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    Old 06-06-2003, 07:56 AM   #1
    Aimee8396
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    Red face Uncontrollable anger

    I had my thyroid removed in November, due to cancer, and underwent RAI treatment in April. I am back on my meds, and seeing my endo for my followup on Wednesday. My question is that in the past 3-4 weeks, since I've started haiving energy, I seem to have feeling of anger that come on so quick, and I can't seem to turn them off. Is this a symptom of hypo, or hyper? I'm no symptoms of either, but this feeling of rage, is very unlike me, and I want it to stop. Small things set me off, and I used to be the most patient person in the world. My endo is only testing TSH, could this maybe have something to do with not converting T4 to T3 right? I have 2 small kids, and I feel like I'm constantly nagging them all day. I know that before I had my thyroid removed, I never felt like this, so I need some ammo to talk to my Dr. Thanks, Aimee

     
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    Old 06-06-2003, 08:09 AM   #2
    Lithiate
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    Former child of a hypothyroid parent speaking here: My mom used to get extremely angry before she was treated for hypothyroidism. If you didn't jump up and start doing what she asked you to do 0.5 seconds after the words left her mouth, she would fly into a rage. God, the fights we used to get into! The started getting treatment when I was about 12 and suddenly everything became a lot more mellow. I discovered that my mom and I were actually very much alike and we ended up becomming best friends pretty quickly. But wow, those pre-treatment days were hell.

    These are also symptoms of hyperthyroidism, like you probably already know, but don't be fooled. My mom was severely hypo, but the majority of her symptoms were (and still are when she forgets her meds) hyper. Definitely see if you're being undermedicated. If you don't have a thyroid to speak of, your current dose of meds may not be enough. Hope this helps!

     
    Old 06-06-2003, 08:20 AM   #3
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    Hypo is my problem, and before I was diagnosed, I was abnormally negative-minded and impulsively sharp-tongued. I couldn't control the verbal barbs I was flinging around everywhere.
    Mood swings are typical of thyroid trouble, either hypo or hyper. It could be you need a dose adjustment.
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    Old 06-06-2003, 08:33 AM   #4
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    Hi! I had a LL on 4/22, and a completion on 5/6, then went severly hypo really fast. I had RAI on Memorial weekend. I did a really good job from December through May of 'getting through it', keeping everyone on an even keel, my kids, my husband, I'm tough, everything will be all right, etc.... Well guess what, now that I'm on synthroid reality finally hit. I have felt like I was on an emotional roller coaster and being too hard on my kids also. So what I did was go see a lady who is a family therepist. She teaches a parenting STEP class that I had attended before, and I like her a lot. I left the first session yesterday and felt a little better, but as the day went on I felt a lot better. You need time for you. And sometimes we just input from an impartial source to help clear the mind clutter, although in hypo it's more of a fog. She gave me the name of of a book which I started and it is very interesting. It's called "The Power of Now" by Eckhart Tolle. It's not the kind of book I usually read, I like Patterson, Grisham, etc. But I like this book.

    Anyway, good luck! Go easy on yourself.

     
    Old 06-06-2003, 10:09 AM   #5
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    Sorry to hear that aimee but know that you are not alone. I personally think it has to do with , when your not feeling, your less tolerant to things that would not normally bother you. I too am experiencing this. I find that I am a bit short with my kids lately due to the fact that I am not feeling well. Kids like routine. Mom's are what hold and keep the family together. And when she's not feeling well, it affects the whole family. To me it's a bit different when dad is sick, the kids still have their routine. Basicly when you don't feel well, we deal with it in different ways. This is different then just having the flu or a cold, knowing you'll be better in a few days, and that also wears on you. Especially because you can't see the end in site (if that makes sense) Anyways, hang in there, you just admitting and recognizing this is a great step. Take care

     
    Old 06-06-2003, 10:45 AM   #6
    SvenskaFlicka
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    Don't feel alone, this is not an unusal problem with thyroid patients, hyper or hypo or whatever, and as far as I am concerend it comes with the territory!

    Some say nutrient deficiencies of B6, B1, essential fatty acids and magnesium keep us on edge, making us irritable.
    Others say thyroid hormone levels are still out of wack and need to be balanced brefore this will go away.
    Some of us have a certain constitution that makes us high strung or more sensitive to external factors that will intensify after treatment. Then thrown in with all the other hormnes that our bodies have, hormonal changes, including both thyroid and sex hormones, we can end up being quite a mess.
    Our bodies and brain have gone through a lot and a tripple whammy for those of you who had thyroid cancer, surgery, and then RAI. Regardless the body needs to catch up with what is or has been going on with us, and for some of us it has probably been many years. It takes time to achieve feeling of wellness. Rome was not build in a day, nor will our health, it takes time to heal.

    This may take awhile, each of us are different therefore timming cannot be calculated, so keep haning in there. While waiting if it gets too bad you might consider antidepressants....many of us have!

    Good Luck,

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    Old 06-06-2003, 12:32 PM   #7
    Aimee8396
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    Thank you all so much!! I feel better knowing my meds not being right have something to do with this, and that I'm not just becoming crazy

    Flicka, I've recently started staking a cacium, magnesium and zinc pill. MY former calcium was making me sick to my stomach, and this pill seems to work better. Hopefully the mag. will help.

     
    Old 06-07-2003, 09:49 AM   #8
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    Hi Aimee,
    I was wondering what your levels were at now? I just got some blood work done, and I am down to a TSH of .225 - big change for me, huh?

    Funny thing is, I don't feel any different, and my heart rate is still at about 60 bpm. I think I have more hypo symptoms now than before, like a delayed reaction. Fortunately they aren't overwhelming, but this thread reminds me to be realistic in my expectations. We've been through a lot!

    Also, I get some more testing soon, for antibodies and thyroglobulin. I'm kind of paranoid about that. I also go off my meds the end of June for my scan in August. I will be SO relieved to have that behind me!! At times it feels like a never-ending nightmare!

    I kind of laughed when you said you didn't get angry as much before. Gee, you must be a good mom! Little ones can sometimes be very frustating and most the moms I know can get pretty mad (including me!). I homeschool my kids and anger was the first thing I had to learn to deal with! I didn't think I had any temper, but they really try my patience sometimes! It may be that you were working with a much longer fuse before.

    Your kids are much younger than mine, but do try to explain to them that you may not be yourself right now, but that it isn't their fault and they can be helpful by doing their best to behave. It is amazing how much kids can understand our honesty and everyone copes better when they do understand. You know - communication, communication, and communication! That is how my hubby and I've managed over the years.

    Let us know how you are doing, okay?
    Take care!

     
    Old 06-07-2003, 12:22 PM   #9
    Aimee8396
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    Ring, I used to get mad at them, just not over the little things that set me off nowadays. I actually used to teach kindergarten, so I consider myself a pretty calm person. Anymore though, I find myself yelling all the time, and I hate it, I don't want to be such a witch. I read in Dear Abby yesterday, that you should get your thyroid checked if you are acting crazy, because it may be out of whack. I go to get blood drawn on Monday, and will know what my levels are on Wednesday. I'm glad you're finally under1, it took long enough. Are they planning on doing a slow increase after your scan? I'll let you know what the Dr. says. Thanks, Aimee

     
    Old 06-07-2003, 02:37 PM   #10
    SvenskaFlicka
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    Very good Aimee and I hope you are adding the below as well.

    V-D will help calcium absorption along with magnesium and selenium.
    Selenium plays a role in thyroid hormone metabolism. It is now thought that severe selenium deficiency may be a possible cause of goiters.

    For hypothyroidism, zinc should be supplemented first along with selenium, then add copper....Zinc works with copper! The optimum zinc to copper ratio is about 8:1 for hypos. Take on full stomach since it may cause nausea. Take in morning as it may keep you awake if taken at night. When nighttime rapid heart beat begins, then iron and copper should be added.

    Magnesium/Selenium should not be taken with V-C or foods containing V-C. V-C, V-C foods, and, calcium and calcium foods should be taken at least 4 hours from taking thyroid meds.... could interfere with thyroid medication absorption. These are the only two vitamins that I know of so far that needs to be taken hours from thyroid meds. with the exception of foods period, which meds should be taken an hour before eating or two hours after eating.

    Manganese is required to transport thyroxin hormone in the cell.

    Intracellular conversion of T4 to T3 is known to require zinc, selenium, copper and iron. The production of T3 is dependent upon vitamin A.

    ringbearer,

    I am hyper/Graves' - before treatment my pulse was always 60 and never altered. I was so hyper I was losing weight like crazy however my pulse was still always 60. Blood pressure on the other hand was on the high side - within range but on the hight side. After treatment and levels pretty good I still average a 60 pulse, give or take depending on the time of day, although better improvement on blood pressure.

    40 to 60 pulse is a slow pulse, but what does pulse tell us? Its what the beats are doing that tells what the health issues are....like skipping beats, double beats, weak or strong etc. Now pulse pressure I would think a better indicator. Pulse pressure is the difference between systolic and diastolic blood pressure. Normal pulse pressure is 40. So if you are on the minus side of 40 you are probably hypo and if on the high side of 40 you probably are hyper. I went out and bought a digital blood pressure monitor that also take the pulse. The last time I took my BB my pulse pressure was 42 from 70 a year ago - I am finalley getting there


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    Old 06-07-2003, 03:47 PM   #11
    Aimee8396
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    Flicka, I am taking the cal/mag/zinc, along with my multi vitamin(prenatal, since it has more iron) the multi has V-D. I also am taking 2 selenium a day. I was takiing all these vitamins/minerals in the evening, while I take my thyroid alone in the AM. I also take a Vitamin C with bioflavinoids in the PM. Should I not take the Selinium with the V-C? CAn I take Selinium with thyroid in the AM? This is so crazy. Also when is it ok to take BCP? I've been taking them right before bed. I also was thought to have hyper before they diagnosed with cancer. My uptake was 33%, and my TSH was .6. I had lost about 35lbs, and a lot of hair. I haven't gained any weight, and even lost another 5 whiole doing RAI. I have been told that I will gain weight, and would actually like a few lbs. Since the goal with my TSH is suppression at 1 or below, will I ever gain weight, or was maybe the weight loss, hair loss, a symptom of something else. Scarey thought. Thanks for responding. I will have to check to see if my vitamins have any manganese is them. Aimee

     
    Old 06-07-2003, 06:08 PM   #12
    SvenskaFlicka
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    Aimee, I made a mistake - its selenium and chromium - they work together and take them several hours apart from V-C. Its V-D and magnesium that help with calcium absorption.
    I take my thyroid meds early early early in the AM. Take all my vitamins with each meal except the selenium and chromium which I take at bed time. However I take V-A and V-D at first meal of the day only with fats, which is usually either nuts or seeds because I am a veggie. I also take nuts and seed with V-E because these vitamins are fat soluble, that is they are absorbed better with fats....good fats. I take separate vitamins except the Bs which I take a multi-50s. Other than Bs they just don't make multis in large enough doses that I want - they'd have to make a multi as big as a tennis ball to get all the vitamins and their dosage to keep me healthy, and I'm not taking them all yet. Multis are for healthy people to keep them healthy. I have much wrong so I need mega doses to keep me healthy.
    What is BCP? - Sorry!
    You probably will gain back the weight you lost if you don't diet to keep most of it from coming back. Then whether you had weight problems or not before RAI you will be the same after RAI. In other words RAI does not make a person gain weight....unless it was lost like we lost it...due to our illness. I haven't gained all my weight back but I diet to keep it from all coming back or else it would. I was never out of my weight range, just to the high side of it...more than I like.

    TSH at 1 is not really suppressed, did you mean .01 or .001? I know they like to keep post cancer/treated patients at suppressed levels. I don't know if suppressed level will keep you from gaining - I just came down from .03 and it didn't effect my weight, however we have different thyroid issues and regardless each of us are different.

    You sound like you are doing good and trying to do the right things for your health situation. Keep it up and you'll do OK!


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    Old 06-08-2003, 07:14 AM   #13
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    BCP= Birth control pills, sorry.

    I consider myself lucky that they want to keep me under 1 for my TSH. The last bloodwork I had done before RAI my TSH was .03, and they lowered my dose, because she said I was hyper. I felt fine though, no symptoms. I lost all my weight about a year ago, and haven't gained an ounce. I had to diet during RAI, so I think that's why I lost. I eat so bad right now, because all that tastes good to me are carbs. I'm 5'8" and weigh 124. I would like to weigh about 135, I feel pretty skinny right now. My endo keeps telling me I won't gain any weight. Who knows. Thanks for the info, Aimee

     
    Old 06-11-2003, 02:35 PM   #14
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    Went to the endo this morning. My TSH was .18, when I told her about my anger issues, she said that I may be too suppressed, and she lowered my dose of Levoxyl from 125 to 112. I go back in 6 weeks for more bloodwork. Since the goal is to keep my TSH under 1, is this a safe way to go, she said there was no need to test T3 or T4 levels. If Istill feel this way in 6 weeks, I'm going to ask my family Dr. to help get me regulated. I hate having these feelings, I'm usually such a calm stable person. I really feel like I'm fighting with myself a lot to stay sane. LOL. Could TSH of .18 be causing me to feel this,. or is this TSH normal?? Thanks for any imput.

     
    Old 06-12-2003, 09:16 AM   #15
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    How funny that after all our *hopping around*, we are now taking the same dose 112mcg. My TSH was .225 (my local doc took that test), and I will have another test tomorrow (with my endo). I won't know anything until next week sometime if he changes the dose. My actual T4 & free T4 were within normal, with free T4 being more in the mid-range, so maybe he won't change anything.

    I feel alright. My biggest problem is at night and in the morning. I often wake around 2am feeling very restless, but not wide awake. I toss and turn, feel achy and even nauseous or something similar. It is very strange! I wake feeling lousy, but shortly after I am up and around I feel fine all day. I don't know what to make of it.

    You definitely could be a bit hyper. That sure could cause you to become angry easily. I'm sure it is very upsetting, when it is so out of character. Let us know how you feel on this new dose.

     
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