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    Old 07-16-2004, 04:00 PM   #16
    TerryB
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    Re: neighbor child is abusing my daughter...

    Everyone,
    Start teaching your kids young that they are worth too much to be abused. They should never continue to play with another child that hits. A young child can be given a second chance but the situation has to be explained to the child: "If you hit (or pinch etc...) I will not play with you." Don't give too many chances either. Swift and severe consequences are needed to curb these budding bullies. You also don't want your child to start getting use to being the victim. Bullies alternate between nice (to keep the victim around) and mean (the fun part) so don't let your kid get sucked in.
    Terry

     
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    Old 07-18-2004, 07:42 AM   #17
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    Re: neighbor child is abusing my daughter...

    Bullies alternate between nice (to keep the victim around) and mean (the fun part) so don't let your kid get sucked in.




    EXACTLY!!! Wish I could send your last post to those parents.

     
    Old 08-03-2004, 10:12 PM   #18
    1egnima
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    Re: neighbor child is abusing my daughter...

    Your daughter has every right to not be hurt by anyone....and as a parent of a 3 yr old my self...I would definately not allow her to play with him anymore.BUT....it really upsets me to hear you,as a parent...as an adult..calling a 3 yr old a sociopath,a brat,etc. He is 3!! He is barely out of the toddler stage. He doesnt have the maturity or ability yet to "monitor" himself in this way. I'm not saying he can go around hitting,wreaking havok...nor is he too young to know he is hurting your daughter. I'm saying this is a problem with the PARENTS!!. You saying its "fun" to listen to them scream over there?? This little boy is being basically abused. I spent years working for social services in our town,Im not a social worker per say...but I know this situation.A 3 year old being able to ride his bigwheel into traffic?? This isn't a bad kid...this is a hurting little boy.He's obvoiusly not being supervised,disciplined. Any 3 yr old who's behaving as you describe....needs help. I'm not saying it's up to you to step in and help him.It's not. And your so right...its not your responsibility to teach him right from wrong...its his parents and they are not doing it.They are putting him in danger. It just saddens me to listen to you sound so uncaring of this little boy. The neighbors all hate him??Can you all not see whats going on?? Why don't you each just put in an annonymous call to social services in your area?? Tell them whats going on. This would take you 10 minutes,you dont have to give your name,you don't even have to know how it turns out. He is doing what a 3 yr old can to try and tell people he's in trouble, he's lashing out. It just makes me want to cry. The fact that his parents are in such denial,the fact that he is even allowed out unsupervised, the fact that he has these problems at 3......would tell anyone he needs help.

    Emily

     
    Old 08-07-2004, 11:03 PM   #19
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    Re: neighbor child is abusing my daughter...

    Amen 1Egnima,

    I agree with everything you said and would only like to add to everyone calling the 3 year old names that they should get great satisfaction out of the fact that this child is living in a home where there is constant screaming, a home where he is allowed to run out of the house naked, a home where no one is paying attention so he is allowed to run out in traffic, a military home where he will be uprooted every couple of years. I hope you find great satisfaction in the fact that if dad remains in the military this child will never know what it is like to develop long lasting friendships. Take satisfaction in the fact that there will be some years where he will go to as many as 3 different schools in one year. The list could go on and on. How can anyone be angry with a 3 year old? Of course he is acting out. Who wouldn't in the home situation you have described. No I do not believe you should allow your child to be hurt. I believe you should do everything possible to keep your child safe. I also believe this 3 year old should have the same thing. It sounds to me as if this child is being abused in more than one way and it also sounds like you are reveling in it. How sad. You can take comfort in the fact that every one of the bad things you said probably will happen to this child. You are right in one thing, you should not get involved. I don't see where you could bring anything good to the situation with the attitude you have toward that child. Imagine being a 3 year old and having a whole neighborhood hate you because you are being neglected and probably physically abused. I just pray that some day this child comes across someone that can be of help to him. This entire thread saddens me.

    God Bless,
    Sherry
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    Old 08-08-2004, 04:44 AM   #20
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    Re: neighbor child is abusing my daughter...

    In defense of the Mom involved hear, I think that the Mom was only thinking of dealing with one side of this problem. Naturally, she needs to think about the protection of her child first. You absolutely can't allow your child to be abused because of pity for another child. It teaches the other child absolutely nothing to be allowed to continue the behavior. Some of these kids can learn "different rules for different houses" and teaching him a better way might somehow help him to understand that he himself does not deserve to be abused.

    That being said, the above 2 posts have an excellent angle on the whole issue and it would be great to discuss constructively what could be done to help the OTHER vicitim, the 3 yr old. It often seems that helping the aggressive child is beyond the control of outside people.

    Reporting child-abusive is a huge step and most of us have some fear about what will happen to us or our children as a result of the reporting. Can this really be annonymous? Does anyone have any experience with this? I've only come close to reporting someone and then there was doubt in my mind that there was a touch of gossip/fabrication to the whole thing. Also, when someone is close to the child, the fear is that if a report is made, she will lose access to the child and things will become worse for the child. I would really like to know more about this issue because someday I will probably want to report someone but not bring retribution on my family.

    So, rather than waste an excellent thread on emotional outrage, lets see what can realistically be done for "bullies" that are themselves victims. Thanks for adding the other side of the equation into the thread 1Egnima.

    Terry

    P.S. The one bully that bothered my child came from a wonderful home-life, except that the parents were pushovers... tolerating bad behavior because of an suspected mental health disorder.

    Last edited by TerryB; 08-08-2004 at 04:46 AM.

     
    Old 08-08-2004, 09:11 AM   #21
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    Re: neighbor child is abusing my daughter...

    I wouldnt say that the parents are abusive towards the children. They yell alot and then are quit for a week or so. I suspect domestic violence in the household, but Im not sure there. Like I said before, they are military, upper-middle class income, seemingly high functioning people. I think dad has a bad temper. I dont think Ive ever seen him be physical with anyone, although it could be going on I suppose. My good friend is a social worker and when I described the situation to her, she said the main thing she would suspect is domestic violence. I apologize for seeming unconcerned with the other child involved. First and foremost, I worry about my daughter, who is younger, smaller, and being bullied. The father has continued to make remarks about me at the top of his lungs in the house. After he does this, the mother will come outside and initiate conversations with me, I think she feels guilty when he does this. At this point I just feel angry. They are making this whole thing MY problem, and my problem alone. They have never made any efforts to reverse his behavior, and are still not supervising him enough in my mind, and on top of it all, when I get upset with their son's behavior and tell him to go home, the father ends up screaming obscenities about me! My husband was home all week and I noticed the father didnt say anything. So I guess he just wants to intimidate me, and didnt want to deal with my husband. I think if I see something definitive in the next week concerning supervision or fighting, I will make a call-in the meantime, I dont let him play with my daughter. The kids are so spoiled , the daughter has a $3,000 laptop, an expensive collection of toys, and the son gets anything and everything he wants. The parents dont want to deal with tantrums, so he gets what he wants when he wants it. Ugh. The sociopath comment was mostly sarcastic. The kid is so spoiled that he acts like one. when one has no consequences for their actions, they do what they want, and have no concept of other people. He has been conditioned to be selfish I guess. i cant fix it. The most I can do is place a call when I see something that is reportable. I used to work in the court-system dealing directly with cases involving kids. Our community has a HUGE occurance of abuse and neglect, due to a large poor, rural population. Our social services department is broken beyond repair, and our public school systems are full of kids who are severely delayed, dirty, and abused. Most cases are not handled as well as they should be, because the caseload on the workers is HUGE. This family looks perfect compared to alot of what I have seen. Now im rambling... I think my job, and my community has left me a bit jaded, and thats why my first response hasnt been pity for the boy. Im not mean to him. Giving him consequences for his behavior probably helps- a little bit. But I dont want them to play together. He is cruel to my daughter, and the parents pass it off as "roughhousing". Im done with it. Im invested in my kids and unless they do something blatantly wrong, Im leaving them alone (the neighbors). There are some great parents here as well. My oldest is in a wonderful small private school so I get to see families that work and are loving. I always used to say that if I ended up with a child that bulliled, I would be deeply upset. It is a behavior that I cannot tolerate. I would feel like a bad mom if my kids decided it was okay to torment kids they perceived as weaker. And I pray they dont have to worry about becoming targets in school. Growing up, I was the kid that was nice to the kids who were bullied. I hope my kids will learn how to treat others too.

     
    Old 08-08-2004, 09:53 AM   #22
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    Re: neighbor child is abusing my daughter...

    hillary,
    I took most comments here as just blowing off steam. One thing that I do with my daughters. If they are afraid of a child and I know that the child has had a tough time with a dysfunctional family I tell her that she does not have to play with that child but she should not engage in any gossip about that child. Now my oldest is like a little social worker. She'll say something like "Gavin, has had it tough at home" or "maybe no one has tried to teach him manners" etc... She even tells the truth to kids that hit. She says "I don't want to play with you because you hit." She only weighs 40 lbs so I think that it is great that she avoids trouble but yet has some compassion for kids that don't have the home-life that she has. I also hope to teach her to see what happens when a woman selects a "bad" man to make babies with.
    Terry

     
    Old 08-08-2004, 10:32 AM   #23
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    Re: neighbor child is abusing my daughter...

    Hillary,

    I'm sorry the system has jaded your outlook on things. I worked in the public school system for 14 years and I saw children just like the 3 year old you described. It deeply saddened me to see the things that were happening. It has been my experience that a 3 year old that "bullies" , hits, and pinches other children is screaming "help me". In most cases, it is their limited communication skills saying "this is what is being done to me". It is usually their only means of communication. Attention is attention whether it be good or bad in origin. I don't blame you one bit for protecting your child from being hurt. It just goes to show we all react differently to situations. You say you have become "jaded", I'm sorry for that. I can see how it can happen. I "chose" to not let myself become jaded. I currently have a 10 yr old girl living with my family who comes from a bad home situation. We are not foster parents and do not participate in the foster parent program, we have taken in and helped 4 children in the last 5 or 6 years. What makes this sad is that the parents just basically ignored these kids and staying a few days became a few weeks, months, etc.. Well, 2 are grown men in the Marines, another is living with his mom now but spending weeks at a time with us, and the last is here full time. This is just what I choose to do to make a difference. This is what God had put on my heart to do. I believe that until "we" as a society become less "jaded" there will be more and more of these situations. Most children grow up to live what they have learned.

    God Bless,
    Sherry
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    Old 08-08-2004, 06:26 PM   #24
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    Re: neighbor child is abusing my daughter...

    Ok, I guess I just keep thinking about how seriously I take parenting my kids. I dont want my neighbors or my parents or my kid's teachers to have to do the things that I as a parent SHOULD be doing. I made a conscious decision to be a parent. I dont understand people who have kids and expect everyone else to pick up their slack. Bringing kids into this world is the biggest decision you can make, why o why would you do it just for the heck of it and be a bad parent??? Sorry, I just dont get it. Growing up, I had friends that came from sadly dysfunctional families. They ended up at my house, hanging out with my mom alot. One even moved in for a couple of months. My parents are good people and several of my friends to this day still call them up when they need advice or the usual parent stuff. I guess i could try to take the 3 year old in but I used to watch him and he tore my house up and almost drank my bug spray (I thought it was out of reach, but not for him!) And of course, last week he took a tennis racket and hit my daughter over the head with it. ugh. I dont think his parents are beating him. But they let him beat on them. He isnt one of the sad kids from the grossly negligent families, he is spoiled rotten. I spent alot of time in their home last year. Saw him get hugged and kissed after trashing the house, peeing on the floor, breaking all the eggs in the kitchen, I have always been so dumbfounded at how DELIBERATE these behaviors have been. THe landlady gave the family a difficult time this weekend. Said neighbors are complaining about their kids getting into their garages , breaking their stuff, etc. I suppose eventually they will move.

     
    Old 08-08-2004, 09:58 PM   #25
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    Re: neighbor child is abusing my daughter...

    Hi Hilary,
    I do understand that your one and only job is to keep your daughter and family safe. And again I say.....I would also keep my daughter away from him. You do realize that having "things" doesnt neccesarily mean he is just spoiled and gets what he wants. Abuse has no limits. And it doesnt have to be physical. A child doesnt have a have bruises and tatteered clothes and be unclean to be a victim of abuse. A well ajusted,well treated 3 yr old just doesnt trash a house,rub poop into the carpet,hit his parents. You saw him being hugged after this type of behavior? It makes me wonder what would have been done had you not been there. A 3 year old doesn't have the mental capacity to understand consequences yet. You said he does these things so deliberatley....it sounds to me the only thing he is deliberately doing is trying to get attention...good or bad.Neglect doesnt have to mean he has no shoes,or never bathes,etc. Emotional neglect can be even worse....and thats what they are doing to him. Having every toy in the world isnt making this little guy any happier obviously.
    You said maybe you could try taking him in....I really dont think thats the answer. Mostly for your daughters sake. His parents need a wake up call. I'm sorry that social services isn't doing its job in your area. You can call annonymously. And if more then one call comes in about the same family (your neighbors call as well)....and if you call a few times (be the squeeky wheel)..they pretty well have to check on this family. If he is causing damage in the neighborhood...call the police.Explain to them what you have seen going on. What I'm saying is you don't need to be his "rescuer"........I know with a 2 yr old you dont have time nor would it be safe to have him in your house. That little boy need professional help.

    Emily

     
    Old 08-09-2004, 05:28 AM   #26
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    Re: neighbor child is abusing my daughter...

    I wasnt saying I would take him in. I was addressing the issue for those who thought I should, which annoys me cause I dont have the time energy or a big enough heart to do that I guess. If I see something call-worthy, I will report it. If his dad decides to do some yelling outside of his house, directed towards me, I will call the cops. Those are my plans. Hopefully someday in a perfect world people will reproduce only with good intentions and not just because they can.

     
    Old 08-09-2004, 12:34 PM   #27
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    Re: neighbor child is abusing my daughter...

    I believe it was Hitler that first proposed that "utopian" society of only perfect people reproducing. Thank God he didn't succeed.

    Regardless of what you think, I do believe your first responsibility is to your children. I also do not think you should try to "take in" that little boy. I agree with Emily that this child needs professional help. I also believe he needs someone to care for him. Obviously his mother is completely overwhelmed with the whole situation. The father sounds controlling and mentally abusive to the entire family. If you do decide to make that phone call, it would be better to call his commander. If the military investigates this situation and finds signs of abuse, they will make sure the father gets the help he needs. Other than getting them evicted or waiting for them to get transferred I really don't see any other way for you to have peace in the neighborhood. I would also caution you to be careful. This man sounds unstable and he very well may retaliate against you and your family. It could turn out to be a dangerous situation. I think you inferred from my post that I was somehow "against" you. I am not. In all reality, the more you have expanded on this situation, the more I have become concerned not only for that little boys safety, but also the safety of you and your children. Ok, now I'm going to step out on a limb here, I don't believe you are as "hard hearted" as you claim. I think deep down the reason you posted this situation is because you know this child needs help and you also felt there is nothing you can do about it. You may not even be concious of it, but I believe you are more worried about this child than angered by him. I could be wrong, it wouldn't be the first time nor the last. I just choose to see the good in people. I don't plan to reply to this thread again, I think that all the useful suggestions have been made and any arguments that may ensue from here are all just semantics. Take care, and I wish you and all the families involved in this a speedy and acceptable resolution.

    God Bless,
    Sherry
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    Old 08-09-2004, 08:26 PM   #28
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    Re: neighbor child is abusing my daughter...

    keeping your child safe is first, but then there is also the resposibilitly all humans share to keep others safe as well and especially those who can defend themselves.
    follow your heart...

     
    Old 08-11-2004, 06:39 PM   #29
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    Re: neighbor child is abusing my daughter...

    Hey update time. Talked to the mom today and they are moving in 2 months!! Hubby is being deployed to Iraq and she is going back to her home in another state. So this is all temporary and I can breathe a sigh of relief! Good thing too, cause this thread ended up kind of annoying me, and alot of other posters too. Its hard being a parent because your beliefs are so strong and we all clashed a bit. sorry guys I was too upset when I posted, and I upset some folks. Its hard enough raising kids as it is, Im gonna just try to RELAX now.

     
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