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    Old 07-28-2005, 11:46 AM   #151
    Hiya
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    Re: Update--Ex wants him back

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SophiaM
    Hey Rose! I'm not sure actually what I am going to do. I would prefer if he brought it up, but if he doesn't, I don't know I think I'll be able to assess the situation better in person, see if he's warm towards me, if he gives me a kiss or just a kiss on the cheek, you know, little things. Yeah, I'll let you know how it goes. I'm curious myself.
    Hey Soph - yeah, I think it's a smart move to just sort of let him take the lead and see where it goes. Men are strange, bizarre creatures who would rather have a root canal than an honest conversation about how they feel about you, but at this point, I do think he really does need to visit the issue to some degree. It wouldn't be right for him to tell you "I'm confused, I don't know how I feel, I wanna be with you, but my ex, duh, I don't know" take off for a week or so then come back and not say anything at all about it. I'm hoping he's got his head on straight and can see what a great girl he's got in you! Keep us posted. Good luck!

     
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    Old 07-28-2005, 11:51 AM   #152
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    Re: Update--Ex wants him back

    Yes, Hiya, I agree with you--it would be kind of inconsiderate of him to just let everything slide and act as if nothing was out of the ordinary. Hopefully that won't be the case. And for the record, I haven't seen him for four weeks now, so that's definitely plenty of time to "clear his head"! And you are also right about the root canal theory--he certainly seems to fall into the clammed-up category of fellows.

     
    Old 07-28-2005, 11:58 AM   #153
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    Re: Update--Ex wants him back

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SophiaM
    Yes, Hiya, I agree with you--it would be kind of inconsiderate of him to just let everything slide and act as if nothing was out of the ordinary. Hopefully that won't be the case. And for the record, I haven't seen him for four weeks now, so that's definitely plenty of time to "clear his head"! And you are also right about the root canal theory--he certainly seems to fall into the clammed-up category of fellows.
    Four weeks, huh? Wow. That is a pretty healthy chunk of time. The best advice I think any of us can really give you is to just use and trust your own instincts. It's so hard to know whether a guy just doesn't really care about you that much, or if he's crazy about you but has baggage or whatever or just doesn't know how to show it very well. I guess the only real acid test we have is how we feel when we're around them. I guess whether he's just not that into or he's really crazy about you but your loving styles are just radically different, the end result is the same.

     
    Old 07-28-2005, 12:45 PM   #154
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    Re: Update--Ex wants him back

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Hiya
    Men are strange, bizarre creatures who would rather have a root canal than an honest conversation about how they feel about you
    Hey Hiya (Repeat that quick three times… Doesn’t it sound like something from a 1950’s cowboy movie?)

    My old friend, I’ve missed talking to you lately. From you, I’ll consider your quote as a compliment. How do you come up with great material like that? I suspect you come up with your very best stuff when you’re under the influence of the superglue fumes coming from the sweatpants you wear… I’ll never, ever forget that comment from you.



    Sophia, for your first “meeting” with NG, I’d suggest that you send some strong signals about your new “tolerated too much in the past” attitude. First, dressing in anything too “pretty” will indicate that you are not very upset with what he has done and that’s letting him off too easy. You two have some dirty business to clean up on this occasion and I’d suggest something more like casual business apparel to stress that fact. Second, I strongly suggest refraining from alcohol because that will send a very clear message about how seriously you take this situation.

    These suggestions should demonstrate your new attitude to NG and establish the proper tone for the meeting. These suggestions are unusual but they should help you feel quite empowered and unwilling to accept anything less than the best possible treatment from NG. Advantage, Sophia.

     
    Old 07-28-2005, 01:26 PM   #155
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    Re: Update--Ex wants him back

    Heartland, you are the best! I was intending to stay away from alcohol, but the business apparel idea has never crossed my mind--it does sound perfect for the occasion, though. I don't really want to look like I'm "trying too hard" to impress him or anything. Thank you, Heartland! Oh gosh, maybe you can be my new Cyber Uncle?

     
    Old 07-28-2005, 01:40 PM   #156
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    Re: Update--Ex wants him back

    Good advice, Heartland. That takes the "turtleneck or boob-shirt?" debate to a completely different level, one I admit I never really thought of before. Did you get that from toastmasters?

     
    Old 07-28-2005, 02:14 PM   #157
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    Re: Update--Ex wants him back

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SophiaM
    Oh gosh, maybe you can be my new Cyber Uncle?
    I would be highly honored to be your Cyber Uncle; see how I beam with pride? I've thought about offering to be your Cyber Uncle but I never wanted you to say “Uncle!” because of me.


    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Hiya
    That takes the "turtleneck or boob-shirt?" debate to a completely different level, one I admit I never really thought of before. Did you get that from toastmasters?
    Probably, because proper appearance is an important part of any presentation. After all, why bother giving a slide presentation if all the guys will be staring at a woman’s low neckline the entire time?

    BTW... Guys do have a similar debate… “turtleneck or sleazy, hairy-chested leisure suit?”…

     
    Old 07-28-2005, 02:41 PM   #158
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    Re: Update--Ex wants him back

    Hehehehehehehehe How about a boob shirt underneath business attire. Actually I just saw a new craze in which you can wear that bubble wrap underneath so that if you get stressed out you can pop a few bubbles at a time!!! That might be just the sorta thing you can use tomorrow night!!!

    But seriously....the business attire is a great idea, Heartland!!!

    I know we'll all be waiting on the edge of our seats waiting to hear what poor NG comes up with to get himself out of this one!!! Poor guy.....perhaps he should be wearing the bubble wrap

    Ha ha....thought that would bring a smile to Sophia's face!! ~ Goody

    PS ~ Gotta go try to catch some fish....but will look forward to Sophia's response

    Last edited by goody2shuz; 07-28-2005 at 02:42 PM.

     
    Old 07-28-2005, 03:05 PM   #159
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    Re: Update--Ex wants him back

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Hiya
    Four weeks, huh? Wow. That is a pretty healthy chunk of time. The best advice I think any of us can really give you is to just use and trust your own instincts. It's so hard to know whether a guy just doesn't really care about you that much, or if he's crazy about you but has baggage or whatever or just doesn't know how to show it very well. I guess the only real acid test we have is how we feel when we're around them. I guess whether he's just not that into or he's really crazy about you but your loving styles are just radically different, the end result is the same.
    Very interesting...I definitely agree with your final conclusion, Hiya, I'm just not at all sure that it's a good idea to judge whether a guy's worth keeping by how you feel around him. We hear women all the time who are being abused, mistreated, and just plain disrespected over and over say that they stay with the guy because they love him and they love being with him, etc. People are willing to excuse the most horrible and degrading treatment just because they want that person to keep seeing them. I do think it's important not to let NG get off easy, even if he does sit you down and say he's decided to pursue you exclusively. And if he says anything less definite, then I think you'd be insulting, even borderline humiliating yourself, by continuing to allow him to play and role in your life. He did, let's not forget, tell you he wasn't sure if he'd rather get back with his loser ex than continue dating you--that's inconsiderate at best and demeaning at worst. He owes you a sincere apology and some impressive groveling...if he doesn't realize this and expect you to jump up and down in glee just because he says I pick you after what he put you through, then his ego is out of control and/or he doesn't respect you whatsoever. It's very key that he understand that you are not pleased with being put through such uncertainty and disrespect and that if you are going to consider giving him another chance, he needs to know he better never, ever pull anything even remotely as arrogant and insulting as what he did with this whole ignoring you then dropping the ex bomb thing. Otherwise, he'll think you're so desperate to be with him that you're willing to put up with just about anything he wants to do with you, which opens the door for more sneakiness, lying, and even cheating.

    If I was in your position and had decided to be nice and understanding enough even to hear him out, which I think is extremely generous, then I would certainly go in there with the attitude that he's very lucky for another chance to win you over. After all, you aren't at all desperate or willing to be pushed around; you're an amazing catch and an awesome woman, and he better act accordingly from now on if he wants the opportunity to make this up to you. Trust me, Sophia, you don't want to let him get the upper hand--he already has it, as he was able to make you sit around wondering and frustrated for a month while he enjoyed himself on vacation mulling over whether you're good enough, in his eyes, to turn down a woman he already broke up with. At this point if you don't reassert your confidence and self-respect, he'll know he can treat you like a doormat from now on and expect you to take it with a smile and no complaints. So please don't give him any more kindness and consideration than you already have (which was already more than he deserved). Stand up for yourself and let him know you won't be treated poorly or walked all over...you may think being sweet and easy-going and not making him face the music about how he left things will make you seem understanding and therefore appealing, but in reality it will make you look spineless and (to be blunt) pretty pathetic. Men will only treat you as good as you make it clear that they must treat you, and so far, NG thinks he can treat you quite disrespectfully and still have you waiting around cheerfully hoping he'll want to keep seeing you. As Hiya said, so far his actions suggest he's not that into you, and if he wants to continue on with you, it's time for him to PROVE NOW that he's a whole lot closer to crazy about you then he was before he left. Anything less, and you really need to cut him loose if you want to retain your dignity and self-respect in all of this...I'm not just saying this because it's my opinion, but rather because I've seen what a rough toll this ordeal has already taken on your self-esteem. I do hope it goes well for you if you and NG are meant to be, please don't get me wrong, but I only want the best for you, and I think we all have a long way to go before NG has convinced anyone he fits that bill.

     
    Old 07-28-2005, 04:19 PM   #160
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    Re: Update--Ex wants him back

    Stacy, what a wonderful post!!! It is perfectly tailored for Sophia and I agree with every word.

    Sophia, most situations in life are not black and white so normally advice should offer some options… BUT NOT IN THIS CASE. No man or woman who did what NG did is worth another moment of time if they haven’t clearly learned their lesson and don’t respond as Stacy said. We all wonder what kind of man NG is and truly hope he finally sees you as the treasure you are… but much more importantly, we are concerned about you getting the treatment you deserve. Please be true to yourself as you weigh his words and actions.

    As a final precaution that I forgot before… if he is picking you up for the meeting, be sure to have an alternative way home available in case things turn out for the worse. I think that needs no explanation. (Cyber Uncles tend to be quite protective. )

     
    Old 07-28-2005, 06:02 PM   #161
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    Re: Update--Ex wants him back

    I have to disagree with what most of you posters are saying about NG. I really think he is going through a stage called "uncertainty". It's perfectly normal in the early stages of dating someone. He's not sure if Sophia is the right one for him, so maybe he had to take a break and decide if he wanted to keep seeing her. This is only "mistreatment" if you perceive it to be. When I look at the situation objectively, I see NG as a man who is interested in Sophia, but would like to get to know her at his pace and on his terms.

    When a women has only been seeing a man for a couple of months, and starts demanding that he bend over backward to please her and show her his undying love, then I think the woman has a problem with her own self esteem.

    Just because he had some problems with his ex coming into the picture and had to go on a business trip, does not mean he has no feelings for Sophia.

    He has been in touch with Sophia on a consistent basis, he has always been honest with her (even though it would be to his detriment to do so), and I just don't see what he has done to deserve the criticism he seems to be getting from all the posters on here.

    I think a lot of women expect too much too soon from a man. This is precisely why they pull away and start heading for the hills! And, personally, I don't blame them if they do.

     
    Old 07-28-2005, 06:26 PM   #162
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    Re: Update--Ex wants him back

    I think there are many good points to NG and there are behaviors of his that at this point are in question... I think this weekend will tell what NG is all about. If he does not bring up the emails or his having to clear his head, then that might be a possible red flag rather then someone who just has a hard time expressing his feelings??? But I dont feel he will do that as he is already proceeding with caution right now by not calling you like he use to. He might pssibly be taking his time now to rehearse just what he is going to say to you, I hope.

     
    Old 07-28-2005, 06:31 PM   #163
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    Re: Update--Ex wants him back

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by greeneyes100
    I think a lot of women expect too much too soon from a man. This is precisely why they pull away and start heading for the hills! And, personally, I don't blame them if they do.
    I agree.

     
    Old 07-28-2005, 07:33 PM   #164
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    Re: Update--Ex wants him back

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by greeneyes100
    When a women has only been seeing a man for a couple of months, and starts demanding that he bend over backward to please her and show her his undying love, then I think the woman has a problem with her own self esteem.

    I think a lot of women expect too much too soon from a man. This is precisely why they pull away and start heading for the hills! And, personally, I don't blame them if they do.

    This may be true for some women, but in general I think you're WAY off base here. Asking a man to not go back on his wish to date you exclusively is not expecting him to bend over backward, it's just common courtesy. I always, always demand only the very best, most respectful and considerate treatment from men, to the point where other women think I'm occasionally way too demanding, but yet I always end up with great relationships with men who consistently treat me like a princess. Then those same female friends wonder why they are always single or end up with men who don't want them or don't treat them all that great and it's like, duh, because you didn't let them know they were damn lucky to have you and better act like it! It's high self esteem, not low self esteem, that gives a woman the courage to expect and demand only the best treatment. I for one have never struggled with low self esteem, I've never had a guy pull away or run for the hills, and I have very high self confidence. Yet the women I see who have relationship after relationship fizzle out or end painfully tend to have such low self esteem that they allow men to walk all over them and don't demand to be treated with respect and consideration...so basically, everything I've seen and experienced leads me to disagree with your comments above, GE, though I do respect your opinions. You may be right about NG, and I really hope you are if he does turn out to be a good guy for Sophia. but in general I think women have the opposite problem of the one you cited. We'd see so many fewer women here lamenting situations in which a man they love is treating them really poorly if we started telling them that it took confidence and self-respect to stand up for themselves and not ever settle for poor treatment rather than that they should be more lenient and put up with more in the hopes of proving themselves to have high self-esteem . Sorry GE if I'm misunderstanding you, but that logic really makes no sense to me...I do know that people often see such things very differently than I do. But in my view, it's pretty obvious that if you have to make excuses, be more patient, put up with crap that seems disrespectful, and basically just cut a guy a lot of slack in order to keep him in your life (which may or may not be what NG is expecting from Sophia), there is a 0% chance that he will be a positive, much less permanent, addition to your life. A man who really loves and wants you will not give you reason to have to lower your standards and be less demanding in your expectations of what constitutes caring, respectful, and loving treatment. Heartland, thank you so much for your comments--I hope that we are being over-protective and overly harsh on NG IF he turns out to be the right guy for Sophia, which would require him treating her wonderfully from here on out. I don't think any of us would want to see Sophia settle for a man who makes her unhappy, doubt herself, or question his feelings for her...and no matter what happens with any one guy, remember, Sophia, that you always have friends and cyber family here who care about your well-being first and foremost (regardless of whether they agree on the specifics of NG and this whole situation). Whatever is best for you, Sophia, is what I know we all want .

    Last edited by Snails; 07-28-2005 at 07:43 PM.

     
    Old 07-28-2005, 08:04 PM   #165
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    Re: Update--Ex wants him back

    Where's the humanity aspect in that approach? After all, we are all only humans?
    So what - one strike and you're out?

    I know I've messed up, and needed second chances in life. I'd certainly give someone else the same opportunity I would want them to give me.

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by snails
    We'd see so many fewer women here lamenting situations in which a man they love is treating them really poorly if we started telling them that it took confidence and self-respect to stand up for themselves and not ever settle for poor treatment rather than that they should be more lenient and put up with more in the hopes of proving themselves to have high self-esteem
    I was one of these women at one time, but even so, when all is said and done, I don't regret not one single day I gave to this guy.
    I also believe, the more demanding I tried to be with him, to more he backed off me. Some people really do need someone who can just be understanding towards them.

    If Sophia does not wish to be the understanding one any longer, I can understand that, but I don't think being demanding of this guy is going to help the situation, that is if Sophia wants to remain involved with this guy.

     
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