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    Old 10-14-2007, 05:49 AM   #1
    Laylah
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    Sister/boyfriend situation raising its ugly head again..

    Well, here we go again with this unfortunate situation I wish had never arisen in the first place. For those who haven't heard me talk about this before, here goes:

    Somewhere in the region of two or three years ago my sister started making drunken and highly inappropriate sexualised comments about my bf. It started out with her mentioning how "sexy" he was, she repeated that assertion on a couple more (always drunken) occasions and then finally, as if trying to back track and undo the damage of her previous assertions, she went into a drunken rant one night about what a "lovely bloke" he was and how she'd "love to be closer to him". She was attempting to paint everything that had come out of her mouth prior to that in a purely platonic light, but it wasn't going to wash with me. You don't repeat for platonic reasons on several different occasions that your sisters bf is "a ride" and "a fine thing" and other vulgarisms in the Dublin vernacular you probably wouldn't understand and might not be acceptable to the mods were I to explain in explicit detail!

    I don't know how much memory she has of her prior comments, as they were all delivered in states of inebriation, but I do know that she must have some memory of at least one of them, as her attempt at a 'patch-up job' on the last night would indicate. Even on that final night the way she was going on was inappropriate; I just wish I could play the tape for you people - she was absolutely gushing about him...

    Anyway, after that I'd had enough, and I (unfortunately) took it out on him one night, telling him that I was sick of the way she launched herself at him for a full physical body hug every time she saw him in that mad flamboyant style, like he was her long lost husband just after having unexpectedly reappeared at the end of the war. I told him (yes, unfairly, I know) that I felt he was encouraging this by way of the fact that he'd never actively discouraged it. He could see I was very annoyed.

    A couple of weeks after that she turned up at our home. He'd just walked out the door and apparently she'd hugged him (cold mountain style, no doubt) outside the back door on her way up the path. Later that evening she and I drove to the local supermarket to get some wine or something in for the dinner and she said to me; "Have I done something wrong, have I said something I should know about, because I hugged ____ today and he was very cold towards me ". Also, she mentioned that he had been more conversational with my brother, who was also there that evening; but she did not put it in that way. She said that she "had felt ignored" and that my bf "must be very rude"!!!

    I brushed all that off and hoped she'd get the message and that it wouldn't have to come to a row between her and myself, because the last time we had a row we didn't speak for SIX YEARS!!! and I REALLY didn't want a repeat of that, at least as much for my sons sake as for hers and mine.

    Anyway, a few months went by, she's been in his company several times since then and has had nothing to say; but a couple of nights back he came in as she and I were sitting at my kitchen table. They said their hello's and to be honest I didn't even notice the exchange, never mind anything odd about it, but she called me the next day and started trotting out the same old BS, asking me had she done or said something wrong and why had he been so rude to her? I asked her what she meant and she said she'd said hello to him and he'd been very rude. I took this to mean she'd said hello and he hadn't responded to her (which wouldn't be like him at all, that's not his nature) so I said, maybe he didn't hear you say hello, I didn't hear you myself. Then she said, "No, he definitely heard me, he said hello back", then I said; "Well then how was he rude to you"? She said; "Because he never made eye contact when he said it"!!!

    It's clear that she's watching and decoding his every little response or slightest interaction with her, and it's really bothering me at this stage. I know the man and if he didn't make eye contact with her while saying hello it didn't mean a damn thing; he was probably busy closing the door behind him or something. It's not like he's behaving like a cat on a hot tin roof with her since my conversation with him. He has voluntarily sat in her company several times since then, and called out to her home with me when he could have avoided it. Yes he is aware that I am uncomfortable with the level of over-familiarity she was formerly displaying, but his changes in demeanor around her are so subtle you'd have to be really really watching out for them to notice. I haven't noticed them myself, so that'll tell you something! I'm sorry this post is so very long, it's just that this story goes back a long way and it's really bothering me. It's plainly obvious she's watching and monitoring his behaviour towards her like a hawk, far more than is normal or necessary.

    My sister has a very combustive personality, she has no confrontational skills at all, nothing is negotiable with her, every disagreement is taken as a personal insult and must result in an explosive row that leaves a reside of deep bitterness. It's very unfortunate because believe it or not, we are actually usually very close. I just don't know how to get her to back off and stop examining her encounters with my bf like they bloody mattered or were any of her business to scrutinise. I know I haven't heard the end of this from her and I'm afraid that at some future point it'll blow up like halloween night... That's the way things go when my sister doesn't get her way, even with the treatment she expects/demands from her own sisters bf, apparently...

    I discussed this in detail with a close friend of mine the other day and she was just gobsmacked that my sister would approach me with the complaint that she didnt feel my bf was paying her deep enough a sense of respectful attention. My friend reckons it's none of her business to be put out over the fact that my bf isnt fawning all over her, and that's she's obviously got a very watchful eye on his behaviours in order to notice such minor things in the first place.

    I'm just wondering what you all think or if anyones got any advice on how to deal with the situation before it all comes to a head, as I have the bad feeling that my sister is sure to drive it in that direction, in fact I believe she's already doing so. My son was hysterically upset the last time it looked like myself and my sister might be about to have a falling out, as he was waiting for a repeat of the six year episode. Help!

    Last edited by Laylah; 10-14-2007 at 05:59 AM.

     
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    Old 10-14-2007, 06:06 AM   #2
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    Re: Sister/boyfriend situation raising its ugly head again..

    The person I feel for in this whole mess is the poor BF. There is a man who is damned if he does and damned if he don't! I can just imagine him terrified that if he is nice to your sister, you will jump on him, and if he tries to please you he gets it in the neck from the sister. Surely you don't have to put up with this, or alienate her totally, there must be a middle road, like fobbing her off with BF's pre-wedding nerves, or some such. Invent a spot of depression, or job worries for him until she moves on to some other drama. Seriously, you cannot live your life pandering to some paranoid fancy coming from another person, in fear of precipitating a row. Also, why should YOU be bunny-in-the-middle; let them get on with it. Just plead total ignorance and indifference to his lack of eye contact and so on. Having said all that, I don't know your sister, but you sound pretty scared of her, so maybe there is nothing you can do but wait for the meltdown. Sera

     
    Old 10-14-2007, 06:19 AM   #3
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    Re: Sister/boyfriend situation raising its ugly head again..

    Hi Sera. Like I said, he hasn’t been avoiding her company at all, and he and I have only had one discussion about this, dating back several months ago now; so no, he's not living in fear of being jumped on. There's no fear of him getting it in the neck from my sister either. She takes all her complaints to me, and I haven’t even bothered relaying them back to him, because I'm not about to dignify them by making them an issue in my relationship.

    As for me, it's not my sister I'm afraid of; it's a return to the six year cold war that affected my family and particularly my son so deeply. I don’t want to go back to that, and I know it is an imminent possibility.

    I did just express total ignorance and indifference as you suggest, that's the line I'm taking at the moment (the same line I took months ago when she first brought this up) so I guess the psychology there is that if it does result in total meltdown she'll have to be the one to initiate it. I guess I'm just hoping the only way around this is to put her in a position where she'll have to make a total irrational show of herself before this reaches boiling point! It's really the only strategy I can think of at this time... I’m guessing from your post you’d agree this is the way to go?

     
    Old 10-14-2007, 06:43 AM   #4
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    Re: Sister/boyfriend situation raising its ugly head again..

    Yes, I do agree...keep your cool and let her be the one who is fussing and picking the fight. Who knows, some other drama may distract her. Your son is about 13 or so? He is old enough to see what is happening, and even though he will be upset if there is a rift, he will see who is responsible. He is not the little boy he was when it happened before. Don't let her rile you, serene calm on your part may defuse or prevent the escalation. (We can only hope). BTW, what happened to the sugar-daddy she met on her cruise?

     
    Old 10-14-2007, 07:09 AM   #5
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    Re: Sister/boyfriend situation raising its ugly head again..

    Oh Lord Sera! The same night she's complaining she got the intolerably rude no-eye-contact treatment from my bf she divulged to me that her 57 yr old holiday romance dude is also a seasoned alcoholic! I told her; "Look, when a 57 yr old man has had every previous relationship end with the woman walking out the door you need to start asking why; I was thinking that before, but surely now you know he's a full-on alco you've got your 'why' - so why bother continuing with this?" She just brushed that off...

    She has been back to the country he lives in since they first met in order to continue this trans-continental relationship. Oh I dont know what to say about all that. I have warned her; I guess she needs to make her own bed there...

    By the way, this; "keep your cool and let her be the one who is fussing and picking the fight" is very good advice. I intend to take it.

    The thing is, if this does blow up, it's going to look so ridiculous to my bf; he's going to wonder where the hell it all blew up out of!! - because he knows largely nothing about her prior comments, and absoloutly nothing about her current ones.

    On the last thread I posted about this someone advised me to keep these comments to myself and not let them infiltrate or influence my relationship; I cant remember who gave that advice, but I really took it to heart, as it struck me as very good sense that I shouldnt let her influence what's between myself and my bf, so the current tense situation really exists only between her and myself (though I can fully understand why it would look like a triangular thing) So, like I say, if the bomb does to off he's going to wonder what's been going on behind the scenes all this time, lol.

    Last edited by Laylah; 10-14-2007 at 07:11 AM.

     
    Old 10-14-2007, 09:46 AM   #6
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    Re: Sister/boyfriend situation raising its ugly head again..

    I have to say, I know you said you're not scared of your sister, but that's really what it sounds like. Even though yes, you're right, you probably shouldn't have blown up at your boyfriend about your sister's comments, but at least some good did come of it. He obviously is treating her more cooly, so maybe there were tings he was doing inconscously to make her thing he welcomed her overly demonstrative advances. Things are the way they should be now between them. I think although it's stressful on you, it's probably a good course of action to keep pleading ignorance and just brush off her complaints that he's not as warm and friendly to her. I don't think you should lie to her and make up some "oh, he's just stressed/depressed now" story, that will only lead to more trouble and confusion. Just keep things status quo, relax and blow off her "he's not nice to me anymore!" complaints as much as you can. If she blows up or has a hissy fit, well, you're just going to have to let her, because the only way to stop that from happening is to tell your boyfriend to be nicer to her again and just let her drool and fawn over him again and let her have her way, and you can't do that, so the ball's in her court. You can't control what someone else is or isn't going to do. If she's going to blow up over not getting enough attention from your man, then you'll just have to let her. You really don't have another choice.

    As for your son, well, this would be a good chance to teach him that just because someone gets mad, or just because someone chooses to not be in your life anymore, that's no reason and no excuse to get hysterical and out of control. He's getting to be a big boy and should be learning by now that people will come and go, and people will sometimes make demands of you that are unfair and unreasonable and it's better to let them go out of your life than to cave to their emotional blackmail. I mean, if he still throws fits and gets hysterical because someone has a fight or isn't in his life anymore, how is he going to handle it the first time a girlfriend he really really loves breaks up with him? You can't protect him from disapointment, rejection and heartbreak forever, so you may as well start teaching him how to deal with it.

    Last edited by Larrylou'smom; 10-14-2007 at 09:48 AM.

     
    Old 10-14-2007, 09:58 AM   #7
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    Re: Sister/boyfriend situation raising its ugly head again..

    Hi Laylah, I am sorry you have to deal with this yet again. yes you should DEFINITELY never express your discomfort to either your bf or to your sister. Make them both feel that it would not even cross your mind that she might be entertaining the idea. I am sure that your sister will finally get tired of seeking unattainable attention. Don't bring this subject up at all, stay in control of the situation and as secure as you ever were. Let her comments go in one ear and out of the other. If a confrontation was to happen, it will only have a negative influence on you all, I can't see any gains by highlighting the issue. Good luck.

     
    Old 10-14-2007, 10:16 AM   #8
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    Re: Sister/boyfriend situation raising its ugly head again..

    Thanks LLM. I've done a bit of rethinking the situation on the strength of the opening lines of your post and I think that the constant balancing act that epitomises my relationship with my sister is probably stressful to the point of having become intimidating to me. Her, herself, as an individual, well she has never had an intimidating influence on me; in fact, the main reason why we didn't speak for so long after the last bust-up was because she drove me to the point where I unfortunately pasted her up and down the back garden, lol, so it wouldn't have actually occurred to me that she was an intimidating force in my life; but yes, taking a closer look at this situation, it, in itself, has become something that makes me nervous, so there's got to be a sense of anticipatory intimidation in that.

    As for my son; he was only a toddler when myself and my sister last fell out, he was two and a half. He didn't see his aunt until he was almost nine, but he'd never forgotten her and asked after her for years. He would have been about ten or eleven when she and I had another argument, so I don't think there was anything unusual about his being extremely upset by that. Yes, he's older now, but he essentially spent the guts of his childhood cut off from his aunt because we could not contain the discord between us and I don't want a return to that in his teens. I'd rather he only had one memory of that; not two.

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Larrylou'smom View Post
    I think although it's stressful on you, it's probably a good course of action to keep pleading ignorance and just brush off her complaints that he's not as warm and friendly to her. I don't think you should lie to her and make up some "oh, he's just stressed/depressed now" story, that will only lead to more trouble and confusion. Just keep things status quo, relax and blow off her "he's not nice to me anymore!" complaints as much as you can.
    On this point here, what I'm wondering is; as much as I want and intend to, how long is it plausible for me to continue on like this??? I already feel that if she brings this up again it will be time for me to ask her exactly where are her concerns stemming from and what business is it of hers to expect anything more from my bf other than common courtesy and civility, which she is already getting. In other words, I feel I'm getting close to boiling point myself and I can only keep the lid on for so long. Her behaviour is so illogical and irrational and unreasonable that I really don't think I'll be able to continue on listening to it should she keep on bringing it up, and anyway, even if I were to keep on letting it just 'roll off', so to speak, surely she'd take that as an indication that this subject was up for discussion whenever she chose to raise it?

    Last edited by Laylah; 10-14-2007 at 10:23 AM. Reason: misspelling

     
    Old 10-14-2007, 10:20 AM   #9
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    Re: Sister/boyfriend situation raising its ugly head again..

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Nina000 View Post
    Hi Laylah, I am sorry you have to deal with this yet again. yes you should DEFINITELY never express your discomfort to either your bf or to your sister. Make them both feel that it would not even cross your mind that she might be entertaining the idea. I am sure that your sister will finally get tired of seeking unattainable attention. Don't bring this subject up at all, stay in control of the situation and as secure as you ever were. Let her comments go in one ear and out of the other. If a confrontation was to happen, it will only have a negative influence on you all, I can't see any gains by highlighting the issue. Good luck.
    Thanks Nina. It may be true that at some point she will tire of seeking unattainable attention, but she hasn't tired of it the last three years, so who's to say when she'll run out of steam?

    Also Nina, she's the one who just wont stop hightlighting the issue; she's like a dog with a bone! I feel that she's pushing me towards a situation where I can no longer ignore this, and worse than that, I feel that that's exactly what she wants!!!

     
    Old 10-14-2007, 10:37 AM   #10
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    Re: Sister/boyfriend situation raising its ugly head again..

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Laylah View Post
    I think that the constant balancing act that epitomises my relationship with my sister is probably stressful to the point of having become intimidating to me. yes, taking a closer look at this situation, it, in itself, has become something that makes me nervous, so there's got to be a sense of anticipatory intimidation in that.?
    I think that's only natural. Feeling like you have to walk on eggshells around someone will naturally put you ill at ease and make you feel like you're constantly on edge doing a juggling act, and that in itself is stressful, draining and intimidating. So it's not her herself, but the havoc she brings, that makes you scared and on edge.


    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Laylah View Post
    As for my son; he was only a toddler when myself and my sister last fell out, he was two and a half. He didn't see his aunt until he was almost nine, but he'd never forgotten her and asked after her for years. Yes, he's older now, but he essentially spent the guts of his childhood cut off from his aunt because we could not contain the discord between us and I don't want a return to that in his teens. I'd rather he only had one memory of that; not two.?
    Well, of course I totally understand that, but what I'm saying is, you may not have a choice. She may not give you a choice. I don't have kids, but if I did, ideally, I would love for them to have my parents and my brothers as a constant part of their family, but my parents are very dysfunctional and my brother is a paranoid schizophrenic, so it wouldn't really be happy and healthy for any kids of mine to be around my parents for long periods of time and it wouldn't be safe for my kids to be around my brother at all. My kids just wouldn't get to have their uncle, as sad as it is. I also recall a celebrity talking about her mom and how she had to keep her away from her kids because she wasn't healthy, I can't remember if it was alcoholism, manic depression or what, but her kids never really had a relationship with her mom, and even though they wanted to know their grandma and spend time with her and have her in their life, it wasn't possible. I'm sure you want to spare your son the pain of losing his aunt out of his life again, but if she is going to be dysfunctional and be hell bent on coming between you and your man and having things her way or she will blow up, then perhaps it's best that she not be in his life, and in the long run, it's just a sad truth he will have to learn to live with. You can't will her, force her or make her become someone she isn't for your son's sake.


    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Laylah View Post
    On this point here, what I'm wondering is; as much as I want and intend to, how long is it plausible for me to continue on like this??? I already feel that if she brings this up again it will be time for me to ask her exactly where are her concerns stemming from and what business is it of hers to expect anything more from my bf other than common courtesy and civility, which she is already getting. even I were to keep on letting it just 'roll off', so to speak, surely she'd take that as an indication that this subject was up for discussion whenever she chose to raise it?
    Well, this is a good point. I don't know your sister or just how nuts she can or would get, but I suspect that if it were me, I'd probably just tell her the truth, and the next time she whined about why he's not nice enough to her, I'd simply say "well, when you were drunk on several occasions, you said this that and the other, and it really hurt me and I felt it was terribly inappropriate and I got so upset, he and I got into it, so I guess to avoid any problems in the future, he has decided to hold you as a distance to put me a priority and not hurt me and show me that he's not encouraging it at all. I'm sorry hun, but you're just not going to get to be inappropriate with my man anymore" But I get the feeling that would not go over very well with her. Maybe you could just say something like "he hasn't said anything to me about it, so I know he doesn't have a problem with you at all. Maybe he's just making sure things stay appropriate.." Or something like that. Otherwise, I mean, what else can you really do? If she keeps "why doesn't he hug me anymore?? Why isn't he as nice to me?? What's wrong???" If she just won't let it go until things go back the way they were, the way that was making YOU miserable, then what else can you do but not have her around as much and not be around her as much? The thing here is, she's rather dense and self absorbed, and she just really isn't giving you much choice.

    Last edited by Larrylou'smom; 10-14-2007 at 10:44 AM.

     
    Old 10-14-2007, 10:41 AM   #11
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    Re: Sister/boyfriend situation raising its ugly head again..

    If you feel that she is trying to push you to such an extreme, then this is more of a reason to NEVER satisfy her wishes. Really Laylah, she may want to sound important, and you will be giving her just that by allowing her immature behaviour and such explosive situation to end in a way that makes her feel, even slightly, that you have anything to worry about. I would be extremely assertive that what she is doing is laughable, unimportant, and ridiculous rather than threatening. Don't predict the worst but if her odd comments continue then you really have to take a firm attitude towards her, even if this would mean seeing her less.

     
    Old 10-14-2007, 11:46 AM   #12
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    Re: Sister/boyfriend situation raising its ugly head again..

    I'm sorry you are dealing with this "sister drama" again. I know how absolutely nerve wracking it can be.

    Honestly, it may be to the point where you are just going to have to tell her like it is. I really don't buy this whole "I don't remember what happened when I drank" excuse one bit. My sister has tried this on a few occassions. I would try to remind her with a few embellishments and then all of a sudden she would be correcting me saying exactly what did happen. So much for not remembering.

    If I were you, the next time she starts this little dramatic act of hers I would tell her exactly what she has done. Don't let her feel like you are at all threatened by her behavior, but rather make her feel that you and your boyfriend (even if he doesn't know all of the details) found her previous actions to be very inappropriate and he doesn't want to have to deal with her unpredictable behavior anymore so he is keeping her at arms length. What good is going to be gained if she feels like she can get away with being this way? She's an adult, shouldn't she have to be respsonsible for her actions?

    But then, she is your sister so obviously you know her better than I do. I just know that if I tried an approach like this with my sister she would be so humiliated that she would be the one avoiding my boyfriend (or husband, lol). She can't stand the thought of people not liking her so she would be trying to clean up her act a bit to make herself look better.

     
    Old 10-14-2007, 12:04 PM   #13
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    Re: Sister/boyfriend situation raising its ugly head again..

    Laylah, I remember you posting about this before. I don't see why you don't just confront her with it if she asks you again. Just tell her flat out, Look Susie, I'm tired of you constantly going on and on about how much you want to boink my boyfriend, and he's really sick of it, too. Either cut it out or don't ever speak to me again. End of story.

    You haven't even confronted her to tell her about how much this upsets you, and that's your biggest problem. She can sit there and deny it all she wants, but it won't change the fact that it happened. You just need to confront her and get it out in the open. Of course she's confused about why your bf is acting distant. She probably has no clue how upset all of this is making you, and that's why you HAVE TO say something!

    My sister would never in a million years say things like that about my bf. Partially because we have such majorly different taste in guys, but also because there are certain lines you don't cross as a sister, and this is definitely one of them. You need to call her on it and don't let her get away with it anymore! Stop hiding the real reason why you're upset and tell her!

     
    Old 10-14-2007, 12:11 PM   #14
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    Re: Sister/boyfriend situation raising its ugly head again..

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Kszan View Post
    Laylah, I remember you posting about this before. I don't see why you don't just confront her with it if she asks you again. Just tell her flat out, Look Susie, I'm tired of you constantly going on and on about how much you want to boink my boyfriend, and he's really sick of it, too. Either cut it out or don't ever speak to me again. End of story.
    This makes the most sense to me, too, but unfortunately, the "either cut it out or get out of my life" bit isn't an option for Layla because she wants to keep her sister in her life and happy for her son's sake. I'm just not sure the sister will ever allow that to be a real possibility.

     
    Old 10-14-2007, 01:07 PM   #15
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    Re: Sister/boyfriend situation raising its ugly head again..

    I disagree with confronting her. I personally think that this will get you nowhere. Your sister must know that it is wrong to speak the way she does . She should not need you to tell her that it and I am not really sure whether she will change by saying it flat out to her. You need to think of the consequences of any step you take. While taking it out of your system maybe helpful momentarily, I doubt that it will stop her from being so impulsive and insensitive again, esp in a drunken state.

     
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