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    Old 04-01-2005, 09:32 AM   #1
    curlyroller
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    testosterone and progesterone: help!!

    can someone help me with my testosterone test results? i am not sure which test matters:

    testosterone, total: 15ng/dL (lab lists normal for premenopausal women as 15-70ng/dL) should i be concerned that i am right at the lowest "normal" range at age 29? is this like total t4 or t3 and it's not the best number?

    % free testosterone: 2.24 (lab lists normal for premenopausal women as .05-1.8) should this concern me? i'm out of range here! could this be why i am growing black hairs out of my chin? why is my free over the range, but my total is at the very bottom?

    testosterone, free: 3.4 pg/mL (lab lists normal for premenopausal women as 1.0-8.5pg/mL) what is the significance of this one? is it similar to free t3 or t4?

    when i got these tests done, i was seeing a quack, and she didn't care about any test as long as you were in range. i haven't asked my current awesome doc yet, because i was so focused on my thyroid and depression, and now my low adrenals. i think i definately have some symptoms of low testosterone (no drive, no passion (for life), etc.), but then some of high testosterone (the hairs on my chinny chin chin, for example).

    can anyone help me understand these results?


    now, for the progesterone:

    i'm concerned about having a hormone imbalance (i'm guessing estrogen dominance from my symptoms), and REALLY concerned about the dark, coarse hair growth that is exploding on my chin. it's gotten so so bad lately. i am plucking every day! i'm not even 30 yet!! and then there are my ovarian cysts which started in december with a trip to the ER, and haven't really stopped since. it seems like i get one every month at ovulation. but, i'm also concerned about my low testosterone. could progesterone cream help me? is it dangerous to start the cream on your own? should i wait to talk to my doc? i'd rather not, if i don't have to, given the expense. how does one know if they are getting too much? are there dangers to that?

    thanks in advance.

    rachel.

    Last edited by curlyroller; 04-01-2005 at 09:36 AM.

     
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    Old 04-01-2005, 04:46 PM   #2
    Gopherhead
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    Re: testosterone and progesterone: help!!

    Hi Rachel. I just had some similar tests done and had some similar results. Low progesterone, hairy chin. Did you have your DHEAS tested? This is where women get the bulk of their androgens - in my case it was high.

    Your Free test isn't high, but your % of free is, and your total is low, making me think your problems are a result of the low progesterone, high estrogen, low or impeded thyroid and possibly high DHEAs.

    Have you had the progesterone test? It would be a good idea, but frankly, I think you'd benefit from the cream. You sound like you're dealing with estrogen dominance - cysts are a big sign of too much estrogen and too little progesterone.

    I would get myself a copy of Dr Lee's book "What your doctor may not tell you about PRE menopause" it will help you understand how to use the progesterone and how it can help balance everything else out. I've been on the cream for 3 months now and it's all starting to fall into place. I'm having normal cycles for the first time in my life and the hairs aren't coming back

    There's a relationship between progestereone and thyroid btw - also included in there is vit D. Adequate thyroid, Vit D and progesterone will help you feel a lot better - each one will assist the other.

    Get the book, you wont regret it
    Nat
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    Old 04-01-2005, 07:53 PM   #3
    curlyroller
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    Re: testosterone and progesterone: help!!

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Gopherhead
    Hi Rachel. I just had some similar tests done and had some similar results. Low progesterone, hairy chin. Did you have your DHEAS tested? This is where women get the bulk of their androgens - in my case it was high.

    Your Free test isn't high, but your % of free is, and your total is low, making me think your problems are a result of the low progesterone, high estrogen, low or impeded thyroid and possibly high DHEAs.
    i did have mine tested, at the same time as the testosterone.

    DHEAS: 517 (62-615 MCG/DL)

    it's not out of range, but it is pretty high up there in the range. could that indicate an imbalance?

    oh, and of course i've got the low thyroid going on. right now, i'm at 1.25 grains of armour, and i cant seem to raise any higher than that without hyper symptoms. that's part of the reason my doc put me on isocort and pregnenalone about 2 weeks ago. we both suspect that i've got adrenal fatigue and that is inhibiting my ability to raise my dosage. i'm going to have more thyroid bloodwork done to see where i am on my levels at this dosage, but i know that my symptoms are not resolved.


    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Gopherhead
    Have you had the progesterone test? It would be a good idea, but frankly, I think you'd benefit from the cream. You sound like you're dealing with estrogen dominance - cysts are a big sign of too much estrogen and too little progesterone.
    see, that's what i'm thinking. if progesterone is dangerous to take without being sure that you're low, i want to take the test, but if my symptoms and these other results suggest that it's low, and i'm not taking a risk with my health, why spend the money? and why wait another few months to talk to the doctor about it, if i could start feeling better now?

    i went to dr. lee's website and took the symptom test. i can up with multiple symptoms in the progesterone deficiency, estrogen excess, estrogen dominance, excess androgens and cortisol deficiency categories. hmm...i'm thinking that we are on the right track here...


    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Gopherhead
    I would get myself a copy of Dr Lee's book "What your doctor may not tell you about PRE menopause" it will help you understand how to use the progesterone and how it can help balance everything else out. I've been on the cream for 3 months now and it's all starting to fall into place. I'm having normal cycles for the first time in my life and the hairs aren't coming back
    thanks so much for the book suggestion! i've read most of the thyroid books, but i'm totally ignorant in this area!! i guess it another area to read up on. i bought some cream today (progestacreme plus, i think it's the one dr. lee reccomends!) and i think i'm going to go for it when i get to day 12 of my cycle. i run about 26 days, not the standard 28.


    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Gopherhead
    There's a relationship between progestereone and thyroid btw - also included in there is vit D. Adequate thyroid, Vit D and progesterone will help you feel a lot better - each one will assist the other.
    excellent. thanks so much, nat. i'll be talking to my doctor about it when i see him next, too. the vitamin d is interesting. i think i might get that, ferritin and something related to PCOS tested when i see him next, if it's not too crazy expensive.

    rachel.

    Last edited by curlyroller; 04-01-2005 at 08:09 PM.

     
    Old 04-01-2005, 08:01 PM   #4
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    Re: testosterone and progesterone: help!!

    hi curlyroller, I was having crazy chin hair too, and i just started some progesterone cream when I read that section of the book from dr lee that said that low progesterone can trigger the thyroid to not work properly. I also started taking saw palmetto the gaia phytocaps and I havent had a chin hair in a week. Its weird. My DHEAS were 208 and my thyroid tsh is 6.1. My hair is falling out like crazy , really thin and whispy and almost half gone.

     
    Old 04-01-2005, 08:12 PM   #5
    curlyroller
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    Re: testosterone and progesterone: help!!

    wow, razzy, that's encouraging. are you being treated for your thyroid? that TSH is REALLY high. my TSH was only 1.2 when i was diagnosed, but i was still miserable with symptoms. good luck to you!

     
    Old 04-01-2005, 08:35 PM   #6
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    Re: testosterone and progesterone: help!!

    my doctor is watching my thyroid but I was also diagnosed with carnitine deficiency and he wants to treat one thing at a time. I was on synthyroid and it pushed my tsh down to .15 and I was having real bad headaches so I stoppedit. Im about to get a retest done on the thyroid panel and see where I stand.

     
    Old 04-02-2005, 12:31 AM   #7
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    Re: testosterone and progesterone: help!!

    guys ...what are the symptoms of high estrogen and low progestrone...please give me the full list of symptoms

    thanks

    Lina
    Egypt

     
    Old 04-05-2005, 04:11 AM   #8
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    Re: testosterone and progesterone: help!!

    hey nat. just wanted to bump this in case you hadn't gotten to see my response yet. i'm interested in your thoughts on my DHEAs level.

     
    Old 04-05-2005, 04:12 AM   #9
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    Re: testosterone and progesterone: help!!

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by linaegypt
    guys ...what are the symptoms of high estrogen and low progestrone...please give me the full list of symptoms
    if you do a search for "estrogen dominance" you should be able to find symptoms pretty easily.

     
    Old 04-05-2005, 06:14 AM   #10
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    Re: testosterone and progesterone: help!!

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by curlyroller
    hey nat. just wanted to bump this in case you hadn't gotten to see my response yet. i'm interested in your thoughts on my DHEAs level.
    I missed it thanks for the bump, Rachel

    I suspect that you're on the right track - and I suspect that you're dealing with a lot of the same stuff I was, minus the adrenals issues (mine seem to be OK for some strange reason). My DHEAs was also high, like yours. Like with thyroid it's not just that you be normal, but where you fall in the range and in this case how it relaties to other hormones, female hormones and testosterone in particular. Something else you might want to test for is SHBG, Sex Hormone Binding Globulin, which might be off, causing the excessive androgens.

    I suspect if you scored high on the estrogen dominance and low on progesterone that taking some of the cream is in order. Your findings go hand in hand with being hypoT.

    Good luck with the other tests - let us know what happens.

    Lina, check out estrogen dominance AND Dr. Lee or dr. Lam. - both offer very good advice on ED and how to cope with it.
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    Old 04-05-2005, 06:27 AM   #11
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    Re: testosterone and progesterone: help!!

    Razzy Berry how did you get diagnosed with Carnitine deficiency. I have just been reading up on that in a book called Natural Energy. It is very interesting and I had never heard of carnitine deficiency until this book and now with you. So if you have any information on this I would be greatly appreciated. Thanks and God Bless.
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    Old 04-06-2005, 06:26 AM   #12
    curlyroller
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    Re: testosterone and progesterone: help!!

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Gopherhead
    I suspect that you're on the right track - and I suspect that you're dealing with a lot of the same stuff I was, minus the adrenals issues (mine seem to be OK for some strange reason). My DHEAs was also high, like yours. Like with thyroid it's not just that you be normal, but where you fall in the range and in this case how it relaties to other hormones, female hormones and testosterone in particular. Something else you might want to test for is SHBG, Sex Hormone Binding Globulin, which might be off, causing the excessive androgens.

    I suspect if you scored high on the estrogen dominance and low on progesterone that taking some of the cream is in order. Your findings go hand in hand with being hypoT.

    thanks so much, nat. it's good to have the confirmation. also, good to hear about the DHEAs. now the strange testosterone results are finally starting to make sense. i'll be discussing all this with my great doc next month, but for now, i've started the progesterone cream. just this morning, in fact.

    i'll add the SHBG to my test list too! let's see, that means progesterone, SHBG, ferritin, estrogen/estriodel...we'll see what the doc says and what the cost is!

    thanks so much!!

    rachel.

     
    Old 04-06-2005, 08:07 AM   #13
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    Re: testosterone and progesterone: help!!

    You're welcome, Rachel.

    Nat(rushka)
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