. And please read your pain contract.

    PS- my contract also emphasizes-

    If your emergency happens after hours/weekends/holidays you must contact this office the next business day with the name and phone number of the prescriber or discharge paper work from an ER/hospital stay.
    constant companion pain

    Last edited by BB07; 07-09-2014 at 04:28 AM.

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    Old 07-09-2014, 07:19 AM   #20
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    Re: Being Dismissed

    That is tough-sorry you are having so many problems, however, you have to understand the doctors point of view too. The doctor, especially pain management Dr. are closely monitored by the DEA-sometimes the PM doc doesn't have much of a choice in some issues regarding their patients anymore. The choice is their license or your pain meds-they have to make a living and yes they are doctors that care for people-but its still a business as harsh and cold as that may sound.

    I went to a pain management workshop for health care workers many, many years ago and one of the key note speakers was a DEA agent and he informed us that it was easier for him to control doctors than street drug dealers since doctors have more to lose.

    Good luck in your search for a new doctor, one thing I would highly recommend-Be honest, tell the new doctor everything up front before they find out themselves-everything is computerized and they will find out anyway.

    Old 07-10-2014, 10:26 AM   #21
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    Re: Being Dismissed

    I am so sorry about what you have been through. I thinkg that having a fall and suffering acute pain because of it, you were entitled to receive proper care at the ER.

    I would recommend for you to talk to the doctor, request an appointment to speak to him. I would also bring the charts from the ER visit.

    Most pain clinics are not open 24/7 thus they can not provide the emergent care, that's what the ER or urgent care facility is for. If I am understanding correctly, I believe you have a fair excuse for what happened. I would expect that with having a chat with your physician he would agree to continue treating you.

    Pain clinics don't have an obligation to provide you with a 30 day controlled medication script upon dismissing you, they are supposed to tapper you down to avoid withdrawals if you are on a high dose (not your case) and to provide you written notice by certified mail of the dismissal from the practice (that's with any doctor).

    The reason why PCP's are not providing scripts for controlled medications involves the legal liability of doing so, as they receive minimal trainning in pain management; and local state laws (depending on the state you need a pain management subspecialty trainning and a license for your clinics if you see more than X amount of pain patients, plus you need to follow more stringent procedures such as urine drug testing, etc to be compliant with the law and not have your DEA license in jeopardy.

    Pain clinics usually have DEA inspectors posing as patients, to verify that the proper procedures are followed. All of this is done to ensure proper treatment of pain following the guideliness and to promote patient safety as well as community safety.

    Remember that if somebody mistakenly takes their significant others pain pill, they might suffer serious consequences; even death. Mistakes do happen, but the consequences are serious.

    In addition most of middle and high schoolers have taken prescription medications from parents/grandma etc. There is also a small number of people that sell their prescription medications. Thats the reason behing all the urine drug testing, pill counts, etc. Remember that the physicians oath says; First do no harm. And harm can be done with this medications if not used properly.

    Speak frankly to your doctor, ask questions as this is the best way to get the most benefit from your visit. Write down questions/concerns, or bring a close family member so that both can gather the info and remind what the other forgets.


    Old 07-10-2014, 02:44 PM   #22
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    Re: Being Dismissed


    I find that "blanket type" statement the DEA agent made alleging that doctors are "easier to CONTROL(?!) to be somewhat arrogant on DEA's part.

    Granted their are some sketchy practicing physicians out there, but for the DEA to say-"control"-like, we are in control, not the doctors-is insulting to the many dedicated one's, having spent/invested many years in their education to genuinely help other human beings.

    I mean to compare a physician in general to common criminals as "easier to control"?

    I guess what I am getting at is-street dealers(usually involving gangs/vicious violent thugs who in lots of cases wouldn't hesitate to harm you or WORSE(kill)over the most petty reason-should be the one's the DEA should be controlling.

    And because doctors have more to lose? What about the general public and our innocent children being murdered in drive by incidents and more?

    I believe most doctors, and again, sure there are bad apples who have no business practicing when they use their medical license in unethical/illegal ways-but what about the good ones, that go way above and beyond to help folks in need.

    OP, we all know pain management is a very specialized area of medicine, and there are rules to be followed for a reason. I never get insulted or embarrassed when asked for a drug screen or a pill count(not implying you do either)I understand. I want my Doctor to feel comfortable that I am taking my medication(s) as prescribed. One can only imagine some of the patients the Docs and staff encounter at times.

    They get lied to all the time, people claiming their medications were stolen, or "lost them"-I can imagine they have pretty much heard so many excuses from folks trying to scam their doctor to get more pills.etc.

    My Doc screens all patients very closely and has a ZERO tolerance policy for dirty urines, incorrect medication counts and the like-I have overheard him say there is no excuse you can tell me I have not already heard many times before.

    Yet, he is not unreasonable, and I find him to be an excellent pain Specialist, I never feel rushed, and most importantly, he really listens to my concerns, and when I am scared about a new finding/results of any testing-he has a real talent for removing the fear from the equation-it's kind of hard to explain that part about him, but I trust him implicitly.

    He has taught me so much about chronic pain, how the patient must get involved and not dwell in misery and that my attitude is key-and how I cannot expect CP to be totally eliminated, but the goal is to learn to manage it and that pain medicine is just a part of the management of CP-I have learned bio-feedback and other relaxation techniques-I must use a cane in my case-I purchased and learned to use a TENS unit, have gone through many injection procedures to relieve some real intractable pain. Most of all to be open and willing to try new things I may benefit from, technology is changing and improving all the time.

    I can honestly say that right now I am experiencing pretty excellent relief. Just like any other CPP, things still get rough-but none of this thing called chronic pain is easy.

    I am pretty lucky to have a very caring, compassionate, and-PATIENT(lol, sometimes I feel like such a whiner)Physician.

    I wish you the same, everybody deserves that.
    constant companion pain

    Old 07-11-2014, 08:47 AM   #23
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    Re: Being Dismissed

    I agree completely BB07-I was floored when I heard that to say the least-What is so troubling to me-is that the DEA seems to be practicing medicine in a sense. By dictating to doctors what, how much and to whom they can Rx schedule medication to. I wish HIPPA applied to chronic pain pt and doctors regarding the DEA.

    Like you, I have no issues with drug test or pill count-IMO these are to help me as much as the doctor. I don't want my medication to become a problem for me-Yes, I am dependent just as a diabetic is dependent on their insulin-I need them to function as normal as a person can in my condition. Big difference between dependence and addiction, however, that is a fine line IMO and why being under a doctors care along with contracts are needed IMO.

    Sadly there is so much abuse with schedule drugs that new rules and laws had to be in acted to protect everyone and while I don't agree with some-I do with others. I love the new one on shutting down the "Doctor shoppers" IMO this helps me and my quest for pain control. If you have nothing to hide/fear none of these new rules/laws affect you negatively.

    I also wanted to comment on the work drug test-generally, due to HIPPA and discrimination laws when the work place request a drug test and something shows up-The lab calls the employee to find out what medication they are on and request the name of their pharmacy-The lab then call the pharmacy to confirm the medication-Once confirmed the drug test is then deemed "negative/passed" There are exception to this as some places of employment don't allow any narcotic due to the type of job.

    Last edited by oldnbroken; 07-11-2014 at 08:51 AM.

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