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    Old 11-30-2005, 06:21 PM   #1
    wxKathy2
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    Nothing works anymore - ideas??

    Hi All,
    I've been on Ambien 10 (and 20 mg a night) which worked for while - Lunesta when Ambien quiet working - lunesta never worked - ambien CR - doesn't work - clonopin - worked for awhile - not anymore - all kinds of benzos, antihistimines etc.....is there any thing else I can try to sleep - my doc doesn't want to use trazadone and I can't take SSRIs.....melatonin leaves me in a stupor all day (and sometimes have nightmares on it) and doesn't really keep me asleep - I have RLS but the clono takes care of that but not the staying asleep or falling asleep - lately I've been getting 1/2 hour to maybe 2 hours a night - I'm losing my mind.....I'm depressed or BPII (not sure yet).....Doctor gave me requip to replace the clono - but I haven't started it - it doesn't help fall asleep anyway and I have GAD too....
    Anyone have suggestions on how to treat this chronic insomnia??? I would greatly appreciate it....
    Thanks so much,
    Kathy

     
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    Old 11-30-2005, 09:43 PM   #2
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    Post Re: Nothing works anymore - ideas??

    Gosh, can I relate to your post. I've been on everything and nothing works anymore. The insomnia and anxiety are almost ever present. And the insomnia makes the panic attacks worse *because* I can't sleep (which really freaks me out). I end up taking 3mg of klonopin to knock myself out. I'm only supposed to take a half of a .5 a day. Only 30 pills a month. I have a small stash which is running out. I have to take them more and more and I don't like it.

    The anti-depressants like Trazadone and Remeron don't work well. Trazadone does nothing and Remeron works sometimes but at a bad price...RLS. The OTC sleep meds also give me RLS. What's the point of taking something (whether if helps or not) if it's just going to drive me nuts with my limbs. I'm so freaking sleepy sometimes when I take them but I can't sleep because I can't stay still! Other times there's no effect at all. But always RLS if I take them.

    I'm so frustrated. I don't have the money (medicaid) to consult a bunch of doctors and other mental health professionals in addition to what I have now which is a p-doc I see once for 15 minutes every three to four months.

    What scares me most is going into a cycle where I can't sleep at all and the end result which is losing my mind and going nuts. If I end up having a total breakdown I don't want to get put in the p-ward. That will be on my record and haunt my life forever.

    Anyway, you're not alone and I hope it gets better for you. I wish I had some advice..but then if I did I probably wouldn't be posting here at midnight.
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    Old 12-01-2005, 12:41 AM   #3
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    Re: Nothing works anymore - ideas??

    HI Newsome - I couldn't have said it better - that EXACTLY how I feel a and exactly my experience! I'll let you know if I figure anything - I just changed pdocs a few weeks ago so we are stil getting "acquainted" and maybe when we get settled in, we can communicate a little better and he might have anothe idea for this insomnia....I used to sleep too much about 15 years ago and before....then...the pendulum swung.....it's awful - I feel like I'm going to lose it too -
    You're not alone either....
    Hang in there - will keep you posted...thanks for your reply!
    Best wishes,
    Kathy

     
    Old 12-01-2005, 12:57 AM   #4
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    Re: Nothing works anymore - ideas??

    Heh...you're still up too

    When I was younger I seemed to sleep more too. No matter what I could always sleep during the day. Now it doesn't matter what time it is. A few people have told me that teens need a lot more sleep and then you go through a switch in your 30s where you need much less and the result is insomnia. I'm 35. Don't know if there is any truth to it.

    Some of it might be genetic. My grandmother always told me that her mother never could get to sleep until it was time to get up. And my grandmother herself could often be found playing solitaire (with real cards!) at 3AM. If my mother had trouble sleeping she never let anyone know it. She said she did, but there was no evidence in her behavior. Mother died in 97 and grandma in 93...I've been pretty much a mess ever since.

    Hope you find a comforting way to pass the night if not sleep.

    Blessings,
    N.
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    Old 12-01-2005, 09:31 AM   #5
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    Re: Nothing works anymore - ideas??

    Hi N,
    I'm so very sorry for your losses - I just lost my Grandmother in Februrary - we were very close - I still have my parents - My Dad is totally nocturnal - but my Mom is completely a morning person and sleeps normally....my Dad has RLS too. I think I have more of Dad's genes although I think he does sleep enough...but takes sleep aids...he turned 69 last week...

    I've heard that too about needing less sleep as you get older (I will be 41 next month) - but I don't think they meant what we are having! do you?

    Hope you too find some ways to pass the nights until it gets better - at least we know nothing ever stays the same forever...right??

    Take care and best wishes,
    Kathy

     
    Old 12-02-2005, 11:37 AM   #6
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    Re: Nothing works anymore - ideas??

    Hi N,
    I wanted to let you know that last night I took requip for the first time - along with my my usual cocktail of ambien CR, 3 clono, and 1 benadryl. Guess what - I got sleepy! I slept 5 hours....pretty hard with dreaming....Don't know how long it will last - doc wants me to to use it and as I ramp up, taper down the clono at bedtime and move that to daytime and decrease overall dose to 2 mg/day......just wanted to let you know in case it might be helpful to you - maybe you've already tried it....
    Best wishes,
    Kathy

     
    Old 12-04-2005, 01:09 AM   #7
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    Thumbs up Re: Nothing works anymore - ideas??

    No, I haven't tried that. I don't have access to medications such as Requip or Ambien. The RLS is bad tonight. I put this linament called "BioFreeze" on my legs. Sometimes the cold/burning sensation helps a little. It's pretty intense it makes me chill. I also take magnesium, folic acid and iron every night. I guess that helps a lof of people but it doesn't do much for me. Of course mine is triggered mostly by the medications I have to take. ADs aren't good for RLS.

    I'm really frustrated as I went to get my scripts filled the other day and they refused my Zoloft after years of being on it. Medicaid won't pay for it anymore unless I try Prozac and Celexa first. I think that's really crappy to force a med change on someone who has been taking a certain med for years. That could really put someone over the edge. Plus, I can't see my p-doc again for four months. You can't get her on the phone. She's only at the clinic a couple times a week for a few hours at a time. And I know she won't give a med change without seeing me first anyway. And there's no way you can get in at these county places like that. If you have to cancel and appointment it could be a month or more before you can get another. So I'm without my AD cold turkey.

    I burned a bunch of my DVD TV Box sets onto my HD (I have 600GB) to watch when I can't sleep or am sick or whatever. So I guess that's what I'm going to get back to. Glad you got some relief.

    Blessings.
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    Last edited by Newsome; 12-04-2005 at 01:16 AM.

     
    Old 12-04-2005, 04:31 AM   #8
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    Re: Nothing works anymore - ideas??

    Hi N,
    Sorry to hear about the stupid insurance- we have those preferred meds too - but I found if I called the doc office and asked them to call the insurance directly I got the insurance to approve the med I needed - do you think they'd do that for you? I also found elevating them helped a little in the evenings....(legs) So sorry for what you are going through - are you able to do any walking? sometimes exercise helps and sometimes it makes it worse for me - currently I cannot exercise due to plantar fasciitis which is all flared up - but I am starting PT next week for it...My hubby just went last night and rented a bunch of movies for me - that was nice of him.....
    Hang in there - I'll be thinking of you.....
    Kathy

     
    Old 12-06-2005, 11:51 AM   #9
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    Re: Nothing works anymore - ideas??

    Hi Everyone: I take Ambien and have for a couple years because I'm a Chronic Pain Patient. It is still working for me and the only complaint is I have to get up and take an extra 5 mg sometimes to get to sleep.

    As for those of you that nothing seems to work, have you asked your doctors about trying a barbituate for sleep? Years ago, I use to take (mainly after surgery, etc) various kinds and they work! The only problem is they're terribly addicting. Of course, Ambien and some of the others we use today are addicting also.

    If you have a good relationship with your doctor, you might ask about Nembutol, Tuinol or one of the others. They definitely would help you get some sleep.

     
    Old 12-06-2005, 11:58 AM   #10
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    Re: Nothing works anymore - ideas??

    Hi Director -
    Thanks - I'm getting desperate - got 1/2 hour last night.....I'm exhausted but can't sleep - it's a horrible way to live...I can at least ask if I know what to ask for....thank you....
    Kathy

     
    Old 12-10-2005, 03:26 AM   #11
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    Re: Nothing works anymore - ideas??

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Director
    Hi Everyone: I take Ambien and have for a couple years because I'm a Chronic Pain Patient. It is still working for me and the only complaint is I have to get up and take an extra 5 mg sometimes to get to sleep.

    As for those of you that nothing seems to work, have you asked your doctors about trying a barbituate for sleep? Years ago, I use to take (mainly after surgery, etc) various kinds and they work! The only problem is they're terribly addicting. Of course, Ambien and some of the others we use today are addicting also.

    If you have a good relationship with your doctor, you might ask about Nembutol, Tuinol or one of the others. They definitely would help you get some sleep.
    Barbituates? Good luck finding a doctor that will prescribe that. It was like pulling teeth to get my doctor to give me 30 klonopin a month when I was on 60 a month back home. Doctors in this part of the country are more concerned with addiction than patient comfort. And unfortunately the only drugs that work for sleep (or anxiety) are addictive. I can't imagine any doctor giving out barbs in this day and age in the US. I'm sure there a few, but finding them would be a long process.

    Kathy...sorry you're having a rough night. I got a few hours but woke up at 5AM. It's *very* frustrating.
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    Old 12-10-2005, 07:33 AM   #12
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    Re: Nothing works anymore - ideas??

    Yeah - I have a rough time getting them to give me benzos for anxiety - I had a one hour night last night .... wish there was some better solution....
    Good luck everyone....
    Best wishes,
    Kathy

     
    Old 12-10-2005, 02:12 PM   #13
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    Re: Nothing works anymore - ideas??

    Hi Kathy,
    I just recently found a combination of klonopin and seroquel. A very small dose about 2 hours before bedtime. Start at 6.5mg of seroquel and whatever. This combo has worked for the last 3 weeks which is a long stretch for me.
    JB

     
    Old 12-10-2005, 03:34 PM   #14
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    Re: Nothing works anymore - ideas??

    Could you possibly try an older tri-cyclic anti-depressant like Elavil. I found it to be more sedating than Remeron. I've gotten up to 150mg/night of Tofranil (similar to Elavil). That might be something to consider.

    Combining that with your Klonopin might do the trick... and sometimes even Xanax can be added to the cocktail to enhance the drowsiness side-effects of the others. Talk it over with your doctor, and see what they think.

    Try CBT or relaxation techniques... If you really give them a good go, you might be surprised how well they supplement your medications.

     
    Old 12-10-2005, 05:36 PM   #15
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    Re: Nothing works anymore - ideas??

    Hi JB,
    I have tried Seroquel and clono together - but thanks for the suggestion....I think I'm drug resistant or something?? Bulletin....thanks for the suggestion of tricyclic - might be something to ask the doc about - I am still ramping up on requip for RLS and hoping that will help whenever I get up to therapeutic dose.....
    I have tried xanax - regular and ER and ativan and no help...a little work with relaxation techniques - have to admit I haven't worked as hard as I could with those - what is CBT - controlled breathing?? I've worked a little there....exercise would probably help - am trying there - have some other obstacles to that to get out of the way.....thanks everyone for your help - I am very grateful.....I am hopeful that this too shall pass some day.....
    Best wishes to all,
    Kathy

     
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