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    Old 10-12-2004, 06:29 AM   #151
    eightball61
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    Re: Marriage after 15 years...happily ever after???

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by heartlandguy
    Please don't worry one little bit about Jeff or me. We are perfectly fine and here for you. In your absence, Stacy was great at protecting us, just in case.

    We always have an angel

     
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    Old 10-12-2004, 06:37 AM   #152
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    Re: Marriage after 15 years...happily ever after???

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by heartlandguy
    Goody, it's so good to see that your back! Lots and lots and lots of people have missed you!!! When you miss someone, three days is a very long time.

    I have only read one paragraph that you have written and of course you start by being worried about everyone else. Please don't worry one little bit about Jeff or me. We are perfectly fine and here for you. In your absence, Stacy was great at protecting us, just in case.

    Since I am a slow responder, I just wanted to say hello before getting back to your thread.

    Hello!
    Hey...Heartland!!! It was nice to have your greeting even before reading my thread. and yes I do see that you and Jeff are in good standing here asyou should be and that an angel is always on your side. As you can see by my sign name...when things aren't going right I try my best to set them right....like my marriage and anyone putting down something that is good

    It's good to be back....and good also to know that I've been missed. There was a time I felt like one of those lost causes but thanks to you and so many here, I see that I'm not. Thanks for making it that way ....Goody

     
    Old 10-12-2004, 09:10 AM   #153
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    Re: Marriage after 15 years...happily ever after???

    Goody, as your weekend progressed, I started to get a sinking feeling as I visualized your challenge. It was dreamlike. Tom and you were walking down a wide path. Some force was keeping you two apart, just out of fingertip reach of each other. You two were struggling to lock fingertips so that you two could pull yourselves together. You were looking in each otherís eyes as you fought the force but couldnít quite overcome it. I guess in a way that did happen. Some force is keeping you two apart.

    You have said that Tom has always taken responsible for home maintenance. Maintaining a relationship is a lot like keeping the wood trim on your home painted. It is obvious to Tom and you that he needed to ďpaint your relationshipĒ. Itís gotten to the point where the neighbors will notice if something isnít done soon. Tom gets out the scraper to remove the accumulating paint flakes. A couple of days of scraping always used to get him by but not this time because the wood is older. The resins in the wood are gone and the wood required attention sooner than expected. Itís obvious now that the wood is rotting and scraping only exposes more rotten wood. Suddenly, a simple paint job has turned into a difficult project. The project is too big for him alone. You have offered to help but the job is too big. Friends are volunteering to help you. If they fail, professional help will be your last hope of removing the ever-increasing rot.

    Think how Tom must be feeling. The rotting would have never happened if he had painted sooner. The dependable provider didnít provide enough in this situation. He knows he has let you down. He is no longer the carefree guy that won your heart. He is bound to have doubts.

    This little allegory points out some of problems that you have starting over this time that you two didnít have the first time. Now that I think about it a bit, it sounds like you two didnít really start over this weekend; instead you went directly to rebuilding your relationship. The fatigue you mentioned is because of all the hard work you two put in this weekend. If your dating was that much work, you two probably never would have got together in the first place. Where was the fun? I bet you two started out with fun dates without expectations, well okay, maybe a few. Start there. Do you see what I am saying? I donít care what the song says; boys just like to have fun. It was fun that lead to romance the first time; expect it to work again.

    I am not naive enough to think this is all that is wrong with your marriage but you two need to identify those items for us if you want us to help in those areas. Maybe you donít.

    Welcome home, Goody and Tom

     
    Old 10-12-2004, 11:09 AM   #154
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    Re: Marriage after 15 years...happily ever after???

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by heartlandguy
    Goody, as your weekend progressed, I started to get a sinking feeling as I visualized your challenge. It was dreamlike. Tom and you were walking down a wide path. Some force was keeping you two apart, just out of fingertip reach of each other. You two were struggling to lock fingertips so that you two could pull yourselves together. You were looking in each otherís eyes as you fought the force but couldnít quite overcome it. I guess in a way that did happen. Some force is keeping you two apart.

    You have said that Tom has always taken responsible for home maintenance. Maintaining a relationship is a lot like keeping the wood trim on your home painted. It is obvious to Tom and you that he needed to ďpaint your relationshipĒ. Itís gotten to the point where the neighbors will notice if something isnít done soon. Tom gets out the scraper to remove the accumulating paint flakes. A couple of days of scraping always used to get him by but not this time because the wood is older. The resins in the wood are gone and the wood required attention sooner than expected. Itís obvious now that the wood is rotting and scraping only exposes more rotten wood. Suddenly, a simple paint job has turned into a difficult project. The project is too big for him alone. You have offered to help but the job is too big. Friends are volunteering to help you. If they fail, professional help will be your last hope of removing the ever-increasing rot.

    Think how Tom must be feeling. The rotting would have never happened if he had painted sooner. The dependable provider didnít provide enough in this situation. He knows he has let you down. He is no longer the carefree guy that won your heart. He is bound to have doubts.

    This little allegory points out some of problems that you have starting over this time that you two didnít have the first time. Now that I think about it a bit, it sounds like you two didnít really start over this weekend; instead you went directly to rebuilding your relationship. The fatigue you mentioned is because of all the hard work you two put in this weekend. If your dating was that much work, you two probably never would have got together in the first place. Where was the fun? I bet you two started out with fun dates without expectations, well okay, maybe a few. Start there. Do you see what I am saying? I donít care what the song says; boys just like to have fun. It was fun that lead to romance the first time; expect it to work again.

    I am not naive enough to think this is all that is wrong with your marriage but you two need to identify those items for us if you want us to help in those areas. Maybe you donít.

    Welcome home, Goody and Tom

    Yes, Heartland...your allegory makes tons of sense...I know what you are saying because I have an allegory much like yours only mine is not in terms of a house being painted. Mine is a garden that needs fertilizing and tending to in order to keep the flowers in bloom. Like our marriage it needs daily nourishment & watering. But throughout the years the weeds have taken over and threaten the beauty of our garden. Tom for some reason doesn't realize that this is necessary and I do my part but the job is a two man job a team effort.....eventually the weeds take over and realizing I can't keep up with them on my own...I take a break and request his help only the TV and other things are used as an excuse to not help. I struggle and pull back realizing I can't do it alone and alittle resentful that I am left to save the blooms that we started together on my own. And I stop too...giving some of the care it needs but not enough...it's too much to do on my own. I don't give up...I still urge for his assistance and tell him how much it means to me to save our garden. He comes in some days to help and disappears on and off. This weekend he came back and he looked at the weeds realizing how many there are to contend with. He's quiet, ashamed and yet he stays....he pulls the weeds...not with as much energy as me but he is still there pulling and we both see that it is job that we'd never have to do if it had been tended to on a daily basis and was not just left to go. The weekend allowed Tom to see finally what I had seen for many years. He continues to work by my side...I just received a phone call...not the usual necessary phone call....but a how is your day going phone call. And stupid me, didn't even make a big deal about it...I was so taken a back thinking it was just a usual one that I neglected to give him a positive reinforcement. See...Tom isn't the only one at fault here....when he does come through I often forget to praise him for his efforts no matter how little they may seem almost as a defense mechanism so as not to get overly hopeful since in the past it always seems to revert to the old ways again. That's the viscious cycle we're in....and the walking on eggshells we seem to be experiencing.

    You say you need more in order to help us out....what might this be? You know me... I'm willing and able to help in whatever way I need in order to get things back on track here. Thanks again for your allegory...it really makes alot of sense and I can see how overwhelming it could be for Tom and at the same time unrealisitic for us to believe there's a "quick fix" here for our relationship....Goody

    Last edited by goody2shuz; 10-12-2004 at 11:20 AM.

     
    Old 10-12-2004, 01:03 PM   #155
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    Re: Marriage after 15 years...happily ever after???

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by goody2shuz
    ...I just received a phone call...not the usual necessary phone call....but a how is your day going phone call. And stupid me, didn't even make a big deal about it...I was so taken a back thinking it was just a usual one that I neglected to give him a positive reinforcement. See...Tom isn't the only one at fault here....
    Is it too late to call him back and tell him that you appreciate his concern? By doing so you set two examples for Tom. 1) That you will acknowledge the positive things he does (i.e., not just the negative). 2) That if you or he misses an opportunity to improve the relationship, it is worth the extra effort to make up for that lost opportunity.

    Quote:
    You say you need more in order to help us out....what might this be?
    In case you uncover a bigger problem than weeds, you may want to tell us about it. Maybe none will turn up; I hope not. However, any skeletons in the closet can be embarrassing so I was leaving this totally up to you two.

    Quote:
    Thanks again for your allegory...it really makes alot of sense and I can see how overwhelming it could be for Tom and at the same time unrealisitic for us to believe there's a "quick fix" here for our relationship.
    Sorry that I forgot about your garden allegory. Yours makes great sense, too. I guess we now have his and hers allegories, one for both of you. Please ask Tom to read the painting allegory so you can report back anything he sees as unfair or inaccurate.

    Goody, you didnít comment on the need for fun when restarting your relationship. Without fun, you two start in adversarial positions. Mediators often seek a point of agreement, no matter how small, to build upon before seeking unity. Doing something fun (you know I donít mean that ) is a good way to build unanimity before beginning a tough session of working out your problems. (For instance, what public events do you two like to attend together?) Donít beat yourselves up; you two are already making enough sacrifices.

     
    Old 10-12-2004, 05:27 PM   #156
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    Re: Marriage after 15 years...happily ever after???

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by goody2shuz
    Yes, Heartland...your allegory makes tons of sense...I know what you are saying because I have an allegory much like yours only mine is not in terms of a house being painted. Mine is a garden that needs fertilizing and tending to in order to keep the flowers in bloom. Like our marriage it needs daily nourishment & watering. But throughout the years the weeds have taken over and threaten the beauty of our garden. Tom for some reason doesn't realize that this is necessary and I do my part but the job is a two man job a team effort.....eventually the weeds take over and realizing I can't keep up with them on my own...I take a break and request his help only the TV and other things are used as an excuse to not help. I struggle and pull back realizing I can't do it alone and alittle resentful that I am left to save the blooms that we started together on my own. And I stop too...giving some of the care it needs but not enough...it's too much to do on my own. I don't give up...I still urge for his assistance and tell him how much it means to me to save our garden. He comes in some days to help and disappears on and off. This weekend he came back and he looked at the weeds realizing how many there are to contend with. He's quiet, ashamed and yet he stays....he pulls the weeds...not with as much energy as me but he is still there pulling and we both see that it is job that we'd never have to do if it had been tended to on a daily basis and was not just left to go. The weekend allowed Tom to see finally what I had seen for many years. He continues to work by my side...I just received a phone call...not the usual necessary phone call....but a how is your day going phone call. And stupid me, didn't even make a big deal about it...I was so taken a back thinking it was just a usual one that I neglected to give him a positive reinforcement. See...Tom isn't the only one at fault here....when he does come through I often forget to praise him for his efforts no matter how little they may seem almost as a defense mechanism so as not to get overly hopeful since in the past it always seems to revert to the old ways again. That's the viscious cycle we're in....and the walking on eggshells we seem to be experiencing.

    You say you need more in order to help us out....what might this be? You know me... I'm willing and able to help in whatever way I need in order to get things back on track here. Thanks again for your allegory...it really makes alot of sense and I can see how overwhelming it could be for Tom and at the same time unrealisitic for us to believe there's a "quick fix" here for our relationship....Goody
    Toto, I don't think were in Kansas anymore...........

    Sorry, but I am having a problem understanding this thread with all the metaphores (somebody will catch me on my sp).
    I don't know, but I think this thread is a little weird. I mean, I can see what you are getting out with your metaphores (OUCH ! got me again) but a lot of people have viewed this but only the same people (me included have respoded). Some of you lurkers must feel the same way I do.
    Goody, I know your mad at me but I must say this. I hope you are able to build your marriage back to where you want it. I really mean no ill harm in my questions and such. As a poster to this BB I think I have a right to my opinion and offer suggestions. Like you said in a recent post you have every right to ignore some posts. I love America!

    I still stand by my suggestion that you get some counceling (professional) to couple with what you get out of this thread.


    Best of luck,
    Marilyn
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    Old 10-12-2004, 06:06 PM   #157
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    Re: Marriage after 15 years...happily ever after???

    Marilyn....Thanks for your well wishes. As far as metaphores,symbolism, analogies and allegories go....they are something that I personally can relate to and for others it doesn't make much sense. I guess it goes with the spiritual side of me which is a big part of my life & makeup. It's for some people and not for others....but nevertheless because of the issues I am now facing in my marriage...it also is of some comfort as I am in the soulsearching process.

    Most people who have visited this thread are comfortable with what is shared here....at least I would like to think so. Those who aren't and see it as too metaphoric will not post and that's okay. The bottom line is that I feel I have a terrific support system that genuinely cares and that is what I feel is most important.

    Thanks again for your good wishes...Goody

    PS....Heartland....I apologize for not responding to your last post and will try to either sometime later on or sometime tomorrow. I am having Tom read your male allegory sometime within the next hour or so...Goody

     
    Old 10-12-2004, 06:10 PM   #158
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    Re: Marriage after 15 years...happily ever after???

    Hi Goody, welcome back!

    I can understand why you'd be walking on eggshells (no sex--yikes!), but some of the things you said about your weekend strike me as excellent signs. First, the fact that you're having a tough time avoiding sex shows that you're still attracted to each other and not alienated to the point where you don't want to be close and physical. Also, it's good that you are both committed to working things outóthat is so important, I think that realization is enough to make your weekend an impressive success! I know itís going to be hard not keeping score of who is doing more work, but as much as possible, Iíd suggest trying to stop yourself from thinking this way. Remember, youíre a team, and so you should add the number of times you reach out to each other TOGETHER, not compare your individual scores as if you were on opposing teams.

    I disagreed with some of the posters who said your problems were much worse and more dangerous than you thought--to me, this can't be true if both people truly want to make it work. You still have many important elements working in your relationship: trust, love, physical attraction, shared family, life, and friends holding you together--sounds a lot better than what obstacles many couples face! At least to me, it doesn't sound like you're in desperate need of professional help, and I'm glad that most posters respect that that is a very personal, private decision between you and Tom. None of know or understand enough to argue one way or another for counseling, and I for one just don't believe in telling people how to resolve their issues. I think the person who needs help is in the unique position of knowing what would be best for their particular situation.

    Jeff, I was a little surprised to see you say that if counseling doesnít work, the relationship wasnít meant to be (did I get that right?). Do you think thatís always the case? At first read I thought so, but Iím not 100% sure. It strikes me that some people just arenít open to professional counseling, that some people really do want to work things out on their own, and may not respond to the counselor. And what if the counselor doesnít really grasp the situation and canít provide much help, or just isnít a good fit for the couple? I think itís an interesting idea to consideróif a professional canít fix something, is it broken beyond repair? Iím not sure, I guess Iíd say it depends, but I do disagree with people who continually repeat the same pat answer: seek professional help without acknowledging that this just might not be the answer for everyone. Itís totally different when someone is suffering from mental illness of some sort, like anxiety or depression, in which case psychiatric help should always be employed. But with ďtherapistsĒ or ďcounselorsĒ (not psychologists), there is no licensing board, no standard that must be met to use this label, so anyone can hang out a sign claiming to be a relationship therapist. This makes me think that sometimes such counselors may do more harm than good or not be able to provide any help. Iím just not sureÖI was wondering what Jeff and others think of this question.

    Goody, it sounds like you're making some important, good progress spending more time together (not in the same room, but actually interacting) doing things like cooking, which hopefully will lead to small doses of affection, like kisses, hugs, pats. I really like that about cooking with my honey, just the time together, working in unison to make something special for both of us, and having the time alone with no TV to talk and be affectionate. I find he's usually happy to help cook if I ask him if he'd like to hang out in the kitchen and cook together, and less happy if I tell him specific things to do, in which case he usually does his tasks and disappears. The best thing about cooking is that he watches and learns to make certain meals on his own, much better than he could do just following a recipe. I think cooking requires a lot of feel, "eye-balling it," and other imprecise, but teachable through observation, techniques in order to perfect any one dish. But there are lots of chores that you can do together (cleaning, gardening, etc.), or at least hang out together while you work on seperate tasks (maybe make his favorite cake together?). It's hard when someone's working a lot, but you can "steal" extra quality time together if you put some thought into it.

    I was thinking more about what we discussed last night, about trying to minimize negative comments and try to rephrase them more positively. I think these ideas also apply to any situation where things aren't going exactly as we'd like with our SOs. There are always two ways to react--get hurt and pull back, or realize that he's not intentionally doing anything wrong, and try to be happy and reach out. For instance, when my sweetie gets home, he doesn't always give me the affection or attention I'm hoping for. Sometimes I withdraw, stay quiet, and pout a bit, which in effect punishes both of us for something he's not doing purposely or manevolenty. But sometimes, I try to ignore my minorly hurt feelings, smile and be loving and friendly. Without fail, this second option gets great results. If you keep in mind that your husband isn't deliberately, perhaps not even consciously, withholding affection, then why not show him what you want from him? I understand that you don't always want to make the first move, but you don't have to make a physical effort to reach out. Put on a cheerful smile and try to talk to him: how was your day, I'm really happy to see you, you look great, I missed you, etc. You don't want to say all this at once, but pay him a compliment and show him you're that glad he's around you. Sometimes my BF doesn't respond much to this, but I try hard not to take it personally, give him a few minutes, and then try something else, maybe a hug or kiss. Sometimes I just curl up beside him while he's watching TV without a word and usually get a big hug and kiss in response. This doesn't just apply to when he first comes home from work, but anytime I'm feeling a bit neglected.

    Anyway, I think that the positive, upbeat approach always works in time--if I'm patient and maintain an happy attitude, he soon warms up and returns my affection, starts a friendly conversation, etc. Goody, this might be a good way for you to handle initiating affection and conversation without always feeling like you're making the first move. Just staying happy and friendly, not constantly buzzing around him, and paying him attention from time to time ensures that he'll come around and reciprocate at his own speed, without feeling coerced, harassed, or nagged. On the other hand, when I respond to his indifference by withdrawing, my sweetie does the same. I get more and more hurt and frustrated and he keeps obliviously ignoring me until it's a big ordeal for one of us to initiate contact again. I guess my point here is it's all about your attitude. After all, our attitudes are the one thing we can control, so it's empowering to take action and have him respond positively by taking control rather than waiting resentfully until he gets the hint and grudgingly reaches out.

    I also apply this approach to nagging. Instead of saying, please take out the trash, I'll say something like, "hey, thanks for all the help around here with things like taking the trash. Would you mind bringing it along when you head out in the morning for work?" If you pay him a compliment and phrase the demand as a question, guys don't seem to see it as nagging or giving orders. My sweetie usually responds with a cheerful, friendly attitude rather than a sullen, "yeah, OK," along with being much less likely to follow through on your request when phrased this way. This can apply to anything, even asking for more affection. Sometimes when I feel a little neglected, I tell my sweetie, "I love to snuggle up with you, I miss being close and it feels so good to be in your arms." He responds eagerly and warmly when he's feeling ready for affection, whereas if I just lunge at him when he's busy, he's more likely to brush me off until later. And if I complain, "you haven't been giving me much affection," he just looks hurt and heads off by himself, frustrated because he doesn't know what I want. I really find it helps a lot to be positive and specific in any requests, and try to make it sound appealing (throwing in a compliment usually sweetens the deal!).

    Sorry for the novel-like post...I hope at least some of it may help. Congratulations Goody for sticking this out and giving it your all, and congratulations to all the respondents who provided helpful and sincere advice, that I think will help many people here, not just Goody and Tom.

    Take care everyone!
    Stacy

     
    Old 10-12-2004, 07:14 PM   #159
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    Re: Marriage after 15 years...happily ever after???

    Stacy...You are such a dolll taking out time to leave me such a wonderful post. I really like your ideas and your post came in just in time for me to try some of your ideas out. You really hit the nail right on the head...I can see how my approach definitely has to change in order to turn this relationship around into something more positive & fun. but it's not easy...I'm putting the scoreboard down and following Heartland's advice of looking towards more fun in our relationship. To be honest it's really been a long time since I can honesty say we had fun ;

    I really like your approach...and I really like you. You have really shown me what it's like to really care about what others are going through and I just wanted to take the time before I went off to bed to thank you for that

    Please don't apologize for your long post...it really helped me out. Now I need to apologize to you for not responding in as lengthy a way...but you see I've got work to do and spending it here is not the thing for me to do...when Tom is at work it's a different story....thanks again....Goody

     
    Old 10-12-2004, 07:39 PM   #160
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    Re: Marriage after 15 years...happily ever after???

    Hi Goody,

    Thanks so much for your sweet words. I had been giving your situation a lot of thought and I realized that it wasn't all that different from my relationship (or probably any other relationship), just that we don't have communication problems/lack of attention all that often. I think all couples run into the same issues as you and Tom, but yours have progressed to the extent where you're both pretty frustrated (which is bad), but also motivated to make things is better (which is excellent!) I definitely think that YOUR attitude can make a big difference in his behavior, and it's great when you have some power over the situation rather than depending entirely on him to change (though he will definitely need to do some of that ). I've just found that happiness and love tends to be infectious, and so does pouting and withdrawing. I do my share of both , but I like how my sweetie acts MUCH more when I'm feeling cheerful and affectionate. Anyway, I'm very impressed by your commitment to get things back on track, and I'm really happy to help in any way I can. I really like you a lot too ! I think you're a great lady, and I love the friendly, funny, appreciative way you respond to your supporters.

    Tom is a lucky guy, both to have you, and to have you so determined to get your marriage back on track. You guys have so much going for you that I really admire your efforts to improve your marriage rather than giving up, as too many couples do. It's not about what kind of help you pursue, just thaat you both care enough to put in the necessary effort to make things better. It did take years for things to get to this point, so you unfortunately can't expect miracles overnight, but I bet if you can have more fun together and keep the overall atmosphere loving and upbeat, you will be satisfied nonetheless by small, gradual changes, which will eventually lead to the kind of marriage you both want to regain. No relationship is perfect, which is why even small improvements can feel like huge achievements (and I see at least a few of those not far in your future! ) I know your friends here are rooting for you big time and surely very happy that you trusted and respected us enough to ask for help regarding such an important situation. Good luck tonight and in general...please keep us posted too when you get a chance!

    Best wishes,
    Stacy

     
    Old 10-13-2004, 05:46 AM   #161
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    Re: Marriage after 15 years...happily ever after???

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Snails

    Jeff, I was a little surprised to see you say that if counseling doesnít work, the relationship wasnít meant to be (did I get that right?). Do you think thatís always the case? At first read I thought so, but Iím not 100% sure. It strikes me that some people just arenít open to professional counseling, that some people really do want to work things out on their own, and may not respond to the counselor. And what if the counselor doesnít really grasp the situation and canít provide much help, or just isnít a good fit for the couple? I think itís an interesting idea to consideróif a professional canít fix something, is it broken beyond repair? Iím not sure, I guess Iíd say it depends, but I do disagree with people who continually repeat the same pat answer: seek professional help without acknowledging that this just might not be the answer for everyone. Itís totally different when someone is suffering from mental illness of some sort, like anxiety or depression, in which case psychiatric help should always be employed. But with ďtherapistsĒ or ďcounselorsĒ (not psychologists), there is no licensing board, no standard that must be met to use this label, so anyone can hang out a sign claiming to be a relationship therapist. This makes me think that sometimes such counselors may do more harm than good or not be able to provide any help. Iím just not sureÖI was wondering what Jeff and others think of this question.
    Heys Snails, Goody, Heartlanderguy, and everyone

    The counseling idea is mater of opinion to me. For me I try to work things out on my own first in my life or a relationship. If the time came for counseling again then I would take that route. From personal expierence counseling helped me but never took it on the relationship scale.

    Everyday I still look up things on this subject because I find it interesting. It does work for some and doesn't for others. I did say if counseling doesn't work then nothing will. I may be wrong about that but as my own personal prospective to it thats what I think. The reason why I came to this conclusion is because I try to work things out first and if I can't then I will seek the help. If help can't help me then what will????

    At that point I would decide to take life in a different direction and see what happens from there. Lets say I was in a marriage for 15 years with many downs than ups and tried everything to make the spark lit again to be happy then I would suggest the group counseling. I would be very opened minded and try to see what that does. If it work then that be great and if it doesn't then I would have to think about what I need to do next.

    Its all about being open minded though and accepting to the idea of someone else trying to get 2 strangers relationships going again. They are a professional for a reason and with the money I put into that then I will be open to try the new things they suggest.

    This is all matter of opinion though and this is my view. Many people may see my view or may not but that is my intake from my reading and my opinion on it. Thanks for bringing that up snail



    Goody,

    You have been offered great advice here and I am happy to see you and Tom taking the right steps on trying yourselve to work things out.
    Many people here do care for you and are routing for you. I am happy to see you offering input on other boards to help others out also.

    You are a very good person and Tom is starting to see that more and thats why he doesn't want to lose you. Keep up the good sparit and things will be a blessing in the end. You may hit some rough points because some people cant adjust well to changes but the benefits will be great afterwards.

    8-ball

     
    Old 10-13-2004, 07:45 AM   #162
    goody2shuz
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    Re: Marriage after 15 years...happily ever after???

    Thanks Jeff, Stacy and Heartland once again for your support and constant array of reponses.

    Stacy....you are what Dorothy sees at the end of the rainbow...that ray of light surrounding the pot of gold. The pot of gold being of course all the anwers I have yet to find. After reading your last few posts I can honestly see what I need to change in order to even have a chance of seeing some change in Tom. It's my entire approach which is not going to be an easy thing for me to do. But yes...I need to get to that place where I don't even expect him to do any particular thing to address my needs...which is ohhhh so hard to do when you have felt for so long that you have been doing it all on your own. How do I begin....I feel so vulnerable especially when Tom has already said he doesn't need the things I do. And I know you guys so well right now that you're asking...well what does he need? I believe it is to have unlimited use of the TV, meals, and sex. It's sad but ohhh so true. He really doesn't mind not holding hands and snuggling etc. He seems to be happy on his little branch of life but doesn't like the squirrel sitting on it complaiining Not having to put work & energy into something is an easy way out and still his needs are being met.

    But, at this stage of the game....I do have his attention especially when one of his major needs...sex is not being met. I expected him to sorta be jumping through hoops by now but he really isn't. I'm wating to feel that "orgasm" outside the bedroom and the way things are I think it'll be a long time coming. So far in my evaluation...there seems to be no resentmnt oranger building so we are staying the course

    So....today my strategy is to not expect a thing from him and to do what comes natural from me with no holding back which I often do as a defense mechanism to avoid disappointment. And to think of some fun things for us to do together. Tonite...we called in a family night to all watch the new DVD "When Tomorrow Comes' which we're all really excited about. I may start it off with alittle cocktail for Tom & I with some hordevous etc. That's my plan and then we'll take things from there....

    Jeff...in regard to your counseling...I know it's an option and have utilized it more than a few times in my life and really don't see it as something that will be helpful for us at this time. I honestly believe that Tom & I have identified some of our issues and we will be feeling this same uneasyness when we do what the counselor suggests (which most likely will be close to what we seem to be coming up with on our own or with the help of others here)

    Hey...Tom & I have gotten farther in this past week than we've gotten in years...and that's a big thing. I am starting to understand that we both have ignored and hidden from our responsibilities in our marriage in the form of TV, books, etc. and we're taking little baby steps now which I hope will turn into bigger steps in the right direction of giving our relationship and each other what is turly deserved. And to me...that's a big step in itself...Goody

    Last edited by goody2shuz; 10-13-2004 at 07:46 AM.

     
    Old 10-13-2004, 07:53 AM   #163
    eightball61
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    Re: Marriage after 15 years...happily ever after???

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by goody2shuz

    Jeff...in regard to your counseling...I know it's an option and have utilized it more than a few times in my life and really don't see it as something that will be helpful for us at this time. I honestly believe that Tom & I have identified some of our issues and we will be feeling this same uneasyness when we do what the counselor suggests (which most likely will be close to what we seem to be coming up with on our own or with the help of others here)

    I dont think counseling is nessessary for you both at this point because you both did find whats wrong and you both are working as a team to work things out. If you didn't see eye to eye then I would stress it more but I feel that you both will do just fine.

    From your last paragraph it shows that you both are working towards the goal and I am very proud.

     
    Old 10-13-2004, 07:59 AM   #164
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    Re: Marriage after 15 years...happily ever after???

    I may start it off with alittle cocktail for Tom & I with some hordevous etc. That's my plan and then we'll take things from there....


    Hi Goody! Good morning!
    That's sounds like a GREAT idea! Something else you said made me think: You said you were not going to expect anything and kinda play it by ear. I think that's a great idea as well. Sometimes not putting so much expectation on something is the best approach. I sometimes like to fly by the seat of my pants and let the wind blow me where it wants to. We as people sometimes get all caught up in planning, and cooridinating and blah, blah, blah, that having a spontanous moment is fun! Hope your movie night is a success!
    Don't forget to take your Ruby Slippers!

     
    Old 10-13-2004, 08:09 AM   #165
    goody2shuz
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    Re: Marriage after 15 years...happily ever after???

    Yup...the ruby slippers are on and with my good witches well wishes and my scarcrow's brains...I'm on my way

    There's no place like home....there's no place like home...sometimes I get a little mixed up & see diamonds and loving couples both young & old floating all around me in a tornadoe that sucked me up...and I remember as my heart speaks to me that there's no place like home ...Goody

     
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